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A Clame made to @protectyrbubble for a stolen phone has been rejected!

 

Have a Police Crime Number, but they are not accepting the claim.

 

Has anyone else had trouble with this Mobile Phone Insurance Company.

 

As it is, it might have to be the small claims court, any other Idea..

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It would be a bit helpful if you gave us some details.

 

I don't think that anyone in the world could give you help or an answer on what you have set out in your post.

 

...unless you are asking us a riddle of some kind.

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This is my daughters claim that I am dealing with on her behalf.

 

Brief background:

 

She was in a Club last Friday evening. She went to the Ladies (which is a very small room) and she and her friend were the only two in there, apart from the Lavoratory Attendendant. She came out of the cubicle & put her phone down next to the sink, washed her hands, literally turned to her left to dry her hands. When she turned back, the phone had gone. Her friend was still in the cubicle which only left the Attendant. She went and reported it to the Security people and they went into the toilet with her and asked the attendant if she had taken the phone. She said no, so my daughter asked if the Security men would search her. They asked her if they could and she said no. They told my daughter there was nothing else they could do. My daughter used her friends telephone to phone her boyfriend and asked him to track her phone (she has the Find My iPhone App). He said it was showing as in the Club. She told the security men that and said she was going to phone the police. The security people then threw her out of the Club, along with her 3 friends. Once out of the Club, she phoned the police and reported the theft. She received a crime reference number. She then contacted o2 and cancelled the contract and emailed Protect Your Bubble of the theft (they are not contactable by telephone over the weekend).

 

She telephoned Protect Your Bubble on Monday (21 Jan) and explained the circumstances of her claim. They told her it was not a theft as she didn't see the person take the phone. She tried to argue the case that it's not always possible to actually see someone steal something, but they wouldn't have it. She then said if they didn't view it as theft, then she was reporting it as a lost phone. They said it wasn't a loss because it didn't fall out of her handbag or she didn't accidentally put it down somewhere!

 

I then took over on her behalf and spoke to them. I asked them if they didn't consider it a theft or a loss, then what was their explanation as to what it was? Did they believe it just disappeared into thin air or did the fairies take it? They said they understood what I was saying but it didn't fall within their terms and conditions (which are forever changing anyway).

 

I quoted their T&C to them as follows:

 

Loss means that the gadget has been accidentally left by you in a location and you are permanently deprived of its use.

 

Theft means the unlawful taking of your gadet against your will by another party, with the intention of permanently depriving you of it.

 

Either of those terms apply to this case. Their terms (with regard to loss) also say the gadget should not be unattended. Their definition of unattended is 'no more than an arms length from you'. Her phone was never unattended as it was never more than an arms length away from her.

 

I am now awaiting a letter from them declining the claim and I will then follow their Complaints Procedure.

 

This company really are a shambles. They twist words and definitions to suit themselves. They take advantage of young people who are attracted to their Insurance because it is cheap.

 

Sorry to go on - I'm actually fuming!

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It would be a bit helpful if you gave us some details.

 

I don't think that anyone in the world could give you help or an answer on what you have set out in your post.

 

...unless you are asking us a riddle of some kind.

 

The thread was started on my behalf by a friend. I have now explained the circumstances :)

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The way these companies operate is to decline claims when they are first reported. They then reconsider the claim, when they receive a complaint. So read the policy wording carefully and make a complaint in writing, sending by recorded delivery. The complaints address will be shown in the policy documents.

 

This is a theft and not a loss claim. Make sure it is made clear that the phone was only put down for a few seconds and any non attention in regard to the phone was only a few seconds. You really have to explain exactly what happened precisely otherwise they will try to decline a theft claim on the basis of not taking care to prevent it.

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The way these companies operate is to decline claims when they are first reported. They then reconsider the claim, when they receive a complaint. So read the policy wording carefully and make a complaint in writing, sending by recorded delivery. The complaints address will be shown in the policy documents.

 

This is a theft and not a loss claim. Make sure it is made clear that the phone was only put down for a few seconds and any non attention in regard to the phone was only a few seconds. You really have to explain exactly what happened precisely otherwise they will try to decline a theft claim on the basis of not taking care to prevent it.

 

Ok. I did explain exactly what happened on the telephone to them and pointed out it was literally seconds that she turned away.

 

I will do as you say and see how I get on. Many thanks.

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You need to ask them to send you a letter detailing exactly why they are declining the claim, once you have this you can make an "Official Complant".

 

They cannot say it was a lost as their own policy says this "Loss means that the gadget has been accidentally left by you in a location and you are permanently deprived of its use" she did not leave the room before noticing it had gone.

 

They seem to have reworded their policy and it works in your favour as it does not preclude your claim.

 

Their definition of theft is thus "Theft - the unlawful taking of your gadget against your will by another party, with the intention of permanently depriving you of it." which is what has happened.

 

They are likely to decline under either or both of the following

 

"where the gadget has been left unattended when it is away from your home or, if the gadget is owned by a business, your secured business premises

4. of any gadget where reasonable precautions have not been taken."

 

Their definition of "Unattended" is thus "Unattended - not within your sight at all times and out of your arms-length reach" not the use of the word "AND" so assuming she genuinely had just turned around and it was within arms length reach she should win the case upon either making an "Official Complaint" or after this then appealing to the Ombudsman. The Ombudsman tends to look at whats fair rather than exactly what the policy says and there's a high chance he will rule in your favour providing the situation is exactly as you described. If she does comply to the phone being "Unattended" your chances are considerably less.

 

When you send an "Official Complaint" (Send by recorded) keep it short and concise and highlight their definition of "Unattended" and confirm that the phone was within "Arms-length reach" and they should see sense.

 

Do not be tempted to bend the truth, it's important she tells the truth.

 

This is the policy wording I viewed the first download of "Click HERE to download our full terms and conditions." in this link uk.protectyourbubble.com/gi-mobile-phone-insurance.html

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OK. Thank you for your post.

 

If my daughter says she literally just turned away for a few seconds, then I believe her. I know her well and she would not lie to the Police or to me.

 

The phone was definitely never more than an arms length away from her and although she did turn away for a few seconds, I doubt she'd have expected the phone to be stolen as there was nobody else in the room, apart from the Attendent (who, being an employee of the Club, she wouldn't have considered a threat) and her friend, who was in a cubicle at the time.

 

She also asked if there was CCTV in the toilets, but unfortunately there isn't. I do feel the Police could have been a bit more helpful, but I suppose they have bigger crimes to deal with than a stolen iPhone.

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The police are busy dealing with phone hacking...

 

Ask Protectyourbubble for a "Final Decision" in writing, warn them you will be making an official complaint.

 

If they fap around on the phone, remind them it was not lost as per their own definition but was a theft as per their own definition and if you would like their final decision on it being covered as a theft before you go down the route of an "Official Complaint" (It tells you how and where to write to in the policy) and Ombudsman should you still not be satisfied.

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If they are declining the claim then they already know they're declining it so a letter should (In my opinion) take no longer than seven days.

 

Feel free to quote this to them.

 

"12. Creating extra paperwork

Requiring a consumer who wishes to claim on an insurance

policy to produce documents which could not reasonably

be considered relevant as to whether the claim was valid, or

failing systematically to respond to pertinent correspondence,

in order to dissuade a consumer from exercising his/her

contractual rights."

 

oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/cpregs/oft979.pdf

 

Unless you get someone with a bit of common sense who can see they're on a losing wicket, there's a good chance they will decline the claim which means you will need to go down the Offical Complaint route, they have eight weeks to respond to that so it could take some time.

 

Bear in mind they will almost certainly replace with a refurbished model of her phone anyway, so if she's desperate for a phone and wants the same phone buying a refurbed one or second hand from somewhere might be worth considering.

 

It's worth getting your daughter (Especially if she has a lot of friends / followers) to post on Protectyourbubble's twitter and facebook as this can often work wonders as big companies have their press departments monitoring them and often get someone with knowledge to look at the claim to try and protect the company reputation. They will probably have read this thread as most big companies with any intelligence have "Google Alert" for their company name which alerts them to any use of their name on the t'internet.

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Thank you.

 

It's already been spread around Twitter and someone from ProtectYourBubble contacted me within minutes of me posting on there. I have been careful what I've said on there - I've only stated facts.

 

The person who responds to Twitter complaints is really just a pacifier.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Official claim rejection letter now received. No reason given - just an 'unfortunately your claim has not been approved on this occasion'.

 

My daughter has a lawyer friend who is compiling a letter of complaint for her to send, so we'll wait and see the outcome of that.

 

I feel this is going to be a rather long, drawn out process.

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She needs to ask for a letter explaining why they are declining the claim, they'ye obliged to provide an explanation.

 

If they don't provide it you will not know on what grounds they're declining and thus how to complain etc

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OK. She has had a letter saying her claim was rejected as 'the gadget was not within sight at all times and out of arms reach', so therefore it isn't classed as theft.

 

Absolutely ridiculous. By using this definition within their T&C, they would never pay out on a stolen item.

 

She has sent an official complaint written by a lawyer who cites a case very similar brought against Prudential Assurance. In that case, the Court found that 'to impose too high a standard (of T&C) would defeat or make illusory the benefits of an insurance policy'. The Court found in favour of the defendant.

 

I'll keep you posted. She has given them 21 days to respond.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Quick update.

 

She received a reply from PYB today saying they received her complaint on 23 February and will come back with an answer within 4 weeks.

 

How can they say they received it on 23 February when she emailed the Complaints Department on 6 February? I didn't realise emails took nearly 3 weeks to reach the recipient.

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They have 8 weeks from the time you send the email ( plus a day or two for them to actually get it). Doesnt matter what they say, theyre the ones wasting time.

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  • 1 month later...

Update.

 

PYB eventually emailed to say they had looked into the case, and were overturning the refusal and were now accepting her claim.

 

She has, this week, received a brand new iPhone 4S from them.

 

Thank you all for your comments and suggestions on this thread. Just goes to prove, if you know you're right, fight for it :)

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Very pleased to hear this has now been resolved - well done for persevering :)

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