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    • My final ticket:      1.      The original Claimant agreed to undertake building work (Project 1) at the original Defendant/now Part 20 Counterclaimant’s property in relation to 3 specific areas of work for an agreed price of £4300.  The work was:   a. To underpin the bay window at the property, b. To replace and repair a previously-removed chimney breast and, c. To install a new beam to the patio door.   2.      It was agreed that Project 1 was to be carried out under the instructions of a structural engineer engaged by the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant and that the Claimant’s work would be as a result of instructions received following the structural engineer's assessment of the property.   3.      Between June and July in 2020 the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant provided the Claimant with a full copy of the structural engineer's report which detailed instructions to the Claimant for the works to be carried out.   4.      It was agreed between the parties that the works would commence on 13 August 2020.   5.      It was agreed between the parties that payments for Project 1 would be made in three instalments. The first payment would be made at the start of the Claimant's work. The second payment would be paid at the halfway point of the Claimant's work. The final payment would be made on completion of the total works.   6.      The Claimant commenced work on 13 August 2020 and the first instalment due was paid.     7.      On 24 August 2020 the Claimant asked the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant to arrange an inspection of his work by the Building Control Inspector.  The Claimant also stated that Project 1 was approaching mid-way and the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant paid the second instalment due.   8.      The Building Inspector arrived to inspect the Claimant’s work but the Claimant was absent.  The inspector was obviously very displeased by the standard of the Claimant's work.  The inspector spoke to the Claimant by telephone, asking him why he was absent and interrogating him about the work he had done.  The inspector then gave him some instructions over the telephone and also left a list of instructions with the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant to be passed on to the builder.  The building inspector then said he would be getting in touch with the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant’s structural engineer with his findings and the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant should hear from the engineer soon.   9.      The Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant passed on the Building Inspector’s instructions to the Claimant who agreed to follow them.   10.  The structural engineer visited and recommended piling to complete the underpinning for Project 1.  The Claimant explained that he could not undertake this work. The structural engineer then suggested an alternative company to the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant to do the necessary work and this company was engaged by the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant to complete the necessary piling at an additional cost to the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant of £3000. (See receipt at Exhbibit-1).   11.  The Claimant asked if the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant needed any more work to be done and, despite the problems encountered on Project 1, the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant agreed on 7 September 2020 to have more work done (Project 2) at an agreed price of £2580 and on similar payment terms to Project 1.   12.  As work commenced on Project 2 and was continued on the remaining work for Project 1, the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant had occasion to make several complaints to the Claimant regarding the standard of his work.   13.   Barely a week after starting on Project 2, the Claimant demanded payment for that work.  After a period of negotiation the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant paid the Claimant £1500 in cash.  Both parties agreed that this left a balance outstanding on Project 2 of £1080.   14.  It later came to the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant’s attention that the Claimant had removed material (including a steel beam) from the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant’s property that the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant suspects either belonged to him or had been paid for by him in connection with Project 1.  When the Claimant challenged admitted he had done this.  The Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant has included the value of this material in his counterclaim detailed below.   15.    On 21 September 2020 the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant highlighted and sent a snagging list to the Claimant (Exhbibit-2).  Over a month later the Claimant sent an employee to attend to this work.  It was not carried out satisfactorily and resulted in an updated snagging list being sent to the claimant (Exhibit -3).  All of this snagging work remains undone by the Claimant.   16.  Apart from the outstanding snagging work referred to in para 16 above, the Claimant also left other work from Projects 1 and 2 uncompleted.  That work which was not completed is listed at ( Exhibit 4.)   17.  During the course of carrying out work on Projects 1 and 2 the Claimant also negligently caused substantial damage to the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant’s property (as itemised in  Exhibit-5) by not executing the work with the skill expected of a reasonable tradesman.   18.  The Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant seeks an order from the court directing the Claimant to pay to the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant the sum of £16,577.12 in respect of:   (a)   the cost of the piling referred to in para 10 above which the Claimant could not undertake and another contractor had to be paid to complete; (b)   the cost of completing work the Claimant had left undone from Projects 1 and 2 referred to in para 16 above; (c)   the cost of remedial work to put right the damage negligently caused by the Claimant and referred to in para 17 above. (d). the cost of the steel beam referred to in para 14 above put down as estimated.   A receipts in respect of 3 items (a) - see Attachment 1 – Page-4-8 for:   (i) £3,000.00 GTM piling,                                                      (ii) Rubble truck £387.12                                                     (iii) £250.00 to Mellor the roofer   The two priced quotes in respect of items (b) (1) Cheshire Bespoke Building Limited for £5,190.00,  and (2) Mellor Roofing Specialist. (c) – see Attachments 6 and 7 - are attached in support of this counterclaim.     The defendant/Part 20 counterclaimant is claiming 8% interest under the County Courts Act 1984 from the 26 October 2020 which was the last day the       STATEMENT OF TRUTH   I believe that the facts stated in this particulars of counterclaim are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.’.    
    • I can't say for certain whether it is all paid up but it certainly suggests that you are getting any more trouble in the future. However, come back to us if they start writing
    • See if they chase you then??   Dx
    • I do not need your help with my claim. I am very familiar with law and legal process. If I need specific legal advice I will consult a solicitor.    I have posted because this is called a "forum". It is where we (Consumers) share views and experiences and opinions etc. I am particularly interested to hear how others feel about the increased use of unfair contractual terms to mislead staff and consumers, and more importantly what can done be to discourage and reduce this unfair practice. Hermes seem to have taken this to whole new level.  The links you provided above add nothing to discussion, and as such, are unhelpful.    I see that you try to guide others through the legal process, and provide advice on law. You seem to have process and expect people contributing to the forum to follow a strict process and follow your advice to the letter if they want receive your advice and guidance.  You are quite rude if people do not do what you expect.     First,  please advise if you are legally qualified to provide such advice., Second, if it is the intention of the CAG to operate this as "forum" or a process based web site that dispenses legal advice.  Lastly, please confirm if you are acting moderator or a legal advisor.     Thank you      
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Marstons saying they have a court orde....but they don't!


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My son’s partner sold her car and cancelled her insurance policy but there then followed an ongoing dispute with her insurance company (Thames) over the termination fee as they alleged that she had not returned her certificate of insurance for the vehicle concerned. She did return what she thought was her latest certificate but they were adamant they had issued a later ‘amended’ certificate what had not been returned.

All went quiet for a few months and then she received a letter from CCI Legal followed by threats from Marston’s who said they were in possession of a magistrate’s court order.

She wrote to:

i) CCI: to inform them that she had complied with Thames request and was unaware of any debt and to refer the matter back to Thames and not to appoint Bailiffs as this would deem to be harassment

ii) Marstons: to inform that she had paid to have a court check done (Trust Online) and there was not, nor has there ever been, a judgement against her and requested explanation of their letter

Neither of the letters was responded to and then on Saturday a ‘Removal Notice’ was shoved through the letterbox by Marstons who were chasing a ‘magistrate’s court fine’ totalling over £600

Not only is my son the sole legal owner of the property he is also the sole owner of the contents, fixtures and fittings.

As this ‘alleged’ dispute is with my son’s partner can they forcibly gain access to his property and what should be his partners nest step as she has written to both parties without a response asking for an explanation of their charges/action?

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It would not be a magistrates court order, but a county court judgement. The Trust Online details can take a month or so, to be updated with the latest CCJ details. Ask Marstons which county court awarded the CCJ and on what date, plus what reference numbers apply. Then Sons partner can phone the court.

 

If Marstons are telling porkies then warn them that they may be committing a criminal offence under the Administration of Justice Act 1970 and you would report them, if they continued to make false claims.

 

If the Insurers or their reps had applied for a CCJ, the court would have sent a court claim to the address they were given. This would have been the address where the Insurance was registered. Following the CCJ, the court would have sent details of the judgement to the address.

 

Marstons cannot gain any access to any property, unless they are invited in. They can try to levy on Sons partners car, if they find it and therefore best to make sure out of sight. Marstons would then give a period in which repayment would need to be arranged, before they could tow the car to dispose of.

 

Thames Insurers are known to be difficult. When the certificate of Insurance was returned, it should have been sent back by recorded delivery. If there is no CCJ, Sons partner should enter into a complaint with Thames and involve the FOS if necessary. If there is a CCJ, then they can complaint to Thames, but the FOS won't touch a complaint already with the courts.

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thanks uncleb' further points as follows:

 

‘It would not be a magistrates court order, but a county court judgement’

A: Marstons specifically refer to a ‘Magistrates Court Fine’

 

Ask marstons which county court awarded the CCJ and on what date, plus what reference numbers apply. Then Sons partner can phone the court.

A: Already done so in December but NO response

 

If marstons are telling porkies then warn them that they may be committing a criminal offence under the Administration of Justice Act 1970

A: this Act was referred to in a previous letter sent to to CCI, who appointed Marstons

 

If the Insurers or their reps had applied for a CCJ, the court would have sent a court claim to the address they were given. This would have been the address where the Insurance was registered. Following the CCJ, the court would have sent details of the judgement to the address.

A: NO court papers received at new or old address

 

They can try to levy on Sons partners car,

A: She now does not have one – she sold it in 2011 and this is from where this dispute originated

Edited by wigvet
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thanks uncleb' further points as follows:

 

‘It would not be a magistrates court order, but a county court judgement’

A: Marstons specifically refer to a ‘Magistrates Court Fine’

Ask marstons which county court awarded the CCJ and on what date, plus what reference numbers apply. Then Sons partner can phone the court.

A: Already done so in December but NO response

If marstons are telling porkies then warn them that they may be committing a criminal offence under the Administration of Justice Act 1970

A: this Act was referred to in a previous letter to CCI, who appointed Marstons

 

If the Insurers or their reps had applied for a CCJ, the court would have sent a court claim to the address they were given. This would have been the address where the Insurance was registered. Following the CCJ, the court would have sent details of the judgement to the address.

A: NO court papers received at new or old address

They can try to levy on Sons partners car,

A: She now does not have one – she sold it in 2011 and this is from where this dispute originated

 

Magistrates fine - Stopped by Police for not having Insurance ? Or other motoring offence ?. So nothing to do with Thames Insurance outstanding premium.

 

If it is court fine, then perhaps Sons Partner should contact the local magistrates court to see if any fine is noted against her.

 

Confused ! If Marstons have been written to with no response, , then I would ask Marstons for a copy of the court order they are using to try to enforce a fine or debt. They have to supply this on request.

We could do with some help from you.

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Confused ! If Marstons have been written to with no response, , then I would ask Marstons for a copy of the court order they are using to try to enforce a fine or debt. They have to supply this on request.

 

letter to Marstons in December 'As I am unaware of any case involving me ever going to court, let alone being able to defend myself, I request a copy of the said court order forthwith so that I may act accordingly'

 

NO response received to letter

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What is noted on the removal notice exactly ? Any clues about what this is about ?

 

Has your Sons partner tried phoning their office to find out what is going on, as no CCJ or court fine has ever been received.

We could do with some help from you.

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I've received a contact from Marstons about this thread.

 

They say that they would like to look into it if they could have a name and address or a reference number.

 

If this interests you then please email me the details to our admin email address - put "Marstons" in the subject line.

 

I don't think that you can lose anything by having them look into it directly for you

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It is good to hear that Marston Group view posts on the forum and are willing to investigate.

 

Other bailiff companies could learn a lesson from this !!!

 

PS: It would seem from this query that a County Court summons had been issued by Thames and as no defence was filed a CCJ was awarded. For the case to have been "transfered up" to Marston Group the judgment would need to be in excess of £600. Their High Court division would be enforcing the debt.

 

If correct.....then you would need to file an application to set aside the judgment AND to "stay the proceedings". Ploddertom is the expert on such procedures.

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PS: It would seem from this query that a County Court summons had been issued by Thames and as no defence was filed a CCJ was awarded. For the case to have been "transfered up" to Marston Group the judgment would need to be in excess of £600. Their High Court division would be enforcing the debt.

 

If correct.....then you would need to file an application to set aside the judgment AND to "stay the proceedings". Ploddertom is the expert on such procedures.

 

Thnaks TT but...

i) NO court papers were ever received at old or new address

ii) The sum ‘allegedly’ owed (for which NO explanation, breakdown or substantiation has been received despite being requested) stands at £605

iii) Marstons specifically refer to:

a) Letter mid December: ‘Being in possession of a Magistrates Court Order’

b) Bailiff note put through letterbox last Saturday: ‘Magistrates Court Fine’

As previously stated:

i) I paid for a court search and NO judgment has ever been passed against the individual concerned

ii) I have asked Martsons TWICE for a copy of the court order, but none has been forthcoming

Due to the lack of response or copy of the order I am unable to make an ‘application to set aside the judgment AND to "stay the proceedings" to which you refer

And as regards Marstons offer to investigate I have written to both their Sale and Waltham Cross office (and to CCI Legal who instructed them) and there has been NO response whatsoever!

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Did you send the letters by recorded delivery? if so have you checked they were signed for? also did you keep copies of the letters?

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Did you send the letters by recorded delivery? if so have you checked they were signed for? also did you keep copies of the letters?

 

faxed AND sent by post; and copies kept

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faxed AND sent by post; and copies kept

 

Was it by recorded post ? (i.e. to be signed for by Marstons)

Help us to keep on helping

Please consider making a donation, however small, if you have benefited from advice on the forums

 

 

This site is run solely on donations

 

My advice is based on my opinion and experience only. It is not to be taken as legal advice - if you are unsure you should seek professional help.

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Incredible

Despite faxing Marstons yesterday fully outlining the case, despite enclosing copies of previous letters (all unanswered), despite asking again for a copy of the ‘court order’ and despite specifically asking that their ‘heavy’ is called off until full facts are at hand and can be dealt with in an appropriate manner he has been knocking at my sons door again this afternoon!!!!

Note pushed through the letterbox states:

Final Notice

I shall remove your goods for sale at public auction’

(house & goods are my sons who is the innocent party in all this!)

Their client is referred to as ‘HMCTS Greater Manchester’

And still no response to letters, no copy of court order just threats, threats, threats!

Shame on you Marstons!

The ‘enforcement agent’ has left his telephone number – I suppose if Marstons won’t take notice of courteous correspondence there is no chance of him being obliging is there or should I call him?

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And of two fax numbers on Marstons correspondence:

 

i) 01992 703703 continually rings

ii) 01992 807389 continually engaged

 

So you can’t communicate by fax with them now!!

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Sounds like this is a fine and not a civil matter.

 

Sons partner may not be telling your son everything they know. Perhaps this is a very old offence they had not paid the fine for.

 

Sons partner needs to phone the court urgently to find out what they need to do.

 

http://212.137.36.113/HMCSCourtFinder/Search.do?court_id=1438

We could do with some help from you.

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you are right uncleb

 

I have spoken to the enforcement agent who informs me that he has a copy of a ‘magistrates court distress warrant’

From what I can understand Thames insurance, upset at not getting the original Motor Insurance certificate back, reported my sons partner to the DVLA for false/failure to declare the sale of a vehicle! I jest ye not!

DVLA must have decided to take action

This has gone to the magistrate’s court in Trafford, Manchester and in my son’s partner’s absence, and her being totally oblivious to the case, the case went against her and she was fined!

I repeat for the sake of clarity she never received court papers of any description

I have asked him for a copy of the ‘warrant’

Two points:

i) The enforcement agent is still threatening to come to my sons to seize property – can he force his way in and what are my sons rights as regarding his entry?

 

ii) Where does my son’s partner stand with the court case if she was unaware of it? Can she have it set aside and if so what is the procedure?

 

The most unbelievable aspect of all this is that despite sending a number of fulsome letters asking for substantiation, breakdown and reasoning of the debt you are TOTALLY ignored!

 

PS thanks very much for your help so far

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As far as I know the Son partner can attend the Magistrates court in Manchester and swear a statement in front of Magistrates to say that they were not made aware of the hearing. The Magistrates should then put a stop on current action and there will be another hearing. She needs to contact the the court urgently. The bailiffs should not force entry, if the property is not owned by the person owing the fine.

We could do with some help from you.

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i) It would appear that this case has nothing to do with an insurance company, as first thought, but has been instigated by the DVLA

ii) Marstons maintain that they have a ‘magistrates court distress warrant’ from August last year against my sons partner; I have now asked FOUR times for a copy of this. Yet having a paid search undertaken with ‘Trust Online’ in December there is NO record of ANY order against her at the address that she has lived at for the past 2 years

iii) This confirms my view that all previous documentation, court papers etc have been sent to an incorrect address

iv) The FIRST she knew of this case was upon receipt of Marstons first letter in late December

v) Once gain I have requested from Marstons a copy of any court papers, orders, client details etc so that I may deal with this in an appropriate manner which I have been unable to do so thus far.

vi) I have asked Marstons that until such time as we receive such documentation and have had a chance to speak to the court to clarify the situation that I respectfully request that any further visits by their enforcement agent are suspended. ...I hold my breath!

vii) One point which concerns my sons partner which I would like a quick response on please.. . My son works during the day and whilst his partner is busy putting the new baby in the car, can the bailiff simply walk in though the open front door to gain entry or does he have to be invited?

Thanks once again for help so far and in response to an earlier post my contact details have been forwarded by CAG to Marstons

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Yes bailiffs can enter through any unlocked door or window. As it is a fine, they can also ask the court for permission to break in using a locksmith.

 

I cannot underline the fact that your Sons partner needs to get down to the court urgently to swear the statutory declaration in front of magistrates, that she never received any court papers regarding a case taken up by DVLA. If she does not do this, then I suspect that bailiffs will be back this week and won't go away until the fine is paid to them.

We could do with some help from you.

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thanks uncle B but

i) I don't know which court to go to as Marstsons won't tell me - despite 4 requests

ii) the house, fixtures & fittings are the sole legal property of my son who is the innocent party in all this and you are saying they can break in HIS house?

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