Rossendales - England/Scotland

[will4298]

Hi everyone; I'd like some advice regarding a council tax debt that is being pursued by Rossendales.

 

 

I moved to England to live with my girlfriend as she was studying down there, lasted all of about 7 months.

 

This was about February of 2012. (edit.) I moved out of our flat in February and back to Glasgow where I've been since.

 

A month or so ago I had a letter from Rossendales hit my door step saying I have a debt to the council!

I spoke to the council and Rossendales informing them I had no court summons or any information about the alleged debt.

 

I was told that they only have to send the summons to the last known address (even though it was Lincoln city council who tracked me down over a year later!) I asked if they could track me down AFTER the court case, what stopped them doing it before? No answer, repeated themselves saying they were only obliged to send to old address (not much use to me).

 

I'm a student, unemployed and living off of approx £50 a week (less than JSA).

 

I was wondering if a English court order could be actioned in Scotland?

What upse

The total amount is a little over £160.

 

I've asked Rossendales to allow me to set up a plan of £3 a week, they declined so I told them I wouldn't deal with them and I'd pay to the council the £3 a week via their online payment, spoke to council who wouldn't do anything because "the debt is with Rossendales now" BS.

A little of something is better than a lot of nothing, right?

 

I also live in a shared house with some family, there is a car parked on the grass of our small front garden, it's broken down. This car is owned by a family member and doesn't belong to me!

It has outstanding finance on it, regards to proving beyond all reasonable doubt, does the bailiff have to call DVLA to find ownership?

 

Oh, they've sent me a letter today saying it has been assigned to an "enforcement officer".

What upsets me more is that they try to make this cowboy bailiff sound high and mighty.

If we want to do that; I am known as an education enforcement officer.

 

Anyway, any advice you have would be great.

 

Thanks.

Edited January 19, 2013 by will4298
add information.

[citizenB]

will flag your thread for site team.

[will4298]

will flag your thread for site team.

 

Thanks very much!

[wonkeydonkey]

http://www.inksters.com/enforcingenglishdebtinscotland.aspx

Sorry I can't answer the enforcement in scotland question but this might help.

 

The DVLA can tell them if a Mr. Bloggs is the registered keeper of a vehicle reg no ABC 123 ... All the DVLA can give is a yes/no answer to that question.... but they cannot tell them the actual name they hold as the registered keeper of that vehicle Easiest route to save a lot of hassle is for the third party owner to make a claim to ownership and provide the proof to back it up to Rottendales.

 

Write to the Council and tell them their agent is refusing to accept payments that can be seen affordable to you in your present circumstances and tell them you will be making those payments direct to them at £3.00 payable every Monday to satisfy the debt to them., make sure you do not default with the weekly payments and you will find there is little to nothing the Council can do thereafter.

 

WD

Edited January 19, 2013 by wonkeydonkey

[will4298]

The DVLA can tell them if a Mr. Bloggs is the registered keeper of a vehicle reg no ABC 123 ... All the DVLA can give is a yes/no answer to that question.... but they cannot tell them the actual name they hold as the registered keeper of that vehicle Easiest route to save a lot of hassle is for the third party owner to make a claim to ownership and provide the proof to back it up to Rottendales.

 

WD

 

Thanks for the reply; will look it up now!

 

As for the DVLA side of things, surely if the bailiff asks the DVLA if it belongs to me (gives them my names) and they say no that would be enough evidence to prove I wasn't the registered keeper of the car?

[wonkeydonkey]

Thanks for the reply; will look it up now!

 

As for the DVLA side of things, surely if the bailiff asks the DVLA if it belongs to me (gives them my names) and they say no that would be enough evidence to prove I wasn't the registered keeper of the car?

 

You would be right to think that...sadly Rottendales just do not know how to think logically, from what we read here on cag it would appear most of their bailiffs are uneducated to even the basics of enforcement, when things go wrong and they are in a tight corner of exposure their boss Mrs Green Jones just labels each of them as a 'single bad apple' ...even she 'can't do the maths' ???

[will4298]

You would be right to think that...sadly Rottendales just do not know how to think logically, from what we read here on cag it would appear most of their bailiffs are uneducated to even the basics of enforcement, when things go wrong and they are in a tight corner of exposure their boss Mrs Green Jones just labels each of them as a 'single bad apple' ...even she 'can't do the maths' ???

 

Thanks for the advice; as for the weekly payments I have no intention to stop paying and even less intention than that to pay a dime to Rossendales.

They can spend as much money as they want chasing me; I'm paying the debt.

 

To a certain degree, I'd like a bailiff to show up on my doorstep; I've heard lots about them and I'd love to see them try and intimidate me and/or my cousin.

I'll record all encounters with my camera (just so they have no way to back down from an inevitable mistake) and I'll print out the automated receipts I get from counci's online payment service, not that Rossendales care I'm paying it to the council but it's worth showing for proof to the camera.

[maroondevo52]

Hi,

 

Bailiffs cannot visit you in Scotland, they would have to apply to the court to get the court summons changed into a summary judegment then they can instruct sheriff officers to collect it.

I would not call them again and make sure you keep everything in wiriting.

I'd also go along with wonkeydonkey's advice regarding paying the Council direct.

[will4298]

Hi,

 

Bailiffs cannot visit you in Scotland, they would have to apply to the court to get the court summons changed into a summary judegment then they can instruct sheriff officers to collect it.

I would not call them again and make sure you keep everything in wiriting.

I'd also go along with wonkeydonkey's advice regarding paying the Council direct.

 

Thanks a lot.

 

And I'm guessing by what others have said about Rossendales that they haven't taken the initiative and got the summary judgement?

Also, is there much difference in a summary judgement and court summons?

 

The hearing has taken place apparently (even though it was "heard" at a bulk court centre) so technically NO ONE gets a hearing, they're just judgements issued.

As for my first encounter with their bailiffs, do I ask for a copy of the warrant and a copy of the sheriffs court's summary judgement too?

[maroondevo52]

As for my first encounter with their bailiffs, do I ask for a copy of the warrant and a copy of the sheriffs court's summary judgement too?

 

I would very much doubt you'll have any visit from a bailiff, they will have to apply to your Local Sheriff Court before taking any further action.

 

I'm not sure what procedure the Sheriff Officers would have to go through as the 'case' has already been decided in England.

[will4298]

I would very much doubt you'll have any visit from a bailiff, they will have to apply to your Local Sheriff Court before taking any further action.

 

I'm not sure what procedure the Sheriff Officers would have to go through as the 'case' has already been decided in England.

I don't trust Rossendales to know the law or the procedures attaining to it.

 

I havea strong suspicion that they will visit me on the off chance I bend and pay them.

If this is the case, I should ask for the original order along with the sheriffs summary, right?

 

I've read that if a bailiff clamps a car without first levying it or ascertaining if it is owned by the debtor then the legal owner of the car can legally remove the clamp by cutting the chain?

 

Just want to make sure I'm covered before his visit, if he doesn't call a little bit of education won't hurt!

[ploddertom]

Rossendales won't & can't visit you as the Certificate the Bailiff holds is only valid in England or Wales. Maroondevo52 has explained the situation in Scotland, personally I think it will go back to the Council and if you tick along at £3 per week then it would be difficult for the Council to do much more.

[IdaInFife]

to confirm as above

 

Bailiffs can't and won't visit you up here.

 

They would need to apply to the high court to have the LO transferred into a summary warrant up here and then would need to employ sheriff officers to enforce the summary warrant.

 

As you are willing to make payment, I am assuming the monies they are claiming are due and correct?

 

 

And if so then make the payments online direct to the council.

 

IF they were to transfer to the scottish court system - if you have been making payment theres not much a court would do about it.

[seanamarts]

I am quite surprised that Rossendales didnt know this, or they do and hoped you didnt.

 

As you are on benefits you are potentially vulnerable so it would need to be handed back to the council anyway.

 

Hopefully they will read this and hand it back any way knowing that it may end up costing them more to pursue it.

[will4298]

I am quite surprised that Rossendales didnt know this, or they do and hoped you didnt.

 

As you are on benefits you are potentially vulnerable so it would need to be handed back to the council anyway.

 

Hopefully they will read this and hand it back any way knowing that it may end up costing them more to pursue it.

 

Thanks for the replies.

 

I kind of hope he turns up; I'd like to ask him if he has any permission to be at my door.

 

I'm not on benefits per se; I was on a full time care order until 2010 and as I'm studying in full time education the local government who issued my care order are obliged to pay my rent and £50ish a week for my general needs.

This isn't technically classed as a state benefit - it's more of an allowance to young people leaving care.

I only started receiving this in October last year.

 

Trying to explain to Rossendales that I simply do not have the money is like breaking teeth.

They can demand all they want but when I simply do not have it, they're going to have a hard time getting it.

 

As for removal of goods; I own very little and if some meat headed, uneducated A-level skipping **** comes to my door and asks for entry he'll get an option of retorts.

If he plays up and starts shouting; I've got nothing to be ashamed of, I'm happy to send him on his way - all on video of course!

[brassnecked]

I think if they are stupid enough to go to Scotland to pester you, you could call the police as they will be fraudulently misrepresenting their powers under Scottish law, their certificates being merely toilet paper north of the border. can't see a Glaswegian copper having any truck with their excuses as he feels their collars.

Edited January 20, 2013 by brassnecked

[Sparks_]

Thanks for the replies.

 

 

As for removal of goods; I own very little and if some meat headed, uneducated A-level skipping **** comes to my door and asks for entry he'll get an option of retorts.

If he plays up and starts shouting; I've got nothing to be ashamed of, I'm happy to send him on his way - all on video of course!

I love your description