Extenuating Circumstance

[kittiekat]

I received a ticket for parking on a single yellow line one Saturday. I was parked outside a shop for less than 5 minutes and was in no way impeding anyone. I had gone into the shop to collect an item of furniture that I was buying and that was the easiest place to park as they could just carry it out of the shop and put it in the car for me. It is not something I could lift on my own. I was always under the impression that you could park in places such as this and get given a 5 minutes' grace' period. I was in the window and could see my car and moved away for less than 2 minutes to pay at the till. I came back to check and saw the warden clearly 'waiting'. When i rushed out he said that it was 'too late'. I said to him he could not have been there as i was looking at the car and had only briefly moved away and he denied this. The ticket was sent in the post which suggested to me he had not written it out fully . It took 2 months from the date to arrive. The ticket says the LA is prepared to consider 'extenuating circumstance' I feel my situation warrant this. Does anyone know if this is likely to be considered and also can anyone clarify the rules around the 5minute 'grace' period.

[sgtbush]

their is no grace period set in statute law

 

you have admitted you were parked and it was the easiest place to park

you might not of been impeding anyone coz you were the only person parked their, everyone else in the town was following the law and NOT parking their.

 

you were rightly given the ticket

take it on the chin and pay up

[kittiekat]

Thanks for your response but you seem to have missed the crux of what i was saying; ie there was no where else to park to load the item of furniture in my car. Had i parked further awasy there was not way the staff would have been able to get the furniture into my car. In effect, I was loading but there was np such loading bay near the shop.

[sgtbush]

their is always other places to park, everyone in the town parks somewhere legally

if you were loading then you should of asked the store to either carry it to your car parked legally

or wait at the kerb while you fetch your car, then loaded it, therefore proving to the CEO that you were loading and not parking

 

the engine was turned off and no one was present, therefore parked, or abandoned

 

 

Waiting restrictions indicated by yellow lines apply to the carriageway, pavement and verge. You

may stop to load or unload (unless there are also loading restrictions as described below) or while

passengers board or alight. Double yellow lines mean no waiting at any time, unless there are signs

that specifically indicate seasonal restrictions. The times at which the restrictions apply for other road

markings are shown on nearby plates or on entry signs to controlled parking zones. If no days are

shown on the signs, the restrictions are in force every day including Sundays and Bank Holidays

Edited January 13, 2013 by sgtbush

[Michael Browne]

Firstly there is an exemption for loading, including completing paperwork. This assumes the item of furniture was pre-ordered and you were merely collecting it.

 

Secondly if you spoke to the warden, why was the ticket sent by post, why was the ticket not placed on your car?

 

A regulation 10 pcn (one served by post) must be served within 28 days

Edited January 14, 2013 by Michael Browne

[crem]

their is always other places to park, everyone in the town parks somewhere legally

if you were loading then you should of asked the store to either carry it to your car parked legally

or wait at the kerb while you fetch your car, then loaded it, therefore proving to the CEO that you were loading and not parking

 

the engine was turned off and no one was present, therefore parked, or abandoned

 

 

Waiting restrictions indicated by yellow lines apply to the carriageway, pavement and verge. You

may stop to load or unload (unless there are also loading restrictions as described below) or while

passengers board or alight. Double yellow lines mean no waiting at any time, unless there are signs

that specifically indicate seasonal restrictions. The times at which the restrictions apply for other road

markings are shown on nearby plates or on entry signs to controlled parking zones. If no days are

shown on the signs, the restrictions are in force every day including Sundays and Bank Holidays

 

sgtbush, you appear to have stated the exemption by which kittiekat would have been allowed to park there to load a (possibly large item from teh sound of it), yet seem adamant that (s)he should not have done so. Not sure which you think it is now.

[sgtbush]

their is always other places to park, everyone in the town parks somewhere legally

if you were loading then you should of asked the store to either carry it to your car parked legally

or wait at the kerb while you fetch your car, then loaded it, therefore proving to the CEO that you were loading and not parking

 

the engine was turned off and no one was present, therefore parked, or abandoned

 

 

Waiting restrictions indicated by yellow lines apply to the carriageway, pavement and verge. You

may stop to load or unload (unless there are also loading restrictions as described below) or while

passengers board or alight. Double yellow lines mean no waiting at any time, unless there are signs

that specifically indicate seasonal restrictions. The times at which the restrictions apply for other road

markings are shown on nearby plates or on entry signs to controlled parking zones. If no days are

shown on the signs, the restrictions are in force every day including Sundays and Bank Holidays

 

 

already stated, how would the CEO know that the car was their to load if the driver was not present, the OP stated that they were in the shop to collect, the CEO would of observed the car for a number of mins, the driver did not return until the ticket was either started to print or a drive off.

 

im suspecting the OP was away from the car a lot longer than she thinks.

if the OP saw the CEO why did she not say look, im loading, here is the very big item im loading into the car

 

i agree if loading was taking place then no ticket should of been issued, but the way it was discribed in the original post, the car looked parked

[sgtbush]

Firstly there is an exemption for loading, including completing paperwork. This assumes the item of furniture was pre-ordered and you were merely collecting it.

 

Secondly if you spoke to the warden, why was the ticket sent by post, why was the ticket not placed on your car?

 

A regulation 10 pcn (one served by post) must be served within 28 days

 

their are a couple of excemptions from reg 10, wether they apply in this case or not i dont know

(5) Paragraph (6) applies where—

(a)within 14 days of the appropriate date the enforcement authority has requested the Secretary of State to supply the relevant particulars in respect of the vehicle involved in the contravention and those particulars have not been supplied before the expiration of the 28-day period;

(b)an earlier regulation 10 penalty charge notice relating to the same contravention has been cancelled under regulation 23(5)©; or

©an earlier regulation 10 penalty charge notice relating to the same contravention has been cancelled under regulation 5 of the Representations and Appeals Regulations.

[kittiekat]

Thanks to MB re regulation 10, I will look into that carefully as the notice was issue over 43 days from the the occurrence.

@sgtbush- not only did i come out and state to the CEO that loading was taking place but also the people from the shop but it made no difference. As you well know these CEOs have their targets and really don't care for reason.

[Michael Browne]

 

Secondly if you spoke to the warden, why was the ticket sent by post, why was the ticket not placed on your car?

 

what prevented the CEO from placing it on your car or handing it to you?

[green_and_mean]

I'm confused, how did you manage to load the furniture then get in the vehicle and drive away before the CEO served the PCN? Surely if you returned mid issue the CEO would have seen that you were loading a large piece of furniture?

[kittiekat]

Thats my point, he had just got there and I had to drive away but he was still telling me it was too late. I was not able to have the furniture loaded due to this even though the people came out and was clearly saying they needed to put it in my car.

[ericsbrother]

You have 20 minutes loading time. Tell the council you were loading and ask them to cancel the ticket. If they say they wont, you put on your appeal form that the contravention did not occur as you were loading. If they still dont agree to cancel the PCN then you take it to PATAS (London) or their equivalent and make sure you have a copy of your receipt for the furniture. CEO's are not allowed to cancel their own PCN's but they can make note in their book saying they saw you loading etc. As for issuing tickets after you have left- that has been allowable for several years but a CEO must have a very good reason for doing so and I dont think your case is a good reason for them to issue a PCN through the post. Ask for a copy of his notebook for that day, they will be obliged to hand it over anyway at the final appeal so I cant see them saying no at this stage when you can prove you were loading.

[green_and_mean]

You have 20 minutes loading time. Tell the council you were loading and ask them to cancel the ticket. If they say they wont, you put on your appeal form that the contravention did not occur as you were loading. If they still dont agree to cancel the PCN then you take it to PATAS (London) or their equivalent and make sure you have a copy of your receipt for the furniture. CEO's are not allowed to cancel their own PCN's but they can make note in their book saying they saw you loading etc. As for issuing tickets after you have left- that has been allowable for several years but a CEO must have a very good reason for doing so and I dont think your case is a good reason for them to issue a PCN through the post. Ask for a copy of his notebook for that day, they will be obliged to hand it over anyway at the final appeal so I cant see them saying no at this stage when you can prove you were loading.

 

No loading took place however so the contravention did occur, showing a receipt doesn't really help as it would imply they were shopping for furniture rather than just parking for the purpose of loading the goods.

[crem]

Drriving off without actually completing the loading also won't help the cause as it sounds like the OP did.

[kittiekat]

Its an instant reaction to drive off if a CEO is about to issue a ticket; the fact that I was there to load and it didnt happen due to the CEO telling me its too late in full view of the two staff coming out and telling me to hang on while they get the stuff meant i took this action. The other thing is, I received no ticket through the post, just a NTO for a £130 (Which i believe is sent after non payment?) of a ticket and this was sent after 43 days. Usually tickets are £60 range. I am now thinking the CEO is either claiming he put the ticket on my car, or they may claim it was sent to me and I did not get it!!

[sailor sam]

Can you clarify that you had already purchased the item of furniture BEFORE you parked on the yellow line?

 

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[crem]

Its an instant reaction to drive off if a CEO is about to issue a ticket; the fact that I was there to load and it didnt happen due to the CEO telling me its too late in full view of the two staff coming out and telling me to hang on while they get the stuff meant i took this action.

I don't follow? You were told by the CEO that it was too late and the PCN issued, surely that should have reassured you that you may as well carry on with your loading as nothing was now going to change the PCN. i.e. he had issued 1, he can't issue a 2nd just coz you still didn't move but it would have added creedance to why you were parked there!

 

The other thing is, I received no ticket through the post, just a NTO for a £130 (Which i believe is sent after non payment?)

AIUI a postal PCN (section 10) is also a NTO

 

of a ticket and this was sent after 43 days. Usually tickets are £60 range. I am now thinking the CEO is either claiming he put the ticket on my car, or they may claim it was sent to me and I did not get it!!

,,

[starfarer]

just to confirm that this actually is Reg10 PCN and not NTO? not sure what they look like but I've seen many people mistakes one for another. Does the ticket has any section with words " this notice has been served by post because CEO........"