Photocopies from Debt Collector

[tanglewood01]

I'm sorry if this is a silly question but I haven't been able to find the answer through searches.

 

If a debt collector can only provide photocopies, is a debt enforceable?

 

I have done a Subject Access request, and a follow-up when I received much less than I was expecting.

 

I used a template from here so included the clause that failure to supply documents would confirm that they did not exist.

 

All documents relating to the debt I'm dealing with are photocopies.

 

If they do not have the original CCA, is there anything they can do?

 

My concern is of course, it is easy to doctor a photocopied document.

[huggy41]

you are not entitled to the orginal but your are entitled to a photocopy of it.

[KaptRoger]

Hi - my understanding is that copies are fine (even ones that are "re-constituted"), its just IF the matter ever goes to court then they must produce the original.

 

If you think about it if the original agreement allows them to take you to court and claim ONE MILLION POUNDS (with suitable Doctor Evil laugh), then the document is worth ONE MILLION POUNDS. That being the case it would be foolish of them to send out such a document and it get "lost in the post".

 

Sorry to have put a bit of a downer on things.

 

Things to consider:

- the age of the debt - is it over 6 years since you have made a payment or agreed in writing that it is yours?

- are all the terms and conditions mentioned in the agreement present in what they have sent you?

 

The members of the site team will be able to provide more specific and accurate advice soon.

[dx100uk]

bit of a silly question if you think about it........

 

 

if they send the originals

 

you destroy them

 

can they go to court on a copy they took before they sent you the originals?

 

tell us about the debt please

 

the days of using 'paperwork errors' to wriggle out of debts are long gone

thanks to the antics of these get out of debt spoofing companies

 

dx

[Amber Leaf]

Am I right in thinking that for pre-2007 agreements that re-cons are not admissible and that they have to produce the original signed agreement?

[dx100uk]

they do, but you still need to becareful that you dont hit the judge lottery

 

it would be a fool who stands infront of a judge and claim 'a paperwork error'

means the debt is not theirs when there is a clear financial link and records of past use/payments.

 

dx

[tanglewood01]

Thank you all for input. Having re-read my post, I can see how it might look like I was expecting them to send me originals, but I was not. Sorry, my mistake.

 

Basically, I'm wondering if they do not have the original, what difference this would make. The copy of the Credit Agreement I received was a photocopy of a fax, and a poor one at that. They claim the original lender has no paperwork anymore so I'm wondering if when the debt was transferred, the original Credit Agreement has gone walkies and all they have is a fax.

 

This is only one of several issues with the debt I am helping to deal with, on behalf of someone else including harassment, breach of OFT guidelines, no proof of proper assignment etc. This would just be an additional part of the case. There are several aspects I'm experienced in challenging but this is just something I'm not clear on.

[unclebulgaria67]

For a pre April 07 credit arrangement not taken up online, they would probably need the original CCA, if it went to court. But normal judge lottery would apply, so arguments would have to be properly made, if a court claim was every received.

 

The DCA has complied with the CCA request arguably and therefore you have reached a standoff position. They will say no dispute so pay up and you can say that you are not satisfied that the CCA request was fulfilled properly, as the copy of the agreement is poor and lacks relevant t&c's that would have applied at the time.

[42man]

You might find it useful to read a high court case called Kotecha vs Phoenix