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    • Done.   I wont be able to send the SAR until the end of the month for TT as I wont get paid until then and I'm a little out of pocket as its my first month working after a spell of no work. Wil that be an issue?   Also what's to stop people jsut selling ficticious debts off? As far as I know, a telecoms provider can't charge you when you move and they can't supply, meaning that a large proportion of that debt is ficticious?
    • Good evening DX100   Here is a draft of my response to the court order.  I would be obliged if you could review it and avise me if I am on the right track.   Defendant Statement of Position in Response to the Order of the Sheriff   The defendant suffered Severe Depression illness almost 12 months prior to the closer of the Bank account. HBOS was made aware of the defendant illness.  A Medical Certificate dated 15 Sept 2017 was handed over to the bank as a proof. (A copy of the report will be submitted exclusively to the court review) The defendant, with the support of her ex-partner, sought a resolution from the OC regarding the escalation of her OD account, which it was mostly formed of extortionate bank charges/penalties being applied to the account. HBOS agreed to reduce the outstand OD sum to £XXX and closed the account. The defendant is confident that her ex-partner has settled the agreed sum with OC, but not absolutely certain, considering her health state at that time. She has been actively trying to reach for her ex-partner for documented evidence, but the fact that, we believe, he is a currently deployed by the UK military forces abroad and communication has been, to put it politely, very difficult due to the nature of his deployment. As the court is aware, the defendant has been trying to retrieve the data of her dealing with/from OC which it should reflect history of the above.  The defendant has already written twice to HBOS, as well as visiting her bank branch, on 01 March 2021, in person demanding the requested data.  HBOS promised to send the data to her as soon as they can. In addition to the above reasoning and contend, the defendant refute the claimants claim is owed or payable.  Due to punitive and extortionate fees the facility became untenable. Any alleged balance  claimed will consist totally of default penalties, punitive charges levied on the account for alleged late, rejected or over limit payments. The court will be aware that these charge types and the recoverability thereof have been judicially declared to be susceptible to assessments of fairness under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 The Office of Fair Trading v Abbey National PLC and others (2009). I will contend at trial that such charges are unfair in their entirety and any alleged balance was due to punitive and extortionate charges . It is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed. Therefore the Claimant is put to strict proof to:-               a.    Provide a copy agreement/facility arrangement along with the Terms and Conditions at inception, which this claim is based on.               b.    Provide a copy of the Notice served under 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974 Demand /Recall Notice and Notice of Assignment.               c.    Provide a breakdown of their excessive charging/fees levied to the account and justify how the Claimant has reached the amount claimed.               d.    Show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim.               e.    Evidence how they have complied with sections III & IV of Practice Direction - Pre-action Conduct.     10.   By reason of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.
    • Same thing. The fact that you declared £4.99 means that is the extent of any reasonable foreseeably consequence. Just go for that small amount. If they cause any problems then you can have a laugh when they spend many times more than what you're claiming in order to resist you. In future, when you contract with somebody – you need to understand that effectively it is an exchange of the reasonable expectations which you create in each other by your agreement.  
    • Current situation: contacted myhermes website's robot talk about the parcel and waiting for their email response. Thanks @BankFodder   I understand that if I were going to pursue under contract law, £4.99 would be the amount that I am entitled for compensate. How about if I were going to pursue this matter under tort - negligence? Would this allow me to pursue them according the true value of the items?
    • Hi UncleB, thanks for responding. I did call them back and it appears to be hit & miss with Devitt and dependent upon which Customer service agent you get.   Spoke with a very pleasant lady and told her that I, like them recorded all calls and gave date time of call and specific time at which a green card was stipulated in order for me to take out the policy.   *Two days later a hard copy of the green card landed on my doorstep. *Free of charge too.
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    • Ebay Packlink and Hermes - destroyed item as it was "damaged". https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/430396-ebay-packlink-and-hermes-destroyed-item-as-it-was-damaged/&do=findComment&comment=5087347
      • 25 replies
    • I sent in the bailiffs to the BBC. They collected £350. It made me smile.
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    • Hi @BankFodder
      Sorry for only updating you now, but after your guidance with submitting the claim it was pretty straight forward and I didn't want to unnecessarily waste your time. Especially with this guide you wrote here, so many thanks for that
      So I issued the claim on day 15 and they requested more time to respond.
      They took until the last day to respond and denied the claim, unsurprisingly saying my contract was with Packlink and not with them.
      I opted for mediation, and it played out very similarly to other people's experiences.
      In the first call I outlined my case, and I referred to the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 as the reason to why I do in fact have a contract with them. 
      In the second call the mediator came back with an offer of the full amount of the phone and postage £146.93, but not the court costs. I said I was not willing to accept this and the mediator came across as a bit irritated that I would not accept this and said I should be flexible. I insisted that the law was on my side and I was willing to take them to court. The mediator went back to Hermes with what I said.
      In the third call the mediator said that they would offer the full amount. However, he said that Hermes still thought that I should have taken the case against Packlink instead, and that they would try to recover the court costs themselves from Packlink.
      To be fair to them, if Packlink wasn't based in Spain I would've made the claim against them instead. But since they are overseas and the law lets me take action against Hermes directly, it's the best way of trying to recover the money.
      So this is a great win. Thank you so much for your help and all of the resources available on this site. It has helped me so much especially as someone who does not know anything about making money claims.
      Many thanks, stay safe and have a good Christmas!
        • Thanks
    • Hermes and mediation hints. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/428981-hermes-and-mediation-hints/&do=findComment&comment=5080003
      • 1 reply
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Can anyone help, myself and my partner used to run 2 pubs however due to lack of support from the pub company and also extortionate rent we quit in February 2012. During March 2012 we wrote to pub company confirming that we wished to make an offer of repayment of any sums owed in respect of goods however disputed the level of rent we hd been charged on both pubs. We received no reply. In November 2012 we received a pre action protocl letter from pub companys solicitor , we sent a lengthy reply stating we had wanted to make a repayment offer in respect of the o/s goods but disputed the rent and had received no communication from the pub company. We received no reply to this letter.


We have now received a claim form in respect of the sum of £39,245.45 which is stated is in respect of goods. This is not broke down between goods and services. What do we do as we wish to avoid a CCJ, myself and my partner have nothing the pub trade nearly caused us to go bankrupt and we now survive on a small income, we explained to both pub company and their representation that they had nothing to gain by taking this action as we own nothing and have nothing???


Any advice on defences to this debt and the fact the rent and goods have been lumped together for claim form purposes?????

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You would need to request that they re plead their Particulars of Claim and particularise..... CPR 16.








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  • 3 weeks later...

I submitted a defence based on they did not allow time to reach a settlement have ignored attempts to settle, have nothing to gain by taking Court action as we have no assets or money and they they should re plead their particulars of claim, I have now received an Allocation Questionnaire??? W

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You need to get the AQ sent off to the Court within the time scale.

Judgment will only be entered by default if you ignore Court directions-or on conclusion of a trial which is some way down the line yet.Do you want help filling the AQ in ?

We have had 2 or 3 previous reported cases of pub companies taking legal action.

I will see if I can find one that I remember was a lengthly case.

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Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.



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I submitted a defence based on they did not allow time to reach a settlement have ignored attempts to settle, have nothing to gain by taking Court action as we have no assets or money and they they should re plead their particulars of claim, I have now received an Allocation Questionnaire??? W


You need to be very careful here. Saying that they did not allow time to reach a settlement and you have no assets is not a defence to their claim. It would only be relevant to the amount of legal costs you are ordered to pay. If there are any reasons why they are not entitled to the amounts they are claiming, you need to raise this now. You will be deemed to have admitted anything claimed in the POC that is not in defence, so it will be very difficult to challenge the amounts later. If your defence does not claim a denial of legal responsibility (as opposed to ability to pay) I imagine the pub's solicitors will try to get a summary judgment (i.e. expedited judgment without a full trial). If you want to challenge the amounts then you need to amend your defence to deny liability for the £39,245.45 and making a request for them to particularise their particulars of claim as suggested by andyorch.


Its important to think about your strategy generally. If you are clearly liable for the money but you just can't afford to pay, then the reality of the situation is that you cannot stop the pub from getting a CCJ. You can write to them explaining the situation but you cannot stop them. If they go for a CCJ monthly repayments would have to be agreed with the pub or set by the court at a later stage as obviously they cannot take what you do not have. Make sure you explain this in writing to the pub's solicitors in a letter with the heading "without prejudice" and it would be a good idea to offer monthly repayments. You need to try and get the solicitors to advise the pub that pursuing this might not be worth the legal costs, do not simply rely on what you told the pub before because it clearly has not been listened to.


If you fight the claim through the courts then you will buy some more time but remember that the loser pays the winners legal costs. If you fight this tooth and nail and take it to trial you could easily end up with an additional bill for tens of thousands for the pub's legal costs. I guess this does not matter if you literally have no assets, but do be careful if you have any assets the pub might try to get their hands on (e.g. your house if you are a homeowner).




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Our argument is we agree to the money owed on the account for goods purchased, but not the rent that they have charged for the properties. They have however lumped it together as one amount for goods???? Any help with AQ would be great if you have ones against pubs??? Do I try and negotiate with solicitors directly or just deal with the Court????

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If you didn't explain that you aren't liable for the rent in the defence, you need to amend your defence to include it ASAP. Any arguments you want to raise in court need to go in the defence, a holding defence is not enough.


It is always a good idea to negotiate with the other side's solicitors, because this will help you when the court comes to look at costs and may help you get a better deal than you would otherwise. Do remember that significant legal costs will get added to the bill if this goes all the way and you lose. Given the amounts at stake it is worth trying to get some proper legal advice here. Good luck.

Edited by steampowered




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