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    • Which would require a hearing....so the fee would be £255.00
    • When providing a copy of an executed agreement in response to a request under section 78(1) of the Act:   a.     must a creditor provide a photocopy (or other form of complete copy) of the original agreement that was signed by the debtor or at least provide a copy which is derived directly from the original agreement or complete copy thereof? or b.     can a creditor provide a document which is a reconstitution of the original agreement which may be from sources other than the actual signed agreement itself?   It was held that a creditor can satisfy its duty under section 78 by providing a reconstituted version of the executed agreement which may be from sources other than the actual signed agreement itself.   The judge accepted that as a matter of law, section 78 does not itself require any particular explanation as to how the copy was made. However, as a matter of good practice and so as not to mislead the debtor, it is desirable that the creditor should explain that it is providing a reconstituted as opposed to a physical copy of the executed agreement. This will also explain why the copy might otherwise look a little odd. The creditor can also explain in the letter that this procedure is satisfactory under the Act. The judge also provided that the following information needs to be included in the reconstituted copy agreement (assuming of course that it was present in the original):   1.     Heading: Credit Agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 2.     Name and address of the debtor 3.     Name and address of the creditor 4.     Cancellation clause applicable to the executed agreement.   All of the above may be provided on a sheet which is separate from the full statement of terms and conditions which also forms part of the reconstituted agreement. The creditor may, however, decide to reconstitute the agreement in a different way so that, for example, the information above is populated electronically onto the same sheet as that which sets out the terms and conditions, or some of them. The judge stated that he did not intend to prescribe the precise form of the reconstituted agreement. The key point is what information it should contain, subject to the point that its format should not be such as to mislead the debtor as to what he agreed to.   The judge also considered whether a statement like the one appearing in the reconstructed application form in Carey referring to the agreement to the terms and conditions "attached" needs to be included in the reconstituted copy. Alternatively if the application form had said "I agree to the terms overleaf", should that statement be included. The judge held that this aspect of the form is not necessary for the purpose of the section 78 copy, although there is nothing to stop a bank from putting it in or indeed from furnishing a copy of the type of application form or signature page that the debtor would have signed, as some banks have done. The statement referring to terms and conditions is not itself prescribed information and the supply of the terms and conditions which were applicable at the time will tell the debtor what he needs to know in terms of the content of what he signed up to, including the presence (or otherwise) of the prescribed terms.   In practical terms what this is likely to mean is that if the creditor chooses to use as the section 78 copy the section 63 copy, which would have been provided to that particular debtor at the time following execution of the agreement, this will be sufficient provided that the information referred to above is supplied. This exercise is not a mere formality. The creditor will need to check carefully that the details of the debtor at the time are correct and that those are the particular terms (including prescribed terms) that he/she agreed to. This is to ensure that it is an honest and accurate copy.   Must a creditor provide a document which would comply (if signed) with the requirements of the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 (Regulations) as to form, as at the date the agreement was made in order to comply with section 78?   A creditor need not, in complying with section 78, provide a document which would comply (if signed) with the requirements of the Regulations as to form, as at the date the agreement was made.   Must the copy provided under section 78 include the debtor's name and address as at the date when the agreement was made, and if so in what form? The section 78 copy must contain the name and address of the debtor as it was at the time of the execution of the agreement. But the creditor can provide the name and address from whatever source it has of those details. It does not have to take them from the executed agreement itself.     If an agreement has been varied by the creditor under a unilateral power of variation, is a copy of the executed agreement as varied, a sufficient copy for the purposes of section 78(1), or must the creditor provide a copy of the original agreement as well?   If an agreement has been varied by the creditor under a unilateral power of variation, the creditor must still provide a copy of the original agreement, as well as the varied terms.     As your agreement is post April 2007  Section 61(1)(a) and 127(3)   Consumer Credit Act 1974 would not apply.   Andy
    • well start a new thread for the court claim.   as for this one i'd await the letter of claim  
    • Useful information...   And....   https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part55
    • nice and ofcourse totally unlawful.   £349.50 is the usual sum RLP try and fleece out of people under some silly civil threats none of goes to the store it all goes in RLP's pocket for their next staff holiday paid for by mugs that fall for their twaddle ignore!!
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Vet and DCA

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Just after some advice please. My vet bill was issued in late Sept and there was a discrepancy over the amount. It was amended and a new bill sent out whilst i was on holiday. When I got back it was lost in all the holiday post. Eventually (mid-Nov) my wife found it and sent a cheque (£71) from work via business post - usually arrives next working day. Now, my dog fell ill yesterday and I need a vet to see her so I called and they claim that my account has been passed to a DCA and there is nothing they can do!

 

I called my bank and they said the cheque has not been processed and 'stopped' it for me. I called the vet back and offered immediate payment over the phone to be told they can't accept it as it is in the hands of their DCA as was passed to them on 28th Nov. It is now 28th Dec and I haven't had ANY comms from them whatsoever.

 

I have checked the bill from the vet and it says nothing about accounts being passed to DCA's or anything like that. It merely states that overdue accounts will attract a 3% monthly charge.

 

My question is this - are they able to pass over an account without any formal notification? I am in business myself and I send an invoice, first payment reminder, second payment reminder with statement and then a letter advising legal recourse if payment not received within 14 days. Surely they will be no different?

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dca have no powers to add anything to a bill

neither have the vets

 

why not take the bill in to them and pay it?

 

dx


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I offered and they said they wouldn't take payment as the DCA were dealing. I have been into them just now and she tried to add a £40 charge but I insisted my contract was with them and seeing as neither they nor I had received any comms from the DCA that they would accept the original outstanding payment, with interest and deem the matter settled. I walked away with them telling me they had accepted payment but that they would look into it properly on Monday. As far as I'm concerned that is an end to it. The DCA can sing for it seeing as neither I or the vet have heard from them regarding this matter.

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a dca has NO LEGAL REMIT

 

to add anything to a debt.

 

dx


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typically because people pay a dca on a debt they do not OWE to the DCA

 

they owe it to the OC

 

then the DCA take a 'cut'

 

dx


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Interesting, I run a couple of businesses and was recently charged £40 by a DCA for their 'fees' in collecting an overdue account. I received no notification, just a letter demanding the overdue amount and £40 + interest. Are you saying they cannot do this?

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correct

 

you could of paid the debt directly without the fees.

 

dx


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I did pay it direct but they insisted on paying the fees. Then they 'closed' our account. I am sure I may have some recourse on this now then.

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unless it is written in the agreed t+c's they cannot charge a fee

 

what i mean is

 

pay the original creditor/invoice not a debt collector

 

never ever pay a dca anything.

 

dx


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My vet tried to send my account to a DCA for £38. After they'd had over £650 from me in 2 days.

 

But I wrote them a snotty letter advising that the whole reason for me not wanting to pay the £38 was due to my dog catching Parvo IN THEIR PRACTICE and the £650 they had out of me the day before the dog was PTS was more than enough.

 

And I know full well they caught Parvo from them as they had addmitted the day before that the7y had 38 cases of Parvo in that week.

 

I havent heard off them since June and my doggies are now reg'd elsewhere.

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Hi

 

What I would also consider is a Formal Complaint to the veternary surgery (if it is part of a chain try to find out the Head Office and send complaint their).

 

Now remember as the DCA services have been employed by that vets surgery they ultimately have the powers to instruct that DCA to stop collection as payment has been recieved by the vets surgery.

 

So the vets surgery excuse that their is nothing they can do is BULL.

 

Now if you do complain in writing (always get proof of posting and keep a good paper trail) and I would ask for a copy of the following Documents:

 

1. Surgery Terms & Conditions.

2. Complaints Procedure.

3. Overdue Account Payments Policy and Procedure.

4. Account Statement.

5. Full Head Office Address-(Only if Part of a Chain)

 

You also require a full explanation as to why the Surgery is refusing your request to pay this account on numerous occasions.

 

Due to the Vets Surgery refusal to accept payment for this account I now place this 'IN DISPUTE' and require you to let your (DCA Name) know that this account is 'IN DISPUTE'.

 

 

NEVER talk to a DCA on the Phone nor hand over any payment to these people only deal with the Creditor (Vets Surgery), a DCA has no powers.

Edited by stu007

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