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    • Which would require a hearing....so the fee would be £255.00
    • When providing a copy of an executed agreement in response to a request under section 78(1) of the Act:   a.     must a creditor provide a photocopy (or other form of complete copy) of the original agreement that was signed by the debtor or at least provide a copy which is derived directly from the original agreement or complete copy thereof? or b.     can a creditor provide a document which is a reconstitution of the original agreement which may be from sources other than the actual signed agreement itself?   It was held that a creditor can satisfy its duty under section 78 by providing a reconstituted version of the executed agreement which may be from sources other than the actual signed agreement itself.   The judge accepted that as a matter of law, section 78 does not itself require any particular explanation as to how the copy was made. However, as a matter of good practice and so as not to mislead the debtor, it is desirable that the creditor should explain that it is providing a reconstituted as opposed to a physical copy of the executed agreement. This will also explain why the copy might otherwise look a little odd. The creditor can also explain in the letter that this procedure is satisfactory under the Act. The judge also provided that the following information needs to be included in the reconstituted copy agreement (assuming of course that it was present in the original):   1.     Heading: Credit Agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 2.     Name and address of the debtor 3.     Name and address of the creditor 4.     Cancellation clause applicable to the executed agreement.   All of the above may be provided on a sheet which is separate from the full statement of terms and conditions which also forms part of the reconstituted agreement. The creditor may, however, decide to reconstitute the agreement in a different way so that, for example, the information above is populated electronically onto the same sheet as that which sets out the terms and conditions, or some of them. The judge stated that he did not intend to prescribe the precise form of the reconstituted agreement. The key point is what information it should contain, subject to the point that its format should not be such as to mislead the debtor as to what he agreed to.   The judge also considered whether a statement like the one appearing in the reconstructed application form in Carey referring to the agreement to the terms and conditions "attached" needs to be included in the reconstituted copy. Alternatively if the application form had said "I agree to the terms overleaf", should that statement be included. The judge held that this aspect of the form is not necessary for the purpose of the section 78 copy, although there is nothing to stop a bank from putting it in or indeed from furnishing a copy of the type of application form or signature page that the debtor would have signed, as some banks have done. The statement referring to terms and conditions is not itself prescribed information and the supply of the terms and conditions which were applicable at the time will tell the debtor what he needs to know in terms of the content of what he signed up to, including the presence (or otherwise) of the prescribed terms.   In practical terms what this is likely to mean is that if the creditor chooses to use as the section 78 copy the section 63 copy, which would have been provided to that particular debtor at the time following execution of the agreement, this will be sufficient provided that the information referred to above is supplied. This exercise is not a mere formality. The creditor will need to check carefully that the details of the debtor at the time are correct and that those are the particular terms (including prescribed terms) that he/she agreed to. This is to ensure that it is an honest and accurate copy.   Must a creditor provide a document which would comply (if signed) with the requirements of the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 (Regulations) as to form, as at the date the agreement was made in order to comply with section 78?   A creditor need not, in complying with section 78, provide a document which would comply (if signed) with the requirements of the Regulations as to form, as at the date the agreement was made.   Must the copy provided under section 78 include the debtor's name and address as at the date when the agreement was made, and if so in what form? The section 78 copy must contain the name and address of the debtor as it was at the time of the execution of the agreement. But the creditor can provide the name and address from whatever source it has of those details. It does not have to take them from the executed agreement itself.     If an agreement has been varied by the creditor under a unilateral power of variation, is a copy of the executed agreement as varied, a sufficient copy for the purposes of section 78(1), or must the creditor provide a copy of the original agreement as well?   If an agreement has been varied by the creditor under a unilateral power of variation, the creditor must still provide a copy of the original agreement, as well as the varied terms.     As your agreement is post April 2007  Section 61(1)(a) and 127(3)   Consumer Credit Act 1974 would not apply.   Andy
    • well start a new thread for the court claim.   as for this one i'd await the letter of claim  
    • Useful information...   And....   https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part55
    • nice and ofcourse totally unlawful.   £349.50 is the usual sum RLP try and fleece out of people under some silly civil threats none of goes to the store it all goes in RLP's pocket for their next staff holiday paid for by mugs that fall for their twaddle ignore!!
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MoonTop

Jsa to Esa claim - DWP is overloading me with documents to provide - self employed

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Hi all,

 

I am presently self-employed but on JSA since few months and have applied to a ESA a week ago.

 

Originally, when I have applied to JSA, Job Centre Plus had wrongly make me an Habitual Residential Test (that I had succeed) because I have told them that I worked for three months in/with an EEA country (through my limited company). After the Habitual Residential Test, my JSA claim had been however wrongly rejected twice on the basis that I was not able to provide the further 'Home Office' document they were requested. Then few months later, using a Citizen Advice Bureau, my new JSA claim has been accepted (because I am a permanent UK resident for more than 5 years (despite of my travel in the EEA) and Job Centre Plus didn't have to ask me so much documents).

 

Unfortunately, I have received a letter from the ESA department this week requesting the documents below but this does not seems wright for me. Also, I would like to know your point of view the below.

 

Send evidence

We require evidence to support your claim. The documents that we need are listed below.

 

Evidence for you

•Birth Certificate

•Medical Certificate(s) - You do not normally need a medical certificate from your doctor for the first 7 days that you are unable to work. However, if you have had one or more short spells of incapacity totalling more than 7 days within the last 12 weeks, you will need to get a medical certificate from your doctor from the first day of this claim to Employment & Support Allowance. If, in the last 12 weeks, you have not claimed Employment and Support Allowance and you are still unable to work after 7 days, you will need to see your doctor immediately and obtain a medical certificate from the 8th day of this claim. If you have been receiving Statutory Sick Pay please ask your employer for your current medical certificate. It is important to note that any delay, or gap, in medical certification could have an impact on your Employment and Support Allowance benefit entitlement.

•Proof of crown/long term tenancy - for example, your tenancy agreement (They know that I am presently receiving housing benefit and my Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement is coming to end but also it will become a Statutory Periodic Assured Shorthold Tenancy)

•Balance sheets for the last year

•Up to date Bank statement or statement from your accountant for your business account (they are asking this because I am self-employed in despite of the fact that they know that I am presently receiving JSA)

• Proof of periods abroad for example, stamped passport, visas, E303 form or airline tickets

•Proof of your Immigration status and details as provided by the Home Office - for example a supporting letter from the Home Office

•Details of deportation or removal from another country - for example, Form IS814

Any documents you send us must be originals, not photocopies

You have until xxxxx 2013 to contact us with all of the information and evidence documents requested in this letter.

ESA

 

Thanks in advance for your help,

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Hi,

 

I would like to know if its is possible to download an ESA form online in goal to claim for ESA instead of making a claim by phone. If yes, than how long it will take before a response?

 

Thanks in advance for your help,

 

MoonTop

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Thanks for the link transient, but I had seen and downloaded this form few days ago but when I brought it to my local Citizen Advice Bureau they have refused to help me fill the form and told me that I have to make the claim by phone (0845 6088598).

Edited by MoonTop

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If the dWP have requested you provide documents for your ESA claim, surely you have already applied for ESA? Also what they've asked for seems reasonable enough.


We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office ~ Aesop

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Also what they've asked for seems reasonable enough.

•Proof of periods abroad for example, stamped passport, visas, E303 form or airline tickets - I am french and also from the EEA: there is no need of visa. They are talking about a trip I had done two years ago...(who keep bus receipt of this kind of thing?).

•Proof of your Immigration status and details as provided by the Home Office - for example a supporting letter from the Home Office - I am french and also from the EEA: there is no need of visa.

•Details of deportation or removal from another country - for example, Form IS814 - ????

Any documents you send us must be originals, not photocopies
: Is this equally 'seems reasonable enough' for you?

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It is standard that originals are asked for. You can take your documents to the jobcentre to get them photocopied and verified that the originals have been seen, then send the verified photocopies.

 

If there is anything you have asked for that is not relevant to you - put in a covering note explaining that as you are french and an EEA citizen, no visa is required, and that you have never been deported or removed from another country. Entitlement to benefits for EEA natiinals who have right to reside due to five years residence, is dependant on there being no abscences above a certain amount of time, and as such, with every new claim, this has to be checked by law.


We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office ~ Aesop

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•Proof of periods abroad for example, stamped passport, visas, E303 form or airline tickets - I am french and also from the EEA: there is no need of visa. They are talking about a trip I had done two years ago...(who keep bus receipt of this kind of thing?).

•Proof of your Immigration status and details as provided by the Home Office - for example a supporting letter from the Home Office - I am french and also from the EEA: there is no need of visa.

•Details of deportation or removal from another country - for example, Form IS814 - ????

: Is this equally 'seems reasonable enough' for you?

 

Well, people from abroad would be well advised to keep records of trips they make outside of the UK if they intend to claim benefits in the UK - these are, as you know, relevant when deciding Habitual Residence. Worth keeping in mind for future reference. However, what's done is done, so I would simply write a covering letter explaining the situation and giving the dates for your trip as best you can remember them.

 

Also, the letter you have received is a "form letter", and it's understood that not every document is relevant to everyone. Your French passport should clear up a lot of these issues. But, and this is critical, you should not send this by post to the DWP. Figure out what documents you need to support your claim and call the Benefit Centre that's doing the processing. Ask for an AJCS (pronounced "ay-jacks") appointment at your nearest Jobcentre. They will be able to inspect your documents and make "official" copies of them to send to the processing centre - that way, your important papers won't be caught up in the department's complex mail-handling system.

 

The requirement that documents not be photocopies? We can argue all day about whether or not it's "reasonable", but it's standard procedure and they probably won't waive it without a very good reason - if at all.


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I had this issue few months ago when I had claimed for JSA and as I had explained I have done and passed the 'Habitual Residential Test' made by jobcentre plus : since it is a transfert from JSA to ESA, and they are sharing my previous documents i do not understand the reason they are requesting again the same document.

 

In addition, my main documents had been stolen in Paris two years ago and I had declared it to the police : is the police report will be enough?

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Details of deportation or removal from another country - for example, Form IS814

Since I have never said anything related to any deportation I do not understand why they are asking me this.

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Since I have never said anything related to any deportation I do not understand why they are asking me this.

 

Because, as I said, it's a standard "form" letter that they send to lots of people. You should simply explain in your cover letter that you have never been deported from any country and therefore cannot provide any papers relating to this. The rule is mainly applied to UK citizens who have been deported back here from another country, not to foreign UK residents from the EU/EEA.

 

With regard to Habitual Residence, there is a slightly different HRT for ESA than there is for JSA. This is because JSA is classed as an "economically active" benefit while ESA is not. So it's possible that they may need to do another HRT for your new ESA claim.


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The idea that all politicians lie is music to the ears of the most egregious liars.

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I had this issue few months ago when I had claimed for JSA and as I had explained I have done and passed the 'Habitual Residential Test' made by jobcentre plus : since it is a transfert from JSA to ESA, and they are sharing my previous documents i do not understand the reason they are requesting again the same document.

 

In addition, my main documents had been stolen in Paris two years ago and I had declared it to the police : is the police report will be enough?

 

It probably sounds redundant to you, but procedure is that these things are checked every claim. What documents do you have, that you are able to provide? Passport?


We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office ~ Aesop

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I have set up an UK limited company since 2009 and have its bank statements and my personal UK bank statements/other documents during the last 5 years. I had temporally left the UK due to hardship I had at this time (assaulted and later unlawfully evicted with the help of a police officer (rent was paid up to date and i was just asking a repair before the payment of the next rent) ) also I needed a break...especially because after these events I was leaving in hotels and need a surgery due to my assault. All these facts are already well known by Job Centre since february 2012.

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In that case you could also mention these facts (politely) in your cover note. Explain that in connection to your prior claim to JSA, you explained that a, b, and c were the case and you provided documents x, y and z to support your statements. But you should still attempt to provide everything they've asked for in relation to your new claim, annoying as it may be, and if you can't provide something, describe why not, or explain that it doesn't apply in your case.

 

When claiming benefits you're dealing with a huge, faceless government department. There is annoying and sometimes pointless paperwork. That's not to say you should never make a stand, of course, but pick your battles if you want to stay sane.


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Hi all,

 

I am suffering severe chronic migraine and is going to ESA.

I have received few days ago a sicknote from GP on which he have writen :

migraine + chronic + severe

under investigation

 

Is this normal, or the 'under investigation' sound suspicious regarding my sickness (it is plan with my GP that I meet an expert in the next weeks).

 

Thanks in advance for your help,

 

MoonTop

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It doesn't sound at all worrying to me - its just and indication from your Dr that the cause of the problem is under investigation. Therefore your GP is doing their job

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Hi all,

 

I am suffering severe chronic migraine and is going to ESA.

I have received few days ago a sicknote from GP on which he have writen :

 

 

Is this normal, or the 'under investigation' sound suspicious regarding my sickness (it is plan with my GP that I meet an expert in the next weeks).

 

Thanks in advance for your help,

 

MoonTop[/quote

 

It is to inform any one who is given the certificate that your condition is being looked to see what further treatment/medication is needed.


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Would have been easier to use your current thread http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?376789-Jsa-to-Esa-claim-DWP-is-overloading-me-with-documents-to-provide-self-employed&p=4086052&viewfull=1#post4086052 instead of starting a new one !

 

Hi all,

 

I am suffering severe chronic migraine and is going to ESA.

I have received few days ago a sick note from GP on which he have written :

 

 

Is this normal, or the 'under investigation' sound suspicious regarding my sickness (it is plan with my GP that I meet an expert in the next weeks).

 

Thanks in advance for your help

 

 

MoonTop

 

 

By the sounds your GP is referring to a consultant at the local hospital,worrying about it is only going to make your migraine worse.

 

Migraine are easily controlled with right medication and Make you better !

Edited by 45002

Just say No to 0870 and 0845 Numbers,Use

http://www.saynoto0870.com/search.php

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Would have been easier to use your current thread http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?376789-Jsa-to-Esa-claim-DWP-is-overloading-me-with-documents-to-provide-self-employed%281-Viewing%29-nbsp instead of starting a new one !

 

 

 

 

By the sounds your GP is referring to a consultant at the local hospital,worrying about it is only going to make your migraine worse.

 

Migraine are easily controlled with right medication and Make you better !

 

Unfortunately, I am suffering this chronic migraine since 2006 and until today I have not found any medication working for me.

The worst in all of this is when your relatives think that your disease is false and also you simply don't want to work.

 

Ps: My migraine is intense with very dry/burning eyes, and joint pain. All on the daily basis.

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That's why it is being investigated, nothing sinister there at all!!


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p'haps best to keep to one thread on all aspects of this claim.

 

two threads merged

 

dx


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Hi,

 

Presently my previous Job Centre adviser is preventing me to claim for ESA and has cancelled my last benefit payments: On 27 december since I was too unwell to sign on I have sent an email to my Job Centre adviser to inform her that i still very unwell (I was already sick since two weeks and also had to claim for ESA).

 

Presently, the adviser just does not answer to my emails and when I call Job Centre Plus they are saying that my JSA has not been closed and also they cannot proceed with my ESA claim.

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Hi,

 

Presently my previous Job Centre adviser is preventing me to claim for ESA and has cancelled my last benefit payments: On 27 december since I was too unwell to sign on I have sent an email to my Job Centre adviser to inform her that i still very unwell (I was already sick since two weeks and also had to claim for ESA).

 

Presently, the adviser just does not answer to my emails and when I call Job Centre Plus they are saying that my JSA has not been closed and also they cannot proceed with my ESA claim.

 

My understanding is that if you get a doctors sick note for more than 14 days, then they have to close off the JSA claim from the relevant date. You then have to phone the ESA claim line and make a new ESA claim. The sick note can be backdated by your GP for the relevant period and sign you off for a relevant period into the future. The JCP staff dealing with the JSA claim, should then release the pay up to date and when your ESA claim goes through, you will get paid every 2 weeks, while you are under a GP sicknote. If you then remain on ESA with a GP sick note, an ATOS assessment should be arranged within 13 weeks, but may take longer.

 

You need to get an urgent appointment with a GP first, then see a JCP advisor and then phone the ESA new claim line.

 

You won't get anywhere with this, without a GP signing you off as sick.

 

If you are having constant migraines, this may be because of some other condition you are suffering from and the migraine is just a sympton. Make sure your GP is willing to investigate thoroughly and they should arrange a blood check, plus anything else that is necessary.


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