Extorted by marstons bailiffs - help pls??

[tonyc123]

Dont know if this is the right place but im in desperate need of some advice on the next step dealing with Martsons bailiffs after being extorted by £860 yesterday

 

a removal notice was put through the door last week addressed to my partner xxxxx, bearing in mind we moved into his propety only 1 month ago. I called the number and told them she wasnt here and to go and check their information. That was was it

 

then very early yesterday morning>>>>>>>>

 

Bailiffs called our house phone & asked for xxxxx xxxxxx@ 07:30 am 18/12/12

xxxxx answered, said they were bailiffs and that they hadclamped the car an were about to tow it away.

 

7:32 I called them back, the bailiff Mr Gxxxxxx said he hada warrant to seize my vehicle and that it had been clamped on our privatedriveway.

 

I then got dressed, exited & locked the house andapproached the van where the 2 bailiffs were in at the end of our driveway.

 

The older 1 then stayed he was going to take my car &then come into the house via a locksmith to take my goods. I asked him why& on what grounds & he wouldn’t tell me and said the papers wre in thevan, his colleague meanwhile was frantically writing paperwork in the van onthe dashboard doctoring the warrant & fee documents.

 

 

 

He then got very close in an intimidating manner and statedthat I was “beginning to f**k him off” I then called 999 as I was in fear formy safety and that of my partner & 2 young children

 

I still at this point did not know the reason and on whatauthority they were treating us like this.

 

I was then advised by the police on my phone to go inside& await an officer. They also advised me that the bailiffs had also calledthe police.

 

I waited in the kitchen and still had no idea as to why mycar had been clamped and why this was all going on.

 

 

 

The police then arrived to me after first speaking with thebailiffs and informed me that I had been acting in a threatening manner &intimidating the bailiff. I then gave told them from my point of view what hadhappened and in no way were they helpful and quite on the contrary weren’t reallyinterested in my version of events just in reinforcing the position &authority of the bailiffs.

 

The police woman then went away to speak to the bailiffs toestablish why they were here. She then re appeared a few minutes later with afew documents which I was not allowed to touch or read initially.

 

 

 

I was then advised that my car had been levied on because ofa parking penalty (which ive never had any notification of) for a vehicle that i sold 6 months ago and that they also had a warrant to enter myhome to take goods due to an unpaid fine relating to a criminal offence for mypartner Ms X.

 

This is the first either me or xxxxx had known about theparking penalty, and xxxxx has never commited any criminal offences nor has acriminal record.

 

I advised the police woman of this and was told by her thatthey had the court authority to carry out the actions the bailiff had stated.The Amount she told me I had to pay (as I wasn’t allowed a copy or to even readmyself at this point) was £429.82 or that the bailiff would seize my vehiclewhich would incur more costs. She then presented a court document and a Martsoncase details document with the detailing an printed outstanding balance £125.44although this had been crossed out by the bailiffs in biro pen to show £429.82!. This is the first time I have been contacted or dealt with by Marstons overthis incident and they have managed to clamp my car firstly then verbally &physically threaten me.

 

The policewoman then hesitantly allowed me to read the documentsrelating to myself, I objected to her about the fact they had plainly justdoctored the document and she wasn’t interested & again re-iterated thefact that it was a court issued document and that it must be paid or they wouldbe taking my car. I then entered my house through the kitchen door from outsidethe rear of our property & informed her that I wanted to copy the documenton my scanner, the policewoman then put her foot in my back door and forcedherself in to take the document back. She stated that I may attempt to defaceor destroy the document, I again stated i just wanted to make a copy for myreference.

 

-

 

She then also mentioned they had a court warrant to enter ourhome to take goods for the debt relating to xxxxx xxxxxx and that too was £430exactly, although I wasn’t shown or allowed to see any documents relating tothis nor were me or xxxxx allowed to copy them. They were simply waived infront of me by the police woman as she again told me the bailiffs were acting onauthority of the court. After awhile it was established through the police andbailiffs phone calls to their office that it was not relating to a criminaloffence and that it was something to do with council tax although no further informationwas given as to the source of this debt nor do we still know any more about it.

 

 

 

The bailiff then stated being re-enforced by the police thatif I did not pay the £430 for xxxxx theywould get a locksmith to gain entry to my property (as i would not invite themin, and the house was secure) to take mygoods using some domestic violence legislation. The bailiff then thrusted intomy face & then pulled back some sort of Marstons branded card stating thisand The police then reiterated they were acting lawfully & that they could& would do this if I didn’t pay the amount being extorted.

 

I had no option than to pay both the amounts in full on thespot using family Christmas money and was given 2 cash receipts.

 

The car clamp was then removed and I noticed they scratchedboth the passenger side sill + wing & also scratched & chipped thepassenger side alloy wheel.

 

This seems like extortion by the appointed bailiffs with thefull backing of the Lancashire Police Constabulary. This has left myself &my partner plus our 2 young children traumatised & feeling completelyunsafe within the confines of our own home.

 

We still do not know where the Debt for xxxxx hasoriginated. And the Marstons & court documents relating to the parkingpenalty notice for myself are all that I know about that matter.

 

We moved house to our current property on 16/11/12 thebailiffs mentioned they had been trying to contact us over these matters at ourprevious address, although we received no correspondence or visits relating tothese.

surely this isnt legal???

Edited December 19, 2012 by ploddertom
I have removed all personal identifiers

[cerberusalert]

Thread moved to the Bailiffs forum.

[tonyc123]

sorry to rant on - just pasted in statement I angrily put together so as not to forget the goings on - not that i would mind being 860 lighter!

 

any help /advice very much appreciated & a blue peter badge for those who manage bear with my ramblings

Tony

[brassnecked]

Welcome to CAG, above all try not to worry,

 

now if you had no knowledge a Statutory declaration that the bailiff appearence was the first you knew about the matter may be an option that should then reset the matter to the summons stage.

 

If the warrant was to a previous address and marstons have data cleansed it as in crossed out the old address.

and scribbled in the new, that is very naughty indeed.

 

now others who know more will be along soon.

[ploddertom]

Is the only paperwork you have been left just the 2 receipts?

[hallowitch]

can you confirm one debt was for council tax and the other was for a pcn

[ohitsonlyme]

Tony I am no expert but trust me others who are will be along to help.

You are in the right place to gain the best of information

Ihave been helped several times on this site just keep calm and your patience will be rewarded

Onlyme

[tonyc123]

Thanks for your reply, very very much apreciated!

How would i go about making a statutory declaration?,

ive emailed the bailiffs office to ask for a full breakdown of the fees theyve charged me.

 

just checked the warrant of execution & their case details docs and they are all at my old adress there is no mention of me at the address where this happened yest,

 

is it lawful theyvecarried this out at this address? given all docs are to my old one?

 

 

the bit they changed in pen was theyre fees, it was printed with outstanding balance of £125.44 then the have just crossed it out & wrote £429.82 next to it on their "case details doc"

 

Thanks!!

[tonyc123]

i can confirm mine was for pcn (lancashire county council), we dont know about the other the receipt states it is hmcs lancashire, it can only be council tax they explained something about her not returning an income form (which we havent had!) that is all we know about them

 

Thanks!

[tonyc123]

2 receipts plus I managed to scan the documents relating to my "debt"

 

-marstons case details doc (4pages)

-warrant of execution - unpaid penalty charge

 

both adressed to my prev house

 

-besides the receipt we have no other paperwork relating to my oh "debt"

[hallowitch]

hmcs lancashire

 

 

I did not pay the £430 for xxxxx theywould get a locksmith to gain entry to my property (as i would not invite themin, and the house was secure) to take mygoods using some domestic violence legislation.

 

sounds like a court fine not council tax

[ploddertom]

hmcs lancashire

 

 

I did not pay the £430 for xxxxx theywould get a locksmith to gain entry to my property (as i would not invite themin, and the house was secure) to take mygoods using some domestic violence legislation.

 

sounds like a court fine not council tax

 

I'll agree with that, TV Licence perhaps - initial fine £130 + £300 Marstons costs.

[ploddertom]

-warrant of execution - unpaid penalty charge

 

both adressed to my prev house

 

-besides the receipt we have no other paperwork relating to my oh "debt"

 

Do you have any knowledge of an unpaid PCN?

[tonyc123]

no ive never had a pcn before, + have no knowledge on it

 

"sounds like a court fine not council tax"

possibly fine for non payment of council tax? we really dont know - my oh said the bailiff stated it was because they had sent a letter for income/benefits request form to our old address which apparently had 14 days to return it, and they said because it hadnt been received it a warrant had been issued for her arrest??? (this was all said by the bailiff while the police were next to her)

 

at first they told her it was for a criminal/ road traffic incident looking back i think that was for the benefit of the 2 police who were with there (i was in the house scanning the docs with 1 officer at my back door not allowing me to close it + the above was being explained to my oh with the bailiffs & officers at the end of our drive) she said the bailiff then called the office and came back to say oh its not for a criminal offence it was for failing to supply info & about a warrant for her arrest

Edited December 19, 2012 by tonyc123

[tonyc123]

thanks again for all your responses!

[TB Law]

If this is a criminal fine then a vehicle clamping can only be done if the bailiff has obtained a clamping order from the magistrates court under section 38 of Schedule 5 of the Courts Act 2003. If no order has been made then you were perfectly entitled to remove the clamp with bolt cutters and there would be no liability on your part under the Criminal Damage Act 1970.

 

Your post later says this is a parking penalty, but enforcement rules are completely different. The bailiff would need to have made a valid levy over the vehicle before using a wheel clamp and without any levy you can remove the wheel clamp and its yours to keep unless the bailiff can prove ownership by producing a sales receipt. Again there is no Criminal Damage liability and you can even sue for the cost of removing and disposal of the wheel clamp.

 

The bailiff has damaged your car and you need to make a separate claim from the bailiff company for the repairs. For this, you need to maintain a separate correspondence file between you and the bailiff company. You need two estimates and get the car repaired and ask the company to pay your bill plus the costs of obtaining the estimates. If the bailiff company does not pay you the repairs then waste little time in making a claim on a Form N1. This is a claim in the county court, very easy to do.

 

You have moved address recently, and this means you can have the case rolled back to pre-enforcment stage regardless this is a magistrates couret fine or a local council parking ticket.

 

Your first task is identify the source and type of debt. You can do this by telephoning a local magistrates court and make enquiries on whether you had any unpaid fines. Your local council can tell you about any unpaid parking offences. You can also make enquiries with the DVLA.

 

You can ask the bailiff company of this information but I have feeling they will get funny and go on about £10 SAR fees and making you jump the hoops etc. This policy is designed to wear you down and hope you don’t discover you have been overcharged and start a claim in the small claims court. An easy way to get information is Form N1 everything you paid them plus the damages for your car, and the defendant bailiff company will complete the defendants response pack giving the nature of the debt and you can apply for a refund of everything else. Once the creditor is identified, add them as the 2nd defendant and ask the court to decide who pays your costs and disbursements. Remember to ask for interest, its a sizeable 8% a year.

 

Once you have identified the origin and type of debt, post back here and we can give you the appropriate guidance on how to move forward and recover your money.

 

The bad news is this wont be settled this side of Christmas.

[tomtubby]

I am sorry to hear of your problems. It is important to deal with EACH case separately.

 

With the PCN did the warrant state upon it your CURRENT address?

 

Next, on the document for the PCN does it state a PCN number? This will start with 2 digits followed by 8 numbers.

 

Was this a PCN that you knew about and has you received the statutory notices?

 

The 2nd case appears to be a court fine. If you had not received a summons then you can file a Statutory Declaration . Any money paid would then have to be refunded.

 

The Police Officer was wrong when she stated that the warrant for the unpaid parking ticket allowed entry into your home. Once you have ascertained what these debts relate to you may well have grounds to make a Formal Complaint concerning the police.

[tonyc123]

thanks for taking the time to reply

 

my case: yes it has a pcn number, and NO the warrant does not have my current address on it (neither, my previous and is dated5/11/2012 & it is for a car I sold 6 months ago

it states the date of contravention: 4/5/12

 

"The Police Officer was wrong when she stated that the warrant for the unpaid parking ticket allowed entry into your home. Once you have ascertained what these debts relate to you may well have grounds to make a Formal Complaint concerning the police"

 

this was stated by the officer in ref to my partners issue the HMCS one

[TB Law]

You need to contact the TEC with your PCN number on 01604 619450 and make what is called an "out of time statutory declaration" (called a 'stat dec') they will send you the forms TE7 and TE9 to complete and return. In other words, lodge an appeal with the court on the grounds you have recenly moved.

 

You need to find out whether the PCN has other grounds for appeal.

 

Post back here and many here can help you fill them in.

[TB Law]

my partners issue the HMCS one

 

I'll make this a separate post for clarity between the PCN and HMCTS matters.

 

Section 38 of Schedule 5 of the Courts Act 2003 says the court must send a 'Further Steps Notice' to your current address before sending a bailiff, and Rule 52.2 of the Criminal Procedures Rules 2011 says the court must not excersise enforcment unless a notice has been sent to the defendant.

 

It is common for bailiff companies to try and trace missing defaulters using credit reference agencies and proceed with enforcsment at your new address without complying with the statutory notice requirements.

 

You need to telephone the sentencing court and say you want to make a "statutory declaration" and they will give you the address for service. I can knock up a stat dec for you but you will need to take it to court to have it sworn in. This will not overturn the fine but it will get you the bailiffs fees back.

[hallowitch]

template of a statutory declaration

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?165753-MAGISTRATE-COURT-FINES.-Template-of-a-Statutory-Declaration.

[tonyc123]

Thanks, I will call them in the morning regarding my pcn

 

re my partners issue we are going to have to ring round the court fines offices i guess to work out where it is from

 

really helpful comments from all of you, feeling a lot more positive about sorting this mess - thanks again

[old bill]

Which part of Lancashire is it, please? Some courts in North West England have centralised their enforcement at Manchester Magistrates Court.

[tonyc123]

Hi, we are based in chorley

 

- my unpaid penalty charge: - the applicant on my "warrant of execution" is lancs county council & is issued by northampton county court

 

- My partners just says HMCS Lancashire on the bailiff cash receipt

Edited December 20, 2012 by tonyc123

[hallowitch]

My partners just says HMCS Lancashire on the bailiff cash receipt

 

this may be of help to you

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?342830-Received-a-notice-regarding-Magistrates-Court-Order