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    • Hi,   Having had a PM exchange with Shamrocker (thank you) I've been advised to upload the General Order/Judgement that was sent to me at the end of September.  Can someone (possibly Andy) clarify that I need to complete a WS for my "side of the bargain".   Obviously, I have just received and uploaded the claimant's WS so I suspect I do, but the actual order was "vague".    Many thanks B   General Order & Direction Oct19.pdf
    • Hmm, so.. basically have to rely on the default notice not containing all that it should and the claimant misleading the court for the reason for the application.. and judge lottery : /
    • Which would require a hearing....so the fee would be £255.00
    • When providing a copy of an executed agreement in response to a request under section 78(1) of the Act:   a.     must a creditor provide a photocopy (or other form of complete copy) of the original agreement that was signed by the debtor or at least provide a copy which is derived directly from the original agreement or complete copy thereof? or b.     can a creditor provide a document which is a reconstitution of the original agreement which may be from sources other than the actual signed agreement itself?   It was held that a creditor can satisfy its duty under section 78 by providing a reconstituted version of the executed agreement which may be from sources other than the actual signed agreement itself.   The judge accepted that as a matter of law, section 78 does not itself require any particular explanation as to how the copy was made. However, as a matter of good practice and so as not to mislead the debtor, it is desirable that the creditor should explain that it is providing a reconstituted as opposed to a physical copy of the executed agreement. This will also explain why the copy might otherwise look a little odd. The creditor can also explain in the letter that this procedure is satisfactory under the Act. The judge also provided that the following information needs to be included in the reconstituted copy agreement (assuming of course that it was present in the original):   1.     Heading: Credit Agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 2.     Name and address of the debtor 3.     Name and address of the creditor 4.     Cancellation clause applicable to the executed agreement.   All of the above may be provided on a sheet which is separate from the full statement of terms and conditions which also forms part of the reconstituted agreement. The creditor may, however, decide to reconstitute the agreement in a different way so that, for example, the information above is populated electronically onto the same sheet as that which sets out the terms and conditions, or some of them. The judge stated that he did not intend to prescribe the precise form of the reconstituted agreement. The key point is what information it should contain, subject to the point that its format should not be such as to mislead the debtor as to what he agreed to.   The judge also considered whether a statement like the one appearing in the reconstructed application form in Carey referring to the agreement to the terms and conditions "attached" needs to be included in the reconstituted copy. Alternatively if the application form had said "I agree to the terms overleaf", should that statement be included. The judge held that this aspect of the form is not necessary for the purpose of the section 78 copy, although there is nothing to stop a bank from putting it in or indeed from furnishing a copy of the type of application form or signature page that the debtor would have signed, as some banks have done. The statement referring to terms and conditions is not itself prescribed information and the supply of the terms and conditions which were applicable at the time will tell the debtor what he needs to know in terms of the content of what he signed up to, including the presence (or otherwise) of the prescribed terms.   In practical terms what this is likely to mean is that if the creditor chooses to use as the section 78 copy the section 63 copy, which would have been provided to that particular debtor at the time following execution of the agreement, this will be sufficient provided that the information referred to above is supplied. This exercise is not a mere formality. The creditor will need to check carefully that the details of the debtor at the time are correct and that those are the particular terms (including prescribed terms) that he/she agreed to. This is to ensure that it is an honest and accurate copy.   Must a creditor provide a document which would comply (if signed) with the requirements of the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 (Regulations) as to form, as at the date the agreement was made in order to comply with section 78?   A creditor need not, in complying with section 78, provide a document which would comply (if signed) with the requirements of the Regulations as to form, as at the date the agreement was made.   Must the copy provided under section 78 include the debtor's name and address as at the date when the agreement was made, and if so in what form? The section 78 copy must contain the name and address of the debtor as it was at the time of the execution of the agreement. But the creditor can provide the name and address from whatever source it has of those details. It does not have to take them from the executed agreement itself.     If an agreement has been varied by the creditor under a unilateral power of variation, is a copy of the executed agreement as varied, a sufficient copy for the purposes of section 78(1), or must the creditor provide a copy of the original agreement as well?   If an agreement has been varied by the creditor under a unilateral power of variation, the creditor must still provide a copy of the original agreement, as well as the varied terms.     As your agreement is post April 2007  Section 61(1)(a) and 127(3)   Consumer Credit Act 1974 would not apply.   Andy
    • well start a new thread for the court claim.   as for this one i'd await the letter of claim  
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s8n

Natwest Bank - Wrong DOB

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Hi Guys.

I have numerous debts with numerous creditors.

One is Natwest, with whom i had 4 accounts.

 

Account 1: £2953 over drawn (Current account)

Account 2: £0.01 Over drawn

Account 3: 0

Account 4: 0

 

After not hearing from Natwest at all except for the occasional bank statement, i received 4 letters this morning/

1 for each account.

 

The letters said:

Dear Mr ****

 

Our collection agent has been unable to contact you or to agree a suitable payment plan therefore your account details have been passed to Fredrickson International Ltd as our new collection agent. ..........

 

Anyway, i contacted the company, and who asked for a reference number, which NW haven't given.

They then asked my details, which i gave them. The agent responded and said the DOB is wrong, so cant discuss my account, but it is on hold until 29/12/2012. He said he will refer back to Natwest and try to get a correction.

 

Does this help me at all, or should i call Natwest and discuss the matter with them.

 

p.s. some of you may have read previous threads, i am supposed to currently be working with Step Change (previously CCCS).

 

Thanks

Edited by s8n

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Stay OFF the phone, you have zero evidence of this call ever taking place least of all the content of it (unless your recording them?)

 

Keep everything in writing.

 

Step change should be dealing with this, unless they're unaware of it?

 

Ignore Freds, deal direct with the bank.

 

Acct 1, is that a current account, with an agreed overdraft? How much of that 2k is charges and fees?


Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Hi Bazooka, thanks for the response.

I have told Step Change of this account, but there is an issue with them guys, they say my case was closed in March this year :s

 

I generally do keep everything in writing, including notes on who i speak to what's said and agreed, and dates and times.

 

Account 1: current account, with agreed OD of £2100. When i stopped using the account on advice of CCCS (step change) it was left at around £1990 over drawn (i know it was under 2k). Sorry correction on my behalf the letter says £2953. So £953 in charges.

 

Does the fact that they have the wrong DOB have any baring in regards to me arguing it through with them?

 

My worry is i have a Mortgage with them, and i dont want them to take the easy option of a charge order.

 

Thanks

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Hi Guys.

This is still an issue.

 

I now have a different credit company contacting me for the same account.

And again i am getting threatening letters, and tried to contact them.

 

They still say they wont talk to me.

 

Any assistance?

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When I say keep everything in writing what I actually mean is stay OFF the phone, unless your recording the calls you have no evidence of what was discussed.

 

Check your credit files and see what is on there.

 

Is step change still dealing with these accounts on your behalf?


Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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When I say keep everything in writing what I actually mean is stay OFF the phone, unless your recording the calls you have no evidence of what was discussed.

 

Check your credit files and see what is on there.

 

Is step change still dealing with these accounts on your behalf?

 

gh

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When I say keep everything in writing what I actually mean is stay OFF the phone, unless your recording the calls you have no evidence of what was discussed.

 

Check your credit files and see what is on there.

 

Is step change still dealing with these accounts on your behalf?

 

I must admit i dont always record the calls.

The problem is sometimes they call withheld or from different numbers. I have even had mobile numbers.

 

To be honest i havent checked my credit file since all this started, i thought whats the point in paying £6 a month when i know its being lynched.

 

Yes they should be, although i have hit a bit of a stumbling block. They need me to provide some evidence for some money coming in, but i cant because it all got tied into a lump some with a solicitor.

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You can check your credit files for free, failing that send £2 to get them.

 

Stay OFF the phone.


Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Stay off the (Edit) phone!

Edited by maroondevo52
Removed inappropriate word.

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lol ok ok i get the point. But how do i handle calls from them that i answer not knowing who they are?

 

Also from the moments i have spoken to them they have said send a copy of photo id with your correct DOB on.

Should i just do that?

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lol ok ok i get the point. But how do i handle calls from them that i answer not knowing who they are?
Stay off the (Edit) phone!
Stay OFF the phone.
Just say, "everything in writing" and hang up.

 

Also from the moments i have spoken to them they have said send a copy of photo id with your correct DOB on.

Should i just do that?

NO!! if they don't know who you are why are they contacting you?

Illegitimi non carborundum

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lol ok ok i get the point. But how do i handle calls from them that i answer not knowing who they are?

 

Also from the moments i have spoken to them they have said send a copy of photo id with your correct DOB on.

Should i just do that?

 

It is not your obligation to provide evidence of who you are.. but for them to have the correct details in the first place.

 

It could be that this debt is nothing to do with you - but by you very kindly giving them some information they can now "make things right".

 

If they telephone then you simply say you do not discuss your financial matters on the phone. That they should put what they have to say in writing.

 

When was the last payment made to the account that is being pursued ?


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It is not your obligation to provide evidence of who you are.. but for them to have the correct details in the first place.

 

It could be that this debt is nothing to do with you - but by you very kindly giving them some information they can now "make things right".

 

If they telephone then you simply say you do not discuss your financial matters on the phone. That they should put what they have to say in writing.

 

When was the last payment made to the account that is being pursued ?

 

Hi guys.

Just a quick update, i still have the company calling, and not being able to ID me.

Normally i avoid them off the phone, although sometimes i get caught out with a slightly different number.

 

I also checked my credit file, and the accounts from natwest are on there, but they are showing the wrong DOB.

 

Can avoiding them cause long term issues? as in court action?

Once they put what they have to say in writing, how do i respond to them? or should i not?

 

As for the account, it was a current account with an OD facility. So the payments where my salary. That stopped when i had to move accounts on advice from the CCCS.

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Send them this letter http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/content.php?493-Harassment-by-telephone-response-letter

 

Enter NW complaints procedure.

When you say it is the wrong DOB on your credit file, I don't understand? How can your credit file have the wrong DOB??

 

Deal in writing ONLY, STOP talking to them over the phone, as soon as they identify themselves or you know who they are hang up. How many more times.


Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Send them this letter http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/content.php?493-Harassment-by-telephone-response-letter

 

Enter NW complaints procedure.

When you say it is the wrong DOB on your credit file, I don't understand? How can your credit file have the wrong DOB??

 

Deal in writing ONLY, STOP talking to them over the phone, as soon as they identify themselves or you know who they are hang up. How many more times.

 

Hi Thanks for the link.

I am just concerned in taking an overly active stance against them, as i dont want them to step up the game and advance things to court procedings.

 

On my credit profile i have the correct DOB. However for each account, there is a DOB that the company has. On this it is wrong.

 

I have now totally stopped dealing with telphone calls and back to ignoring numbers i dont recognise.

Thanks

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hi guys.

Just a quick update, i still have the company calling, and not being able to id me.

Normally i avoid them off the phone, although sometimes i get caught out with a slightly different number.

 

I also checked my credit file, and the accounts from natwest are on there, but they are showing the wrong dob.

 

Can avoiding them cause long term issues? As in court action?

Once they put what they have to say in writing, how do i respond to them? Or should i not?

 

As for the account, it was a current account with an od facility. So the payments where my salary. That stopped when i had to move accounts on advice from the cccs.

 

stay off the phone!!!

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There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking an aggressive stance with them, this is the only way in which they will listen and change.

 

As CB said you are under absolutely no obligation to provide any identity to them, if they have got the wrong details then that is entirely their problem not yours.

 

Have you started the complaints process with them yet?

 

Put the idea of court out of your mind, that is a long way off, if at all, besides you need to reclaim all of their charges and fees yet.

 

http://www.natwest.com/commercial/contact/g1/existing-customer/complaints.ashx


Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Hi, i havent started the Complaints procedure yet.

But it is on my plan to try to start it this weekend.

 

Can you even claim charges on Defaulted accounts? I have 6 of them which are crrently going thorugh the IVA process?

 

Thanks

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IVA process? WHY? Do you have more debts then?

 

Who are you using to do this IVA?

 

You can reclaim any charge on any account whether it is defaulted or not.


Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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