URGENT HELP REQUIRED

[MrsDocteur77]

Help!!!!!

 

In June 2009 I lost my job and after 2.5 months of non payment to mortgage the mortgage company took us to court. When we got to court I got back into work (even though my child was just 8 weeks old) and the court gave us a suspended possession order. Since then we made payments every month and on time. June 2010 my husband lost his job. I asked if they could change our mortgage type to interest only - this was refused. We paid something every month to them and they seemed happy with that. My husband got back into work in June 2012 and we offered to repay arrears £50.00 on top of our normal monthly amount. This was refused on the basis that they did not think we could stick to it. We sent bank statements to them and they said that because during this time various things changed my son was now entitled to free nursery places so that cost was reduced and we cancelled lots of our direct debits he would look at it again in a few months. We continued to pay £50.00 extra every month. They sent a letter end of October asking for Income/Expenditure form which i forgot to send back. They called my mobile during working hours and never called my house phone after 5 (which they had done before). Friday last week we received a solicitors letter out of the blue to say we have until today (Wednesday) to repay the arrears of £4880 otherwise they will seek a warrant of possession. We ofcourse don't have this money. They have given us no warning nothing. We are worried sick we will be made homeless for christmas - can anyone help us,, please.

[nomorecrooks]

Help!!!!!

 

In June 2009 I lost my job and after 2.5 months of non payment to mortgage the mortgage company took us to court. When we got to court I got back into work (even though my child was just 8 weeks old) and the court gave us a suspended possession order. Since then we made payments every month and on time. June 2010 my husband lost his job. I asked if they could change our mortgage type to interest only - this was refused. We paid something every month to them and they seemed happy with that. My husband got back into work in June 2012 and we offered to repay arrears £50.00 on top of our normal monthly amount. This was refused on the basis that they did not think we could stick to it. We sent bank statements to them and they said that because during this time various things changed my son was now entitled to free nursery places so that cost was reduced and we cancelled lots of our direct debits he would look at it again in a few months. We continued to pay £50.00 extra every month. They sent a letter end of October asking for Income/Expenditure form which i forgot to send back. They called my mobile during working hours and never called my house phone after 5 (which they had done before). Friday last week we received a solicitors letter out of the blue to say we have until today (Wednesday) to repay the arrears of £4880 otherwise they will seek a warrant of possession. We ofcourse don't have this money. They have given us no warning nothing. We are worried sick we will be made homeless for christmas - can anyone help us,, please.

 

 

 

Slow down one moment! I can assure you that if you fight you will not be out of your house before Christmas!

 

If there is a suspended possession order on your property then the mortgage company must seek an eviction order. This will take some time and will not take force for some time.

 

Once you receive the eviction order then you must file a N244, peopl on this site will help you prepare the form. The N244 requests that you return to the Court to argue your case. Given Christmas and the New Year break this is unlikely to be much before the middle of January.

 

I must stress that you MUST complete the N244 with all of the relevant attachments and submit it to the Court once you receive the eviction date.

 

You will receive plenty of help on this site I am sure; in particular read the advice you receive from Ell-enn from the Site Team.

 

Who is your mortgage with?

How many months left on your mortgage term?

What is the amount of arrears?

 

Stay calm!

[havinastella]

I have started your own thread for you, help is on the way.

[ims21]

Multiple identical posts all moved to this thread and thread tidied.

 

Please just keep to this one thread for this issue.

[MrsDocteur77]

Thank you so much - i'm breathing and staying calm.

 

Yes we have a suspended possession order already on the house. Our Mortgage is with Engage Credit and we have around 17 years left on our mortgage - the arrears are £4808 however they were higher five months ago as we have been paying £50 off a month.

 

Yes i've been reading about the N244 form. I have sent a letter to them (posted 1st Class Monday) and their solicitor offering an extra £30 on top of the £50 we are already paying.

 

Thank you so much for your advice.

[MrsDocteur77]

As mentioned about I have sent a letter offering more and also sent a Financial Statement together with a statement from me explaining why we are in this mess and that we can afford the agreement and have been paying it for the last 6 months. Can they send us a solicitors letter without warning us? I am also going to ask for a breakdown of arrears to see if they have put anything additional on this figure.

[nomorecrooks]

Thank you so much - i'm breathing and staying calm.

 

Yes we have a suspended possession order already on the house. Our Mortgage is with Engage Credit and we have around 17 years left on our mortgage - the arrears are £4808 however they were higher five months ago as we have been paying £50 off a month.

 

Yes i've been reading about the N244 form. I have sent a letter to them (posted 1st Class Monday) and their solicitor offering an extra £30 on top of the £50 we are already paying.

 

Thank you so much for your advice.

 

OK, good.

 

Now please wait half a day for one of the site experts to respond to you. Don't worry, they will!

 

In the mean time I suggest you download an N244 form and put together a budget sheet (available on this site as an MS excel document).

[MrsDocteur77]

Ok thank you will do it now.

 

Thanks again.

 

 

Claire

[nomorecrooks]

Look, if your mortgage term has 17 years left and you have been retiring the arrears at £50 per month then this should / ought to be acceptable to the Court (as the arrears will be retired within the term of the mortgage).

 

You absolutely should ask for a complete breakdown of the arrears figure.

 

Solicitors letter: it may be that your letters crossed in the post. Have you spoken to the solicitors to confirm their receipt of your letter?

 

Reading between the lines of your posts:

 

* since the possession order was granted have you consistently paid your mortgage? If you misssed a few payments (in June 2010?) have you been consistently paying them lately?

* if you have been paying consistently as of late (including an additional £50 per month to retire the arrears) then I am at a loss as to why the mortgage company would attempt this action as it is quite illogical. It may well be that the letter from the solicitor was a scare tactic.

 

In any case, stay calm. Ell-enn is the expert and I am sure she will offer you very good advice!

[MrsDocteur77]

We received the solicitors letter Friday and I called the mortgage company who told me that unless I could clear the arrears then they will seek a warrant so then I sent a letter to them Monday first class. They told me that the reason for going down this route is because there is no arrangement in place. Even though we have tried many times to come to some sort of agreement with them. We asked for interest only whilst my husband was out of work, this was refused so we still paid something every month as they said then at looks like we are making an effort. I used to speak with a lovely man called Sam, the last call I had was from a lady who said she was sending out a Income/Expenditure form which she did in October then no letters received until this solicitors letter Friday. Yes since my husband has been back at work we have paid every month plus extra.

 

I am going to call them tonight after work and ask if they have made a decision as the deadline was now (4pm) and if they are continuing with the warrant then I will ask for a breakdown of arrears etc plus ask for their procedures because i think this is completley unfair and out of the blue - no warning nothing.

 

Thank you so much for your help - my mind feels a little clearer now and your right i'm keeping calm.

[nomorecrooks]

We received the solicitors letter Friday and I called the mortgage company who told me that unless I could clear the arrears then they will seek a warrant so then I sent a letter to them Monday first class. They told me that the reason for going down this route is because there is no arrangement in place. Even though we have tried many times to come to some sort of agreement with them. We asked for interest only whilst my husband was out of work, this was refused so we still paid something every month as they said then at looks like we are making an effort. I used to speak with a lovely man called Sam, the last call I had was from a lady who said she was sending out a Income/Expenditure form which she did in October then no letters received until this solicitors letter Friday. Yes since my husband has been back at work we have paid every month plus extra.

 

I am going to call them tonight after work and ask if they have made a decision as the deadline was now (4pm) and if they are continuing with the warrant then I will ask for a breakdown of arrears etc plus ask for their procedures because i think this is completley unfair and out of the blue - no warning nothing.

 

Thank you so much for your help - my mind feels a little clearer now and your right i'm keeping calm.

 

Clearly I do not know the full circumstances of your situation. That said I cannot help but think that a Court would look anything but very favourably on your situation if it comes to that. I say this with the condition that you have a full and complete defense package for the Court (via the N244). This will include the form itself, the financial statements and a full witness statement which details all of the points we have been discussing.

 

Regarding the arrears: if I were you I would look very carefully at any monthly arrears charges which may have been levied on your mortgage account. Although the charges have probably been added to the capital amount rather than the arrears there is a line of defense using monthly arrears charges that has been very persuasive in Courts throughout the UK. So, check what the monthly arrears fee has been and how much in total has been charged.

 

If you receive an eviction notice (which may or may not happen) then I will explain the arrears charges argument to you.

 

Interest rate: is your monthly interest rate based on Libor? I'd be interested to know exactly how (as according to your mortgage terms) your interest is calculated, word for word.

[MrsDocteur77]

Thank you for all this. I will have a look and let you know tomorrow about the interest rate. Our house is worth £190k and the mortgage is £124k outstanding. They have given me no options whatsoever and have been reading about Pre-action protocols. Should they have asked us if we wanted to capitalise our arrears? We have proved affordability of arrears so cannot understand why they are going down this route. Thank you so much for all your wonderful advice - I cannot wait to speak with them later and see what answers I get. Is there anything else I should ask them? Thanks

[nomorecrooks]

Thank you for all this. I will have a look and let you know tomorrow about the interest rate. Our house is worth £190k and the mortgage is £124k outstanding. They have given me no options whatsoever and have been reading about Pre-action protocols. Should they have asked us if we wanted to capitalise our arrears? We have proved affordability of arrears so cannot understand why they are going down this route. Thank you so much for all your wonderful advice - I cannot wait to speak with them later and see what answers I get. Is there anything else I should ask them? Thanks

 

I cannot advise you on the pre-action protocols: iam am unfamiliar with this argument.

 

I would ask them for the monthly arrears charge, if any and the total amount paid in monthly arrears charges since the mortgage started (probably you will need to SAR them but they might tell you.)

 

I am always very cautious with what these companies / solicitors say on the phone. I'm afraid you simply cannot rely on telephone statements unless they are recorded.

[MrsDocteur77]

Thank you for this.

 

I will let you know how I get on tomorrow. Thanks again

[Ell-enn]

Hi there, please try not to worry too much - I know it's a scary situation but judges don't take people's houses away when they are able to make monthly payments towards the arrears.

 

Have a read of my guide her http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?325527-CAG-guide-Are-you-facing-eviction-or-repossession there are examples of everything you need for your N244 application and I can help you with it.

[Lea_HTH]

There is some incorrect information in this thread.

 

1. A warrant of execution is a paper exercise, it takes, at best, 5 minutes to complete, and the only delay in the notice of eviction arriving is to do with whether or not the bailiffs have appointments available. From issue of warrant to the notice of eviction can take as little as 7 days, but is more likely to be at the very least a couple of weeks. It depends entirely on how busy the local bailiffs are. Bailiffs in my jurisdiction do not evict over the Christmas period, so unless a date is available before 18th December, it is not likely to occur before the first week of January - and far more likely to be towards the end of January. Not all bailiffs work in the same way.

 

2. The pre-action protocol is no longer relevant - the action started a long time ago and ended in a suspended possession order, the mortgagee has no obligation to go back down the pre-action route since they have already taken action and have secured an order.

 

3. Charges are not a 'line of defense' (sic). Charges cannot be stated in court as 'arrears', only actual missed payments of current monthly instalment (CMI) can be stated in court as arrears. It is very unusual these days for mortgagees to be silly enough to come into court with figures that include charges. Even if they do, so long as they can determine what are arrears and what are charges, the overall effect will be the same.

 

4. The fact that a solicitor's letter was received before the notice of eviction was advanced warning - the mortgagee doesn't even need to do that at this stage. With an SPO they can go straight to executing the warrant.

 

Now the good(ish) news.

 

If the arrears can be paid back within the term of the loan, and the OP can afford the CMI plus that arrears payment, then a judge is likely to stay any eviction. However, this will also be tempered with whether it is reasonable to allow the mortgagee to gain possession given the circumstances of the arrears. If there has been a flagrant disregard of the order made previously, and payments have not been kept to for any consistent period of time, then a stay is less likely than if there was consistency followed by a minor, brief blip in payments that can be explained by an event (e.g. losing a job).

 

How many payments have you missed since the SPO was granted? How much were the arrears when the SPO were granted? Are they lower now? By how much?

 

You will need to show good evidence of the reasons for your difficulties in meeting your obligation to the mortgagee, but if you can, there is a strong likelihood of the warrant being stayed.

[nomorecrooks]

There is some incorrect information in this thread.

 

1. A warrant of execution is a paper exercise, it takes, at best, 5 minutes to complete, and the only delay in the notice of eviction arriving is to do with whether or not the bailiffs have appointments available. From issue of warrant to the notice of eviction can take as little as 7 days, but is more likely to be at the very least a couple of weeks. It depends entirely on how busy the local bailiffs are. Bailiffs in my jurisdiction do not evict over the Christmas period, so unless a date is available before 18th December, it is not likely to occur before the first week of January - and far more likely to be towards the end of January. Not all bailiffs work in the same way.

 

2. The pre-action protocol is no longer relevant - the action started a long time ago and ended in a suspended possession order, the mortgagee has no obligation to go back down the pre-action route since they have already taken action and have secured an order.

 

3. Charges are not a 'line of defense' (sic). Charges cannot be stated in court as 'arrears', only actual missed payments of current monthly instalment (CMI) can be stated in court as arrears. It is very unusual these days for mortgagees to be silly enough to come into court with figures that include charges. Even if they do, so long as they can determine what are arrears and what are charges, the overall effect will be the same.

 

4. The fact that a solicitor's letter was received before the notice of eviction was advanced warning - the mortgagee doesn't even need to do that at this stage. With an SPO they can go straight to executing the warrant.

 

Now the good(ish) news.

 

If the arrears can be paid back within the term of the loan, and the OP can afford the CMI plus that arrears payment, then a judge is likely to stay any eviction. However, this will also be tempered with whether it is reasonable to allow the mortgagee to gain possession given the circumstances of the arrears. If there has been a flagrant disregard of the order made previously, and payments have not been kept to for any consistent period of time, then a stay is less likely than if there was consistency followed by a minor, brief blip in payments that can be explained by an event (e.g. losing a job).

 

How many payments have you missed since the SPO was granted? How much were the arrears when the SPO were granted? Are they lower now? By how much?

 

You will need to show good evidence of the reasons for your difficulties in meeting your obligation to the mortgagee, but if you can, there is a strong likelihood of the warrant being stayed.

 

 

I am sure you are correct on many of your points above, however I have indeed used (as have other CAG's) the monthly arrears charges as a point of argument at the stage of requesting a stay of eviction. The argument is as follows:

 

A - the monthly arrears charges have been found by the FSA to be excessive (in my case £50) as they exceed the costs of managing the arrears (FSA's findings in the case of DB Bank (UK) and GMAC);

B - because the arrears are in part interest on the capitalised monthly arrears charges the amount of arrears as stated is incorrect.

 

I am not suggesting that this is a "killer argument" but rather an argument which if combined with other arguments can be compeling for a Court.

[MrsDocteur77]

Good Morning,

 

I called them last night for an update as we had until 4pm to pay the arrears and my account manager was "on the other line" I asked whether they had instructed the solicitor to seek a warrant and as at 6pm they hadn't. I asked what was happening and they said that my account manager had received my letter and was preparing a reply. He said he would ask him to call me and I said that was fine but i would also like everything in writing which they said they would do. They also said they would send me a statement of my mortgage so will see what happens next.

 

Will keep you all informed and thank you all so much for your advice.

[Lea_HTH]

I am sure you are correct on many of your points above, however I have indeed used (as have other CAG's) the monthly arrears charges as a point of argument at the stage of requesting a stay of eviction. The argument is as follows:

 

A - the monthly arrears charges have been found by the FSA to be excessive (in my case £50) as they exceed the costs of managing the arrears (FSA's findings in the case of DB Bank (UK) and GMAC);

B - because the arrears are in part interest on the capitalised monthly arrears charges the amount of arrears as stated is incorrect.

 

I am not suggesting that this is a "killer argument" but rather an argument which if combined with other arguments can be compeling for a Court.

 

Of course I'm correct - it's my job to know what I'm doing.

 

Point 3 in my post is clear and covers what you have said. It would only be 'compelling' to a court if by removing the charges there were no arrears at all...which is largely unlikely. The only thing that is compelling to a judge hearing a stay application is whether the person can afford to pay the CMI plus something towards the arrears to clear them in a reasonable time.

[MrsDocteur77]

Hi Lea-HTH

 

We have sent a financial statement to our mortgage company showing we can afford the monthly payment plus £80 extra a month. We are (and have been for the last 5 months) paying the mortgage plus £50 extra every month. The arrears are due to my husband loosing his job in 2011 - we are both now back in work. The arreas total now £4808 but where higher five months ago and the mortgage life is another 17 years. We received the Suspension Order in Feb 2010 after I lost my job in June 2009. They put the arrears on the life of our mortgage.

 

Thanks

[MrsDocteur77]

Just received a call from my account manager at Engage Credit who tells me all action is on hold - whoooo hooooo - and that he will look at our proposal and hopefully get an agreement put into place.

 

Thank you all so much for your help.

[Lea_HTH]

Hi Lea-HTH

 

We have sent a financial statement to our mortgage company showing we can afford the monthly payment plus £80 extra a month. We are (and have been for the last 5 months) paying the mortgage plus £50 extra every month. The arrears are due to my husband loosing his job in 2011 - we are both now back in work. The arreas total now £4808 but where higher five months ago and the mortgage life is another 17 years. We received the Suspension Order in Feb 2010 after I lost my job in June 2009. They put the arrears on the life of our mortgage.

 

Thanks

 

You have done the correct thing by sending a financial statement and making an offer to the mortgagee. They have 10 days in which to respond to you - if they do not do so, ensure when you go to court that you include the letter and offer with your N244. If you have kept to the terms of the previous SPO subject to issues such as your partner losing his job, then a judge will be sympathetic. These things happen, particularly in this lengthy recession.

 

Your arrears payment should clear the arrears in a little over 5 years, which is good as that is well within the Norgan calculation. So long as your income and expenditure show you can afford this amount, (and not more) then the judge should accept that.

 

What I am unclear about in relation to your statement above is that you say the arrears were 'put on the life of the mortgage' - do you mean they were capitalised? If so, then you should not have had an amount to pay towards the arrears, merely an increased CMI. Could you clarify that please?

 

Also, are the arrears now more than they were when the original SPO was granted?

[MrsDocteur77]

Just received a call from my account manager at Engage Credit who tells me all action is on hold - whoooo hooooo - and that he will look at our proposal and hopefully get an agreement put into place.

 

Thank you all so much for your help.

 

 

 

You have done the correct thing by sending a financial statement and making an offer to the mortgagee. They have 10 days in which to respond to you - if they do not do so, ensure when you go to court that you include the letter and offer with your N244. If you have kept to the terms of the previous SPO subject to issues such as your partner losing his job, then a judge will be sympathetic. These things happen, particularly in this lengthy recession.

 

Your arrears payment should clear the arrears in a little over 5 years, which is good as that is well within the Norgan calculation. So long as your income and expenditure show you can afford this amount, (and not more) then the judge should accept that.

 

What I am unclear about in relation to your statement above is that you say the arrears were 'put on the life of the mortgage' - do you mean they were capitalised? If so, then you should not have had an amount to pay towards the arrears, merely an increased CMI. Could you clarify that please?

 

Also, are the arrears now more than they were when the original SPO was granted?

[Bah Humbug!]

I am glad to see you are getting support from the site. This is my first time using a site- do not feel confident but forced myself because I am also in need of help from anyone who knows how to challenge a Fixed Charge Receiver. It is not my home as it is yours but a buy to Let, Yes I am a Landlord which seems to be a dirty word when you ask CAB to advise because you cannot afford to pay for legal advice. I am very hardworking and have always maintained my property well and had a good working relationship with my tenant. On an interest only mortgage at 6.04% I have made absolutely no money but was looking at the long term for my Retirement. This action of Receivership will bankrupt me for less than £2,000 mortgage arrears. Immediately on being told by Yorkshire Bank trading as Chelsea Building Society for the first time I offered full settlement over the phone using my Debit card. Chelsea refused my offer of settlement saying they had appointed the Receivers Allsop two days earlier. I had called Chelse two days before that to discuss other matters and was not told of the impending action ? Is this legal ? Chelsea denied I offered settlement but I managed to get a copy of the recorded conversations. Allsop look to be getting paid hansomely from my family's abject misery. thed debt is likely to exceed over £60,000 and was totally unecessary. Allsop stand to charge three times over because not only are they Receivers,they are the Management company ARIM and I believe Estate Agents and Auctioneers. Talk about conflict of interests ???? Is this legal ? Allsop Receivers have RECEIVED not one penny in rent because they did not ask the tenant for it in over twelve months. The reason Allsop gave was that I was having Chelsea investigated by the Financial Ombudsman ? However the Ombudsman confirmed he did not instruct Allsop to not collect rent or evict the then non paying tenant. They took this financial decision yet Allsop claim to be an Independent company to Chelsea, HA! Ha ! Why did Chelsea tell them to do nothing ?

This stress has severely affected my health, I literally survived a life threatening condition directly because of Chelsea/Allsop action.I am desperate it is a living nightmare, is there anyone who can help me and my family ?