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FCC Notice of Intention to prosecute: Details of offence not given on notice

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Hi all,

 

Some advice needed please.

 

I've posted this on one other forum on a different site already but received conflicting opinions about what I should do.

 

I'm posting here too in the hope that someone may be able to offer something more concrete on how I should proceed.

 

On Friday I received a Notice of Intention to prosecute from FCC.

 

The notice stated that on the date in question and at time.....my details were taken by a RPI.

No offence is mentioned, only that my details were taken.

 

It then continues to say:

'This letter is to inform you of our intention to take this case to the Magistrates Court

and the enclosed form provides you with the opportunity to tell us what happened from your own point of view. Information should be both factual and honest.'

 

A list of potential penalties that the court can issue is then given.

I continued to read on to the section entitled

 

'Details of Offence' which read:

'On the above date you were stopped and questioned in regard to the following alleged offence(s):

' beneath this statement it is just blank, nothing is written, i.e. they have not stated details of any offence once again.

 

I am then asked to provide my own statement of what happened.

 

Can anyone enlighten me as to what this amounts to,

in respect of the fact that I have not been told what offence they allege I have committed and what they intend to prosecute me for?

 

Are they looking for a statement from me incriminating myself before they decide how to proceed?

 

The reason I had details taken is that on the date in question

 

I was pulled by an RPI for the offence of being in first class on a standard class ticket, returning to Stevenage from Finsbury Park (1 stop, 17 mins).

 

In hindsight it was stupid to do that,

but I should point out that I only entered first class as the rest of the carriage (standard class) was full and 1st was empty.

 

On entering the train I had every intention to sit in standard.

 

Looking back I should of stood up, but stupidly I didn't.

 

When approached by the RPI I explained why I sat in 1st and offered immediately to leave and stand in standard for the remainder of the journey.

I was told that he could not allow this and that I would have to pay the penalty fare.

I explained that I could not pay there and then and so he cautioned me and explained that the matter would likely go to court.

 

Having not been in this situation before and not knowing if this was normal or not I just accepted and waited for the letter to come through.

 

Now that I have that letter no offence is mentioned, only that my details were taken.

 

I feel like I should not make any statement without having been notified of the exact offence that I am being prosecuted for

so that at a legal level I know what I am accused of before I make a statement.

 

Am I within my rights to withold my statement at this time and is that the best approach?

 

I am not trying to dodge any fine here and I am more than willing to pay the fine/fare to have this matter resolved,

but does this kind of thing count as an admistrative error on the part of FCC which would see the case get thrown out of court anyway?

Any help would be much appreciated.

Kind regards.

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Who is fcc ? Is this a private security company or something ?


I hate bailiffs. Let me know if you have had a problem with them. I am sure i could upset them.

I now have experience with Securitas Security Services (UK) Limited and won in court against them 01/2018

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Who is fcc ? Is this a private security company or something ?

 

First Capital Connect, I think.

 

My best, HB


Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Who is fcc ? Is this a private security company or something ?

 

FCC is First Capital Connect. I should of made that clear at the start.

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Are they claiming you shop lifted or something ?


I hate bailiffs. Let me know if you have had a problem with them. I am sure i could upset them.

I now have experience with Securitas Security Services (UK) Limited and won in court against them 01/2018

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ok so you travelled in 1st class without the correct ticket

 

std approach

 

send a grovelling letter apologising for the mistake

 

keep it sort and truthful with out waffle.

 

offer to pay all reasonables costs and fines to prevent it going to court.

 

several threads here already on like situations

follow those too

dx


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Can anyone enlighten me as to what this amounts to, in respect of the fact that I have not been told what offence they allege I have committed and what they intend to prosecute me for?

 

Are they looking for a statement from me incriminating myself before they decide how to proceed?

 

 

 

No, it will be clear from your original post that they already have a report of the offence from the inspector and I suggest that contains sufficient evidence for the TOC to proceed. You were travelling in a First Class carriage and failed to show the appropriate ticket on demand as indicated by you below:

 

The only question that arises in my mind is what type of ticket were you travelling with. Was it a Standard class season ticket?

 

 

 

The reason I had details taken is that on the date in question I was pulled by an RPI for the offence of being in first class on a standard class ticket, returning to Stevenage from Finsbury Park (1 stop, 17 mins).

 

In hindsight it was stupid to do that, but I should point out that I only entered first class as the rest of the carriage (standard class) was full and 1st was empty.

 

On entering the train I had every intention to sit in standard.

 

Looking back I should of stood up, but stupidly I didn't.

 

 

 

Unfortunately, neither the length of the journey, nor the idea of standing in First Class would have made any difference I'm afraid. The best option in these circumstances is to either, stand in Standard Class, or ask someone to move their bags off a seat and into the luggage area if seats are inconsiderately occupied in this way. That is often the case on FCC in my experience.

 

 

 

I feel like I should not make any statement without having been notified of the exact offence that I am being prosecuted for so that at a legal level I know what I am accused of before I make a statement.

 

 

 

From your own post it seems clear that you do know what you have been reported for so I cannot see what could be gained by procrastination. It might be better practice for FCC to state in their letter 'on DATE you were reported when you failed to show a valid ticket for your journey', but they have not broken any rules.

 

You travelled seated in First Class, but had not paid the First Class fare.

 

 

 

Am I within my rights to withold my statement at this time and is that the best approach?

 

 

 

In my opinion that option would be foolhardy because it will miss an opportunity to help yourself. It is entirely up to you how you deal with this, but all that FCC will do if you do not respond is proceed to issue a Summons and will mark the file to say that they wrote to you but you 'Failed to respond'.

 

 

 

I am not trying to dodge any fine here and I am more than willing to pay the fine/fare to have this matter resolved, but does this kind of thing count as an admistrative error on the part of FCC which would see the case get thrown out of court anyway?

 

 

 

No, this would not get the case thrown out of court, in practice FCC do not have to write to you at all. Once an alleged offence is detected they could go straight to issue of a Summons to have their evidence tested by the Magistrates, but in common with other TOCs they have written to provide an opportunity for you to put your explanation.

 

All that any of us can offer are suggestions that might be considered by the reader and I try to give an unbiased view based on the rules in force and more than 30 years experience of dealing with such matters directly.

 

With regard to comments elsewhere, I'm afraid I can understand your confusion as there are many users of various internet sites who give what should not be considered as 'sound advice', but might better be described as opportunities for users 'to drive their own agenda'. I stress that this is not the case with all users of course, a great many do make excellent suggestions, but there are a handful who have personal agendas for whatever reason and the conflicting responses are unhelpful to those looking for assistance in understanding the issues.

Edited by Old-CodJA

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are there any examples of the style of letter that I should respond to them with?

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no

 

each case has its own merits

 

you might want to browse simular threads

 

use our search top right

 

dx


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

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Hello there.

 

The main thing is to write in your own words rather than to copy and paste. I suppose a brief explanation of why you were in first class when you shouldn't have been, an apology and expression of any remorse you feel.

 

And you could undertake not to do this again. They need to believe that you mean all this.

 

Then you can offer to meet their reasonable admin costs if they would agree to settle out of court. [They don't have to.]

 

HB


Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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