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    • https://www.bindmans.com/news/neale-v-dpp-the-right-to-silence-citizens-duties-and-coronavirus-regulations   Perhaps the OP should have said nothing - and risked arrest!   "Firstly, the case calls into question the logic behind aspects of the criminal justice response to the public health crisis created by the Coronavirus pandemic...   "Secondly, it is clear that some police officers have misunderstood and misstated their powers, and citizens’ obligations, under the Regulations and at common law...   "Thirdly, the case confirms reasonable excuses for being outside are not limited to those explicitly set out in the Regulations. Police officers considering whether there are reasonable grounds for believing that an offence has been committed under the Regulations so that an FPN may be issued, or the reasonable grounds for suspicion that are necessary for an arrest, should give proper consideration to any explanation given by members of the public (and what a court might think of them) rather than only recognising those exceptions explicitly listed in the Regulations and/or government guidance...   Fourthly, the case is an example of a failure of the CPS review into prosecutions brought under Coronavirus Regulations, which has found that alarming numbers of cases were wrongly charged..."   Above quotes from the Bindman's article, not the decision.  Case arose from the first lockdown and was in Wales.  Same now?  Also was about not being at home - not mask wearing.    
    • No the first LBA was delivered by royal mail, but I responded by email, sorry if I didn't make that clear.   I look at redacting the emails tomorrow, got to get some sleep now.   Thanks
    • ok well that changes things alot. you've accepted one before by email  and now they are doing it again ..   might have shot yourself in the foot until now lets get some 1st aid done.   gonna be a pain to redact but i'm gonna need to see all the emails in/out please in ONE MULTIPAGE PDF from/inc  date of their last PAPLOC   redact them properly !! read our upload guide carefully   you may  think this is immaterial, but its not, esp important is their and your exact wording
    • OK I've looked back at my emails and it appears I've been dealing with shoosmiths since the start of 2019 when they sent a LBA that I'd totally forgot about.   I replied that I didn't recognise the debt and we got into a big letter tennis over the facts.   They then went quiet and then contacted me again in April 2020 asking for income and expenditure details to work out a payment plan with them.   After I responded with my covid comments they went quiet again.   And now they are back with another LBA and I haven't responded to that.   Hope that clears it up. 
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    • I sent in the bailiffs to the BBC. They collected £350. It made me smile.
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    • Hi @BankFodder
      Sorry for only updating you now, but after your guidance with submitting the claim it was pretty straight forward and I didn't want to unnecessarily waste your time. Especially with this guide you wrote here, so many thanks for that
      So I issued the claim on day 15 and they requested more time to respond.
      They took until the last day to respond and denied the claim, unsurprisingly saying my contract was with Packlink and not with them.
       
      I opted for mediation, and it played out very similarly to other people's experiences.
       
      In the first call I outlined my case, and I referred to the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 as the reason to why I do in fact have a contract with them. 
       
      In the second call the mediator came back with an offer of the full amount of the phone and postage £146.93, but not the court costs. I said I was not willing to accept this and the mediator came across as a bit irritated that I would not accept this and said I should be flexible. I insisted that the law was on my side and I was willing to take them to court. The mediator went back to Hermes with what I said.
       
      In the third call the mediator said that they would offer the full amount. However, he said that Hermes still thought that I should have taken the case against Packlink instead, and that they would try to recover the court costs themselves from Packlink.
       
      To be fair to them, if Packlink wasn't based in Spain I would've made the claim against them instead. But since they are overseas and the law lets me take action against Hermes directly, it's the best way of trying to recover the money.
       
      So this is a great win. Thank you so much for your help and all of the resources available on this site. It has helped me so much especially as someone who does not know anything about making money claims.
       
      Many thanks, stay safe and have a good Christmas!
       
       
        • Thanks
    • Hermes and mediation hints. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/428981-hermes-and-mediation-hints/&do=findComment&comment=5080003
      • 1 reply
    • Natwest Bank Transfer Fraud Call HMRC Please help. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/428951-natwest-bank-transfer-fraud-call-hmrc-please-help/&do=findComment&comment=5079786
      • 33 replies

ebay issue, please help and advise


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Hi everyone, i joined this forum after reading plenty of other eBay related threads. Basically i sold an item on eBay (a portable DVD player). The item was a gift an never used by myself so thought it was time to get rid (was going through a clearing out phase).

 

I tested the item fully before even bothering to go through the hassle of listing the item, it was my first listing so if the item was faulty would have saved me lots of hassle. Anyway i tested the item playing a couple of DVDs including one all the way through to test the battery was working ok as well as other functions that were included (digital tv etc)

 

My buyer took receipt of the item on a Friday, she had this item for a good six days before contacting me that it wasn't working she said "it fails to read my DVD" and then opened an eBay dispute. Knowing how much time and effort i went into testing this i was inclined to think it was something wrong with her disc (maybe a copied/pc burnt disk etc).

 

Needless to say we didn't reach a refund agreement, she wanted her original money plus the cost it would cost her to send it back to me. I informed her that if for some strange reason the item was damaged during delivery she left it too long to inform me that the courier i used said they would class it as she broke the item.

 

I had a real suspicion she had buyer's remorse, she insisted that the item was for her daughters birthday and was complaining that my "knowingly selling her a fault item" left her without a present a day before her daughters birthday, i asked why she waited a week and thus leaving it right before her daughters birthday to check the item, to which i received no reply.

 

So ebay in their "wisdom" took action and said that they fully believed that i checked the item and ensured it left me working, however the buyer had a significant case for the item not being as described and ordered her to return it to me at her own cost for a full refund.

 

I received the item earlier today, the first thing i did was un-package it and test the item and what do you know it still works exactly how it did when i sent the item out.

 

I know i can ask ebay to re-consider their decision what i would like to know is do i have any chance of winning here? in my eyes the buyer has lied as her reason to get her money back, it still works however i am out of the postage cost, paypal fee's and ebay fees.

 

Due to the buyer lying in her not as described case and ebay refunding her, they are now chasing me for the debt of £46.03 yet the true amount i earned was 40.60 after ebay and paypal fee's this doesn't even include the postage costs i incurred. If the sale was returned to the buyer IE the transaction never took place why are ebay still keeping their fee for a sale that according to them was cancelled and because their chasing me for the full amount they basically want me to pay their fees 4 times (2 ebay fees and 2 paypal fee's) is this legal?

 

 

Really sorry for the long post, i just wanted to as specific as possible, as you can probably tell i'm rather upset at the whole ordeal, i sold the item because i am currently job hunting and even smallest amount i'd have got for it would help. Now i'm facing being left out of pocket for what i am now sure was buyers remorse as her case was based on a complete lie.

 

Thanks for any help/advice you can give me.

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Best advice ?. Just nput it down to experience. Its one of the perils of Ebay, there are an awful lot of idiots out there who will mess you about and lie, etc.

 

I would of thought you wouldnt be out of pocket due to ebay/paypal fees, etc, in situations like this the fees are jnormally credited back to you although you could lose any postage costs.

 

It just isnt worth fighting over a few quid, but if you wanted to, then be aware that rarely/if ever do ebay/paypal puruse debtors through the courts, but should you not pay up, your ebay/payapla accounts will be barred, youll get DCA letters and they can in theory affect your credit rating.

 

Andy

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Ebay fees and paypal fees should be refunded by ebay and paypal as no transaction took place.

 

The only out of pocket expenses should be one way postage.

 

EDIT: what paypal fees? did you click the refund button on the transaction in paypal for the sold item or did you make a separate payment through paypal to refund the buyer?

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Hi thanks for the replies, the idea of my paypal and ebay accounts being barred isnt really an issue, i have no intentions of selling on ebay again nor will i buy on there, might sound dogmatic to some people but out of principle i just wont be one of their customers again. I only use paypal for ebay so if i wont use ebay dont really care about paypal.

 

I'm only young so the idea of fighting off debitors and the potential for a bad credit file is not really somthing i would like, i just dont see why i should be peanalised for actually not doing anything wrong.

 

As for the ebay/paypal fees, i didnt do anything, the transaction says reversed by ebay, one of the emails i got from ebay said they wont refund fee's which again to me sounds wrong, they say the sale transanction was reversed/cancelled/never took place what ever word they want to use so surely the fee's i incurred from both parties should be reversed/cancelled.

 

Anyway im about to phone them up, i cant deal with another useless emailing telling me that sometimes buyers and sellers have issues dont really need to be told that its quite evident to me as its currently happening.

 

Thanks for the info

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Just an update, phoning them was worse than the emails (didnt think that was possible). I was told i can appeal which of course i am going to do, however if i loose and owe them the money i have to pay them the full amount, then re-list my item and the fees on the second sale wont be counted.

 

Can they be for real? their seller support is shocking, why on earth would i want to go through that stress and hassle again, i paid my fee's on time with cash so they should be retuning said fees via the same method.

 

Am i right in assuming they have to return my fee's in cash so basically just take it off the amount i owe them?

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It seems odd that they told you the fees on the relist item won't be counted. I've never had this. It's always been that the seller fees were refunded at the time of refunding the buyer.

What would happen if you decided not to relist.

Have you tried posting on the sellers forum on ebay community? Maybe they know or have heard of this before.

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Hi Nagasis, the woman i spoke to on the phone was absolutely useless, was instantly easy to tell she was reading a script. I did say that i had no intention of re-listing this item or ever selling any item useing their service again so i request my fee's back in real money not eBay credit but i think her script must have said error because she didnt really respond.

 

Her overall solution was, i pay ebay £46 and relist the item, when it sells my fee's wouldnt be taken a second time but i can see that going horribly wrong for a start. They would look into the buyer and potential delete and block the buyers account because she said the actions of the buyer are against eBays rules and would be suspended. So even thou it sounds like the buyer has broken rules she gets her account suspended and i get chased for money i can see why they cant chase the buyer for the money as they decided to play judge and jury and they got it wrong.

 

I spoke to a friend of the family who runs his own company, he spoke to his lawyer's and they all agreed that i should say to ebay that if they want the money from me they will have to take me to small claims court i will represent myself and the item and with a impartial judge i will win because the item is working. The friend of the family seems to think they wont bother with this course of action based on that fact they know they would loose.

 

Does this sound like good advice? or is it too much hassle and effort i love a good argument but i'm currently un-emplyed looking for work which is probably more stressful than my entire uni course last thing i need is another reason to make my blood pressure go sky high.

 

I havnt used the ebay forums, mainly because all the posts i've read people just state your the seller you have to offer refunds etc and then just end with pretty much its ebay suck it up and try again. Whilst i value everyone's opinion thats not going to make me feel much better i thought maybe a different community might offer a less biased insight.

 

ooops long reply again sorry.

 

It seems odd that they told you the fees on the relist item won't be counted. I've never had this. It's always been that the seller fees were refunded at the time of refunding the buyer.

What would happen if you decided not to relist.

Have you tried posting on the sellers forum on ebay community? Maybe they know or have heard of this before.

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There is prob little more we can add. Things go wrong pn ebay for nearly everyone eventually you learn to deal with it and be careful about what you sell and who to. As youve discovered their customer service is awful but there is little you can do, if you are genuinelly agreived then sue them, many have been succesful but moaning on here will not get your money back. I like others above dont understand the fees situation, when sales r reversed ebay and paypal fees are refunded.

 

Andy

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The only thing i can think of is maybe not having any money in paypal caused the fee's not to be refunded as technically i still have the money i made from the sale just in my bank account not paypal.

 

Either way i have decided to fight this case because they emailed me saying that they are glad i received the item working, and that because it works i can and should just re-list the item however they still wont reverse their decision which without saying the word they have near enough said that they were wrong.

 

I have told them that i am fully prepared to go down to their head office in the Richmond as i live about 30mins away from it or they can take me to court for the money.

 

Luckily i dont have to go through the hassle of suing them i have my money they will have to sue me if they want to be paid

 

There is prob little more we can add. Things go wrong pn ebay for nearly everyone eventually you learn to deal with it and be careful about what you sell and who to. As youve discovered their customer service is awful but there is little you can do, if you are genuinelly agreived then sue them, many have been succesful but moaning on here will not get your money back. I like others above dont understand the fees situation, when sales r reversed ebay and paypal fees are refunded.

 

Andy

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No my paypal accont is 0 it was in negative during the dispute, however now my paypal says 0

 

but on ebay it says "You have an unpaid balance of £46.02 in connection to a case or cases in the Resolution Centre." so they claim i owe them the full amount they repaid her because she paid 36.02 plus £10 postage which they refunded. I can see why the say i owe them 46.02 because thats what they refunded the buyer however i havnt given back my paypal fee's or final sale fees so thats why it feels like they want me to pay 4 times for fee's.

 

Im going to get my some legal advice of my own via the citizens advice next week, so i know were i stand legally.

 

Is your Paypal account negative ?, how much do you believe Ebay/Paypal claim you owe them ?
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I very much doubt whether CAB can give you any meaningful advice, they are a very busy organisation and the law regarding ebay/paypal is very unclear and is mostly covered by the T&C's, which dont forget you agreed to...so I doubt whether they would know where to start...this is further complicated by them being both registered in Luxombourg with a limited Uk prescence.

 

Either you pay Ebay, dont pay them (and youll be chased but they wont actually start any legal action) or sue them for the returnm of the fees (although I suspect that have actually complied with the law and T&C's so Im not sure how you could sue).

 

Andy

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What I would pay is the 40.60 that is owed for the item.

Then id have a think about the £5 odd listing and final fees.

 

Do you want to be chased for such a small amount.?.

If youre like me I'd tell them where to go out of Principe, however im silly sometimes and will fight just for the sake of it. If 5 quid buys you a quiet life then maybe just as Andy says chalk it up to experience.

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haha it sounds like were both the same, i'm very much of the opinion its the principle. Honestly i dont really want or need the hassle of being chased for money nor do i need or want the hassle of having to keep contacting them.

 

I would bite the bullet and loose the delivery fee's and chalk that upto experience, but the idea of not having fee's refunded and having to pay them again is probably the part that has really frustrated me. If they agree to me paying back what i actually received then yes for the quite life i would probably give in. I've always said these big companies rely on people just bowing down to them and they should be stood upto once in a while but it truly does seem like too much hassle.

 

 

What I would pay is the 40.60 that is owed for the item.

Then id have a think about the £5 odd listing and final fees.

 

Do you want to be chased for such a small amount.?.

If youre like me I'd tell them where to go out of Principe, however im silly sometimes and will fight just for the sake of it. If 5 quid buys you a quiet life then maybe just as Andy says chalk it up to experience.

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Hey everyone its been a few days since my last post, i thought i would give an update and say that my persistence is starting to pay off. I decided to stop using the normal means of contact I.E the telephone calls and emails to customer service who where just absolutely useless and of no help, and decided to go straight to the organ grinder, I sent a direct email to the CEO and president of eBay.

 

He assigned someone from within the "office of the president" to assist me, currently they have admitted that their buyer protection system has flaws and that it does allow buyers to make fraudulent claims because they never see the items. They claim that because they do not inspect items they "cannot mediate or take sides in a dispute." i thought they did this all the time thou?

 

Anyway, they have finally admitted that i should not be out of pocket for their mistake in siding with the buyer, so they have issued me with a £20 eBay voucher that expires on the 31/12/2012. Its a gesture of good will however they still haven't explained why my eBay/pay fee's weren't refunded or why they are charging for them again.

 

I'm currently trying to get them to take the money off what i owe with the voucher as i have no real use for it and the whole point of selling something was to make some money to pay bills not buy more stuff i probably don't need.

 

Anyway i just wanted update the thread in case anyone else goes through the same issues, never back down without a fight if you know your honestly in the right these companies are big but they aren't against the law and a letter/email to the right person always helps :)

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  • 3 weeks later...

hello i am currently in a dispute with ebay also and find communicating with them shocking..would it be possible for you to post the CEO email address as it seems you have had some joy by emailing him.thanks

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