Traffic Offence fine not mine

[jimmy2times]

Hi, I'm new to this forum. I need some advise.

 

I sold a car two months ago and have received the new owners traffic offence fine they committed. I have return the paper work stating I sold they car but its been rejected, stating I have not supplied any evidence for proof of sale. I have appeal it this and my appeal is next month.

 

When I sold the car I signed the V5 log book but gave it to the new owner to sign,it was a present of this wife and so she couldn't sign it for me to post it off there are then. Unfortunately they signed and sent off the V5 2 weeks later, stating it was sold then, after the fine was issued.

 

I have written to the DVLA stating the date of sale is incorrect and asked for it to be changed. Technically I have no other proof I didn't own the car when the offence was committed. The new owner has refused to accept liability, has not paid the fine even though I have contacted them and sent them the paper work.

 

All I have is a letter from the DVLA with a copy of the V5 with my signature backing my version of events, and a few txt messages from the new owner agreeing the price of sale. The car was advertise on Ebay, he didn't win but contacted me within 5 minutes of the end asking to buy it, so i have a record of this, just no actual receipt on the day.

 

What are my chances of winning this case if the DVLA do not update they records to prove I was not the owner?

 

Should I cut my losses and pay the **** bags £130 fine, I am so :mad2: ****ed off about this!!!

[Conniff]

If you print off the ebay correspondence then a really good chance. I'm assuming you did your talking after the sale through ebay as well.

Get everything you can into a bundle so you can submit it.

 

See, another case of 'I don't care who done it, I just want the money', all government departments act this way now.

[Aretnap]

How did he pay? If it was cash, I don't suppose you have a bank statement to show that you put a large sum of cash into your account a day or two later?

 

I suggest you opt for a personal hearing with the adjudicator if it's practical; in the absence of indisputable evidence it may come down to your credibility, and turning up in person and coming across as honest can count for a lot.

[CrappoMan]

Did you cancel your insurance or notify your insurance company of the change of vehicle on the day of the sale ?

Where was the offence committed ? Can you prove you were elsewhere at the time in question ?

 

Depending on your answers, these could be evidence in your favour.

[Surfer01]

A bit late now, but I assume it is the responsibility of the old keeper, yourself, to send off the V5 and not the new keeper which prevents this sort of thing happening. For all you know the car could have been used in a bank robbery in the meantime. Also what other tickets are going to make their appearance or even bailiffs visiting. Can you prove that you were elsewhere on the day in question? Do you have a bill of sale signed by both parties?

[jimmy2times]

Did you cancel your insurance or notify your insurance company of the change of vehicle on the day of the sale ?

Where was the offence committed ? Can you prove you were elsewhere at the time in question ?

 

Depending on your answers, these could be evidence in your favour.

 

I did cancel my car insurance a week before the sale, because that's when I picked up my new car. So no nothing to show it happen on the day.

 

The offense was committed by the owner driving through a no entry bus only lane. It happen 3 days after I sold the car.

 

Regarding the proof of where I was at the time is not that relevant, the owner/registered keep is responsible for all tickets apparently.

 

I have written to the DVLA's sensitive case department explaining the issue, they will get back to me in a few weeks, hopefully with the letter stating the corrected exchange of ownership. If they don't do this before the appeal I will write to the adjudicator and postpone one more time the hearing until I'm ready with my evidence.

[jimmy2times]

How did he pay? If it was cash, I don't suppose you have a bank statement to show that you put a large sum of cash into your account a day or two later?

 

I suggest you opt for a personal hearing with the adjudicator if it's practical; in the absence of indisputable evidence it may come down to your credibility, and turning up in person and coming across as honest can count for a lot.

 

I have arranged a personal hearing for this reason as currently my evidence is thin on the ground. The car was paid with cash so no bank transaction.

[jimmy2times]

If you print off the ebay correspondence then a really good chance. I'm assuming you did your talking after the sale through ebay as well.

Get everything you can into a bundle so you can submit it.

 

See, another case of 'I don't care who done it, I just want the money', all government departments act this way now.

 

Not quite, he didn't win the auction, he failed to meet the reserve. The sale was done outside of Ebay, thus avoiding Ebay transaction fee's (would be worth it now I know!). I do have text message immediate after the auction ended asking what the reserve was and how much I wanted for the car. Also 3 text message on the day he bought the car asking for directions etc. But again nothing in the text to say "Thank you for the car I am happy to have purchased such a fine car on this date xzy". So nothing solid to show he bought the car on that day.

[Conniff]

This is how these [problematic] work - there is enough warning on ebay 'not' to do business outside after the auction has finished especially with a failed bidder.

[Kiki1]

Not quite, he didn't win the auction, he failed to meet the reserve. The sale was done outside of Ebay, thus avoiding Ebay transaction fee's (would be worth it now I know!). I do have text message immediate after the auction ended asking what the reserve was and how much I wanted for the car. Also 3 text message on the day he bought the car asking for directions etc. But again nothing in the text to say "Thank you for the car I am happy to have purchased such a fine car on this date xzy". So nothing solid to show he bought the car on that day.

 

Since the auction is under 90 days old and you were the seller, you should be able to pull the bidders details - even if the highest didn't actually win. Since the auction site also allows personal detail to be shared once somebody has bid in the link below

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/ebayadvsearch/?_sofindtype=9

 

you can use the date of the auction and the info to confirm the car was for sale at the time, if not transferred to another person shortly after.

 

The fact the buyer was bidding on your vehicle does show he was interested before the offences were committed, which helps your case. If the same phone number appears on both the auction 'contact info' detail and your phone, then you have confirmation the same person was in contact with you after auction end, which wouldn't be the case if he was compeletely unrelated to the cars sale, and subsequent history.

 

It's not 100%, but does get you somewhere further.

[Aretnap]

Regarding the proof of where I was at the time is not that relevant, the owner/registered keep is responsible for all tickets apparently.

You're correct that the owner (wo is not necessarily the registered keeper) is liable for parking tickets, so no the fact that you were somewhere else isn't in itself enough to get you off. But when it comes to proving that you did indeed sell it when you say you did, it would help if you can show that you and your wife were elsewhere at the time - so who else would have been driving it but the mystery buyer? Every little helps.

[green_and_mean]

Not quite, he didn't win the auction, he failed to meet the reserve. The sale was done outside of Ebay, thus avoiding Ebay transaction fee's (would be worth it now I know!). I do have text message immediate after the auction ended asking what the reserve was and how much I wanted for the car. Also 3 text message on the day he bought the car asking for directions etc. But again nothing in the text to say "Thank you for the car I am happy to have purchased such a fine car on this date xzy". So nothing solid to show he bought the car on that day.

 

Serves you right really for selling off ebay after using their site to get a buyer, they are not a charity its a business when you sign up you agree to their terms and conditions.

[adamr0we]

I don't really see it as an ebay issue at all, although they might be able to provide information about the bidder. I think the fact remains that it is the Keeper's responsibility to notify the DVLA of the sale and as such you would remain liable for any penalties or fines issued until it is taken out of your name. Even if you didn't have the V5 you could have sent them a letter with the details and date of sale. If you don't hear back within 4 weeks then it is still your responsibility to follow up and make sure the DVLA received the details. You should always create an invoice/receipt for a car sale, even if it's just a couple of lines in Word.

 

I hope you do get enough info to help with your appeal, but if not you may have to chalk it up to a lesson learned.

[jimmy2times]

I hope you do get enough info to help with your appeal, but if not you may have to chalk it up to a lesson learned.

 

I hope so too. If I dont win I'm going to take the E£$%£$% to the small claims court for my £130 quid, even if it ends up costing me more.

[jimmy2times]

Serves you right really for selling off ebay after using their site to get a buyer, they are not a charity its a business when you sign up you agree to their terms and conditions.

 

Dont be a fool, the advert costs £20 to list. You really are misinformed, back in your box.

[jimmy2times]

Since the auction is under 90 days old and you were the seller, you should be able to pull the bidders details - even if the highest didn't actually win. Since the auction site also allows personal detail to be shared once somebody has bid in the link below

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/ebayadvsearch/?_sofindtype=9

 

you can use the date of the auction and the info to confirm the car was for sale at the time, if not transferred to another person shortly after.

 

The fact the buyer was bidding on your vehicle does show he was interested before the offences were committed, which helps your case. If the same phone number appears on both the auction 'contact info' detail and your phone, then you have confirmation the same person was in contact with you after auction end, which wouldn't be the case if he was compeletely unrelated to the cars sale, and subsequent history.

 

It's not 100%, but does get you somewhere further.

 

Excellent advice, I now have an email from Ebay linking the highest bidder of my car to the address of the buyer. Useful evidence for me, cheers for that.

[lamma]

"If you don't hear back within 4 weeks then it is still your responsibility to follow up ". That is the DVLA point of view, the courts differ.

[Kiki1]

Excellent advice, I now have an email from Ebay linking the highest bidder of my car to the address of the buyer. Useful evidence for me, cheers for that.

 

The phone number is more important than the contact address as it provides you with proof of the text messages and therefore the day the new owner made plans to come and see/collect the car.