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    • Try CPR 31.15 Possibly but a party is not compelled to disclose any documents pre allocation
    • Hi, I shown my key worker a letter that was sent to me saying that I owe £1200, she setup a standing order around 2021, this was to pay back money I owed, with my mental health status I have had complex issues to deal with and I just simply forgot about this standing order so it has been running for about 3.5 years acording to my key worker, anyway I'm not worried about the money that was sent that I call a overpayment, it went towards supporting my child's household so I am just happy with that, I am a little sad that I am being told I still owe this £1200, I have sent bank statements over 3 years worth but they have not taken away this £1200 bill and still say I owe it   Thank you
    • She did try contacting EON in the early days of the debt but they refused to speak to her because she could not pass the security checks. She didn't know the answers on an account she hadn't opened?   I also saw this article recently which could be what has happended here: Debt collection agencies in the UK are using fair means or foul to link people to an address where an unpaid debt has been run up, sometimes years after they have moved out The Guardian Anna Tims Mon 22 Apr 2024 The letter from the debt collection agency arrived out of the blue, and it was intimidating. It informed Joshua Simpson* that he owed £2,212 to Octopus Energy, and accused him of ignoring previous requests to settle the bill. If he did not stump up within 14 days, he was told, further action would be taken to recover the money. Simpson checked his Octopus account – it was in credit. Then he noticed the address where the debt had been accrued between 2022 and 2023. It was his childhood home – which his family had sold 18 years previously. "Since I was only 16 when we left the property, I was astonished that they'd linked my name [to it]," he says. "The debt collection agency insisted I provide a tenancy agreement to prove how long I've lived at my current address. I couldn't, since we bought our home. "They are now actively pursuing me for this debt, causing me a huge amount of stress. We are about to remortgage, and if this debt prevents us switching to a better deal, we will face real financial hardship." Simpson had been sucked into the shadowy world of "identity tracing", whereby investigators recruited by creditors seek to locate individuals who have moved home without paying their bills. It is an unregulated sector where anyone can set up as an agent in a back room without a licence, or scrutiny, and use fair means or foul to identify debtors. Reputable companies join a trade association that operates a code of practice, but membership is not mandatory, and mistakes are common. Last year, a teenage boy was chased for a debt of more than £900 by debt collectors acting for the energy company Ovo. A "trace agent" had somehow linked him to the debt because his parents had previously rented the property in question. An investigation by the Observer established that the debt had been run up by a subsequent tenant. The consequences of mistaken identity can be catastrophic. Individuals who are erroneously linked to a debt face, at worst, court action, bailiffs and a ruined credit rating. At best, they can endure weeks of stress and paperwork in order to prove they are not the debtor. It is estimated that 20m identity traces are made in the UK every year, many on behalf of companies that are owed money. Personal data is often obtained from credit reference agencies, which record applications for credit, and details are supposed to be verified with several different sources before being used for debt enforcement. In practice, however, this does not always happen. Simpson's details had been passed along a chain of intermediaries before the demand was issued. Octopus had given the unpaid account to a debt collection agent, which had contracted a tracing service, GBG, to find the debtor................ Full Article: https://www.theguardian.com/money/2023/oct/04/a-cry-for-help-energy-providers-play-the-villain-in-dramas-to-chill-the-blood ..............The Financial Ombudsman Service, which investigates complaints about financial firms, states that debt collection agents have to produce convincing evidence to link an individual to a debt, rather than rely on names, addresses and birth dates. According to the trade association, the Institute of Professional Investigators, an unknown number of investigators and trace agents are operating below the radar. Many more are merely inept, as data protection compliance training is not mandatory. "We have been campaigning for many, many years to try to get all private investigators regulated," says secretary general Glyn Evans.
  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Starting Three Claims From Lloyds ** WON **


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Hello everybody,I've been reading this site for months now tryng to gather enough info to be confident in my claims.Yet somehow still feel as if I don't know anything!I have read through the small claims book and will refer to it as and when necessary.

Anyway, I have posted three preliminary letters for three accounts(two classic, one business and the ball is rolling.Like so many other sole traders I have read about here, my husband has been ripped off by Lloyds for years.After eight years of trying to manage, he had to admit defeat.The constant burden of loan payments,overdraft limits,bank charges and penalties was more than he and the business could support He was very lucky to get a job (he is 59) and after weeks of rearranging finances which mainly entailed putting all the debt on the mortgage,here we are trying to get some of it back, thanks to this site.

Will keep you posted and good luckto all

BELLA 47

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Hi, I've been on holiday so this post is behind schedule. The usual template responses from Lloyds were waiting for me when I arrived home.The business(sole trader) account response was different from the personal account ones even though I've been advised it's still a standard letter.I 've decided to combine the three accounts now and have sent only one LBA letter which refers to all three accounts.(The total amount being claimed is under £5000).

I keep reading around the site and learning all the time, I' m really beginning to enjoy myself!

Bella

BELLA 47

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Hi, I've been on holiday so this post is behind schedule. The usual template responses from Lloyds were waiting for me when I arrived home.The business(sole trader) account response was different from the personal account ones even though I've been advised it's still a standard letter.I 've decided to combine the three accounts now and have sent only one LBA letter which refers to all three accounts.(The total amount being claimed is under £5000).

I keep reading around the site and learning all the time, I' m really beginning to enjoy myself!

Bella

 

 

Best of luck Bella stick with it girl.;-)

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi, Well, I waited three weeks before I filed my court claim, having heard nothing at all from Lloyds.In fact I gave my defendant's address on the claim form as the London one, because that's what I have read somewhere on this site, but then the Customer services centre in Andover( who I sent the preliminary and LBA letters to)replied to my LBA letter after four weeks! They have offered £750 as,quote 'a gesture of goodwill because we might face that cost in dealing with your complaint if you took it any further'unquote.They then add that it does not mean that they consider they have any legal obligation to do so.They state that the payment will be credited to my account the next few days.

When the payment arrives, shall I write to the court informing them of the payment with a revised schedule of charges?Then write to the bank thanking them for their payment but accepting it as only part of the sum owed and inform them that the claim for the balance still stands?

BELLA 47

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This £750 offer seems to be a new tactic of Lloyds to sweeten people up in the hope they will go away.

Accept the offer as 'partial settlement' of the claim and add that you will be pursuing the claim for the balance.

Once the money is in your account then I would just let the courts know the outstanding balance and continue with the claim.

You might find that they withdraw the offer anway when the know you want 100%

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi All, Well the £750 didn't materialise! When I received the letter offering it from customer services at Andover, I had already sent off my court claim, so I suppose when they realised that, they decided not to give it to me after all.

The 14 days was up yesterday so I telephoned the court to ask if they had had any communication from Lloyds, they hadn't so I've sent off the court form asking for judgement with the daily interest until today added ( I don't know how you workout the eventual daily interest as how do you know how many days it will be before they give you the money?)I've also asked for immediate payment as it's an option. Can't understand why Lloyds are being so inactive!

Watch this space!

B

BELLA 47

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ha ha "Lloyds Inactive" sorry had to smile at that one, my terminology is a little ruder than that.

 

Good luck with it! Sounds like its not long to go for you now!

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Hi, Well, would you believe it! Lloyds have sent a cheque for £750. It arrived today from the customer services department at Andover and they said sorry for the delay. They also said this is the final offer, blah, blah, leaflet for ombudsman blah blah. So, the next thing is a letter to the court telling them lloyds have given us £750 so the new figure we are claiming is the original amount minus £750.I will wait until the cheque from Lloyds is cleared before I thank them and tell them that the claim is still going ahead for the balance.I

feel confident thanks to this wonderful website!

 

B

BELLA 47

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Hello again! On 5th January I received an allocation questionnaire and a defence from Lloyds all in the same envelope, and this is only two days after they sent me a cheque for £ 750!The whole set up they have is very disjointed and not at all efficient.There's customer services replying to my complaints with an offer of money and at the same time there's LLoyds head office employing solicitors and telling me they are going to defend the whole amount!I suppose I should have just written to head office and not bothered with customer services because it's obvious they don't communicate with one another.So what to do now? I've already written to the court telling them I have received £750 from Lloyds so the amount I'm claiming is £750 less than it was. I've also given them the new daily interest rate as from 4th January.Will the courts be O.K.with this? The £750 is in my husband's Abbey account but will not be available until 9th January. Shall I write to Lloyds using the template letter about refusing the money as a full and final settlement and accepting it as partial repayment only?Should I give them the option of taking it back? I think because everything seems to have crossed in the post I'm now confused when before I thought it was easy and straightforward. The main problem has been Lloyds taking so long to reply to everything. Any thoughts or comments very welcome

Thanks B

BELLA 47

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hello, Just about to send in my allocation questionnaire and after reading Gary's new suggested strategy for directions have decided to use it.The thing that's worrying me more and more is, what shall I do about the £750 that LLoyds gave me recently? I keep reading that the schedule of charges submitted at the hearing must be the same as the original one. But of course mine is now less! I have informed the court and the solicitors that I have accepted the amount in part settlement only.Anyone know if this is enough?

B

BELLA 47

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I'm not sure if this is the entirely 'proper' way to do it or not, but what I think I'd do is use the original schedule with the amount before the refund and just put a note underneath saying something like "Defendent made part-payment of £750 on **/**/**"

Please remember to DONATE! Help CAG keep up the fight!

 

 

Any advice or opinion is offered informally & without liability. Use your own judgment and if in doubt seek advice of a qualified and insured professional.

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Hello, delivered my allocation questionnaire to the court on the evening of the 16th January(deadline 19th).Reading the posts tonight jolted me into realising that I hadn't copied the questionnaire in order to send SC&M a copy!I panicked for a moment until I read a post which said that when they asked for a copy of SC&M's allocation questionnaire they told her they weren't obliged to send her one!

I used the new strategy for suggested directions in section G so now awaiting the reply from the court with interest.

BELLA 47

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I am a little ahead of you, used the new AQ strategy and SCM sent me a letter that would normally amount to full settlement last week - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/47207-guido-t-lloyds-tsb.html. However, I am claiming back 10 years with contractual interest.

 

Hopefully they will offer you full settlement soon.

If I have been helpful please click on my star and add a comment.

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Good luck Bella- i had an offer from lloyds today- keep going and you will be fine- seems like you know what your doing :)

Letter asking for my money back sent 24/07/06

Letter sent by them saying a big fat "NO" on the 26/07/06

LBA sent via email on the 31/07/06 14 days and counting.

Letter from them on 07/08/06 saying Bugger Off

MONEY CLAIM ISSUED 14/08/06

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I know this is nothing to do with my claim but thought I'd share it with other C.A.Ger's. I have kept my personal account with Lloyds open because at the moment it's more convenient and none of the accounts I am claiming for are overdrawn now. Anyway,the other day I thought I'd investigate Lloyds personal loan rates of interest(I bank on line) so I clicked the 'loan' sign with my mouse thinking it would give the info I needed.I was flabbergasted when up came details of a personal loan I'd taken out nearly five years ago!I was under the impression I'd paid it off.I seem to remember asking for a settlement figure and then going to the branch and transferring nearly all of the amount owing into the loan account to pay it off.That was in March 2005 after I'd been making payments for two years.I thought that if a small amount was still owing ,Lloyds would write and tell me. I never received any communication from them so I assumed it was the right amount and thought no more about it. What had happened was that I did still owe a small amount(£101.93)but Lloyds just left it and did nothing about it.They sent me no loan statements, letters, nothing! By the time I accidently discovered it whilst doing my internet banking recently,the amount I owed them was a massive £425.79!!!Over the course of 21 months that was how much interest had accrued.So all you contractual rate of interest claimers, don't think that you are being greedy, you'd have to go a long way to beat 417.72%!!!

( I telephoned Lloyds loan arrangers and complained so much that they agreed to write off the amount owed!)

BELLA 47

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Hi, today I received a notice from the court.Here's what it says:-

 

 

It is ordered that:

1. The claim be allocated to the small claims track

2. the claim be listed for further directions only at a preliminary hearing to take place on 14 February 2007 at 10.30 am, time estimate 5 minutes, to be held at King's Lynn County Court.

3.At this hearing the court will consider either:

a. to stay the claim pending the decision in a test case involving the defendant, or

b. to give directions for this claim to be heard as a test case, and if necessary to reallocate the claim to the multi track for that purpose.

4.Not less than 14 days before the preliminary hearing, the defendant shall file with the court and serve upon the Claimant details of any cases proceeding as a test case, the decision in which will determine the issues in this claim. Alternatively, the defendant shall file with the court and serve upon the claimant draft directions for this case to proceed as a test case.

5. The Claimant may make any representations to the court in writing provided these are received by the court and served on the defendant not less than 5 days before the preliminary hearing. If either party is prepared to abide by the decision of the judge as to the directions to be given, that party is excused from attending the preliminary hearing.

 

Has anyone got any idea what to do about this? Why will it have to be re allocated to the multi track if it turns out to be a test case? What representations should I make to the court as to the decision to proceed as a test case?I don't know whether it's good or bad.Would it be better to attend?

 

 

HELP!!!

BELLA 47

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You can write representations if you want to, instead of attending. I've seen this order a couple of times before and I think I did something for the claimant to send in. I'll have to try to find it and get back tro you. It'll be tomorrow afternoon now though cos I've got to rush off in a minute, is that ok? Pm me if I forget.

Please remember to DONATE! Help CAG keep up the fight!

 

 

Any advice or opinion is offered informally & without liability. Use your own judgment and if in doubt seek advice of a qualified and insured professional.

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Hi, today I received a notice from the court.Here's what it says:-

 

 

It is ordered that:

1. The claim be allocated to the small claims track

2. the claim be listed for further directions only at a preliminary hearing to take place on 14 February 2007 at 10.30 am, time estimate 5 minutes, to be held at King's Lynn County Court.

3.At this hearing the court will consider either:

a. to stay the claim pending the decision in a test case involving the defendant, or

b. to give directions for this claim to be heard as a test case, and if necessary to reallocate the claim to the multi track for that purpose.

4.Not less than 14 days before the preliminary hearing, the defendant shall file with the court and serve upon the Claimant details of any cases proceeding as a test case, the decision in which will determine the issues in this claim. Alternatively, the defendant shall file with the court and serve upon the claimant draft directions for this case to proceed as a test case.

5. The Claimant may make any representations to the court in writing provided these are received by the court and served on the defendant not less than 5 days before the preliminary hearing. If either party is prepared to abide by the decision of the judge as to the directions to be given, that party is excused from attending the preliminary hearing.

 

Has anyone got any idea what to do about this? Why will it have to be re allocated to the multi track if it turns out to be a test case? What representations should I make to the court as to the decision to proceed as a test case?I don't know whether it's good or bad.Would it be better to attend?

 

 

HELP!!!

 

The court is considering putting your claim forward as a test case, which will mean allocation to the Multi-track.

 

Bear in mind that every test case so far has been settled, including many involving Lloyds. You should decide whether you are prepared for the case to proceed as a test case or not. Remember that the multi-track carries the risk of costs being ordered against you if you were to lose.

 

If not, you need to write representations as to why your not happy with this, and request that your claim proceeds on the small claims track. The reasons would include that you are an ordinary consumer who filed the claim on the understanding that as the claim is under 5k, it would be allocated to the small claims track. You have no desire to carry the responsibility of a test case and to burden you with both the costs risk and added stress would be grossly unfair.

 

Additionally, the overriding objective's (Part 1) of the Civil Procedure Rules requires that both parties are on an even footing going into the hearing. The bank is a multi-national financial institution who can easily bear any costs risk, whereas you are a litigant in person for whom a costs award against you could mean financial disaster. You could argue that this is an uneven footing. The arguements against fast/multi-track allocation are outlined in this post by Zoot - ade,steph,jack v barclays HELP IM WORRIED??

 

Of course the court could refuse your request, in which case you'll go to multi-track. Its highly likely Lloyds will settle in any event, but I'm sure you'd get lots of help if your case were to go through on that track or as a test case. Here's the forum dedicated to test case claims where you may want to start a thread - http://www.consumeractiongroup.c o....t-cases-stays/

 

Basically, I think what I'd do if it were me is write in to the court with representations as per 5), asking that the claim proceed with a small claims hearing, and proposing the directions as per this draft order, which you should attach to your letter - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/53570-new-strategy-allocation-questionaires.html#post482191.

Please remember to DONATE! Help CAG keep up the fight!

 

 

Any advice or opinion is offered informally & without liability. Use your own judgment and if in doubt seek advice of a qualified and insured professional.

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Thanks very much for your information Gary. I am communicating with Phil and Bish who also have received the same info for the same court as me.We are deciding how to respond together and are considering signing the same letter in response to King's Lynn court.Do you think there is strength in numbers in these circumstances?

B

BELLA 47

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It'll certainly help that there are others in the same boat, if only for the support. Remember that it is likely that Lloyds will settle before the prelim, but obviously you should prepare for every eventuality.

 

To the letter, you could also attach a list of settled cases (which I can find for you if you like) and include in the letter that the pattern of cases would suggest that the banks have no intention of stepping foot inside a court. You should also make the point that there have been numorous claims put forward as test cases before, but again, the banks have settled them all pre-trial and clearly do not wish to see the matter definitively resolved. You could take a few bits and pieces (not too much, it doesn't need to be an essay) from the stay removal template, or this - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/abbey-bank/11437-keren29-abbey-9.html?highlight=keren29#post370997, which is based upon the stay template anyway.

 

I know Bish is very switched on, as do you seem to be too, so I'm sure you'll do a great job of it between you.

Please remember to DONATE! Help CAG keep up the fight!

 

 

Any advice or opinion is offered informally & without liability. Use your own judgment and if in doubt seek advice of a qualified and insured professional.

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