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Hi, I agreed to place a £500 deposit by telephone to hold a Campervan and stated clearly it was subject to a vehicle inspection (proof available). I advised the dealer (LeedsLeisureVehicles) that I could not inspect the vehicle until the following Sunday (it was late Wednesday afternoon when I rang initially). Due to a job offer not being received I could not go through with the sale and telephoned first thing Sunday morning to say I would not be coming to inspect the vehicle. I was told the person to talk to would ring me back on Monday. I was advised on Monday that my deposit was lost.

This comes under the distance selling agreement which provides additional protection over normal transactions. I signed nothing and was not advised that my deposit was not refundable at any time by the salesperson (proof available).

How do I stand re recovering my deposit?

Can I just warn others that this it not the action of a reputable company and I would strongly advise anyone to steer well clear of Leeds Leisure Vehicles.

Many thanks in anticipation of your help.

Brian

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Hi, I agreed to place a £500 deposit by telephone to hold a Campervan and stated clearly it was subject to a vehicle inspection (proof available). I advised the dealer (LeedsLeisureVehicles) that I could not inspect the vehicle until the following Sunday (it was late Wednesday afternoon when I rang initially). Due to a job offer not being received I could not go through with the sale and telephoned first thing Sunday morning to say I would not be coming to inspect the vehicle. I was told the person to talk to would ring me back on Monday. I was advised on Monday that my deposit was lost.

This comes under the distance selling agreement which provides additional protection over normal transactions. I signed nothing and was not advised that my deposit was not refundable at any time by the salesperson (proof available).

How do I stand re recovering my deposit?

Can I just warn others that this it not the action of a reputable company and I would strongly advise anyone to steer well clear of Leeds Leisure Vehicles.

Many thanks in anticipation of your help.

Brian

 

If you placed the offer and it was subject to an action you were going to carry out then didn't, I can understand the company being less than helpful. Look at it another way. What would you of said had you arrived to inspect the vehicle and found it had been sold despite you leaving a deposit. I dont think recovering the deposit is completely clear cut. Although DSR do cover contracts made over the phone or via email. They dont cover one off or bespoke items, which a used car or camper van is.

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If you placed the offer and it was subject to an action you were going to carry out then didn't, I can understand the company being less than helpful. Look at it another way. What would you of said had you arrived to inspect the vehicle and found it had been sold despite you leaving a deposit. I dont think recovering the deposit is completely clear cut. Although DSR do cover contracts made over the phone or via email. They dont cover one off or bespoke items, which a used car or camper van is.

 

The action was open-ended with no guarantee that I would inspect the vehicle. It could also be construed as saying I will not leave a holding deposit UNTIL I have inspected the vehicle. It was up to the dealer to state if he was not happy with this by stating that if another customer comes along he reserves the right to sell the vehicle. I believe he should also have reminded the customer at this point that any deposit made would be non-refundable. That is the whole point about distance selling, the legal agreement is not easily accessible for perusal by the customer. This brings me onto your second point, a second hand car/camper van is a one off or bespoke item. This might apply if I had asked the dealer to modify the vehicle to my personal taste, but this was not the case and so the camper van could not be considered as anything other than 'off the shelf'.

 

Consumer protection laws were brought in to protect people from dealers like this who make large sums of money from doing nothing and supplying nothing after taking a customers hard earned cash. In my eyes this is nothing short of theft. I am more than happy to take this dealer to court as I believe such bad business practice should be exposed for the protection of all.

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The action was open-ended with no guarantee that I would inspect the vehicle. It could also be construed as saying I will not leave a holding deposit UNTIL I have inspected the vehicle. It was up to the dealer to state if he was not happy with this by stating that if another customer comes along he reserves the right to sell the vehicle. I believe he should also have reminded the customer at this point that any deposit made would be non-refundable. That is the whole point about distance selling, the legal agreement is not easily accessible for perusal by the customer. This brings me onto your second point, a second hand car/camper van is a one off or bespoke item. This might apply if I had asked the dealer to modify the vehicle to my personal taste, but this was not the case and so the camper van could not be considered as anything other than 'off the shelf'.

 

Consumer protection laws were brought in to protect people from dealers like this who make large sums of money from doing nothing and supplying nothing after taking a customers hard earned cash. In my eyes this is nothing short of theft. I am more than happy to take this dealer to court as I believe such bad business practice should be exposed for the protection of all.

 

I'm a little bit puzzled here Brian, If you didn't want the dealer to hold the vehicle, why then did you place a deposit? I would of thought in most peoples minds that placing a deposit means you do not want the vehicle sold to anyone else? if you were happy for it to remain on sale until you saw it there would be no need to place a deposit. In all fairness most people wouldn't contemplate such a large purchase or leaving a deposit on such an expensive item as a camper without viewing it first. Apologies if this sounds blunt, but DSR's are there to give fair protection to consumers, not to protect people from carrying out actions which most people would consider naive if not rather stupid. The used vehicle is very much a 'one off item' I'm afraid. You could only claim it wasn't if he had more than one of those campers at the exact same miles, price, spec, age etc. I do agree £500 is excessive, but I do believe the trader has acted honestly and in accordance with the law including DSR.

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http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/consumer-news/35416/watchdog-dealer-refuses-deposit-refund

 

If the dealers main business is selling vehicles then the dsrs do apply. There's nothing one off about it.

 

With all due respect nagasis, the link you give just says that the refund was returned by the dealer without any court order. probably due to not wanting the adverse publicity. I stand by my statement which is based in real life experience within the motor trade, that used vehicles can be considered to be 'one off items' and as such exempt from DSR's in many cases due to the fact they are just that-one off. A dealer may well have 100 cars on his lot. But he can honestly say he only has eg 1 focus with 45k miles and that particular trim level.

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The one off thing in the DSRs means that you only occasionally sell by distance means. That's why cars aren't normally covered by DSRs because most folk would go and see it and inspect/test drive etc. It would be a rare event to send a car to a buyer who'd never seen it. Much less to do this regularly. Also the DSRs don't apply to personalised goods (which could be referred to as being a "one off"). There is a general presumption that deposits are non-refundable, but the best advice here I think would be to argue that the £500 deposit doesn't accurately reflect the trader's losses and therefore amounts to a penalty. The keeping of the deposit should be to cover any costs associated with re-listing it etc and £500 seems a bit high. Offer him £50 and tell him you'll take him to court for the balance. He'll have to demonstrate to the court how he justifies keeping the £500.

Edited by Prolix
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The vehicle was never de-listed (I checked their vehicle listings and nothing had changed in between my initial phone call and cancellation) and so the company incurred no cost whatsoever. You are right Prolix - they cannot justify keeping this money and to do so only serves to demonstrate their contempt for fair trade and a desire to make a fast buck at the customers expense. I have every intention in taking this trader to court - I deplore such people and their greed mentality.

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The dsrs apply here.

 

If the dealers business is vehicles then there is no one off. The type, age, milage of the vehicle is irrelevant. The vehicle in question was not made or acquired for the op specifically and was general stock.

Cab, ts and the oft will confirm this.

 

Taken from lawman

 

What specifically do I have to refund to the consumer if they cancel?

You must refund any money paid by or on behalf of the consumer in relation to the contract to the person who made the payment. This means the full price of the goods, or deposit or prepayment made, including the cost of delivery. This is because when a consumer buys from home, delivery of the goods is an essential part of the contract.

 

If you provided additional services such as gift wrapping or express delivery that a consumer specifically requested, then you may withhold the additional charges incurred by the consumer for these services only if:

The additional services were provided under a separate contract; You had the consumer’s agreement to start the additional services before the end of the cancellation period; and You provided the consumer with the required written information before you started the additional services, including information that the cancellation rights would end as soon as you started to carry out the additional services.

Edited by Nagasis
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Prolix gives excellent advice. OP while you are entirely within your right to pursue for all your money back. Remember during that time the trader has your £500. You may not get the result you would like in court. DSR's would not apply to used cars for the following reasons. It would be classed as a one off item, the trader doesn't have another one to sell if a customer wanted to buy it. Also as prolix points out, DSR's do not apply to businesses that do not ordinairily conduct distance sales.

 

I spoke to trading standards on Friday and they came back with this advice today after speaking to their legal team.

 

Try and speak to the dealer and offer a reasonable amount by way of an apology for inconvenience. That way you get the majority of your money back with no further hassles.

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  • 3 months later...
Hi, I agreed to place a £500 deposit by telephone to hold a Campervan and stated clearly it was subject to a vehicle inspection (proof available). I advised the dealer (LeedsLeisureVehicles) that I could not inspect the vehicle until the following Sunday (it was late Wednesday afternoon when I rang initially). Due to a job offer not being received I could not go through with the sale and telephoned first thing Sunday morning to say I would not be coming to inspect the vehicle. I was told the person to talk to would ring me back on Monday. I was advised on Monday that my deposit was lost.

This comes under the distance selling agreement which provides additional protection over normal transactions. I signed nothing and was not advised that my deposit was not refundable at any time by the salesperson (proof available).

How do I stand re recovering my deposit?

Can I just warn others that this it not the action of a reputable company and I would strongly advise anyone to steer well clear of Leeds Leisure Vehicles.

Many thanks in anticipation of your help.

Brian

You are not the only one to have trouble with Leeds Leisure vehicles. I bought a campervan from them 1/11/12 and on my way home to the North of scotland the gearbox developed a whine. I'd got nearly to Glasgow and put it into a garage.The proprietor told me the geabox had failed. When I phoned Leeds Leisure I was told not to worry and they would sort it. Many phone calls later in spite of promises that they would pay for it nothing has been done. They promise the earth but never deliver. They have kept me hanging on waiting for them to pay the garage bill in spite of me offering to pay half of the cost of a reconditioned gearbox in order to get things moving. Stay clear of this firm. Their claims of superb second to none aftersales service are so much hot air.

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  • 6 months later...
You are not the only one to have trouble with Leeds Leisure vehicles. I bought a campervan from them 1/11/12 and on my way home to the North of scotland the gearbox developed a whine. I'd got nearly to Glasgow and put it into a garage.The proprietor told me the geabox had failed. When I phoned Leeds Leisure I was told not to worry and they would sort it. Many phone calls later in spite of promises that they would pay for it nothing has been done. They promise the earth but never deliver. They have kept me hanging on waiting for them to pay the garage bill in spite of me offering to pay half of the cost of a reconditioned gearbox in order to get things moving. Stay clear of this firm. Their claims of superb second to none aftersales service are so much hot air.

 

I had similar problem with VAT payment:

Hi everyone,

 

I had brought a camper van from these criminals bank in 2012, they charged VAT for it. When approached James Moores via phone and informed him that the VAT number was false and I had informed customs and excise if this matter, he told me he would deduct the VAT, I thought it was strange, arranged to meet JamesMoores, he was not available, and spoke to a timid looking Asian man. I have now found out that it was the convicted criminal Shahidur Chowdhury from Bradford.

 

False VAT number used by Leeds Leisure Vehicles:

Value Added Tax number: GB 973 4814 89

 

See copied newspaper article below:

 

Bradford company director is told to pay back cash for counterfeit car accessories

 

6:00am Wednesday 12th June 2013 in News By Kathie Griffiths, T&A Reporter

 

A Bradford company director convicted of selling counterfeit car accessories has been ordered to pay back £741,136.50 under the Proceeds of Crime Act (POCA).

 

Shahidur Chowdhury, 39, has six months to pay it back or faces four years in prison.

 

Judge John Potter made the POCA order yesterday ruling the proceeds would be seized from the sale of six of Chowdhury’s properties, including houses and a warehouse on a business park in Essex Street, Bowling – all of which were purchased from criminal benefits. Father-of-six Chowdhury was also ordered to pay £40,000 prosecution costs The order comes after Chowdhury, of Lindisfarne Road, Shipley, pleaded guilty in 2011 to 12 charges under the Trademark Act of selling counterfeit car accessories and possessing them with a view to selling. He had also asked for 14 further offences to be taken into consideration.

 

At that time he was sentenced to four months’ imprisonment suspended for 12 months, with 200 hours of unpaid work.

 

The fake items, which made up about 50 per cent of the goods stocked in the warehouse, included Vauxhall air fresheners, Land Rover boot and wash bags, and car mats. They were found by West Yorkshire Trading Standards officers in the Essex Street warehouse.

 

Since 2011 trading standards officers have delved deeper – working with financial investigators from Kirklees Council and with the Regional Assets Recovery Team, the court heard.

 

It was revealed over a two-day hearing last week that Chowdhury had used his business account to pay £25,000 in school fees and that he and his wife, now divorced, had claimed a joint income of £15,000 a year in order to get child tax benefits.

 

Judge Potter said Chowdhury was “an intelligent man” who was “shrewd in business, maximising where possible his personal benefits”.

 

But he added his evidence had lacked credibility.

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