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    • Hi   I assume this mattress was the Tenants own property?   So after moving out the Tenants provided an attachment showing a stained mattress and wanting full deposit back and threatening to claim against you for this.   1. Tenants failed to notify you of this stained mattress issue until the end of tenancy after they had vacated the property.   2. You have no evidence that this was the actual mattress used in that property nor evidence to back up there claim the staining caused this mattress damage.  (i.e. one of them could have had an accident and wet the bed or done this when they moved from the property).     3. Ask them that you wish the mattress independently inspected. (which you are fully entitled to do and if it proves this claim is false it will be added to the deposit claim by you the landlord for damages as well as the Garden if you need to get landscapers in to carry out the work that should have been carried out by Tenants as per Tenacy Agreement and raised  by yourself (Landlord) on a few occasions which Tenants failed to rectify even at end of tenancy.   4. Ask them to provide you with the contact details of there Contents Insurance Company (tenants whether Private or Social Housing should always take out and have Contents Insurance but is up to that tenant) bet they don't provide it Big question is the Deposit protected in a Tenancy Deposit Scheme (TDS) and those Tenants that have left were given a copy of the Prescribed Terms for that TDS? (Bear in mind you may need to tell TDS that you are in dispute with the Tenant about damages i.e. mattress and Garden)    
    • plenty of time to research and calm down. nothing much to do until the end of june.    
    • well ...... 1st you need to go back to post 1 and carefully read ALL this thread from the start again and pay attention to the advice and the undertones it explains about 'debt'.   2nd ...the truth is you owe no-one ANYTHING, the OC wrote off and sold the debt, and got most of it back against tax and business insurance schemes ...throw the morality card out the window...the OC did by selling the debt on for <10p=£1. and the DCa want the full balance ...id so many fools stopped paying powerless DCA's tomorrow, the whole industry would collapse overnight.   3rd the only reason this is still around your neck is because you failed to follow given advice...had you ..it would now be statute barred.      ^^^ very important research the M+S credit card debacle using our enhanced google searchbox on this page   as for the PAPLOC reply,   D.. desipte a previous CCA requests, the claimant has yet to supply any/all of the required paperwork.   i: delete [CC is attached to this reply form]"   
    • Hi again   Yes, it's been a lovely day weather wise.   Guess you've better things to do with weather like today than help with this problem, so thanks very much for your input, it's very much appreciated.   Late this afternoon I did receive a reply from the tenants, and they are asking me to go 50/50 with getting the garden sorted, not only that, as they have moved away they are expecting me to get the quotes.   Regarding you view on this issue, its so easy not to see the whole picture and my thoughts that the staining damp may be of their own doing didn't occur to me as I was so locked into the historical leak. Taking a closer look at the room in question today, I'm convinced that they are trying it on with the stained mattress- they did mail through a picture and then a receipt for supposedly the mattress. My wife and I then took both the pic and receipt to the bedding store where purchase was made to ask if the two married up, the picture does not show any emblems/manufactures logo or such to prove that this is the case, so we are none the wiser- our thoughts being that the stained mattress is from elsewhere.   A few days back I spoke to our letting agent regarding all of this, as was quite correctly mentioned there are two parts to this equation, namely the mattress and then the property.   Our agents mentioned to me that as an inventory was not carried out initially with the let, (hindsight) the pictures that were used to advertise the property could not be used as evidence to present to the TDS to be compared to the pictures now as there is no proof that the advertising pictures were in fact how the property was when the let started. I mentioned that all digital pictures have a means of finding when that pic was taken- Geo tag/Metadata- agent was quite surprised by this. The agents thoughts then went for a hide in a vacuum-   This is going off at a tangent here-many moons ago my wife studied computer science at a local University, one of her classmates who she is still in touch with is now a practising Solicitor. My wife suggested that maybe I give her a call, a bit rude I guess, but I did  phone and with the pleasantries out the way  I asked for her opinion of the best way to get this sorted. Her remit isn't landlord type stuff, however she will speak to a colleague on Monday and come back to me.   The property is due to be relet on the 21st, we will ensure that the new tenants move in to a home that is immaculate and welcoming, trouble is its getting a tadge close to get the garden issues sorted in time.   I know that all this will get closure in the end, but at the moment I've had more fun with a toothpick-   Again, many thanks.
    • The collection is currently stored at curator James Blower's home, but he has now found a space situated in an old bank premises where he hopes to exhibit them from this autumn or early next year. View the full article
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My 17 year old son arrived at a train station as the train was pulling in.

 

He did not use the ticket machine which is located juast outside the station as this would have meant he would miss the train.

 

He intended on purchasing a ticket from the conductor on the train.

 

When he was on the train an inspector asked to see his ticket and my son said he did not have one but was intending to purchase one on the train. The inspector then said my son had broken a law and that he would be prosecuted for doing so. He collected some information from my son and said a letter would be issued.

 

The train guard later apologised to my son because he felt the way my son had been spoken to was innaprorpriate and he was rude. He gave my son the details of how to make a complaint.

 

A complaint has been logged and a holding response has been issued by the train company.

 

Today my son received a letter from Transport Investigations Limited stating they have received a report which indicates that sufficient evidence does exist to warrant a prosecution. The file is presently with their prosecutions team who are considering whether to issue a summons.

 

They have stated that if they do not receive a written response within 14 days a summons may be issued.

 

His friend who got on the same train at the same time without a ticket has been sent a £30 fine in the post but no mention of a prosecution.

The train company is Arriva Trains.

 

Has anyone any advice that may help.

Edited by honeybee13
Putting in a bit more spacing for easier reading.
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Hello again.

 

I expect the transport guys will be along later, but I think in essence Arriva are in the right. From what I understand from reading this forum, arriving too late to buy a ticket isn't good and not seeking out someone on the train to buy a ticket from isn't good either.

 

I have a feeling though that your son's age may act in his favour, but please wait for the experts for that because I can't remember the details.

 

Hopefully the guys will give you some pointers on how to put together a letter for your son to send. Could I just ask please, was the letter addressed to him or to his parents?

 

I'm just starting this off with a few thoughts, I expect expert help will arrive soon.

 

HB

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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It was addressed to him. I'm a bit concerned about that as effectively he could end up with a prosecution without his parents being aware, not sure if being 17 makes him a minor.

 

Transport Investigations Ltd are deemed to be authorised officers of the railway. Arriva Trains Wales sub-contracts most revenue protection duties to this company, and as part of their contract, provides the legal authorisation to identify, report & prosecute (potential) offenders.

 

Your son has committed an offence under the railway byelaws, specifically Byelaw 18(1). The maximum penalty is a £1000 fine. That said, if it ever goes to court, any fine would be around the low hundreds.

 

I don't think your complaint is helpful. It may make the situation worse if it didn't recognise the fact your son was to blame for the incident. It certainly won't prevent any prosecution action. If it was written in a way that appears aggressive or demanding, you may have made it worse.

 

The fact two people travelling together in the same circumstances and have been treated differently suggests your son may have failed the attitude test, didn't have enough money to pay for the journey, gave a false name/address etc. Someone being told they may be prosecuted can make some people rather mouthy, "jobsworth" etc.

 

You need to write a very apologetic letter to Transport Investigations Ltd stating that your son is only 17 and you have explained the consequences of his actions, and offer to pay any administrative costs incurred. (If they ask for them, they may be a lot more than £30!)

 

Your son should also write to them, in his own words, that he is apologetic and about learning from the experience. It needs to demonstrate remorse etc, and how it could affect his future career prospects.

 

You then just need to wait and see what they decide.

 

They can prosecute in court, but as he is only 17, he should be able to avoid it by writing decent apology letters and possibly paying their costs. This once.

 

I'd send it electronically (e-mail etc), if possible. Failing that, use recorded delivery so you know when/if they get your letter.

Edited by firstclassx
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Thanks for the reply.

The complaint was made as the train guard suggested he should do so as he felt the inspector was rude to my son and he said he would also send a report to his supervisor.

My son had the money and bought a ticket on the train.

In terms of the attitude test my son gave the correct details otherwise we wouldn't have received the letter.

The frustration is everyday I see people buying tickets on the train or paying at their destination station, I have done it several times this year. This is standard practice with Arrival trains, their signage says you should attempt to purchase a ticket before. It doesn't say you must.

I'll send a letter however I want to see the response from Arrival before agreeing anything.

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Thanks for the reply.

The complaint was made as the train guard suggested he should do so as he felt the inspector was rude to my son and he said he would also send a report to his supervisor.

My son had the money and bought a ticket on the train.

In terms of the attitude test my son gave the correct details otherwise we wouldn't have received the letter.

The frustration is everyday I see people buying tickets on the train or paying at their destination station, I have done it several times this year. This is standard practice with Arrival trains, their signage says you should attempt to purchase a ticket before. It doesn't say you must.

I'll send a letter however I want to see the response from Arrival before agreeing anything.

 

Hello again.

 

You've got a 14 day deadline though and could risk this becoming more serious if they don't hear anything. I don't know if you can count on the complaints people and the prosecutions lot communicating that there is a complaint, especially when prosecutions aren't done in-house.

 

Are you expecting to hear about the complaint before your deadline to write about the fare problem?

 

HB

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Thanks for the reply.

The complaint was made as the train guard suggested he should do so as he felt the inspector was rude to my son and he said he would also send a report to his supervisor.

My son had the money and bought a ticket on the train.

In terms of the attitude test my son gave the correct details otherwise we wouldn't have received the letter.

The frustration is everyday I see people buying tickets on the train or paying at their destination station, I have done it several times this year. This is standard practice with Arrival trains, their signage says you should attempt to purchase a ticket before. It doesn't say you must.

I'll send a letter however I want to see the response from Arrival before agreeing anything.

 

If the guard did suggest that, it is usually because he does not want any hassle from the passenger, and can just agree with them. I can almost guarantee no report would have been completed by the guard. Basically passes the problem to customer relations rather than him.

 

RevenueProtectionIMG.jpg

 

Posters like the above appear at many Arriva Trains Wales stations. Regardless, it is your legal obligation to purchase a ticket when facilities exist to do so, or you commit a criminal offence. Arriva spends around £20k-£30k installing a single ticket machine . I struggle to see why you think buying before getting on a train is optional. When you buy a ticket on board, this is because the guard is not qualified to do anything else (i.e. report for prosecution), therefore the only way to deal with you, is to sell you a ticket. However, Inspectors, like in this case, also check tickets, and WILL report you for prosecution.

 

Your complaint will not prevent a summons or prosecution, if that is what you are hoping.

 

I would strongly suggest you post a copy of your letter to Transport Investigations on this forum, because I suspect it will need some editing.

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Firstclassx has covered virtually everything perfectly well in the posts above. The only things I can add are in general terms, for instance the age of criminal responsibility in England & Wales is actually 12 years. There are guidelines in relation to dealing with young people of course and it is rare for any TOC to proceed with this kind of charge against someone so young as that, it is clearly not a very serious offence, but is an offence nonetheless. It is not impossible for these matters to end up before a Court and Magistrates recognise that people who are almost 18 should certainly know right from wrong. Your son is over 16 and the company would be right to write directly to him.

 

There is often a kind of 'cut-off' area where, if is a traveller is over 17 and a half and have been reported for an allegation of an offence, they may well face prosecution and this is more likely if they 'fail the attitude test' as firstclassx points out. Some TOCs actually have a policy of prosecuting at 17 and a half

 

Buying a ticket before you board a train is not optional. If there are facilities to get a ticket before boarding a train Byelaw 18.1 is strict liability and states that you must do so.

 

So far as I am aware, new signs at Arriva Trains Wales stations were put in during the second half of last year and have reinforced that instruction.

Edited by Old-CodJA
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