Help with council tax bailiff please, newbie, no idea where to start!

[serena88]

Hello,

I am new to the forum. I have tried to get advice from the many other threads by people in similar positions but being honest I don't understand a lot of the terms used I am not sure where to start.

I hope it's OK to start my own thread as I am utterly lost!

I have council tax arrears from the last 3 years. My council refuse to talk to me and say the debt has been passed to Equita. We have dealt with Equita for over a year and now from what I can gather they have passed the debt to Ross & Roberts.

The most recent development is my partner paying the bailiff £300 and allowing him in to levy goods, as he said this was the only way he could set up a payment plan... his "payment plan" is £200 a month which we cannot afford. I realise that this was probably a HUGE mistake to let him in but it's done now and I'm not sure what we can do next.

I am fairly sure we have been charged unfair fees by Equita, what do I need to do to get a breakdown of fees from them and Ross & Roberts?

I don't know where to start, what information do I need to post here in order for people to advise me?

Thank you in advance for any help you can give!

[hallowitch]

Hi serena88 welcome to CAG

 

can you list the goods levied the fees charged as written on the notice of seizure and the outstanding balance owed to the council

 

has the bailiff done a separate levy for each accounts listing the same goods

 

there is a template on here to send to the bailiffs to find out what fees you have been charged will find it and post it for you

[hallowitch]

send this to both bailiff firms and the council can be done by e-mail

 

To:

Acme bailiff Co

bailiff House

Ref: Account No: 123456

Dear Sir

With reference to the above account, Can you please provide me with a Breakdown of the charges.

This includes:

a - the time & date of any Bailiff action that incurred a Fee.

b - the reason for the fee.

c - the name(s) of the Bailiff(s) that attended on each occasion a Fee was charged.

d - the name(s) of the Court(s) the Bailiff(s) was/were certificated at.

e - the date of the Certification.

This is not a Subject access request under the Data Protection Act S7 1998 so does not incur a fee of £10. You are obliged to provide this information.

I require this information within 14 days.

Yours faithfully

 

get this info from the council

 

1 - how many Liability Orders they have against you

2 - the dates they were obtained

3 - the addresses they were for

4 - the period of time each covers

5 - how much each one was for

6 - how much is still outstanding

7 - the dates they were passed on for enforcement

[Conniff]

You have been conned with regard to the payment plan and the levy. I wouldn't believe a bailiff if he said the sky was blue, and you shouldn't either. Never ever believe a word they say.

 

The councils are getting this way as well, lazy can't be bothered good for nothings.

The council has not sold the debt to the bailiff, so the council still own it and 'must' speak to you and not just fob you off. If you phone the council, don't be put off by anything of this nature they say, demand they send the info you want.

[serena88]

Hi,

Yes, they have levied the same goods on 3 separate pieces of paper, for the 3 years.

The goods levied were:

1 X Slow cooker

1 X Chrome toaster

1 X Panasonic TV

30 X DVDs

1 X 3 seater sofa

1 X 2 seater sofa

1 X Blackberry phone

1 X PS3 & games

1 X cloth chair

1 X dining table

2 X dining chairs

1 X bookcase

30 X books

1 X PC Tower

1 X flat screen TV

1 X wood chair

2 X CD shelves

1 X bedside table

1 X dart board

 

 

The 3 levies are for

£372.99 + bailiff costs of £97.00

£532.93 + bailiff costs of £78.50

£1243.56 + bailiff costs of £96.50

 

On the receipt for the £300 we paid it says

O/S balance £2145.98

Costs £272.00

 

 

I have no idea which figure relates to which year, other than I'm guessing the last figure must be this years council tax. The bailiff was unable to even tell me the period of time that these bills are relating to ?!

 

Thank you for all the help.

I was not in at the time, and the blackberry phone on the list does not belong to us (belongs to my father in law, on contract in his name) but presumably there's nothing I can do as my partner allowed them entry and has signed the forms etc?

[brassnecked]

Once you have the information from hallowitches questions at post #3, initiate a formal complaint regarding multiple levies on the same goods which are a no no. as per Leeds CC v Throssel, and the LGO report into Blaby Council and Rossendales.

[ploddertom]

One thing you should be aware of is that when you have spoken to the "Council" you have probably spoken to a member of a private Company called Capita - they do most of the back office functions for a lot of Councils. They are renowned for not being helpful and by telling you to deal with the Bailiff, this is because capita are the parent company of 2 Bailiff firms - Equita and Ross & Roberts.

[ploddertom]

Hi,

Yes, they have levied the same goods on 3 separate pieces of paper, for the 3 years.

The goods levied were:

1 X Slow cooker - little value

1 X Chrome toaster - little value

1 X Panasonic TV - how old, what size, LCD, LED. Plasma or CRT?

30 X DVDs - little value

1 X 3 seater sofa - see below

1 X 2 seater sofa - see below

1 X Blackberry phone - 3rd party goods - exempt

1 X PS3 & games - property of a child perhaps?

1 X cloth chair - see below

1 X dining table - probably exempt

2 X dining chairs - see below

1 X bookcase - little value unless solid oak or similar

30 X books - probably no value unless all 1st Editions

1 X PC Tower - worthless on its own

1 X flat screen TV - no make or model etc listed so little value

1 X wood chair - see below

2 X CD shelves - no value

1 X bedside table - little value

1 X dart board - little value

 

I was not in at the time, and the blackberry phone on the list does not belong to us (belongs to my father in law, on contract in his name) but presumably there's nothing I can do - oh yes there is, you will need a copy of the contract showing your FiL details and send to both Council & Bailiffs - as my partner allowed them entry and has signed the forms etc?

 

When the Bailiff was allowed entry what rooms did he go in? There are a lot of chairs listed on the levy - if they were all to be removed for sale at auction would you have sufficient seating left - you need 1 seat per person in the household. Do the sofas still have their fire safety labels intact?

 

In my view the Bailff may have spent a long time writing his list up but he may have been better writing it on Andrex as that is all it is worth. Please note I am not trying to belittle your goods but if removed they woul fetch very little at auction.

[brassnecked]

Ploddertom, is illustrating how you can challenge the validity of the levy, as for a debt of say £1,000 the bailiff needs to levy £10,000 worth of goods as at auction seized goods may fetch only 10% of their value, so in your case he may well have levied exempt items, and if the original fire retardent notice tags are not on settees etc, it is illegal for the bailiff to sell them at auction. Looking at your list it may well be argued that the levy is merely to garner fees for the bailiff, and in any case if the same items are listed individually and are identical on each levy, two of them are automatically invalid imho.

[serena88]

Thanks everyone for the replies.

Ploddertom, I know that the goods aren't worth much, I presumed that they were doing it just to add fees on, and that if they did take the things it would be to add a few hundred quid on top for removing them!

The panasonic TV is very old, and huge.

The flatscreen listed is literally cracked all over and does not work but he said that didn't matter.

He listed all the chairs in the house, he entered every room except my sons room.

The sofas have no fire safety labels.

 

I will do all the things you have all advised and report back.

I wish I had found this forum a year ago!

thanks again

[sgtbush]

one visit can only generate one set of charges no matter how many liability orders are in place

multiple levies on the same items--- BIG NO NO, he cant do this

their is insufficiant items levied to pay the debt, charges and removal fees, im not saying your items are worthless, they only fetch little at auction, its used as a leverage tool

the only qustionable item is the blackberry phone, i hope the contract shows the phones imei number on it, as you can swap sims, you have to prove the actual phone belongs to someone else, ie, the owner needs to prove the HANDSET belongs to them and not you to be removed from levy

[serena88]

one visit can only generate one set of charges no matter how many liability orders are in place

multiple levies on the same items--- BIG NO NO, he cant do this

their is insufficiant items levied to pay the debt, charges and removal fees, im not saying your items are worthless, they only fetch little at auction, its used as a leverage tool

the only qustionable item is the blackberry phone, i hope the contract shows the phones imei number on it, as you can swap sims, you have to prove the actual phone belongs to someone else, ie, the owner needs to prove the HANDSET belongs to them and not you to be removed from levy

 

Thank you for this, I will ask them to check the contract.

 

What is likely to happen when I make a complaint about the multiple levies on the same items?

At the moment we payed them £300 on 11/09/12 and are due on our "payment plan" to pay them £200 on 11/10/12. On the paperwork I have here it says that missing this payment will add costs of £178. Do I pay the £200 and use the month this buys me to try and get breakdown of fees and make the complaint? Or is paying them a bad idea?

[ploddertom]

Normally I would advocate stuff the Bailiff but have to agree that to buy a bit of time I would probably pay your new best mate - then start letter writing. The idea of the levy in most cases is as you say, a lever to get you to pay then hope somewhere you default so they can add more charges.

 

I imagine when you first complain you will get the standard answer back to say all charges are in accordance with the Regulations. From then on we can help sort it all out and it is amazing how many offers of goodwill and/or administrative errors there are when the fees are removed.

[serena88]

Ross & Roberts have replied with a breakdown of fees

 

Its quite confusing but basically on the 25/06/12 i was charged £24.50 for a first visit for only one of the years debt.

no second visit

then on 11/09/12 I was charged 3 X £12.00 walking possession fees for the 3 years of debt

also 11/09/12 levy fees were £35.00, £42.00 and £60.00.

 

 

Does this sound right?

[hallowitch]

Ross & Roberts have replied with a breakdown of fees

 

Its quite confusing but basically on the 25/06/12 i was charged £24.50 for a first visit for only one of the years debt.

no second visit

then on 11/09/12 I was charged 3 X £12.00 walking possession fees for the 3 years of debt

also 11/09/12 levy fees were £35.00, £42.00 and £60.00.

 

 

Does this sound right?

 

Is the bailiff certificated

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?210956-On-line-search-to-check-if-a-Bailiff-is-Certificated.....

 

 

The 3 levies are for

£372.99 + bailiff costs of £97.00 levy fee £35 walking possession fee £12 (the walking possession fee can be charged if you signed to notice off seizure ) total £47 .00 (£50 to be accounted for on this account) 1st&2nd visit fees are £42.50

£532.93 + bailiff costs of £78.50 £42 levy fee + WP fee £12 total £62) £18.50 to be accounted for on this account) could /Will be 2nd visit fee

£1243.56 + bailiff costs of £96.50 (£60 levy fee £12 WP fee £12 total £72.50 ) £24.50 to be accounted for (could/will be a first visit fee)

[serena88]

They did not confirm whether he was certificated, just provided a link to check. I searched his surname and got nothing, then searched Ross & Roberts and his name is not on the list of results. Does this mean he is not certificated?

In their email they only supply details of the bailiff who did the walking possession and levy, but the letter delivered for the first visit has a different bailiffs name on it, who is on the list of cerificated bailiffs. Does this make a difference?

Edited October 9, 2012 by serena88

[hallowitch]

txt the bailiff who did the levy and ask him to confirm the court and date he was certificated at if he has nothing to hide he should provide this info

 

also phone the Ministry of Justice Public Register of bailiffs on 020 3334 6355 and ask them if there is a certificated

 

also send an e-mail to the revenues of your council and ask them to confirm the certificate details for Mr xxxx xxxxx who attended your property on 11/9/2012 and levied your goods as he does not appear on the register of certificated bailiffs

 

a bailiff must be certificated to levy distress

[serena88]

I text the bailiff, no reply.

I phoned the number you gave but was 27th in the queue, so decided to ring them later!

I emailed the council, who forwarded my question about the bailiffs certificate to Ross & Roberts who says he was certificated at Bournemouth on 7/09/2012 so maybe the list hasn't been updated yet?

 

What is my next step with regards to Ross and Roberts who have provided a break down off fees, but it doesnt quite add up, and also complaining about the multiple levy on the same goods?

 

still no reply from equita, then again i have paid them so much i am not surprised it is taking them a long time to add it up!

[serena88]

Hello again, I now have replies form the council re liabilty orders they have against us, and a reply from equita, is there a way of attaching a document?

what do i do with this info now I have it /:???:

thank you again

[ploddertom]

Just type them up giving specific dates, amounts etc but remember to leave any personal info out.

[serena88]

ok here goes, email from council is exactly this (with addresses omitted) :

 

Liability order 1

Liability Order Hearing date: 10/11/12

Address Order Relates to : (address 1)

Financial Year: 01/04/10 - 30/01/11

Original Value (inc court costs) : £925.11

Outstanding Balance (inc bailiff costs) : £203.64

Bailiff dealing with order : Equita

Date instructed: 04/07/11

 

Liability Order 2

Liability Order Hearing date: 14/07/2011

Address Order Relates to : (address 2)

Financial Year: 28/01/2011 - 31/03/2012

Original Value (inc court costs) : £358.69

Outstanding Balance (inc bailiff costs) : £133.49

Bailiff dealing with order : Ross & Roberts

Date instructed: 23/04/2012

 

Liability Order 3

Liability Order Hearing date: 10/05/12

Address Order Relates to : (address 2)

Financial Year: 01/04/2011 - 31/03/2012 (council tax benefit adjustment 7/11/11-31/03/2012)

Original Value (inc court costs) : £532.93

Outstanding Balance (inc bailiff costs) : £493.68

Bailiff dealing with order : Ross & Roberts

Date instructed: 29/05/12

 

Liability Order 4

Liability Order Hearing date: 07/06/12

Address Order Relates to : (address 2)

Financial Year: 01/04/2012 - 31/03/2013

Original Value (inc court costs) : £1243.56

Outstanding Balance (inc bailiff costs) : £1195.31

Bailiff dealing with order : Ross & Roberts

Date instructed: 17/07/2012

 

I will add letters from Equita and Ross & roberts in next post

[serena88]

From Equita:

 

Liability Order date: 10/11/2010

Debt: £674.22

Statutory Visit fees: £42.50

Levy Fee: 43.00

Attendance Fee: £167.00

Dishonoured Payment Fee: £130.56

Card payment fee: £2.50

 

Total : £1059.78

 

Payments received : £786.14

Balance: £273.64

[serena88]

From Ross & Roberts:

 

Debt: £348.49

First visit: £24.50 (25/06/12)

Walking possession fee: £12.00 (11/09/12)

Levy fee: £35.00 911/09/12)

Total due: £419.99

Total payments : £125.00

Current balance: £294.99

 

Debt: £532.93

Walking possession: £12.00 (11/09/12)

Levy: £42.00 911/09/12)

Total Due: £586.93

Total payments: £78.50

Current balance: £508.43

 

Debt: £1243.56

Walking possession: £12.00 (11/09/12)

Levy: £60.00 911/09/12)

Total Due: £1315.56

Total payments: £96.50

Current balance: £2022.48

 

thankyou to anybody who has managed to trawl through all that!

i dont know what to do next...

[ploddertom]

From Equita:

 

Liability Order date: 10/11/2010

Debt: £674.22

Statutory Visit fees: £42.50

Levy Fee: 43.00

Attendance Fee: £167.00

Dishonoured Payment Fee: £130.56

Card payment fee: £2.50

 

Total : £1059.78

 

Payments received : £786.14

Balance: £273.64

 

Do you have the dates of the Visits, date of levy, dates for the other fees etc? What goods did they levy on, can you describe them exactly as written on the Notice of Seizure?

[ploddertom]

From Ross & Roberts:

 

Debt: £348.49

First visit: £24.50 (25/06/12)

Walking possession fee: £12.00 (11/09/12)

Levy fee: £35.00 911/09/12)

Total due: £419.99

Total payments : £125.00

Current balance: £294.99

 

Debt: £532.93

Walking possession: £12.00 (11/09/12)

Levy: £42.00 911/09/12)

Total Due: £586.93

Total payments: £78.50

Current balance: £508.43

 

Debt: £1243.56

Walking possession: £12.00 (11/09/12)

Levy: £60.00 911/09/12)

Total Due: £1315.56

Total payments: £96.50

Current balance: £2022.48

 

thankyou to anybody who has managed to trawl through all that!

i dont know what to do next...

 

Again what goods have they levied on and please, please tell me they have levied on the same goods for all 3 accounts & did you sign the walking Possession?