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    • Yes, Hotpoint UK has been a subsidiary of Whirlpool for over 20 years. And unlike some domestic goods manufacturers you can buy from them direct and I believe they employ their own service engineers, Is that your situation? You bought direct from Hotpoint and Hotpoint sent out their own engineer?
    • It's Hotpoint (but I believe they're part of the Whirlpool group now?). The part was bought direct from them as a consumer.
    • Thanks BankFodder for your latest, I'm in complete agreement on the subject of mediation and will be choosing to decline mediation, the longer timeline is not an issue for me, I will happily let the going to court run it's course. I really appreciate the support from the Consumer Action Group. I'll post the email text I'm sending to Evri's small claims in answer to their recent defence response. Regards, J    email text I'm sending to Evri's small claims in answer to their recent defence response:  
    • Sec127 (3) repealed, now gone. S. 127(3)-(5) repealed (6.4.2007) by Consumer Credit Act 2006 (c. 14), ss. {15}, 70, 71(2), {Sch. 4} (with Sch. 3 para. 11); S.I. 2007/123, art. 3(2), Sch. 2
    • We used to recommend that people accept mediation but our advice has changed. The mediation process is unclear. Before you can embark on it you have to agree that you are prepared to enter a compromise – and that means that you agree that you are prepared to give up some of your rights even though you are completely in the right and you are entitled to hundred percent of your money and even though EVRi are simply trying to obstruct you in order to discourage you and also to put others who might want to follow your example off from claiming and even though they have a legitimate basis for reimbursement. Mediation is not transparent. In addition to having to sign up that you are prepared to give up some of your rights, you will also have to agree not to reveal any details of the mediation – including the result of the mediation – so that the whole thing is kept secret. This is not open justice. Mediation has nothing to do with justice. The only way of getting justice is to make sure that this matter goes to trial unless EVRi or the other parcel delivery companies put their hands up and accept the responsibility even if they do it is a gesture of goodwill. Going to trial and winning at trial produces a judgement which we can then add to our small collection to assist other people who are in a similar boat. EVRi had been leading you around by the nose since at least January – and probably last year as well – and their whole purpose is simply to drag it out, to place obstacles in your way, to deter other people, and to make you wish that you'd never started the process and that you are prepared to give up your 300 quid. You shouldn't stand for it. You should take control. EVRi would prefer that you went to mediation and if nothing else that is one excellent reason why you should decline mediation and go to court. If it's good for them it's bad for you. On mediation form, you should sign that you are not prepared to compromise and that you are not prepared to keep the result secret but that you want to share the results with other people in similar circumstances. This means that the mediation won't go ahead. It will take slightly longer and you will have to pay a court fee but you will get that back when you win and you will have much greater satisfaction. Also, once you go the whole process, you will learn even more about bringing a small claim in the County Court so that if this kind of thing happens again you will know what to do and you will go ahead without any hesitation. Finally, if you call EVRi's bluff and refuse mediation and go to trial, there is a chance – maybe not a big chance – but there is a chance that they will agree to pay out your claim before trial simply in order to avoid a judgement. Another judgement against them will simply hurt the position even more and they really don't want this. 300 quid plus your costs is peanuts to them. They don't care about it. They will set it off against tax so the taxpayer will make their contribution. It's all about maintaining their business model of not being liable for anything, and limiting or excluding liability contrary to section 57 and section 72 of the consumer rights act.     And incidentally, there is a myth that if you refuse mediation that somehow it will go against you and the judge will take a dim view and be critical of you. This is precisely a myth. It's not true. It would be highly improper if any judge decided the case against you on anything other than the facts and the law of the case. So don't worry about that. The downside of declining mediation is that your case will take slightly longer. The upside is that if you win you will get all your money and you will have a judgement in your favour which will help others. The chances of you winning in this case are better than 95% and of course you would then receive 100% of your claim plus costs
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

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      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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have I just got myself fired?


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Hi everyone. I work for a corporate, about 6 years now.

 

Twice I've been sent to college by company. Finished twice with the highest grade. I have good record at work with relation to overall performance (attendance, sick, always on time, never refused to do my job etc).

 

On Friday I've been approach by manager asking me to do some more hours to which I replied "no thanks". Minute later my colleague ask me why I am not interested in doing extra hours to which I replied "I have work my ass off for this company for the last 5 years, spent my free time on getting educated, when I could be sitting down the pub with my mates and now they are not interested in doing anything for me, so I am not staying any f****** minute longer".

 

What I did not know is that my manager was sneaking behind by back. So she approached my and ask to repeat what I said to which I replied it was a private conversation between good friends and has nothing to do with her. Obviously I've been asked to step into the office and had a chat with her about how unacceptable it is to say thing like that about company and that it is not true, that they invested many in me etc.

 

I said then "investment is something you care about, something you may want to make sure company will benefit from in the future and that during all that time I've been doing my HND certificate not even once anyone of them have come down and ask me how I am doing, is everything OK, not even mention college ended in June and they did not even asked my for a proof of final grade.

 

I also said that it is now time to get me into practical training before I loose what I learned at college, they know I am not after more money but simple chance to put in practice all my knowledge. I then said I believe my opinion is justified by their actions or lack of it and I have sound grounds to feel that way."

 

She was a bit shocked and said it is all for now, but I know I am gonna have to take b*******g on Tuesday when big boss is back and I am worry they may try to crucify me.

 

Can I start packing my staff on Monday guys? :| What Is the worst possible outcome out of this.

 

I just want to add that we (employees) have been slowly stripped from all our privileges like bonuses etc and overall morale is at its lowest ever been i.e. no one is willing to do any OT etc.

 

Thanks for any advice, cheers!

Edited by honeybee13
Editing in some spacing for ease of reading.
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I know it's too late now, but you would have been far better off dialing down the attitude when you spoke to your manager in her office, rather than continuing to be confrontational. I'm not sure that they'll be able to find grounds for gross misconduct, but if I were you I'd be focusing on damage limitation at this point. At best, you've probably seriously impaired your relationship with your manager - regardless of your standard of work in the past, if I was managing an employee who had been paid to do an HND and then said that they'd have preferred to be down the pub with their mates, I'd be wondering if I'd chosen the right employee to invest in.

 

You could try writing a letter apologising for your attitude and recognising that the company have invested heavily in you over the last few years. If you feel that you have gained skills on your HND that could be utilised to their benefit, use the letter to constructively point out that you are committed to the company and would love the opportunity to put those skills to use. Try to politely put over the fact that you are a valuable asset to them, and would be very sorry if one out of character outburst were to damage your relationship with them.

"Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me". Martin Niemöller

 

"A vital ingredient of success is not knowing that what you're attempting can't be done. A person ignorant of the possibility of failure can be a half-brick in the path of the bicycle of history". - Terry Pratchett

 

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Probably not fired yet! but i would start looking for another job, if you have complaints about the way things are there is a proper and correct way to bring up your concerns, shooting off at the mouth isnt one of them. Anyway they have paid for you to do a course they dont have to ask how it was for you, and how did you do etc, they must have thought it was worth you doing but weather they use your new skills or not is up to them.

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Probably not fired yet! but i would start looking for another job, if you have complaints about the way things are there is a proper and correct way to bring up your concerns, shooting off at the mouth isnt one of them. Anyway they have paid for you to do a course they dont have to ask how it was for you, and how did you do etc, they must have thought it was worth you doing but weather they use your new skills or not is up to them.

 

It does not bother me at all as I will be looking for something as soon as next year summer time, probably self employed as well. I just need to survive there till then. I've sign contract agreement and if I quit sooner I am eligible for all of the college costs and that is over 4k. TIMBER :mad2:

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If you are dismissed you are still liable to repay fees usually.

 

The company have invested money and time in you - your response is shocking. I have people lining up for company sponsored education and competing for it.

 

I personally would be looking at a warning for attitude and language; and then I'd be watching you like a hawk for the first excuse to get you out.

 

That would change if I believed the apology i got after the weekend was in any way sincere.

 

That's just me, but I am probably typical of many.

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Some serious apologising, being very nice and explaining it was a one off . . . sounds like you've had a lot on recently and feel like you've not been supported but was it that one managers fault that you let rip at?

 

Dont know much about what will happen but a bit of a random question for you . . . Have you had some time off/holiday recently? I got like that in a previous job where i didnt take time off, put a lot of time in and it all got too much and lost it with a manager and shouted n swore. I didnt get sacked but told to take 2 weeks holiday and chill out that was pub work and dealing with people every day, not sure what your situation is but you sound overloaded and like you need a break

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If you are dismissed you are still liable to repay fees usually.

 

The company have invested money and time in you - your response is shocking. I have people lining up for company sponsored education and competing for it.

 

I personally would be looking at a warning for attitude and language; and then I'd be watching you like a hawk for the first excuse to get you out.

 

That would change if I believed the apology i got after the weekend was in any way sincere.

 

That's just me, but I am probably typical of many.

 

Emmzzi makes a very good point, which I hadn't thought of...you could be liable for the fees if you're dismissed - you really need to check your contract of employment, to see if there is anything in there regarding dismissal and the repayment of fees, just in case.

 

If I'm honest, I can't disagree with anything else she's said, either.

"Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me". Martin Niemöller

 

"A vital ingredient of success is not knowing that what you're attempting can't be done. A person ignorant of the possibility of failure can be a half-brick in the path of the bicycle of history". - Terry Pratchett

 

If I've been helpful, please click my star. :oops:

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Tell them you were uncharacteristically stressed out. Tell them how terribly grateful you are for all their support, and grovel and apologise like mad. It is not relevant you want to leave in summer; best keep that to yourself and remain respectful.

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To be honest you've been a bit unlucky that your manager has heard you swearing while speaking to your colleague. What is the culture like in your office? Is swearing commonplace and accepted - does your manager swear in conversation (I don't mean at you, just in conversation)? Some of the points you made about the training are probably valid, and the suggestions you made about using your training were to benefit the company, but perhaps you could have chosen a better time to air them.

 

It is good that you stood up for yourself and expressed an opinion, the best way for the manager to deal with it would be to perhaps bring up the subject informally - 'are you feeling better/less stressed', something like that. Taking formal action against you for something like this is likely to do more harm than good, but they may try and discipline you.

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