Salford City Council - refuse to show council tax rules

[EcclesTony]

For 3 years i have been having problems with Salford City Council regarding Council tax exemptions: ------ repeatedly refusing a Class A exemption on a flat: ----- refusing to visit to see that it was SO uninhabitable it had no internal walls, electrics, plumbing etc ----- refusing to answer questions ----- it took them over a year for them to change their mind - NOT UNTIL AFTER I HAD SOLD THE FLAT ON AT A LOSS DUE TO STRESS - denying any responsibility ------- repeatedly refusing a Class A exemption on a house we bought to do up and move into ----- refusing for over a year ------ refusing to visit to see how bad it was ------ refusing to answer questions ----- TAKING US TO COURT - which was a joke. The council were allowed to withdraw and resubmit - THEY NEVER DID ----- finally granting it ------ DENYING RESPONSIBILITY FOR ALL OUR STRESS ---------- repeatedly refusing Class C exemption on the above house, even though ----- they admit i lived in the house for more than 6 weeks at a time. I MOVED IN DUE TO THE STRESS IT WAS CAUSING ME AND MY WIFE ----- we took our old house off the market because of this - SO THAT WE BOTH HAD SOMEWHERE TO LIVE – so have had to pay another mortgage ----- they insist i have to prove me living at the new house made it my main residence - as my wife still lived at our old house ------ they refuse to answer questions ----- they refuse to show me proof it has to be my main residence ----- they refuse to acknowledge it is the house that should be looked at and not the individual ----- THEY HAVE NOW ISSUED A COURT SUMMONS FOR MYSELF AND MY WIFE --------- I HAVE INVOLVED: ----- COUNCIL TAX STAFF ----- DEPARTMENT MANAGERS ----- COUNCIL DIRECTORS ------ COUNCILORS ----- THE OLD COUNCIL LEADER ----- THE NEW MAYOR ----- MY LOCAL MP ----- AND STILL IT GOES ON ----------- I HAVE HAD TELEPHONE CALLS, MEETINGS, OVER A HUNDRED PAGES OF LETTERS & EMAILS ---------- WE HAVE LOST THOUSANDS OF POUNDS ---------- I HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO WORK - AND DO NOT CLAIM A PENNY OFF THE STATE ---------- ME AND MY WIFE ARE BOTH NOW ON ANTI-DEPRESSANTS ---------- ANY IDEAS ????

Edited September 18, 2012 by EcclesTony

[revshelp]

If theres issues of maladministration then you can take it up with the the Local Government Ombudsman (but you need to exhaust the councils own complaints procedure first).

 

With regards to rules concerning Council Tax the main legislation can be found here

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1992/14/contents

but there are lots of supplementary regulations and amendments which you may need to search through.

 

Establishing a person's "sole or main residence" is key part of determining council tax as it will distinguish a property as being some one's main home or a second/holiday home and influence the chargeable amount. You may want to refer to this court case "Cox v London (South West) Valuation and Community Charge Tribunal and Poole

Borough Council Community Charge Registration Officer (1994)" as it may have some relevance to your situation.

[EcclesTony]

Thank you for your advice about the Local Government Ombudsman ------------- According to The Council Tax (Exempt Dwellings) Order 1992 ---------The Council Tax (Exempt Dwellings) (Amendment) Order 1993 ------------ The Council Tax (Prescribed Classes of Dwellings) (England) Regulations 2003 ........... Classes A - K variously refer to 'sole or main residence' BUT NOT FOR CLASS C. -------------- information on the Valuation Tribunal website & guidebook also refer to 'former resident' (clarified as sole or main resident) for Classes D, E, F, I, J ..........BUT NOT FOR CLASS C...............Thanks again.

[id6052]

i am having difficulty understanding your post, it might help if you rephrase things

 

it is difficult to understand which properties, which exemptions and which periods you are referring to

 

it appears there are 3 properties - a flat, your old house and your new house

 

the issues with the flat appears to have been dealt with, is that correct?

 

i think your issue relates to an application for a class C exemption for one of the 2 houses, which property are you attempting to get the exemption for and what period?

 

during this period, was the property unoccupied and unfurnished? where were you living? where was your wife living?

[revshelp]

For classes D,E,F,I,J a property can remain furnished if the 'liable party' leaves the property unoccupied e.g. Class D if they are detained in prison or under the mental health act.

 

Class C: a vacant dwelling which has been such for a continuous period of less than six months ending immediately before the day in question

 

For Class C the property could theoretically remain your sole or main residence, as it need only be vacant (unoccupied and substantially unfurnished) so this shouldn't present a problem when claiming an exemption.

[EcclesTony]

Ist property, the flat, was EVENTUALLY sorted out. -------------- 2nd property, house we bought to do up and move into is the one we are having problems with Salford Council. --------------------- 3rd property is the one we lived in and wanted to sell ------------ Due to the stress, not a good time at home so i moved into 2nd property by myself on 2 occasions ------------ As per Class C rules, I lived in it for more than 6 weeks at a time each time -------------- tried to claim Class C ---------------- SALFORD COUNCIL AGREE I LIVED IN 2ND PROPERTY TWICE, EACH TIME WAS OVER 6 WEEKS & RULES REGARDING FURNISHED / UNFURNISHED WERE FOLLOWED AS PER CLASS C RULES ---------------- THEY REFUSED TO AWARD IT AS THEY SAID IT WAS NOT MY 'SOLE AND MAIN RESIDENCE', EVEN THOUGH CLASS C RULES DO NOT STATE IT HAS TO BE ------------------------ The rules say it is 'the property not the individual' that should be considered ----------------------- Afraid to sell 3rd property in case problems at home again mean i have to move out again (both now on anti-depressants, not good!) ------------------ costing us money we cannot afford

[id6052]

Okay, let's see if I have got my head round it...

 

You and your wife normally live at new house

You applied for and received a 6 month class C exemption in respect of old address, this was awarded?

 

Then when the exemption ran out you moved back in to old address for just over 6 weeks which would restart the clock for a class C exemption

You then moved back in with your wife and re-applied for the 6 month class C exemption, which was refused for some reason unknown?

 

You moved in to old house for a second time for just over 6 weeks

You then moved back in with your wife and re-applied for the 6 month class C exemption, which was again refused for some reason unknown?

 

You say that the Council accepts you were at old address for more than 6 weeks on each occasion, do you have anything in writing from them?

Have they given any reason for refusing both your applications?

[EcclesTony]

Me and wife normally live at old house ------------- i lived at new address for over 6 weeks & applied for Class C at new address, still not awarded --------------- after 6 months i again moved into new address for over 6 weeks and then applied for a 2nd Class C, still not awarded --------------------- for each 6 month period i had applied for Class C i lived at old address with wife ----------------- got it in writing from council that they agree i lived at new address for 2 periods of over 6 weeks and complied with unfurnished etc in between --------------- they refused the Class C because they said i had to prove new address was my 'sole or main residence' each time i lived there !!!

[id6052]

have you appealed to a Valuation Tribunal?

[EcclesTony]

Not yet ------------------ Salford did the same thing twice with Class A exemptions, refusing for over a year each time with wrong reasons and then EVENTUALLY granting them -------------- i assumed they would realise they were AGAIN wrong and award the Class C

[EcclesTony]

I am also waiting for information i have been asking Salford for 3 years before i apply to VT ------------ and for Salford to show me PROOF that their refusal was correct ---------------- Also, this has REALLY knocked us for 6, we are not thinking straight & can't believe Salford can get away with it EVERY TIME

[id6052]

if they are messing you about, you really should go over their head and appeal to VT, no point in waiting for them

[EcclesTony]

I think i will do now ---------------- thanks

[revshelp]

The VT is your best bet. For the "6 week rule" to apply the property dose not need to be occupied, let along be your sole or main residence, as long as its fully furnished that should be enough.

[ss002d6252]

The VT is your best bet. For the "6 week rule" to apply the property dose not need to be occupied, let along be your sole or main residence, as long as its fully furnished that should be enough.

 

That's a matter for debate, the actual wording of the regs states

 

(2) For the purpose of determining the last occupation day, any period of less than 6 weeks within which the dwelling concerned was occupied shall be disregarded.