Garage Taking Ages to Repair, car still not repaired, is lien enforceable??

[skegnar]

Hi, I need some help!!!

 

my car has some collision damage, that needs repair with a jig.

Found a garage close by that does collision repair, jigging, bodywork and etc...

Asked the guy there to take a look at the car and tell me if he could fix it.

A mutual friend who is a mechanic said he worked ok,

so it looked like i could trust him with repairing my car.

 

The guy from the garage had a good look at it

and said it would repair it for an xxx amount.

and that it would take just less than two weeks.

 

After 1 month and a half the car is still not fully repaired.

 

I have chased him repeatedly over the phone,

and I have been at the garage quite a few times

to check on the progress

and chase up on the repairs

but the thing is that most of the times i go there

he is not there and i get told by other people

that share the place that he’s not being to work

for days.

 

During this time he has revealed himself

to be a crafty and untrustworthy person

and I am now concerned that he may be planning on

not completing the repairs

and holding my car for ransom

forcing me to pay him

for the work he has not done,

or even worse

perhaps planning on charging me a fortune

alleging it is due to storage.

 

I am a bit unsure of my options from this point on.

 

I had a look at some consumer advice information

and from what i could gather

the law seems to say that

the repairs need to be within the agreed time

or i am entitled to take the car somewhere else

and then claim back the costs from him.

 

But i am not sure on how or if the above influences

the “in lieu” situation,

if it is enforceable in these circumstances

and how can i get my car back

as soon as possible

preferably repaired.

 

Thanks in advance for reading and for helping out.

[Conniff]

Have you had a quotation in writing for the work required ?

 

Has he removed the damaged panels ?

[skegnar]

Hi, thank you for your reply

 

 

Have you had a quotation in writing for the work required ?

 

no quotation i writing,

but my partner can witness what was the agreed amount, agreed work to be done

and agreed time for completion of repairs

as he came to our house

the day we took the car to the garage

and she was present

 

honestly i do not think he will dispute the agreed amount

but do i see the point that it all should have been in writing.

 

it crossed my mind at the time

but it looked a bit excessive

as he looked a very easy going person

so i regret it now.

 

 

Has he removed the damaged panels ?

 

The damage was very light.

The car was delivered to him

with most of the parts already removed by me

for him to have very easy access

and be able to work on the damage straight away.

The only parts that were not removed are the ones he specifically asked

to be in the car for the purpose of him being able to re-align the car.

 

The damage for him to repair

are only the parts of the chassis

within the engine compartment

that got bent.

So he was supposed to fix the chassis.

 

My focus at this moment is

how to get my car out of his dodgy hands

as soon as possible

and regain full control over my car

as he is not there most of the time to even repair it,

and it looks to me that he is happy

for the car to remain idle and unfinished over there.

 

I am not sure on how his reiterated breach of contract

affects the "in lien" situation over the car.

 

Would like to know if it is possible

(or if there is any case law or similar precedent)

for me to regain the initiative and perhaps go to a court

to get like an injunction or something like that

to get a judge to say i

he should hand the car back to me

and we'll sort out the money afterwards

as for now he is not fixing my car

and i fear he may be planning on holding my car for ransom

and planning on extorquing me through my car being there.

[Conniff]

Lien would only come into it if the job was done and you refused/couldn't pay the bill and then he could hold a lien over it.

 

You couldn't take it elsewhere to be completed and him foot the bill. If he agreed to you taking it away, he could present you with a bill for work done so far.

[skegnar]

Lien would only come into it if the job was done and you refused/couldn't pay the bill and then he could hold a lien over it.

 

I meant to say he has a lien on the amount owed for the work completed so far.

 

 

 

You couldn't take it elsewhere to be completed and him foot the bill.

Are you referring to the situation if i take my car paying only for the work done so far?

 

When i mentioned that i was referring to the situation

(which in my opinion is what he's planning on doing)

where potentially i would be forced by him

to pay (under protest) the full amount

just to get my car back.

Can you please clarify on the above?

 

I do not see why this not being possible

in the scenario where if i end up paying the full amount

for the full repairs just to get my car back?

If i end up paying for the full repair

and he does not deliver on what was agreed

i think i am entitled by law to do so.

 

 

 

If he agreed to you taking it away, he could present you with a bill for work done so far.

I know that and to be honest at the moment I am happy with that,

as he has clearly demonstrated he is untrustworthy person,

and he is repeatedly in breach of contract, so I just want my car back asap,

and out of his claws either repaired or not.

 

But his behaviour so far leads me to believe that

it will not be easy to agree with him

when it comes to how much is fair for what he has done so far

and how much should i pay out of the agreed total for the repairs

for the work done so far.

 

He was supposed to jig it back into place,

repair the remaining dents and creases,

put some filler and paint

and its repaired.

 

Two weeks ago the car was still

virtually untouched,

so i got a bit more assertive

and he guaranteed me the car would be ready

within a week.

 

Since then he did the jigging but not a lot more.

That second deadline also passed

and the car was still not repaired.

 

At the moment he did only the 1/3 of the job

so i am happy to pay only up to 2/3 of the total.

And that is including a "desperation" premium

that i am happy to pay just to get my car back

and not have to fear for my car anymore.

 

And this is where my problem lies.

I have a strong suspicion that he will not let me take the car unless i pay him the full amount.

I think he is in breach of contract,

due to not repairing within the agreed time

even when given subsequent opportunities required by law to complete the repairs he still

failed to meet those deadlines as well,

so i am not sure how or if it affects any “in lieu” right

to prevent me from getting my car back asap.

 

He has done some work, around 1/3 of it,

so i am obviously happy to pay some money for his incomplete work,

and although i have not discussed this with him yet

his behaviour so far leads me to believe,

or better i am 99.999% sure he’ll refuse any amount other than the full amount

and he’ll say to me to pay up or take him to court to get my car back from him

whilst my car rots there and he is happy adding up artificial extortionary storage charges

to claim even more money he does not deserve out of me.

 

So, in conclusion I was wondering if anyone could offer me some advice on the above

and hopefully avoid me from having to give in to his blackmail

and pay up for work he has not done

just to get my car back.

As he does not seem to be bothered in repairing my car any time soon.

[Conniff]

Ok, I think we got a bit muddled.

 

If he agrees to you taking the car but at the full price, you can send him a letter saying the agreed price and that you will be claiming back the billed amount for another garage to complete the job.

 

You might be being a bit presumtive and need to have a talk to him either in a recorded telephone conversation or by recorded delivery letter, (prefered) to find out exactly what his intentions are. You can make time of the essence and give him a deadline by which to finish the job.

 

Make certain you get a letterheaded or name and addressed stamped full receipt for any monies paid over to him.

[skegnar]

Hi thank you for your reply

 

you may be right, i may be too presumptive here

but i am just getting worried and worried and

my disbelief in his good faith stems from my experience so far

and especially from our last conversation over the phone last friday

where he suddenly changed his behaviour

from his previous very friendly, very informal,

easy going and approachable attitude

to a sort of passive/aggressive,

"i waaay smarter than you, so you better not test me and do as i say and shut up" stance,

suddenly starting talking to me in a way as if he was a lawyer,

getting all careful in his choice of wording,

revisiting and reinterpreting everything he said before

and threatening to retain my car

"untill xmas" and even charging me storage.

 

I have a strong feeling that i can anticipate his

reply to any letter whatsoever, no matter what's in it

will be pay up the full amount or i'm keeping your car.

I think that as i am being very patient, calm polite and conciliatory

throughout this entire time and every single time i talk with him,

he figures i am a soft target.

 

At one point halfway through the call, out of the blue he even said

that he had been at his workplace all day "since 6am" working on my car,

and that my car was finished. ?????

 

To what I said, in that case, can i go and have a look and pick my car up?

He said no. I asked why, he said “because i am not going to be here

when you get here because i do not want to talk with you”,

as if i was insulting him or something for understandably wanting to get my car back

and pay him the money for repairing my car. ????

 

I told him that it wasn't normal for someone to not want the customer

to go and pick up a finished car

and pay the money owed for the job,

so he then after a while, recognized the car was not finished

but from then on he ostensibly and very deliberately

began going to extreme lengths

to avoid saying what was left for him to do on the car,

as if he was thinking i might be recording the call.

l obviously I went there straight away anyway which tool me about 15 mins

and he was already gone.

 

I could confirm straight away that

his tale of being there “since 6 am” working on my car was obviously a lie.

I called him around 3pm, so according to his tale he had about 9 hours working on my car.

 

But in fact the only thing he did to the car that day was to screw back the headlights

(which is just a simple matter of screwing 4 very easy access screws each

and takes about 3 minutes each)

and replace the bonnet spikes/springs that lock the bonnet with spare ones i had at home

(which is even easier and takes about 2 minutes each to remove and 2 more to fit back)

And he put these in just to test if they fitted, (eg, not bothered to plug in the lights)

and all of that took him 15-20 mins at best

and he did nothing else whatsoever in the car that day.

 

This is exactly a perfect example of what he does.

According to his mate, (apparently they just share the garage space but work independently)

lately he goes there just for 1 or two hours

does just a small bit of work on whatever car

the owner is chasing him the most at any given time

and then he is off again for the rest of the day

and many time he does not show up there again for 2 or 3 days.

 

My idea of him, from having to deal with him all this time,

is that he is a crafty fella, that believes he can outsmart most people.

 

I think he is trying to scare me into going there and pay what he wants

just to get my car back and take the car as it is, even if its not repaired

because he knows i know full well that

he has a “in lieu” right on the car until he's paid

whatever he thinks he's entitled.

And its either pay asap whatever he wants,

complete the repairs somewhere else

and then hope to claim back from him in court

with all the expense in money time and hassle it represents

and no guarantee i’ll get my money back,

or he simply keeps the car

and i never see it again.

 

So he figures i am smart enough

to figure out that if i want my car back any time soon

i have no other option but to give in to what he wants

and pay up whatever he says.

 

He told me in our last conversation that he has been here before,

(Clearly!!!, plenty of times i am sure)

and that he is "self taught" in legal matters

so he has been to court a few times and

"they always lose".

 

And furthermore he had the nerve of accusing me of being another one of

"those customers" that is secretly planning to rip him off

by saying at the end that there is more work to be done

and therefore want to pay less money.

 

Again this is ludicrous!!!

All this time all of my focus was just the time it was taking.

The issue of money was never even brought up by me at anytime,

so there was never any question whatsoever

in that regard.

I only ever spoke to him again and again

about him not completing the repairs on time

and me seeing he’s not being at his workplace most of the times

and that being the reason why the repairs are not being done by him,

so money has never been the issue for me.

 

So, that is totally artificial and ludicrous,

but furthermore he said he needs to protect himself

from "customers like me"

so he said he now refuses to speak to me in person

(why??? As i was always totally calm and polite,

clearly this is not the first time he has done this to someone)

and he says he will not do anything else in the car

until i hand in a written note to his mate at the garage

detailing exactly and precisely

what the repairs are and exactly what he needs to do to the car

to repair it.

 

Again i perhaps i am being presumptive,

but I think that in reality this out of the blue note demand is just a hoop and potentially a trap.

He’s trying to con and scare me into making me jump through hoops

when he’s the one who should be getting his act together

and actually doing his job.

 

First of all I am not a mechanic

so i am not qualified to say to him or anyone

in a note how to repair collision damage on a car.

So i am a bit concerned that if i do as he is demanding

and do this wrong,

and more importantly if i miss out anything important on the note

he will use this against me

and thus avoid having to do this or that

because i did not specified it in the note he’s demanding.

 

I think it is also another crafty excuse for shifting responsibility on any future the delays onto me,

thus artificially creating something he can use to stop working on my car altogether,

the responsibility of which he thinks he can pin on me,

to artificially shift the responsibility for the delay onto me

and if i do not comply with his demands

he figures this will enable him to eventually start claiming

he had a reasonable motive to charge a fortune for storage in the near future.

 

But what i really and truly fear is that

no matter whatever i put in the note

if there is anything more than what he has already done,

which was basically just the jigging,

he is just going to say that was not included in the price

he gave me, so its either pay up or go to court

and my car will rot away in its greedy hands.

 

So that is why i would like to avoid this altogether.

I do not trust this person anymore,

so i would really prefer to take my car to some other place

to finish the repairs there.

 

Hence the reason for asking for help from CAC members

is that i am a bit unsure of my options from this point on.

 

I thank you for your advice on the

"time of the essence and ask him to declare his intentions" letter .

I am also inclined to think this might be the best way forward.

 

Last time i spoke with him this friday got me so worried that

i literally spent all this weekend researching on this

and i was already thinking of writing such a letter and even found one i was thinking of adapting in this site

tradingstandards.gov.uk/cgi-bin/glos/con1item.cgi?file=*adv0006-1011.txt

but at this point there are few things i am unsure of.

 

Primarily I am not sure if it is wise at this point to add other bits to the letter as well, so not sure if i should:

 

a- just stick to a very short "time of the essence and ask him to declare his intentions" letter

or

b- whether to also include (inevitably long) narrative of what happened so far

c- cave in to his demand and also include a description of what has been done so far

and what else he needs to do for the repairs to be completed.

 

d-none of the above,

i) for example, if possible bypass him altogether and go straight to a court ask for the lien to be lifted, due to clear and repeated breach of contract or any other reason

(potentially conditional with me agreeing to pay a fair percentage of the total amount, as per decided by the court and not him)

ii) or any other suggestions you may have

 

I am inclined to be cautious and go with just (a) for now as per your advice and see how this evolves from there. (one of the downsides being that my car will remain idles there for another week or too at least untill and/or if he replies back)

but i am open to comments and/or other suggestions on how to proceed.

 

I am sorry for the very long post but its a bit difficult to explain certain things without going into some considerable detail.

 

 

 

 

PS- i do have a pocket voice recorder

but not sure if in case i have a chance record my future conversations with him

the recordings would be acceptable (as proof) in a court

[Conniff]

I understand and you are within your rights not to trust him. Garages and builders have the worse reputation of all trades.

 

If he isn't there most of the time, can you visit while the other one is there and see if your car is finished?

 

Don't talk to anyone unless you can either record the conversation or it is in a letter, you will be making things more and more difficult for yourself if things turn out as you think they might.

[skegnar]

As i just got access to a voice recorder

i was reflecting a bit on regarding exactly what to do at this point,

and basically i was thinking of going there one last time

with the voice recorder and record whatever happens

to see if i can sort this out

which would be brilliant, but i am not putting my money on it to be honest

or if it does not get sorted out

then at least if i can get him to repeat some of the things he said to me on the phone the other day,

but not sure if such recording would be admissible in court.

 

I suspect it will take me perhaps the whole week and many hours or days waiting outside

his workplace until he finally shows up.

and i am not sure whether he'll even speak to me, but i guess i'll be able to get him to at least say something,

so i am willing to give it a go and only go down the letter avenue as per (a) above

after that last attempt is exhausted.

 

again, i am open to comments and/or other suggestions on how to proceed.

 

thanks in advance

[skegnar]

Many thanks for your comments and advice.

 

Don't talk to anyone unless you can either record the conversation or it is in a letter, you will be making things more and more difficult for yourself if things turn out as you think they might.

 

You are absolutely right. I could not agree more.

My mother always told me that form a certain point on

every communication without exception must be in writing.

The problem is that communication in writing

before that point can sometimes be a bit overkill,

and trigger an allergic defensive reaction

so there is a degree of common sense

to pinpoint and decide when to go stop being informal/verbal

and start to go down the exclusively formal/written route.

To me it was during last phone call where

he out of the blue started to clearly show he could not be trusted

and that he is not in good faith regarding this matter.

 

That is also why i decided to get this voice recorder,

to perhaps get some record of what is being said in the future

whilst making one final attempt to resolve this

in a normal way.

 

 

 

If he isn't there most of the time, can you visit while the other one is there and see if your car is finished?

 

Yes, at least up to last friday so far

i have never been denied access to my car

to inspect it, get something from it or whatever.

That is why i always know what's being done in my car

(usually nothing at all).

 

 

The other guy is there all the time working on his customer's cars

and he's been always understanding and helpful.

 

I am not sure due to his sudden change in attitude towards me

and in light of what he said last friday

if my future access to the car will be restricted in any way.

 

But the other guy is very laid back,

and he's mostly inside the garage working on his own thing

with both the yard and the garage's gates fully open all the time

and the car is all alone outside in the yard, so unless they put

other cars in front of mine,

if i had my key i could even drive it out or perhaps push it out, but not sure if i should.

 

Much the contrary, for example

last thursday i was there for over two hours waiting for the guy to meet me there

as i was there in the morning around 12

and he arrived, went in and came straight back out but he said

he would be there at 3pm to work on my car

so he told me to be there at 3 as well.

 

Needless to say i was there at 3 and he never showed up,

he was not answering his phone or replying to my messages either,

and i was there waiting for over two hours like an idiot

until i left and he did not even bothered to pick up the phone or apologise

So that was also why i called him on friday. (but i diverge)

 

 

The point is that i arrived at 3 and after a while

the other guy goes away

and leaves the garage totally unattended,

with the exception of that he knew i was

in my car just outside the garage.

So he felt comfortable in leaving me there

as he knew i would keep and eye on the shop

whilst he was away.

So in reality if i had another key i could have taken my car away that day,

or at least i could have pushed it out of the shop.

Not sure if that would have any legal implications for me with regards to the "en lien" situation.

But the fact is that contrary to him

i am a man of my word

and i am a trust worthy person

so the thought never even crossed my mind

while i was there all alone for well above 30 mins

until his colleague got back.

[Conniff]

Don't get left there on your own again, I don't trust anyone and you shouldn't either, there could be an accusation of impropriety.