Dubai Debt

[wangdoodle]

Hi,

 

without going into details, the why and how etc due circumstances within and without of my control I have recently returned to the UK after living in Dubai for several years.

I have left behind Mortgage debt, loan and credit card debt as a last resort, anyone who knows about Dubai will understand why.

What are the legalities with regard to recovery?

I understand if I return to the UAE I'll be jailed until the debt is cleared but if I don't can any debt incurred in UAE be recovered in UK?

I'm looking for advice only, please don't judge as I understand my circumstances to be far from unique.

Comments and advice is appreciated,

 

thanks

[cerberusalert]

What are the legalities with regard to recovery?

If they know where you are they can ask politely & that's about it. They would need to seek the permission of a UK court to be able to apply for a judgment & you can contest it on the grounds that a UK court does not have jurisdiction & there are no reciprocal agreements between the UK & Dubai.

[wangdoodle]

If they know where you are they can ask politely & that's about it. They would need to seek the permission of a UK court to be able to apply for a judgment & you can contest it on the grounds that a UK court does not have jurisdiction & there are no reciprocal agreements between the UK & Dubai.

thanks, appreciated, thought as much

[unclebulgaria67]

Just don't go anywhere near Dubai. I read a very sinister article on how the State of Dubai deals with debtors. They appear to be totally on the side of the creditors and look upon debtors as something nasty they have trod in. There have been people arrested as they arrived at the airport and taken into custody.

[renegadeimp]

I wonder how they can explain the reasons for jailing someone until the debt is paid. Thats pretty much self defeating. But given that the country is ran by multi billionaires who have siphoned off money from the citizens, it becomes obvious.

[cerberusalert]

I wonder how they can explain the reasons for jailing someone until the debt is paid. Thats pretty much self defeating. But given that the country is ran by multi billionaires who have siphoned off money from the citizens, it becomes obvious.

 

It's difficult for a Westerner to get their heads around Sharia law, but most Arab countries take an extremely dim view of both debt and usuary. Even bouncing a cheque will land you in deep doo-doo.

 

Will any further posters please refrain from commenting on the rights or wrongs of Sharia as it will not help the OP & will in all likelihood be unapproved.

[unclebulgaria67]

There have been people ripped off in property scandals involving various con artists and they have had very little help from the Dubai authorities and some have even been arrested, as the con artists had made complaints about non payment.

[wangdoodle]

so reasonable to assume that collection in UK of debt from UAE is not enforceable and DCA's trying are just making empty threats?

[cerberusalert]

For them to bring an action in the UK it would take an extremely long time and would probably be prohibitively expensive for them even if they were to obtain permission to proceed from a UK court, which is unlikely.

 

They are willy waving.

[unclebulgaria67]

They are willy waving.

 

You would get arrested and jailed in Dubai for that.

[oleg]

You would get arrested and jailed in Dubai for that.

 

In my experience, absolutely not: they're all at it.

[oleg]

so reasonable to assume that collection in UK of debt from UAE is not enforceable and DCA's trying are just making empty threats?

 

In case you were unaware, you must not enter any GCC state, not just UAE, as they share databases. You would be liable to be arrested. Saudi jails leave rather a lot to be desired.

[wangdoodle]

In case you were unaware, you must not enter any GCC state, not just UAE, as they share databases. You would be liable to be arrested. Saudi jails leave rather a lot to be desired.

thanks, aware of that even though i know people who have returned albeit on new passport. I've no intention of returning and just want to be comfortable that nothing can be done.

[oleg]

Yes. I was wrongly accused by a spiteful employer of some ghastly crimes. They wrote to me never to dare set foot in the Emirates again. So i didn't ... for the next 8 weeks. )

[wangdoodle]

Morning All

,see below text from letter,

are the threats to recover in UK possible or is it non-enforceable

- any suggestions on reply to the letter appreciated,

don't know if it makes a difference but now residing in Scotland,

thanks

 

Dear Sir

 

Indebtedness to First Gulf Bank

 

We act on behalf of First Gulf Bank, based in Abu Dhabi in the United Arab Emirates (“UAE”).

 

We have been instructed by our client to engage with you and to make arrangements for the repayment of your credit card debt to our client.

 

We hope that you will engage with us for this purpose. If you do not, then we have instructions to commence legal proceedings against you which, regrettably but inevitably, will result in your liability increasing by reason of the contractual costs indemnity (“the Costs Indemnity”) which was agreed in writing with our client when you applied for (and obtained) your banking facilities.

 

In terms of prospective legal proceedings, please note that our client’s position is fully reserved in terms of the choice between:

 

(a) Debt recovery proceedings to be issued before Northampton (CCMCC) County Court; or

 

(b) Bankruptcy proceedings to be issued before the nearest County Court to your home with insolvency jurisdiction.

 

Regardless of the above choice of legal forum (and whilst stressing again that we hope court proceedings can be avoided through engagement and negotiation) we ought to clear up a common misconception which has arisen in the course of our debt recovery work for this client and for numerous other client banks operating within the UAE.

 

Whilst the terms under which you are indebted to our client are governed by the laws of the UAE, our client is free to (and does) pursue legal proceedings in numerous jurisdictions around the world.

 

An express term within the contractual terms and conditions to which you signed up and agreed states that no single court (whether in the UAE or elsewhere) has “exclusive” jurisdiction to determine these credit card debt claims.

 

Based on expert evidence given on the applicable laws of the UAE by Baker & McKenzie Habib Al Mulla (leading lawyers in the UAE) we are currently securing an average of ten judgments each month before Northampton (CCMCC) County Court.

 

In relation to your indebtedness, we have satisfied ourselves that your liability to our client is immediately due and owing and, as such, legal proceedings can be commenced in the UK at any time.

 

However, as we have stated, we hope that legal proceedings can be avoided and that, instead, you will engage with us and agree to the repayment of your liability.

 

To this end, we are able to give you 21 days from the date of this letter to make proposals to repay your debt which currently stands at AED XXXXXX .

 

If the above indebtedness is paid in full to our client within 21 days, then no additional liability for our legal costs will arise under the Costs Indemnity.

 

However, this concession will only be made available to you on these terms and for this period – so without operating in any way as a waiver to the terms of the Costs Indemnity.

 

Assuming a settlement agreement can be reached with you, please note that all settlement monies need to be paid into our client account giving the reference: .

 

Beneficiary COYLE WHITE DEVINE LIMITED - Client AccountBank LLOYDS TSB BANK PLCBranch GERRARDS CROSSAddress 33 PACKHORSE ROAD, GERRARDS CROSS, BUCKINGHAMSHIRE SL9 8PFSort Code 30-13-30Account No 14769868BIC: LOYDGB21358IBAN: GB75LOYD30133014769868

 

Joanne Perry has been allocated to your account. Please make written repayment proposals to Miss Perry by no later than close of business on 25 September 2013.

 

Miss Perry’s email address is set out above if email communications are more convenient for you. We look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully COYLE WHITE DEVINE

Edited January 16, 2017 by dx100uk

[citizenB]

I have popped some spacing into your post for easier reading.

 

It was my understanding that they are unable to obtain judgment against you for a debt in another country. However, I am sure those that know for sure will be along soon to advise.

 

Can you perhaps post a summary of the actual debt - how long ago the agreement was entered into - how long is it since the last payment was made.

[wangdoodle]

Can you perhaps post a summary of the actual debt - how long ago the agreement was entered into - how long is it since the last payment was made.

 

debt approx. £12k - no communication or payments since leaving Dubai November 2011

[citizenB]

Excellent, thank you. I am just trying to think of things the "experts" might need to know.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?400955-Threatened-with-UK-Bankruptcy-over-Dubai-Debt-from-2009

 

The link above seems to be a similar situation to yours. You might find some information in that, which will help you

[wangdoodle]

Excellent, thank you. I am just trying to think of things the "experts" might need to know.

 

no worries, I've been told that even if an attempt to secure a judgement in the UK is made it will be thrown out and effectively there is no real legal recourse to recover in UK, and even less in Scotland.Just need advise on wether to reply to it or not and if so how to contruct the reply,thanks

[unclebulgaria67]

Think you need specific advice about foreign debts being enforced in Scotland.

National Debtline should be able to find out the answer to how the Dubai bank would be able to apply to the Scottish courts to enforce a Dubai debt.

 

 

I think it is possible, but it is probably not a straightforward process.

 

http://www.nationaldebtline.co.uk/scotland/

 

It would be a good idea, if you were able to look at the Dubai bank credit card terms to see whether it allows for enforcement of the debt in any country you were resident.

[Globaleye01]

Hi wangdoodleWhat is the latest on your case - I find myself in a similiar situation, whereby I have received the same communication from the same firm in relation to a UAE debt. I have been sent a sent a statuary deman notice...

[unclebulgaria67]

Hi wangdoodleWhat is the latest on your case - I find myself in a similiar situation, whereby I have received the same communication from the same firm in relation to a UAE debt. I have been sent a sent a statuary deman notice...

 

If it is a statutory demand, then you will need to get this set aside within the 18 days allowed. Otherwise you risk a bankruptcy petition being made against you.

 

If you need advice on the set aside process, you will need to set up your own thread in the CAG legal issues folder.

[budwiser123]

Hi Wangdoodle,you still not heard anymore from these people after months and months??

[wangdoodle]

Hi Wangdoodle,you still not heard anymore from these people after months and months??

 

Hi,had the same letter twice in last few months, no further contact and nothing since March

[budwiser123]

Thanks for your reply,"maybe" these people have bought all these debts from UAE banks,and are chasing those with assets first.its all a bit bizarre it seems.