HSBC and Sigma SPV 1 Split Claim

[knet2020]

Hi, hope you can help. DCA (Sigma) has issued a summons against me, the debt from an HSBC Overdraft Account having been sold to them:

 

Fist port of call was forum/showthread.php?241827-Legal-Action-how-to-start-off.-IMPORTANT-IF-YOURE-BEING-SUED

 

P.o.C (Particulars of Claim)

 

"Part only of monies due under regulated Credit Agreement no. XX between HSBC and the defendant, the benefit of which was assigned to the claimant on 21/12/11.

 

The Agreement was terminated upon the defence failure to comply with the terms of the agreement and or the statutory notice of default served by HSBC Bank plc.

 

The claimant seeks interesticon pursuant to section 69 of the CCA 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum from the date of issue continuing at the daily rate of 0.07"

 

NOTE: Cant post links yet but this provides additional info

 

Split Claims are an abuse of process fortunately in the above SoC they have failed to mention that they don't wave any balance due on the same account number

 

forum/showthread.php?349072-HSBC-DCA-has-issued-summons-for-interest-on-default-notice&p=3829736&viewfull=1#post3829736

 

it is unlawful under section 35 County Courts Act 1984 to split one claim into smaller claims

 

forum/showthread.php?139265-Bryan-Carter-And-solicitors-how-to-defend-ccj-claim**WON**&p=1481366&viewfull=1#post1481366

 

The PoC does not include any section like:

 

for the avoidance of doubt in making this claim for a part of the debt the claimant does not waive any rights as to the balance of the debt, which the defendant continues to owe to the claimant under the agreement. The claimant reserves the right to make further claims for such sums of the debt as remain outstanding

 

forum/showthread.php?139265-Bryan-Carter-And-solicitors-how-to-defend-ccj-claim**WON**&p=1481443&viewfull=1#post1481443

 

Step 1 is to look at the response pack ...normally these things go through Northampton which is an online system.. make sure to acknowledge the claim in the time frame ... this is the acknowledgement of service (I said I will defend claim in full and ask for 28 days)

 

Step 2 write to the claimaint (note this is likely the address for sending documents and payents and will be different) I used the following thread and advice:

 

a CCA request is made under the provisions of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 whereas a CPR request is made under the Civil Procedure Rules

 

the CCA request cannot be refused and non compliance results in the debt becoming unenforceable , the CPR request has no such efects and non compliance would be a matter for the courts

 

So I have requested CPR and will also request a CCA

 

CCA - Section 5 | Sample Letters - nationaldebtline.co.uk/england_wales/debt_advice.php#6

 

CPR - forum/showthread.php?159445-Getting-Them-To-Reveal-Their-Vitals.-Using-CPR-31.14-to-Your-Advantage

 

CPR - forum/showthread.php?139265-Bryan-Carter-And-solicitors-how-to-defend-ccj-claim**WON**&p=1493642&viewfull=1#post1493642

 

Can I get clarification wether my PoC would be seen as a Split Claim? I feel it is but...

I will update this thread as this progesses for the benefit of others

[AndyOrch]

Hi Knet and welcome to Cag legal Forum

 

Take a read here save having to repeat the advice.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?349072-HSBC-DCA-has-issued-summons-for-interest-on-default-notice

 

Regards

 

Andy

[knet2020]

I responded via MCOL - Money Claim Online

 

Claim Status

 

A claim was issued against you on 08/05/2012

 

Your acknowledgment of service was submitted on 13/05/2012 at 20:47:28

 

Your acknowledgment of service was received on 14/05/2012

 

(I asked for an extension but have not recieved any confirmation of that)

 

So as I understand it I have until 27/05/2012 to submit a defence. I wrote a CPR which was sent Special Delivery 14/05/2012 I also sent a CCA which was sent 16/05/2012. The CPR shows as 'delivered' and the CPA was recieved by claimant on 17/05/2012.

 

I need to know what my next step should be? I have read a few threads here and feel it will be submission of a 'holding' defence. Can anyone advise?

[AndyOrch]

Hi knet,

 

Looks like you are well organised, not much can do now apart from watch the dates, wait for responses, and research, read read read.

 

 

Andy

[knet2020]

Thanks, it's a wonderful place this forum but it's a scary thing this

 

Reading this forum/showthread.php?283443-Embarrassed-Defences-and-the-problems-with-them.

[AndyOrch]

Not that scary, worse things happen at sea.There are no debtors jails and they cant shoot you so don't let this consume your life.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[knet2020]

Hi knet,

 

Looks like you are well organised, not much can do now apart from watch the dates, wait for responses, and research, read read read.

 

 

Andy

 

I am doing that...

 

it seem's I may have got the extenstion request a little wrong, I was under the impression that the request was made via acknowledgment of service (which I did) it seems that I may be incorrect here? I have to write to the claimant no?

 

On this basis would it be prudent to submit a defence by 27/05/2012 (assume I have not recd any response to my CCA or CPR) Would someone be kind enough to give me a rough idea of the next steps?

 

I have ordered the Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide but don't think it will be here till next week which will be after 27/05/2012

[AndyOrch]

You need to ring their Sols and agree an extension and then ask then to confirm it in writing (28day) ask them to email or fax as time is tight but you still have 5 days.Then you attach that to your covering letter and send to Northampton requesting extension pursuant to CPR 15.5 as agreed with the Claimant (see attached) work out the new date that your defence will be submitted (27th +28 days) and state my new defence will be xxth XXXXX 2012.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[knet2020]

Thanks for the info, can I confirm then (where the confusion arose) the AoC via mcol is therefore simply letting Northampton know that was my intention?

 

I will speak with them tommorow.

[AndyOrch]

The AoS is simply to confirm you have received and accepted the summons, no more no less.

[knet2020]

This is a bulk centre claim so I have been given an MCOL code to acknowledge.

If you acknowledge you get a further 14 days to file the defence (28 in total)

 

So...

 

So as I understand it I have until 10/06/2012 to submit a defence

[AndyOrch]

So...

 

So as I understand it I have until 10/06/2012 to submit a defence

 

Yes but check it with the CCBC. once your notice has been processed.

[AndyOrch]

Duplicate Gremlins are back

[vic synex]

Any updates on this?

[Shotters]

Brilliant thread, I am going to basically mirror the actions you have been taking knet2020...

 

Good luck.

 

Shotters

[knet2020]

Hi,

Due to various issues I have not been able to reply here, but as the date to enter a defence are now here....

 

I will be entering a defence but need clarification regarding the issues below:

 

• I made a request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 [sections 77-79] 13/05/2012 - No response recieved (sent via recorded delivery)
  
• I made a request under the CPR 31.14 12/05/2012 - No response recieved (sent via special delivery)
  

From what I have read and been able to learn I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with the request for a copy of the agreement and statement of account under these sections of the Act.

 

I understand that under CPR 31.14 the court will take a dim view of such action by the claimant.

 

I plan to enter a version of the following defence(s):

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?349948-Desperate-For-Help-Sigma-Court-Part-Payment-For-Costs-Claim-Form-Received&p=3858710&viewfull=1#post3858710

 

I xxx am a litigant in person and this claim, given the constraints of the bulk system, is frivlous and without merit.

 

It is claiming part monies and costs with no indication of the further monies and costs allegedly owed. No account details are given and no indication is given as to the actual status of the account, therefore it is a split claim and as such should be dismissed without allowing the claimant to amend or re-enter a further or future claim.

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?349072-HSBC-DCA-has-issued-summons-for-interest-on-default-notice&p=3830938&viewfull=1#post3830938

The Defendant entered into an agreement with HSBC on or around xx the xxxx xxxx. The account reference number XXXXXXXXXXXX an overdraft bank account agreement.

 

The Defendant is bemused as to why the Claimant is only claiming " Partial Monies " on an account with a balance of £XXXX.It is a averred that this is an abuse of process if it is the claimants intention is to issue further proceedings on the remaining balance

 

On (insert date) by recorded delivery a request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 section 78(1) for a true copy of the executed Credit Agreement. This was received by XXXX and signed for on (insert date).

 

The courts attention is drawn to the fact that creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they

fail to comply with the request for a copy of the agreement and statement of account under these sections of the Act.

 

The Claimant is therefore put to strict proof that such a complaint document exists

 

HSBC assigned all of its rights under the Agreement to the Claimant Sigma SPV 1 Ltd on the 21st December 2011

 

The Defendant can not recall ever receiving notice of said Assignment and therefore puts the Claimant to strict proof that one was served and compliant with the LoP 1925 Act.

 

It is the Defendant’s contention that the Claimant’s claim is entirely spurious and without merit and should be struck out for the aforementioned reasons or the Claimants should be made to re plead and equate their total claim pursuant to CPR 16.4.1

Essentially I am going to request the claim be struck out, however it is interesting to note:

the Claimants should be made to re plead and equate their total claim pursuant to CPR 16.4.1

Q: Any ideas, suggestions or pitfalls?

Q: Is it advised to include a request to strike out pursuant to CPR 3.4?

Edited June 7, 2012 by knet2020

[knet2020]

So to confirm I have filed a defence, and now we shall see #gulps

[simon54]

Good luck...I have recieved 2 similar claims and intend to follow your process..The wording and amounts are identical to yours but the amounts owed to hsbc are very different. Once again Good Luck

[havinastella]

Just a quick question, how much did they claim and what is the full amount owed?

 

Jogs

[simon54]

Loan 7K Credit Card 1K both claims for 299 99 plus costs 364 99.They are trying to get agreements to repay the full amount of the loans not just the 364.99

[Old Cogger]

new angle this, wonder how DJ!s are responding to this abuse of the system, unfair trading comes to mind, BCOBS?

[havinastella]

Just a quick point, it may be worth it to take the hit of the CCJ for £300 and pay it in full before the 28 days are up!

 

They can't come back for the rest.

 

Jogs

[knet2020]

An update (if you can call it that) is no further progress yet, the claimant has 28 days to respond before it will go to the next stage, it does seem that the 'split claim' issue is not valid but I a still rather suprised that these claims are issued via a solicitor. Sometimes it feels like they may know something we don't but it's either that or unprofessional practice?? I have done a lot of reading on this and will keep the thread updated. It's also a valid point to note some people I spoke with get very 'moral' about repayent of a debt, even when you argue it's not the repayment it's the enforcement of legal process.

 

Shoddy process fails the whole system and should not be tolerated.

Edited June 17, 2012 by knet2020

[marshmallows]

An update (if you can call it that) is no further progress yet, the claimant has 28 days to respond before it will go to the next stage, it does seem that the 'split claim' issue is not valid but I a still rather suprised that these claims are issued via a solicitor. Sometimes it feels like they may know something we don't but it's either that or unprofessional practice?? I have done a lot of reading on this and will keep the thread updated. It's also a valid point to note some people I spoke with get very 'moral' about repayent of a debt, even when you argue it's not the repayment it's the enforcement of legal process.

 

Shoddy process fails the whole system and should not be tolerated.

 

I have got one of these split claim jobbies from Sigma. So is the split claim perfectly acceptable in court?

[knet2020]

Further update:

 

Today I recd a pack from Sigma Red (not solicitors) which essentially contains 2 letters and a copy of statements on the account. The letters look like they have all been typed recently despite the fact dates are jan 10 & 23 (1st is an assingment letter & 2nd is 'our enquiries find no reason you shouldn't pay this')

 

It's worth noting at this point no response was recd to CPR and CCA this was noted in defence.

 

The main letter states "Sigma SPV1 Ltd is prepared to not pursue the claim and to allow the claim to be stayed" IF i enter into a repayment plan (for the full amount)

 

1 - I was under the impression it's the court who stay a claim? Sigma have no 'power' to do this

2 - As I already filed a defence and they are about 7 days from the 28 day limit it's not looking good

3 - The claim is 'split' and as such I am prepared to go to court now (I came this far)

 

So is this scare tactics, i.e make a smaill claim in the hope I would enter into a plan? The fact they have abused the process now makes me more determined than ever to see it through. It's not a moral issue it's a point of law.

 

Thoughts, advice?

 

Can I now clarify the next stage is the Allocation questionaire (which they have to pay a fee) after this (14 days) a district judge will actually look at the claim?

Edited July 4, 2012 by knet2020