Investigatory hearing - ** RESOLVED **

[moll 61]

Appreciate that HB just it seems to escalate into different areas as the original prob really was accusing me of neglect

[honeybee13]

Appreciate that HB just it seems to escalate into different areas as the original prob really was accusing me of neglect

 

I see the problem. Maybe a couple of the people who've helped on the thread would express their opinions?

 

HB

[moll 61]

The whole of the society has now gone home for the bank holiday weekend, except me, left to close up (have not been inducted into what happens at head office when closing up) no lunch break due to line manager disappearing, Done all the manual work as if it does not get done we are closed until next wed.

Hmmm appears they are trying to get to me

[moll 61]

Grievance in.

I have only just been given the transcript of my investigatory hearing from May 4th! as I asked for them to write my Grievance.

it's a 2 point Grievance

 

1 Whilst on amended duties due to my back problem, I had no support from my line manager since our disagreement over internet access on 23rd March until the neglect allegation on 27th April, especially as I am a lone worker.

 

2 False and Malicious allegation re neglect of residents.

 

am I entitled to see the transcript of his part of the investigatory hearing, as i have no idea what has been said/

 

The Ops Manager is of the opinion that he has made reasonable adjustment to accommodate my condition by shifting me to head office to do Admin work which puts an extra 1hr 40 mins traveling time to my day and he insists that I have to be there from 9=5 despite my doctor informing him when I take my medication in the afternoon (for the medically knowledgeable amongst you it consists of 100 mg Tramadol, 300mg Gabepentine 500mg Naproxen and 2mg Diazepam) which i think normally would put down a Bull Elephant, previously I was allowed to leave at 3pm and was able to get home within 10 mins, Is this reasonable?

 

I feel Papasmurf is right and they are trying to make things difficult for me, fortunately I have full support of my colleagues which is a great comfort.

 

I have told them that I am still open to mediation, but have taken my time to put in the grievance to ensure I am not acting rashly unlike my line manager who i feel reacted whilst angry

[lbruk]

Do they realise you are on that much medication? Tramadol, Gabapentin and Diazepam all cause drowsiness/sedation and in some cases confusion. I believe Naproxen is for epilepsy as well and causes heartburn and some stomach disorders.

 

In my opinion you should not be driving long distances under that much medication, so no it is not a reasonable adjustment.

[moll 61]

Do they realise you are on that much medication? Tramadol, Gabapentin and Diazepam all cause drowsiness/sedation and in some cases confusion. I believe Naproxen is for epilepsy as well and causes heartburn and some stomach disorders.

 

In my opinion you should not be driving long distances under that much medication, so no it is not a reasonable adjustment.

 

I can't drive on that much, so I have to get the bus, which at peak times may mean standing which does not help, Falling asleep at work is obviously Gross Misconduct, perhaps that is what they are waiting for.. but at this time I am particularly synical

[lbruk]

equality act will be your friend. You have a major case for Disability Discrimination in regards to not making reasonable adjustments in my view

[moll 61]

Have checked the equality act, I have been up since 4am with back pain and unable to take any more medication. I intend to go into work but will be going in later than 9am will they be able to withold pay for the period I am late, similarly can they stop pay if I have to finish early, I am salaried not hourly paid. Normally I would go sick, but we are so short staffed and our clients will suffer, as said before we do have a passion for our work. once my medication has been taken I am pain free for about 4-5 hours and I believe some work is better than none, I need as much info as possible before I present the equality/disability act to my ops manager. My doctor has stated all my medication on my fit note and the effects once taken.

 

One good thing about being up is I have been able to get some information for another cagger by trawling the internet

[lbruk]

I really feel for your predicament at the moment and i cant believe how heartless they are being. A grievance is the way to go stating that it is unreasonable for a person, able or disabled to catch a bus for 2 hours a day. That because of the pain you are in they might need to adjust your hours of work, seating arrangements, break schedule etc

[moll 61]

I really feel for your predicament at the moment and i cant believe how heartless they are being. A grievance is the way to go stating that it is unreasonable for a person, able or disabled to catch a bus for 2 hours a day. That because of the pain you are in they might need to adjust your hours of work, seating arrangements, break schedule etc

 

 

Interesting day today, went to a county show and popped into a tent for a coffee and a sit down, did not know at the time it was a solicitors stand, selling insurance (12.99 pa) for dispute cases. Had an informal chat with a nice lady and gave her the outline of what was happening at work, she seemed to think like everybody else that the RA was not fair, and that I should out line the work hours I feel I could do due to medication and travel and if they disagreed to ask them to send me to an occupational health Doctor of their choice for their thoughts, then if their Doctor is of the same opinion as mine and they refuse my request (which would be 9-3) then get into dispute.

She was not trying to sell me her insurance, though I did take some leaflets incase any of my colleague s would like to take up their insurance scheme, which I think is better value than some unions (I was paying £11 a month when I was in the prison officers association 10 years ago

 

any thoughts?

[papasmurf1cx]

Depends if you actually want to get into dispute?

 

It all boils down to how committed you are in fighting. If you feel you cannot fight then this effectively forces them to a position they don't want to go to. If they refuse, or comply and then decline the OH advice, where does that leave you? You either comply with their view of things or fight. These things tend to escalate... be ready for it or capitulate for health sake.

[moll 61]

The Ops manager is a bully, I will stand up to him no problem, then I hope the younger staff he tries to Bully with have the confidence to stand up to him too. I have done nothing wrong and am just asking for some understanding until I see a consultant and get my back sorted. This is a charity we work for after all, and I expect the same compassion as we give to the less fortunate we work with. As I stated earlier majority of managers are social climbers, very good at what they do, but no man management skills, as Buddha once said "a bully will never learn a lesson unless he is taught". They have now got two disciplinaries against me both thrown out, I have put in grievances against both, one upheld on 6 points, and the other I am dealing with now, thanks to the help and support I have received off here

[moll 61]

Any body know or had dealings with Croner, this is who my Ops manager says he takes advice off?

[moll 61]

HAve just been summoned by my Ops Manager re Reasonalbe adjustment due to my back, They have taken advice off of Croner who say

a) I am fit enough to do my old role of running a hostel? No medical taken place or offered.

 

b) I have to inform a line manager if I take medication

 

c) they have spoken to my Doctor (thught they would need permission for this, but she supports my position)

 

d) Other members of staff are allowed to work from home, I have asked that If I have to go early I can possibly do some work from home, as I am putting a course together on basic life skills to present to our clientelle I could easily cover any hours taken off, I have previously done plent of unpaid work out of hours which I have never claimed it's just a part of the job.

 

e) Other members of staff if they go off sick still get paid no punitive messures against them.

 

f) If a manager feels I am not fit for work they can send me home and it will be treated as sick leave therefore half pay (wouldnt that be medical suspension?)

 

I want to challenge this and really am in need of some sound advice and support

[papasmurf1cx]

HAve just been summoned by my Ops Manager re Reasonalbe adjustment due to my back, They have taken advice off of Croner who say

a) I am fit enough to do my old role of running a hostel? No medical taken place or offered.

 

b) I have to inform a line manager if I take medication

 

c) they have spoken to my Doctor (thught they would need permission for this, but she supports my position)

 

d) Other members of staff are allowed to work from home, I have asked that If I have to go early I can possibly do some work from home, as I am putting a course together on basic life skills to present to our clientelle I could easily cover any hours taken off, I have previously done plent of unpaid work out of hours which I have never claimed it's just a part of the job.

 

e) Other members of staff if they go off sick still get paid no punitive messures against them.

 

f) If a manager feels I am not fit for work they can send me home and it will be treated as sick leave therefore half pay (wouldnt that be medical suspension?)

 

I want to challenge this and really am in need of some sound advice and support

 

Can you please update us on where the Grievance is? I have skimmed the thread and to be honest I don't know if you have actually put in your grievance and if you have what your grievance stated.

 

Additionally, the points that you quote above are these in reply to points made in that grievance? I think you need to make these things very clear.

[moll 61]

Sorry Pappa

My Grievance is in, re a false allegation at work by my line manager, I have had an investigatory hearing and this is nothing to do with my back.

 

The above is due to my back problem. I was taken out of the Hostel I worked in due to innability to do the manual work, stairs and trips into town to get supplies as It is at the top of a steep Hill.

 

My Doctor gave me a fit note to say I could undertake admin type work at Head Office which I am doing now. Occasionly if my back pain is too much (this has only happenned twice in three weeks) I will have to finsih and go home. The Medication I take makes me drowsy, I can take it later than I'm used too to stretch out my working hours.

 

Everything above is about making a reasonable adjustment, I feel discriminated against as I feel the above is not accross the board to other workers, apart from my back prob starting in Sept last year I have had an excellent sick record. Any other information you need I will gladly pass on

 

cheers Moll

 

 

Having to travel to Head office leaving at 5pm my bus is oviously a rush hour one, and often leaves me standing for up to 45 mins.

 

No other members of staff have had the above sanctions applied to them on return to work, so I feel as you stated before, they are out to get me and it is going to be a bumpy ride which I am willing to see out

[papasmurf1cx]

It seems to me that if this is a separate issue that you are back into making a grievance about it and if the grievance is lost to go to the ET. Of course if the issue is what is reasonable or not reasonable the ET is the only place to decide on it so either way you are set for the ET, so remember the time limits that apply.

[jackieandwayne]

Oh at last, a lady who thinks just like I did when I got bullied at work! (sorry if you are a guy!) You are right in everything you do, blessed bullies. This person does need teaching and your new manager is right, the other manager IS afraid of you, you are a threat to them because of your experience, the support and respect you can command, and your age related common sense! You hang on to that thought, it should help you smile everytime you act to have them exposed.

 

You go and do whatever it takes to A) to make you feel better and B) get this idiot out of an organisation that deals with vulnerable people before the clients become victims.

 

Good luck and I'm behind you 100% +

[moll 61]

HAve just been summoned by my Ops Manager re Reasonalbe adjustment due to my back, They have taken advice off of Croner who say

a) I am fit enough to do my old role of running a hostel? No medical taken place or offered.

 

b) I have to inform a line manager if I take medication

 

c) they have spoken to my Doctor (thught they would need permission for this, but she supports my position)

 

d) Other members of staff are allowed to work from home, I have asked that If I have to go early I can possibly do some work from home, as I am putting a course together on basic life skills to present to our clientelle I could easily cover any hours taken off, I have previously done plent of unpaid work out of hours which I have never claimed it's just a part of the job.

 

e) Other members of staff if they go off sick still get paid no punitive messures against them.

 

f) If a manager feels I am not fit for work they can send me home and it will be treated as sick leave therefore half pay (wouldnt that be medical suspension?)

 

I want to challenge this and really am in need of some sound advice and support

 

 

This is where the thread gets complicated with issues going off on tangents

 

I have a Grievance in re False and malicious allegtions, being dealt with thank you for advice on this.

 

my present plight is the above which I feel is unreasonable.

 

This is what I want to challenge, no other member of staff has or ever have had these restrictions

.

Ifeel I am being harrased due to the grievance I have in

.

I have told my Manager that I do not think it is right and have requested a meeting with the Chief Executive, I would like something cast iron (if poss) to go in with.

 

This is likely to go on, so please be patient with me.

 

Also thanks everyone for the notes of support. These people are true bulllies and hopefully other employees will have the confidence to challenge them once they have seen they are not acting as they should be.

[moll 61]

Just spoke to a colleague who unfortuantely had 8 weeks off last year due to depression, none of the conditons or hoops I have to jump through were mentioned to him, he says he just got a nice welcome back chat and that was it. Doesnt remember being on half pay after 6 weeks, however I dont have a problem with the half pay, its the conditions put on me. I will be speaking to the HR firm later to see why they gave my manager the impression that I was fit for normal duty with no medical ?

[moll 61]

Still awaiting to hear re my grievance, should I be asking questions?

[moll 61]

I hope this may help with people tryng to assist me

The following is the grievance Procedure.

 

 

 

We wish to ensure that any employee who feels dissatisfied with any matter relating to his/her work has an immediate means by which such a grievance can be aired and resolved.

 

At all stages of the grievance procedure you have the right to be accompainied by a work colleague to help you explain the situation more clearly. Alternatively, you may be accompanied by a trade union official where the nature of the grievance arises our of our duty under statute or common law. If you wish to exercise this right please inform your immediate superior prior to the grievance being heard.

 

If you feel aggrieved at any such matter during your time with us you should

 

1. First raise the grievance with your line manager

 

2. Agree with that person a further time at which the mattr will be discussed with a view to resolution or, if no resolution of the problem is initially possible a time at which your grievance can be heard by the General Manager/Chairman whose dicision is final.

 

 

My grievance was put in on 06/06/12 and was heard at 1500 that day by my line manager.

 

the last part of the transcript from the meeting was " The process is that this (Hand written transcript) will be typed up and a copy given to you for your signature and then it will be passed to the Operations Manager, any further action will be taken by management"

 

I had supervision by my line manager on 27/7/12 where I bought up the question of what was happening with my grievance, I was told to chase it up with the Operations Manager, I asked if that was his job (Line Manager) he replied no.

 

Any advice desperately required as I am now thinking of ET.

 

I have been advised by ACAS to e-mail my Ops manager and set a time limit for a response, due to recent activity at work I do not feel this will be received well, but I have been keeping a log of goings in just in case I require it.

 

I feel I will be leaving this position one way or another as it is now affecting my mental health and disrupting my home life, will be visiting GP next week.

 

Many thanx

Moll

[moll 61]

Still no answer to my grievance, which I put in on 6th June, surely this is more than reasonable time.

My back problem has solved itself thank goodness, and am now going through withdrawal symptoms from Tramadol which is absolutely awful.

 

Too much stress now, as awake a lot during the night due to above withdrawal, and this still ongoing at work, When will it end?

[jackieandwayne]

Snap re withdrawal from painkillers! I went through it 6 years ago but with a codeine based product, for a back injury. Its dreadful, I know, but it has to be done, and it will be over soon.

 

If I remember rightly, after 6 months of high dosage, I couldn't eat, sleep, I was depressed and weepy and my poor tum was so upset. And in the first couple of weeks, the urge to go to the GP and tell him I needed that painkiller again was very strong. I even convinced myself the injury was back again but luckily that only lasted a few days in my head, all part of the withdrawal apparently. Oh, and when I did sleep, whacky dreams/nightmares and night sweats. Are you being weaned, or have you just stopped them dead? GP wanted me weaned, but I was so upset when I realised I might have an addiction, I just stopped the things. My GP told me that although it was an unpleasant thing to go through, for a heroin addict to go cold turkey is 50 times worse, and after what I went through i can see why these poor people have such a time getting off it. (you have to look for something to be glad about in every situation life throws at you, and I was very glad that it was just prescription drugs I was being taken off). Yours is probably a bit worse than what I went through as well, because I think Tramadol is morphine based isn't it?

 

The work situation is appalling and I hope it gets resolved soon, one way or the other. You stay strong, you'll wake up one morning quite soon now and realise that the Tramadol is now out of your system and you can put your best foot forward again and deal with this bunch as they should be dealt with. X

[moll 61]

I am weaning myself off, surprised that GPs do not inform you of the addiction or withdrawal. But thank you for your kind words

 

Just got my payslip and have been paid £100 less than normal, no reason for deductions on payslip. I work at the same place as my wife and we just compare payslips. Time for legal advice I think, I have employme nt cover on my house insurance so a free half hour to see if it is worth persuing, people have had longer off than I have without these sanctions, apart from 3 months following radiotherapy in 2007 I have had no sick at all until my back problem, and that has been 6 weeks over 12 months. I have kept a diary of all their activity and as soon as I find another job I will be out of there.