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Bryan Carter/Arrow/Fredrickson and Orange **Help with defence needed urgent**


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Hi,

 

I have not been on for a while as I had managed to sort out previous creditors thanks to CAG, however, this one seems to be a stubborn bugger.

 

I have been locked in dispute since September 2011, over an alledged Orange debt dating back to January 2007. The first I knew of this was when I received a letter from Fredrickson's stating that they was acting on behalf of Arrow Global to recover a debt in relation to an Orange mobile contract. I did move address late on in 2007 but do not recall having ever received a default notice, nor a notice of assignment from Orange. Now prior to this I have never received any communication from Arrow Global, the company that alledgedly owns the debt now.

 

Anyway, I sent them the standard I do not acknowledge this debt etc and they continued chasing for a payment. In between, Bryan Carter sent me a lovely invoice of the amount I would have to pay, should it got to court, however, I chose to ignore them. I then received a further letter from Fredricksons chasing payment at which point I then put the account into dispute in October when I informed them that I had never received a Notice of Assignment, nor a letter confirming themselves as the new 'owners' of the debt. I requested they provide this evidence, along with the existance of this debt. In return I received a statement of account, on Orange headed paper, that showed an amount outstanding back in 2007. Now to me this is not evidence that they own the debt, for one, the statement is from 2007 and for two, it is on Orange headed and as Orange no longer own the debt why would this be? I wrote back informing them of this and also bringing to their attention that they had still not provided me with anything that would show their legal status and right to collect on this debt, if it does in fact exist along with the proof that this debt exists at this moment in time. Fast forward to three days ago where I received a letter from BC informing myself that they had sent my account for litigation and that I would receive court papers. Today they dropped through the door, just as I was compiling a letter informing BC that the account was still in dispute from last year.

 

Now then, here is where I am stuck as to what I need to do next. I was thinking of sending an SAR to Orange but in the meantime I need to file a defence. I am fuming as they think they are above god!:mad2:

 

So lovely caggers, help please :|

 

x

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Arrow will have bought the debt,

Firstly get the aknoledgment of service

off stating you will be defending the claim.

The Statement would been supplied By

Orange to Arrow.

You could send a request of a copy of the

Orange Service Contract To BC, it is not

a CCA'74 regulated contract but send £1 po.

Get these done now then we can work on

a defence.

Carter is known for issueing claims and withdrawing

at the slightest hint of a defence.

Any Letters I Draft are N0T approved by CAG and no personal liability is accepted.

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Thank you for your response Brigadier2JCS.

 

I have just added the request into the letter I have written to them, unless there is a template specifically for this and have also clarified the point that the £1 is to be used for the copy of the contract only and is not to be used towards the alleged debt. This letter and the acknowledgment of service will be posted first think, recorded, tomorrow.

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Hi, Sometimes a simple letter is better

than a well used template,what you have

done is fine.

Any Letters I Draft are N0T approved by CAG and no personal liability is accepted.

Please Consider making a donation to keep this site running!

Nemo Mortalium Omnibus Horis Sapit: Animo et Fide:

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Sorry to high jack this thread.

 

I have all so started my own and the perticulars are near on the same as yours.

 

It would seem that I need to be composing a letter the same as you have done.

 

Could you tell me what it was you asked for I am getting my self confused and wondered if you could set me straight on what to put in it.

 

Thanks

 

Bread

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Hi Bread Bread, my letter was a follow up to two previous letters I had sent to Fredricksons last year asking them for proof of assignment and proof of the debt, both of which have been ignored. I pointed out to Mr Carter that he was being a naughty boy by persuing an account that was in dispute and had been for 4 months and that I was now going to tell his mum.....tongue in check of course ;).

 

I informed Mr Carter that at no point had I received a Notice of Assignment from Orange and that Arrow had failed to send me a 'hello' letter to introduce themselves. I also pointed out that a statement from 2007 on Orange headed paper does not constitute evidence that Arrow own the alleged debt nor that this alleged debt exists. Always put alleged, because that is what it is until proven otherwise and always put at the top that you do not acknowledge this debt.

 

I also requested a copy of my mobile contract and enclosed a £1 postal and stated that the money is not to be used as payment to the alleged debt. I wrote this on the back of the postal order as well.

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@ Misspd

 

Thanks for the reply.

 

So just to get it clear...

 

I need to go to the County curt web site and say I will defend the action.

 

Then send a letter to Brian Carter stayting that I do not acknowlage this debt.

 

Ask for a copy of the moblie contract.

 

Say that I never received a Notice of Assignment from Orange.

 

And saying that I wish them to supply evidence that this debt is real.

 

Does this sound right or am I missing any thing?

 

........................

 

 

In fact on the court paper work I have there is nothing to say that the debt is for orange any way.

 

.........................

 

Thanks so much Bread.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi, well I have had a response from BC on my request for a copy of my contract. Basically they have sent the postal order back and have told me to go back to the shop where I originally got it from. Considering this is nearly 10 years ago, I cannot for the life of me remember where it was done. They also, in response once again for evidence of the NoA and proof that Arrow now own this alleged debt, told me that they confirm both have been done. Am I being thick or something because to me that is clearly not evidence, that is just them telling me that it has been done! I could turn round and tell them if that is the case then I am the Queen of Sheeba, "oh you want evidence, well you will just have to take my word for it"! I am so frustrated at their evasive techniques when all I am asking for is proof.

 

I have 28 days from the 7th February 2012 to file a defence so by my reckoning the time up is Tuesday the 6th March?

 

I need a little bit of guidance as to what to do next please.

 

stressed miss :(

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Thanks Havinastella, I have located a good one and shall be getting it sent off tomorrow. Should I send it to BC or Arrow as BC have stated that any requests for further documents should be addressed with Arrow.

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Ok, I have just read a bit on CPR requests, however, I have just read their POC again and they have not stated any agreements, contracts etc so that would indicate they have nothing?! Am I correct in thinking that? How can they pursue a claim in court if they have not stated in the POC what evidence they will be relying on? or am I grabbing the wrong end of the stick?

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moved to legal form

 

should get more attention there

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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You have given us very little to work with..

 

Can you please type in exactly what they say on their claim please.. eg .. why they are issuing the claim :)

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Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Thank you for the reply.

 

Ok the POC states:

 

The Claimant claims 216.37 being the balance of consideration outstanding to it under the account number AGGL ******** in respect of services rendered to the Defendant.

 

The Claimant also claims interest thereon pursuant to s.69 County Court Act 1984 limited to one year to the date hereof at the rate of 8% per annum amounting to 0.00.

 

The claimant is Global Arrow Guernsey Ltd and it signed (typed) by Bryan Carter.

 

thanks.

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Thank you for the reply.

 

Ok the POC states:

 

The Claimant claims 216.37 being the balance of consideration outstanding to it under the account number AGGL ******** in respect of services rendered to the Defendant.

 

The Claimant also claims interest thereon pursuant to s.69 County Court Act 1984 limited to one year to the date hereof at the rate of 8% per annum amounting to 0.00.

 

The claimant is Global Arrow Guernsey Ltd and it signed (typed) by Bryan Carter.

 

thanks.

 

I have 28 days from the 7th February 2012 to file a defencelink3.gif so by my reckoning the time up is Tuesday the 6th March?

 

Was the 7th February the Claim issue date ?

 

This is the timeline..

 

Issue date + 5 days for service + 14 days to acknowledge + 14 days to submit defence = 33 days from Issue date.

 

I am just going to have a read back over your thread to see how you have arrived at this point.. BRB

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Ok thanks.. so

 

7.02.2012 + 5 = 12.02.2012 + 14 = 26.02.2012 + 14 + 11.03.2012

 

So I make it 11th March..

 

I think you have two choices..

 

As the PoC is very brief you can ask for them to replead their case

 

 

 

The Defendant takes issue with the Claimants pleadings. The Claim is a Bulk Centre claim, however, the rules on pleading apply even to the Bulk Centre and furthermore the Bulk Centre rules and guidelines state that if you cannot properly particularise the claim in 1024 characters then you should not use the Bulk Centre to issue the claim. The Claimants pleadings amount to circa 330 characters, leaving at least 700 characters available for the Claimant to plead adequately. The Defendant is embarrassed by the Claim, which faces him.

 

or

 

 

 

 

The Defendant disputes the full amount claimed by the claimant and does not recognise the Claimant's Claim in any way for the following reasons.

 

The Claimants pleaded case is not sufficient for the purposes of CPR 16. The Claimants pleaded case is lacking the most basic facts and detail such as dates of demands made by the Claimant, date of default, date of service of notice of assignment, date of service of default notice and date of agreement, which has alleged to be breached. This information is fundamental to the Claimants case, yet no details are offered or pleaded.

The Defendant requested further details by way of CPR31.14 DATED, however the Claimant has chosen not to provide any further information.

 

The Defendant neither admits nor denies any allegation made in the claimants Particulars of Claim and put the claimant to strict proof thereof.

I would hope that others would pop in and advise also. I will flag your thread for more advice.

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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I like the sound of the second one, although, strictly I never did a CPR 31.14 format as after reading it I thought it was for PoC's that actually indicate what evidence they are relying on? Does that matter or does the fact I requested the information in a letter, on several occassions dating back to October last year and never received what I requested, amount to good enough?

 

Thank you so far CitizenB.

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Just amend CPR to "letter" that should take care of that.

 

If questioned regarding not sending by CPR.. then simply confirm that you are aware the CPR only permits you to request documents that are mentioned and as none were.. you decided just to write to him .. Ok :)

 

Certainly mention that you requested information on more than one occasion. You can add or delete from the defence as it stands....

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Ok defence submitted. Funnily enough Bryan Carter Solicitors rang earlier, I confirmed my name then refused to confirm anything else. Politely asked him to put anything in writing. Wonder what they wanted.

 

All nervous now :/

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