Help - Natwest have instructed capquest - large debt

[dx100uk]

in Scotland it's the Prescription and Limitation (Scotland) Act 1973 that statute bars action after 5 years it also extinguishes the debt which the limitation act 1980 does not.

 

A correctly worded CCA request will not reset limitation.

An averrment that an "alleged debt" would be SB'ed if it existed will not reset limitation.

 

 

ignore them

have a nice holiday

 

dx

[fuzzel]

dx - I'd really love to ignore them and I can see why I can ignore them if it is statute barred but without being sure of that because I can't recall when I last paid them, how is it that I have nothing to worry about? You say capquest can suck lemons because it wasn't mentioned on the credit expert report but I still need to know (a)why they can't pursue me just because it isn't mentioned on my credit record if natwest assign the debt to them, and (b)whether or not it might be on an equifax report but not on the credit expert report that i have?

 

To me it seems simple that if natwest assign to capquest and it's not SBed then capquest can sue me for the monies due. Is that not what the law of contract says? They get the rights that natwest otherwise had to sue me under the contract?

 

I don't mean to be cheeky dx but if there is a record somewhere (maybe equifax/vreditcall or just a note somewhere but with natwest) that 5 years ago I made a payment then by not contacting them to arrange a payment scheme they may decide it is worthwhile suing me for such a large sum, as it appears they have done to at least 2 others in this thread. So, I can't risk a writ landing through my letter box then just tell them and my missus "well they guy on the forum said it' be ok but I'm not sure why" if you know what I mean. As I mentioned earlier, I really appreciate your advice but I need to know why you're saying not to worry about it and ignore them when it might not be SBed and they may well have bought the legal rights to the contract from natwest?

 

Thanks,

 

fuzzel

[dx100uk]

if it were not sb'ed it would be on your cra file

 

go do some reading around and you'll get the idea

 

and stop worrying about nothing.

 

dx

[Jasper1965]

As things stand Capquest cannot lawfully litigate against you as they not only have failed to perfect any assignment but have positively averred that they are acting as agents for NW.

If CQ raise a claim prior to informing you of an assignment to themselves it is defeated by Cia Colombiana de Seguros v Pacific Steam Navigation Co [1965].

Natwest can litigate but well one would have to guess they have their reasons for involving CQ.

Scottish court procedure is very different to that of England and Wales to begin with the claimant would need to supply a copy of the agreement from the very beginning which is often a stumbling block and IMO Scots Law is less subject to the sytematic abuses enjoyed by certain DCA's and Sols for hire that are often mentioned on this site than the CCBC Northampton setup.

 

You are subject to Scots law in respect of both limitation and litigation. Pro rata, cases in the Scottish Courts are few and far between on this site primarily {again imo} because the sytem does not encourage the %age game the way the E & W county Court default judgment sytem does.

 

If a claim comes in it can probably be defended. Defend it properly and force them to prove it all the way if you discover it isn't SB'ed.

 

It's worth stating that a judgment cannot be obtained if creditor has failed to comply with a lawful CCA request (Harrison v Link Financial Ltd [2011] EWHC B3) so if anything I'd be looking to CCA them early in the New Year at the latest. Costs a £1, PO proof of postage is evidence it was sent, request under sec 77 if fixed loan, sec 78 if credit card. Reconstructions are acceptable but they must be 100% accurate as must any t&c's, interest rates etc.

There's nothing stopping you contacting Natwest directly by telephone and asking them when the last transactions were made on this account though NW aren't the most helpful in my experience. CQ have made it clear that Natwest still own the ac so don't stand for any rubbish off Natwest.

Yesterday a Capquest rep phoned and spoke to a vulnerable autistic girl about her mothers alleged debt to capquest, telling her that her mother was in serious trouble, deeply upsetting her. I'd think long and hard about negotiating with people who behave like that and trust me if you do set up a payment plan then it will be very shortly after your first missed payment that the Court papers arrive, all you will have done in the interim is provide them with a cash cow to milk and a paper trail to waft in front of the Sheriff proving the a/c "cant be time barred" and proving your acceptance of liability to the sum claimed.

[fuzzel]

Thanks for that Jasper, that explains it really welll. I will do as yourself and dx have suggested and just ignore their letters in the meantime, apart from sending offoff CCA request to give either peace of mind that it is statute barred or a date which I know I need to get to for it to be Sbed.

 

Should I also get a CRA report from equifax in case something shows up there? I'm simply amazed that the "credit expert" report is missing quite a few smaller debts (mostly credit cards) that I was paying up until only a year or so ago that I thought would be there for sure, not to mention some that I simply have not paid for a few years (but nothing like 5 years). According to the credit expert report I have only a defaulted student loan and 2 well-run current accs with RBS, giving a "fair" score of 891. That seems madness when I have been paying various DCAs small amounts here and there for the last few years (apart from natwest obv).

 

Should I send the CCA letter to natwest or capquest?

 

Fuzzel

[theshuffler]

If the debt just happens not to be SB but pretty close wouldnt it be an idea to challenge everything , requesting paperwork etc never actually admitting the debt and dragging it out till it is SB,d ?

[dx100uk]

If the debt just happens not to be SB but pretty close wouldnt it be an idea to challenge everything , requesting paperwork etc never actually admitting the debt and dragging it out till it is SB,d ?

 

no i'd keep your head-down

 

dx

[dx100uk]

Thanks for that Jasper, that explains it really welll. I will do as yourself and dx have suggested and just ignore their letters in the meantime, apart from sending offoff CCA request to give either peace of mind that it is statute barred or a date which I know I need to get to for it to be Sbed.

 

Should I also get a CRA report from equifax in case something shows up there? I'm simply amazed that the "credit expert" report is missing quite a few smaller debts (mostly credit cards) that I was paying up until only a year or so ago that I thought would be there for sure, not to mention some that I simply have not paid for a few years (but nothing like 5 years). According to the credit expert report I have only a defaulted student loan and 2 well-run current accs with RBS, giving a "fair" score of 891. That seems madness when I have been paying various DCAs small amounts here and there for the last few years (apart from natwest obv).

 

Should I send the CCA letter to natwest or capquest?

 

Fuzzel

 

this is my fear and why you are asking lots of questions

 

me thinks you've been well stung or

as we call it 'cash-cowed' by DCA's in the past

by BELIEVING what they have said on the phone to your.

 

now you're finding out the truth, and are a wee bit puzzled.

 

sadly , DCA's will NEVER put in writing what THREATS they make on the phone to spoof you into

paying debts that p'haps you dont need too

 

now

 

you can get that experian report to double check

 

it'll be free anyhow.

 

dx

[fuzzel]

Ok guys I am opting for keeping my head down in the meantime.

 

dx - does the credit expert report show ALL credit records that exist for me, or is it possible that there is a heap of entries at equifax that may include the natwest account details. I suppose it depends whether the credit expert report is asummary of all the CRA records or just experian?

 

You can see where I'm coming from - you're saying if it's not on the CRA report that it is prob SBed, but if the credit expert report doesn't show the FULL record of the CRA entries that are out there for me, I'd be a fool to sit here thinking it must be SBed cos the credit expert report doesn't show natwest on it. (Though as Jasper has said I can still relax until such time as the debt is assigned properly).

 

fuzzel

[dx100uk]

you are really really worrying about nothing.

 

there is not 'one' cra that lists ALL

 

nor are some OC's only signed up to one cra.

 

just get the report that'll be two, then p'haps you'll feel a wee bit less stressed

 

there are literally 1000's of people on here that face the same as you, i think only 2 have ever seen court papers & both of those are SB'ed defenced anyhow.

 

dx

[fuzzel]

with the greatest respect dx, you say I have asked a lot of questions but if you read back I have actually asked you the same questions quite a few times that you haven't really answered, namely:-

 

(1) WHY it is that I can ignore the DCA in these circumstances - you just kept saying I should ignore them and keep my head down but not explaining the legal basis for not worrying about capquest suing me. - Jasper has explained that they haven't assigned the debt yet or at lest not properly which means they can't sue me yet as they don;t have the rights to yet, so I now understand where you were coming from there.

 

(2) Whether the credit expert report (which must come from experian as they own and run credit expert as far as I know) actually shows the true position and all CRA records for me, or whether I need records from all the CRAs. You were telling me that if it's not on the CRA report then it's probably SBed, but that can only be true if the "credit expert" report I now have constitutes a full report. That's why I have been asking whtehr it does or not, so I know whther to rely on it or not or write to the other CRAs to check their records also. You say to get an experian report aswell but is that not what i have really via credit expert?

 

You are probably right that it seems I may have been stung in the past and agreed to paying DCAs that have not had the debt assigned to them but I am trying my best to get clued up by asking what i thought were the right questions. It does seem to me that if capquest have the debt assigned to them and it's not SBed than I will have something to worry about and no one has said anything to the contrary so far, provided they go through the correct procedures. that's why I was asking so often about the report being the whole story.

 

Of course I really appreciate your advice but it makes it much easier to follow it if you explain your reasoning like jasper did.

[fuzzel]

I think i've done it again and typed up a post while you were posting yours

 

That's the info I was after, thanks. I will now go and get the equifax report to confirm.

 

The low court rate is reassuring too

[Dot1]

Fuzzel,

 

Since you have checked your CRA and the debt is not showing, the only way of being sure if it is SB is to SAR Natwest.

Since you are also worried about CQ taking legal action, may be sending them a SAR also may help as it will buy time and while your request is not complied with, they may not take any action.

Well that is what I think BUT I AM SURE SOMEONE WITH MORE KNOWLEDGE WILL ADVICE YOU BETTER ON THAT.

WHEN and IF they respond to your SAR, it is almost certain that they will not provide you with all the information you have requested which means you have to write back and ask for what is missing.

There is a high chance that them may never provide the missing on at all considering the age of the account.

Basically it will help in buying time in getting closer to the SB if it is not yet.

 

In reference to post 20, yes Capquest do take legal action, I have been down that road too with them on another debt.

I think you loose nothing by sending a SAR or any other request suggested in the thread because from what I have learn, it does not restart the clock.

 

In my case, I was sure of when the last payment was and I sent a SB letter then checked my CRA, there was no recording of the debt.

Today CQ confirmed that the account is closed and they will not pursue the debt any more. The balance is Zero.

 

You have a few options but one thing for sure is you have to make a decision as to which way you what to go.

With all the help available here, I am sure you will make the right decision.

Good luck.

[citizenB]

As dx has explained.. not all the creditors/dcas report to ALL of the CRAs.. so to obtain a full check, you really need to contact the 3 main players.

Company Secretary

Equifax Limited

Capital House

25 Chapel Street

London

NW1 5DS

Company Secretary

CallCredit Limited

1, Park Lane,

LEEDS

West Yorkshire

LS3 1EP

Company Secretary

Experian Limited

Talbot House

Talbot Street

Nottingham

NG80 1TH

You can either complete the forms online or send a letter (below) with a £2.00 postal order.

Address

Company Secretary

CallCredit Limited

1, Park Lane,

LEEDS

West Yorkshire

LS3 1EP

 

Dear Sir or Madam,

 

Limited Data Subject Access Request

s9(2) The Data Protection Act 1998

 

I hereby request a copy of my Statutory Credit Report, served under s9(2) of The Data Protection Act 1998.

 

I enclose the Statutory Fee of £2 paid via Postal Order, number: 123456.

For the purposes of confirming my identity, I can confirm the following details:

 

My full name:

 

My Maiden Name:

 

My Date of Birth:

 

My current Address:

 

I have lived at the above address for XX years.

 

 

I note that under s7(3) of the above Act, a data controller is not obliged to comply with a request under this section unless he is supplied with such information as he may reasonably require in order to satisfy himself as to the identity of the person making the request and to locate the information which that person seeks.

However, I feel the above information identifies me sufficiently to discharge your obligations to establish my identity before posting my Credit Report.

 

I am aware that you have 7 Working Days to post the Credit Report to me, commencing the day after this s9(2) Statutory Request has been delivered to your Company.

 

This letter must not be regarded as granting your Company any Data Consent.

 

Yours faithfully,

citizenBcitizenBcitizenBcitizenB

citizenBcitizenBcitizenBcitizenB

citizenBcitizenBcitizenBcitizenB

citizenBcitizenBcitizenBcitizenB

Enclosures:

1 x Statutory £2.00 Fee via Postal Order Number: 123456

Notes: this letter is being sent via Royal Mail Special Delivery service

 

 

 

 

[fuzzel]

Hi all,

 

thanks a lot for all that info jasper it was a real help. I tried to PM you but it said your inbox was full.

 

I had prepared a SAR letter to Nawtest but Sod's law, as I'm copy and pasting the SAR letter the letters come through from capquest saying they have bought the debt from Natwest.

Should it now be CapQuest that I send the SAR letter to? I have already sent the CRA letters to capquest and callcredit to get a full picture of the position.

 

Although my flat is in my wife and mother's name, I have been sending money to my wife's acc each month from my bank acc to help pay the mortgage. Does that affect your view that the flat is still safe?

 

Am I right in thinking that if I SAR capquest it will stop them raising proceedings in the meantime?

 

Kind regards,

 

Fuzzel

[fuzzel]

Sorry, I meant to ask, is it okay to sign the SAR letter too?

[dx100uk]

cra to callcredit?

 

they wont have any agreement with you you want to see your credit file on more than one cra experian and one other wil be ok

 

as for the sar that always goes to the oc original creditor.

it will matter not if you sign it

though it might help

no need to really do anything else

 

its dead you are just add belt and braces

 

dx

[dx100uk]

oh and CQ cant buy a debt that no agreement exists on its dead..buried...parrott...etc etc

 

time to forget about the debt it does not legally exist...........

 

dx

[fuzzel]

Thanks dx,

 

I am confusing myself! What I meant to say was that I have sent CRA letters to EQUIFAX (not capquest) and callcredit. I will now send the SAR letter to Natwest as planned though.

 

Is it worth sending a CCA letter to capquest now that they are saying they have bought the debt, or would that also be the OC? Jasper was telling me that they need the original contract or reconstituted contract in order to raise proceedings and from some of the posts I have read, the letter saying they have bought the debt is normally a pre-cursor to raising proceedings. I also read that the SAR letter can stop them raising proceedings but if I am sending that to the OC Natwest, does that still stop Capquest raising proceedings? I am keen to send capquest anything I can to postpone that until I can confirm the SB position, without of course making contact with them unneccessarily.

 

Thanks

 

Fuzzel

[fuzzel]

I appreciate what you're saying dx but there is a chance that they have a contract for this debt and that it's not SBed, so if that is the case and they raise proceedings they will be legally entitled to recover from me for it, subject of course to any technical issues with their claim. If that happens the parrot will be pecking away at my eyeballs no?

[Frog Escalator]

Hello Fuzzel,

 

Well done on trying to cover all angles and get yourself properly informed. I wonder whether it's actually helping you however to be told that you're worrying about nothing, and that you should ignore ignore before you yourself have fully appraised yourself of the reasons why you might be able to ignore them and not worry ... I saw your expression of this several times in your thread and I felt your frustration.

 

One thing that I can't see mentioned in the thread is: what type of debt is (sorry, WAS) this? Credit card/Overdraft/Loan?

 

I'm not in a position to advise, given that I've only recently started tackling my own situation. I would have thought that if it's a credit card or loan, there's no harm in sending CapQuest a correctly worded CCA request. HOWEVER, as you're either past or very close to the statute barred date, this is something you would not want to jeopardise, so I would wait for some more informed advice from others more knowledgeable than myself.

 

One thing though that I think you should put well and truly to bed at this stage are any notions of offers of payment!!!

 

Very best wishes -- I'm sure you'll get through this as you're going the right way around finding out the fine detail of your situation and your available options.

 

F.E.

[fuzzel]

HI, F.E.

 

thanks for the input, I hope you're getting as much help with your issue as I have had from the guys here!

 

The debt was loan for a large sum (10k+) along with a small overdraft (£400) that they are also chasing for. I suppose I know that for smaller debts it is not financially viable for DCAs to take you to court but in this case where the sum is worth while chasing I am more concerned and hence why I'm keen to confirm the legal position. Hopefully getting reports from the other CRAs will confirm the SB issue and, failing that, I can send a CCA letter to confirm what paperwork they have and, as Jasper suggested, put it up on the site for those in the know to pick holes in.

 

From the CCA standpoint it would make sense to me to send this to Capquest since if they have bought the debt as they say, surely Natwest have passed them all the relevant documentation and it is they who i want to prevent from raising proceedings? I'd be grateful to receive some thoughts on that and whether or not I should send it to capquest ASAP since, if I understand the forums correctly, as things stand, Capquest can raise proceedings whenever they feel like it but a CCA letter would put that on hold until they comply with it (without risking a SB reset of the clock)??

 

Fuzzel

[dx100uk]

if i did not know any better i'd say somethingy fishy or froggy is going on here.

 

time will tell

 

dx

[fuzzel]

dx can I ask exactly what you're getting at in your last post and why you haven't made any attempt to answer my query about sending the CCA letter? If you need me to send you scans of the letters I am receiving I would be happy to do so.

 

I'm not sure what beef you have with Frog Elevator but my problem is very real and I am worried that any day Capquest will raise proceedings so I need to know whether you guys recommend sending the CCA letter to them to stop them raising in the meantime, until I have all the CRA records to hand and can confirm the SB position, as per my post.

 

Your tag states that you are in "a sort of fire fighting role on here" but in many of your posts all you have said to me is the equivalent of "your house isn't really on fire, don't worry about it" without any explanation, when all I can see is smoke billowing out the top of it. If that is what FE was getting at then he has a point, though as I have said if you have beef with him it is nothing to do with me and I am grateful for what help you have given me.

 

I hear that you do sterling work on the forums and again, some of your posts have been very helpful to me and for that I am grateful, but please do not suggest my thread is anything less then genuine by suggesting something"fishy" or "froggy" is going on just when I feel the **** is about to hit the fan and need some urgent advice re the CCA letter. I have one ready to go, I just need to know if I should be sending it.

 

Any advice you guys can give me today would be very much appreciated. I am tending towards sending capquest the CCA letter but don't want to make any big mistakes by doing so.

 

Fuzzel

[citizenB]

Apart from checking your CRA files to see if the debt is still "live", I think you also need to establish the status of the assignment.

 

You can do that by sending the following letter, suitably amended where "DCA / BANK" names are required.

 

[ATTACH]32306[/ATTACH]

 

Did you send this letter off as I advised a while back ? If you did, have you had a response to it ?

 

You can send a CCA request to CapQuest - It is highly unlikely they will have a copy and they will almost certainly advise they are referring it back to their "client".

 

Sadly, if you read round the forums, the lack of a CCA will not always prevent the determined DCA from starting litigation.. however, whilst they can do that until they provide some evidence of the existence of the agreement then they will be unable to obtain judgment.