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    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 162 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Abbey's lack of reply


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Hello fellow Abbey's extortion victims !

I sent Abbey the "Letter before Action" on 22nd March by recorded delivery - sent it to Prescott St in London - but have not had a reply yet and it is only a couples of day away from the deadline, now.

Has anybody else experiended this silence from them ?

Should I try and get this Mr Turbitt involved by sending that letter to his attention in Bradford or just steam ahead with the court action ?

 

I have also just today recived the end of March statement where they have raised another £ 145 on top of the £551 they had collected till now. They are just raising charges and pushing acounts further in the red so they can keep on topping up their pockets with the charges. It is so unfair !

When is the OFT going to stop them ?

 

regards

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If you can prove it was delivered then it is down to them what they do.

If you give them a deadline and they chose to ignore it/shred the letter/send it on to the wrong department that is their problem.

Abbey (Charges on 3 accounts and default on my credit record) - DPA letter sent 30/03/06 - 40 days limit is 9th May - Recieved DPA printouts 05/04/06 with microfiche "fob off" letter. <p>Barclaycard (Charges on 1 account and default on my credit record) - DPA letter sent 03/04/06 - 40 days limit is 13th May - Recieved some statements 08/04/06 along with DPA printout and a microfiche "fob off" letter. Claim for £340 sent 11/04/06

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If you can prove it was delivered then it is down to them what they do.

 

Not true. If you can show that you wrote the letter, complete with address, it will be pretty much assumed that you posted it, and therefore that it was sent, and received within 2 days.

In other words, as long as you have a copy of the letter you wrote, you're covered.

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Bookworm. Quite right.

 

In the Civil Procedures handbook 2005 - it clearly states that if you sent it in a letter with a stamp on it (or faxed or emailed) then this is seem in the civil courts as 'delivered'.

 

Why should the individual be 'penalised' for the inefficiencies of the PO or the bank - although, it seems that the post office has a serious dislike of delivering letters to banks lately.

 

...or something like that anyway.

 

(bear in mind, I have had one thing go missing in about 5 years of selling on ebay (given that up, but that's a different story) and sending letters to my friends in Oz and official bodies in France. Yet, I have sent 3 letters to 3 banks, and oddly all three went missing. Coincidence? Ha. Pathetic really, yet these people actually probably do sleep at night).

 

So, in essence - stick to YOUR guidlines and timescales. Do the banks send threatening letters by recorded delivery - not in my experience. Are THEY scared of the court not beliving them? No.

 

When the 14 days are up - you know what to do.

 

Don't be scared. The courts were set up to protect US from this type of behavior, just because it's been abused by the banks doesn't mean it's not true.

 

(and fogrive me if that sounds patronising, it is not meant to be)

 

Abbey WILL give in - if they don't then they face more of the same publicity that started this whole thing in the first place!

 

Remember - YOU are right, YOU have acted within the law. Have they?

If you feel that we have helped you, or you would like to help keep this web site running so that others can continue to get their money back, please click the donate button at the top of the forum.

Advice & opinions of Dave, The Bank Action Group and The Consumer Action Group are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability.

Use your own judgment. Seek advice of a qualified insured professional if you have any doubts.

 

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Add me as your friend on FaceBook - I need all the friends I can get :-(

 

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Fair enough but why then recommend recorded delivery?

 

I work in the mail order field and we send 99% of our stuff by recorded delivery/special delivery. If you don't and they deny getting it what can you do?

Abbey (Charges on 3 accounts and default on my credit record) - DPA letter sent 30/03/06 - 40 days limit is 9th May - Recieved DPA printouts 05/04/06 with microfiche "fob off" letter. <p>Barclaycard (Charges on 1 account and default on my credit record) - DPA letter sent 03/04/06 - 40 days limit is 13th May - Recieved some statements 08/04/06 along with DPA printout and a microfiche "fob off" letter. Claim for £340 sent 11/04/06

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I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that Abbey are in a mess. They are getting slower and slower at dealing with DPA requests, and they seem to be responding to letters well after the deadlines.

 

Whilst legally it does not appear to be necessary, I am sending out all letters by recorded delivery - simply for my own peace of mine. By doing this, I know they have got the letter...even if it may be under a large pile of others!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Sending recorded delivery is a much better idea.

 

Whilst not a legal requirement, it shows the banks that you don't trust them and you can prove beyond any doubt that you sent the letter.

 

I haven't sent any of my letters recorded, however, I will be doing so in future (pretty much to any business).

 

Banks are 'losing' these letters at a rate far, far above the national average for lost post and the rate that they are being 'lost' has been steadily increasing over the past few months.

 

Sending recorded is the best bet.

If you feel that we have helped you, or you would like to help keep this web site running so that others can continue to get their money back, please click the donate button at the top of the forum.

Advice & opinions of Dave, The Bank Action Group and The Consumer Action Group are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability.

Use your own judgment. Seek advice of a qualified insured professional if you have any doubts.

 

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Add me as your friend on FaceBook - I need all the friends I can get :-(

 

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=577405151

 

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Sending letters via the post office and asking them for a "Proof of posting" would probably be sufficient since the banks reckon they loose stuff anyway. As long as you have proof of posting each and every letter then this would seem to fit with what others here are saying? The service of "Proof of posting" is free, unlike the recorded delivery.

 

BTW - has anyone seen the poll on NTL homepage?

 

Have your say

Would you try and claim back unfair bank and credit card fees if it was possible?Yes No

Ginger Rogers could do all Fred Astaire did but SHE could do it backwards AND on heels!

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If you send recorded delivery, you get a barcode reference (or something like that) The letter is deemed delivered the next day (if you post before 15:30)

 

You then log on to the post office site the next morning (give the postman time to actually deliver the thing...) and by 12:00 you can use 'track and trace' to get confirmation that it was delivered, and which office delivered it.

 

My letters to the bank have gone via this method, first class, and I think it costs 92 pence, a cost I hope to get back if it goes to court...

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that Abbey are in a mess. They are getting slower and slower at dealing with DPA requests, and they seem to be responding to letters well after the deadlines.

I spoke to someone in the call centre on the phone last night about why my statements had not yet been sent.

 

He said that as it was the end of the financial year they were getting a lot of requests for statements. Ha! End of financial year? More like all their customers are realising the ride Abbey have been taking them for and are fighting back.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I have not had a reply yet to my letter requesting that Abbey refund me their charges (didn' t send a DPA because I have all the Abeys statements).

Am I doing something wrong ?

I wrote to their dept. C, PO Box 382 , Precot Street, London E1 8RP by recorded delivery, attn MS C. Robertson.

With so many offices thy have I would like to be sure I am sending the correspondence to the right office .... particularly if I then proceed with taking court action. SHould I write again ?

 

In case I decide to proceed legally then which court do I select ? The one nearest to Abbey's or nearest to me ? Suppose I get it wrong I'd be wasting £ 80.00 I can hardly afford to waste.

 

regards and happy Easter festivities...

 

Nino

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The Preliminary approach letter for refund (which is what I sent Abbey recorded delivery on 22nd March) and the Letter Before Ation to which almost everyone refers to as the second step to take by the claimant, look very much similar to me !

 

Both letter give a threat of legal action if they not comply within 14 days.

 

Am I overlooking something here ?....

 

NINO

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You're not missing anything at all. The first letter is simply a polite request for a refund, and putting the bank on notice that you are setting a timetable for action. The second letter is a more forceful demand, effectively telling the bank that they owe you money, and that they have (7)(14) days to comply before you raise the claim in court...

 

When their time runs out then you tell them the good news...good luck.

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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This is in essence what they have stated in their letter (incidentally I had sent them a final notice letter by recorded delivery today unaware that their reply had been delivered by the wonderful Royal Mail while I was at work today. Wonderful wonderful service that of the Royal Mail don't you think so?) .

Here it is:

 

"We don't accept that Abbey's charges are unfair."

They then go on to say they apply charges in line with other banks and that they made them known to me and I accepted them when I opened the account.

 

"In any event we do not agree that the charges are disproportionate. THey are reasonable...." (sic!)

 

"Like most banks we operate an "AUTOMATED" system." (This seems in contraddiction with what another member reported in the forum that Abbey had declared.)

 

THey then admit mistakes can happen and they are happy to review accounts when asked to and that they will reverse - as a good will gesture but not as a recognition of an eror from their part - £ 90 out of the nearly £600 they have charged me for what I know, so far.

 

But right in the middle of their letter, there was this paragraph:

 

"If the complaint escalates into a claim in the County Court. we will review each case individually and if we feel that our relationship with our customer has broken down completely, we may decide to give notice to close the account under the terms and conditions".

There!

 

I have an account with 1st Direct and could switch almost immediately but it doesn t give me the same size of overdraft nor I see from this Forum that they behave any better than Abbey.

What hurts is that I have funds invested with 3 of their savings accounts although the cheque book a/c is admittedly the only one that is always in red .

They get rid of me they get rid of a net worth customer but I doubt if they d even care looking at my full financial status.

 

So , I think County Court it will have to be!

 

But why do they seem to ignore the OFT decision of a couple of weeks ago ?

Is it because they know the OFT can bark but not bite ?

 

Nino

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It's a good job you sent your second letter when you did - that sounds like a standard (ish) response, designed to scare you off.

If the complaint escalates into a claim in the County Court. we will review each case individually

And what a load of cobbl*rs that sentence is - if they DO review your case individually, they will see that you have 4 (?) accounts with them, and then the bit about closing the account will throw egg on their faces: do they close and lose 4 accounts, or do they capitulate and look stupid for making empty threats - either way, you win, they lose.

 

Not only do they lose, but they also don't learn.

 

Good luck.

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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This sounds just like the letter we received. We wrote the letter before action and included this in it

 

You have stated that you may decide to give notice of the closure of our account if it escalates into a claim in the County Court. This, you can do; given the correct amount of notice required by your Terms and Conditions and the Banking Code.

 

However, we feel we must warn you that to do so, in our opinion would constitute a breach of the aforementioned banking code and indeed the Unfair Terms in Contracts Act (1977) and the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Act (1999). If you take this action, we will have no choice but to take this up with the Ombudsman and indeed the Office of Fair Trading.

 

To close an account because a customer complains and stands up for their legal rights has already been addressed by the Ombudsman and as one would expect, the outcome was favourable for the originator of the complaint and the complaint was upheld. The Ombudsman agreed that to close the account was against “natural justice” and awarded compensation to the purveyor of the original complaint.

 

When they replied (saying they won't write anymore and will merely file letters away!) they chose to ignore that bit. The wording was from a posting of Dave's and if you look at the top of each forum there is also an announcement from Bankfodder headed

******** ::::::::::------Account closures are unfair. Write to the OFT ------::::::::********

 

Our thread is here if you are interested

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=1889

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  • 3 weeks later...

MODERATED threads joined .please keep to your original thread when updating this is for your benefit and the benefit of everyone who is following your claim

When you want to fool the world, tell the truth. :D

Advice & opinions of Janet-M are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Use your own judgment. Seek advice of a qualified insured professional if you have any

doubts.

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  • 12 years later...

This topic was closed on 03/07/19.

If you have a problem which is similar to the issues raised in this topic, then please start a new thread and you will get help and support there.

If you would like to post up some information which is relevant to this particular topic then please flag the issue up to the site team and the thread will be reopened.

- Consumer Action Group

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