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Charging order - Now trying for orders of sale - old CARCRAFT DEBT - HELP

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Hi folks

 

I bought a car from Carcraft in 2006 and the finance was done via Blackhorse and Open & Direct (Now known as Creation).

Was done through 2 companies as my car I was putting in for part ex had no equity and my credit rating was not great.

 

I started having problems with it and couldn't afford a big repair bill and thought best option might be to get a new car

and maybe pay a bit more each month but know the car was a bit more reliable.

So I contacted carcraft to see if they could could organise settling the finance and getting me in a new car.

 

When I called they asked if I had the settlement figures and I said no but seeing as they had sorted out the original deal last year

asked if they could find out if I gave them the reg number and was told yes.

 

finally managed to sort a new car and when it came to signing the paperwork they showed me the amount I was borrowing,

part ex value for mine and settlement figure and everything looked fine so I signed on the dotted line.

 

A couple of days later I received a latter from Creation saying they have not received my monthly payment and now I'm not sure if carcraft have settled both or just blackhorse.

Thinking about the figures in the cold light of day and not just thinking about a shiny new car I'm struggling to get the figures to add up and think they haven't settled with open & Direct/creation.

 

If they have only settled with blackhorse what can I do ?

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Has anybody any ideas with this as it is looking more and more likely that Carcraft have only settled half of the finance.

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Well as suspected Carcraft have only paid off Blackhorse. Have contacted them and they advised that only blackhorse showed up on the HPI check and the other is a personal loan so I have to sort that or provide settlement figures. TOld them that when I first got in touch I told them the finance was with both companies and that they had arranged the original agreement. Their attitude now is tough, the original deal was to settle blackhorse although my understanding was they were settling both. Not sure where to go from here, any ideas anybody ?

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Hmmm not exactly sur eon the legal stuff but regardless of that you have grounds to complain. Do so in writing, keep copy & send rec. delivery. Depending on the outcome you could then take it to the Financial Ombudsmans Service ( FOS ) but would need to have gone through Carcrafts complaints service first. Hopefully someone else will be able to give more specific advice in terms of the other loan... good luck! :)

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I have received a stat demand 3 days ago and have spoke to the DCA and their legal arm and made an offer but have not received any answers back. One chap emailed me his contact details and has asked me to email my dispute, however I have gone over this so many times on the phone there is no way they don't know what it is. I made an offer to pay £50 each month but he has jst said he needs instruction from his client, I have contacted his client who just refers me back so I'm going around in circles.

 

I was going to follow Tomterm8's advice and use the letter requesting all the info on the account. As they have emailed me rather than posting with all the strikes happening can I just reply to his email and would this be sufficient if it did go to court ?

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No post it as you will have evidence it got there. Just bacause the email did not bounce back to u the DCA could delete it and then they could easly say they never recieved it. You will aslo need to send a £10 PO with the SAR


OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

Essex girl in pc world looking 4 curtains 4 her pc,the assistant says u dont need curtains 4 a computer!!Essex girl says,''HELLOOO!! i,ve got WINDOWS!!'.

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What kind of debt is this for and how much? Who is the lender/DCA ( not Connaught by any chance? )? If there is a genuine dispute on the debt you have grounds to get the SD set aside.

 

And issuing a SD doesn't necessarily mean a bankruptcy petition will follow

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I bought a car via carcraft and it was a finianced by black horse and open & direct.

 

A year later I did a part ex again with carcraft as I had no problems with them.

 

They settled the finance with black horse but open and direct.

I found out and told open what had happened.

 

Their attitude I owe them the money (Fair point) my attitude carcraft should have settled it and carcrafts attitude tough sh*t.

 

I have kept in touch with open and told them what was happening and was told it had been put on hold.

I then get a letter from redcastle saying debt has passed to them so I fill them in and they tell me its put on hold.

I then get another letter speak to them and get told they have crossed and it is definately on hold.

 

Then Monday I get a guy on the door with an insolvency stat demand in the name of All in one finance and legal and receivables.

The figure and agreement number don't match the ones I have so I call to find out who it is and thats when I find out its fro the open & direct loan.

 

Spoke to Legal (Largo as they are known) and say to prevent it going further I will pay a monthly figure of £50 to stop any action

because I hope to claim it back at a later date but at least their client will be getting something as a gesture of goodwill on my part.

If carcraft don't cough up they are getting paid.

 

He just kept telling me he would hav to refer to his client so I asked for redcastles contact details and called them.

Explained situation and made same offer, suffice to say still nothing agreed as yet.

 

Largo had emailed me his contact details and wanted details of my dispute but kept saying his clients would distance themselves from teh carcraft arguement

as that wasn't anything to do with them (again fair point) he also said his clients wanted full amount of £3k.

 

Spoke to Largo and redcastle on tuesday and wednesday and made same offer and asked for confirmation they accept and will halt proceedings.

 

Because I hadn't heard I thought emailing the letter with a read reciept atached would make them see I know something about the procedures

they have to follow and would twist their arm abit.

 

carcraft will not pay and have just said take them to court whihc I can't afford to do so I think I will have to pay but I want to reduce the monthly payments

because I thought this would be paid when I took the new car on.

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If u want to take carcraft to court then u will get ur costs back so there is no need to worry about costs.


OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

Essex girl in pc world looking 4 curtains 4 her pc,the assistant says u dont need curtains 4 a computer!!Essex girl says,''HELLOOO!! i,ve got WINDOWS!!'.

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You can fill out form EX160 to ask for exemption from court costs - it usually helps if you are on a means tested benefit or get working tax credits but you can plead hardship without this.

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For anyone wanting confirmation of receipt of e-mails,AND approx how long they are opened for,and and any other action taken with them eg forwarding,then the link below are presently offering a 2 week FOC trial to anyone who wants it.

Due to the postal dispute I needed to give a DCA a good going over for failure to reply to recorded delivery letters,as they said they did not receive them,even though I had a time of delivery and signature.I used this and is is excellent,the DCA received it in 2 mins and it was opened for 9 mins.And confirmation and details are sent to you immediately by e-mail.

[email=http://www.readnotify.com]http://www.readnotify.com[/email]

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you would be advised to send it special delivery (next day guaranteed)

 

If you believe the debt is not due, i would suggest applying for the stat demand to be set aside. Don't trust the b**ggers. call the court to check if any bankruptcy petition has been issued.

 

Also, call national debt line.


i will be off site for the next month or so. if you have any problems, feel free to report the post so a moderator can help you.

 

I am not a qualified or practicing lawyer.

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Right brief update. I emailed my letter (Sorry sent it before I had responses about posting). I had detailed a couple of my disputes but have kept a couple back in case I need to use them later i.e amounts on previous letters and stat demand different, also agreements numbers differ.

 

So detailed a couple of disputes and pointed out I had made an offer to them and their client to pay by regular monthly payments then used tomterms template and at the end pointed out that as I was replying to an email they sent there wouldbe no reason why it wouldn't arrive and asked for them to reply back confirming receipt. Suffice to say no receipt arrived so called them up and they confirmed they had received and agreed to send an email confirming, which they did a couple of hours later (Had decided I would re-send it each hour until they did reply with confirmation). They have still not replied to say if they will accept my offer or not.

 

Called the court to check dates but they couldn't advise me and the person I need to speak only works certain hours so have to call back. Then need to work out whether to set aside or defend. Think I will have to pay these as liability is in my name and will then need to chase carcraft to get the cash back.

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Have spoken to court and been told that I would need to set aside and in this type of case you don't fine a defense as such. Advised me to speak to CAB (Who are a nightmare to get hold of in this area). Told me I have 18 days to request set aside and is sending me a form out. Also told me that the DCA would have to file a bankrupcty petition before they could take any further action.

 

Think I'm being a bit dense but can anybody tell me what I should be doing. Have sent email to DCA last week givinig 14 days to respond but that takes me past the 18 days deadline on the stat demand. Waiting for the form from the court but with strikes not sure when that will arrive.

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you need to do it on this http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/c.../n244_0400.pdf form.

 

On a technical legal point, you should do it with an affidavit http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/c.../n285_0499.pdf which you can swear in a court for free (or, via your local soliciter, for a small fee). the affidavit must state when you recieved it; the date you apply for the set aside MUST be less than 18 days after you recieved it.

 

I can't write the application for you, but am willing to have a look at anything you produce.

 

I would suggest that the grounds for set aside should be that you do not owe the money for the reasons stated in post #1, and that you believe the agreement many not be properly executed. State that the creditor has failed to provide a properly executed agreement despite your request.

 

there is no fee for an application to set aside a statutory demand.


i will be off site for the next month or so. if you have any problems, feel free to report the post so a moderator can help you.

 

I am not a qualified or practicing lawyer.

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No post it as you will have evidence it got there. Just bacause the email did not bounce back to u the DCA could delete it and then they could easly say they never recieved it.

 

Depends how you send it on email. Basically you can set it to send you a "read receipt" irrespective of whether the person who views it selects "no"

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I received forms from the court yesterday which I need to complete to have the stad demand set aside. The demand was received on 08/10/07 so I need to get my application in by 25/10/07.

 

Below is the email I sent to the DCA (Legal and Receivables T/A as Largo) last week.

 

Dear Mr Gibson

 

As you are aware I have made repeated telephone calls to yourself and Brian XXXX at Redcastle / Gothia with a view to resolving this matter, however you and you clients seem unwilling to enter into any serious dialogue.

 

 

 

I have advised Open & Direct / Creation, Redcastle / Gothia that I do not believe I owe this money as Carcraft should have settled this finance as part of an agreement with them when I purchased a new vehicle. I have been advised on numerous occasions that this had been put on hold due to my dispute and no further action would be taken without contacting me first. Some of people who assured me of this are Connor XXXX, Dave XXXX on 23/06/07 and Neil (Wouldn’t divulge surname) at 18:11 on 11/07/07 . Even though I had been advised no further action would be taken these promises have not been kept.

 

 

 

Even considering I do not believe I owe this money I have made an offer (on several occasions this week) again to yourself and Brian XXXX to make regular monthly payments of £50.00. This offer has been made as a gesture of good will on my part. If Carcraft do pay in full I will be requesting a refund of theses payments, should Carcraft fail to settle the account the monthly payments will continue until the account is paid in full. I have advised you and Brian XXXX on numerous occasions I would make a card payment on 27/10/07 and would then set up a standing order / direct debit for the 27th of each month. I think I have been more than fair in making this offer considering my belief that I do not owe any money.

 

 

 

As I first made this offer 4 days ago via the telephone and have repeated this offer each day since and as yet have still not received a response (either positive or negative) I can only assume you are trying to delay matters in order for the deadlines to set aside / file a defence to pass so judgement will go in your favour.

 

 

 

Should you wish to accept my offer I require confirmation that all proceedings will be halted and no further action will be taken while ever regular monthly payments are made.

 

 

 

Whilst I await your answer in response to my offer and to enable me to file a defence and counter claim, I require specific information regarding the account to be provided forthwith. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below. The information must be furnished by 26th October 2007 , which gives you 14 days to provide what has been requested. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this email will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.

 

1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened.

 

 

2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:

 

 

a. A transcript of all transactions, including charges, fees, interest, repayments and payments and both the original amount of the loan and any repayments made to it the account.

 

 

b. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company, or by any previous creditor

 

 

c. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account.

 

 

d. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

 

 

e. Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).

 

 

f. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

 

 

g. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

 

 

h. A genuine copy of any deed of assignment, or proof that you have a legal right to this money.

 

 

i. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

 

 

j. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

 

3. Any other documents you seek to rely on in court.

 

 

4. A copy of your complaints procedure, as required by the Consumer Credit Act 2006.

 

 

5. Clarification of the date you acquired the debt, what organisation you acquired it from, their registered office, their company number (if any) and what legal title they had to this debt, and what credit license number they had at the time that the debt was purchased or entered into.

 

I will require this information within the next 14 days. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, it will be reported to the Court that you are trying to frustrate proceedings and denying me the opportunity to file a defence on this serious matter.

 

 

 

As I am replying to the email you originally sent me I can see no reason why this would not arrive and would be grateful if you could reply to this email to confirm receipt.

 

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

XXXXXXXXXX

 

 

 

cc. Bryan Snowdon (Gothia / Redcastle)

 

 

I'm going to send an email to them today to point out that 7 days have passed and I have still not receved the information I requested and as such will give me grounds for a set aside on its own (I'm still not going to mention at this stage the agreement number on the demand is wrong). I also intend to point out when I set aside that I don't know who All in One Finance are as I have never had any info from or about them, I know Open & Direct are now called Creation and Redcastle are also called Gothia but no idea about All in One.

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Would it be better for me to try and have it set aside because of the whole I don't owe carcraft do or would it be better to dispute because of the incorrect agreement number, the fact I have never heard of All for One Finance and the amount is incorrect if it does match the redcastle / gothia figures from previous letters.

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I intend to use the following to try and get the stat demand set aside, has any body got any suggestions to change it in anyway. I never gave them a £1 for the info, however If they had asked I could have given a card payment. I wasn under the impression because of receiving what I first thought were court papers (before reading this site) that I would have been entitled to any information they planned to use in court i.e agreements, statements, letters, transcripts etc.

 

Apply for the statutory demand to be set aside as the creditor is aware the debt is in dispute, the creditor has failed to comply with its obligations under the Consumer Credit Act, and I believe that the creditor issued this statutory demand as an abuse of process intended to pressure me into paying the full amount of an alleged debt when such pressure is contrary to the OFT Debt Collection Guidelines.

 

I have also received no previous correspondence from All in One Finance or Legal & Receivables Limited t/a Largo prior to receiving the Statutory Demand. The agreement number as detailed (on the Statutory Demand) does not match any agreement I am aware of as asuch I have made a request for a copy of the alleged agreement.

 

The creditor has defaulted under section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 for failing to provide a copy of the alleged agreement on request within the prescribed period. The prescribed period as stated in SI 1983/1569 Consumer Credit (Prescribed Periods for Giving Information) Regulations 1983 is 12 working days. Under the provisions of s78 (6), the creditor is not entitled to enforce the alleged agreement while this default continues.

 

My request under s78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 was emailed to (Acutal email address used BGibson@largogroup.co.uk and bryan.snowdon@gothia.co.uk was copied in) for a copy of the alleged agreement on 12/10/2007 This request was received and an email acknowledgement of receipt was received by myself on the 12/10/ 2007. At this present date 24/10/07, Legal & Receivables Limited t/a Largohave failed to comply with the request made. (Attached is a screen print copy of the correspondence and acknowledgement)

 

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Got stuck on traffic on way to court and by the time I had got there the department had closed. managed to speak to someone who has advised I can go to local court to swear avidavit and they can fax the forms to the county court so long as I forward the original stat demand.

 

Got home and had received info from Largo so part of my application to set aside is now defunct. They have supplied the agreement, a statement of payments / charges, some telephone notes (although I know I have made calls than the ones they have sent)

 

Couple of issues and would appreciate any advice.

 

The stat demand says default was issued december (the default I have is dated July this year)

 

Stat demand says agreement terminated in January yet statement of payments shows payments were still made until March this year.

 

Agreement number on stat demand is wrong and is not the one on the agreement they have sent me.

 

There have been some charges applied but not masses but still intend to leave that part in my request to set aside.

 

The letter that came with the info also states they are refusing my offer of £50 per month. Total debt is for £3k and original payments were for £62.37 so I didn't think I was being too unreasonable in offering £50 as I was still disputing the case, (see my previous email that I sent them)

 

Anybody got any ideas on what reasons I should give for setting aside, I've got to get it to the local court today so any help pwould be greatly appreciated.

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OMG now I'm worried. I received the application from the court yesterday with a date for a hearing to have the stat demand set aside.

 

I have received the stat demand with the court documents and have looked at them again and the agreement number, date of agreement, date of default and date of when the agreement are terminated are all incorrect. (I think they have mixed up my account with someone elses)

 

I'm going to try and use this in court as the documents from Largo is for my agreement. So my plan is to say the stat demand they have served has an agreement I know nothing about. They wil not be able to produce an agreement, or statment relating to the agreement on the stat demand in my name. I do have an agreement with them but different number and date. I have looked at the agreement they have sent and it seems ok so if they serve a second stat demand with the correct details on not sure what I will do. I'm hoping that if they attend the hearing the will end up looking fools and will just want me to to make an arrangement on the actual agreement I have. This is also going to be my argument if they flag up that I did make an offer because of the stat demand - I was just going to say it was because I thought it was on the agreement I do have and that offer still stands for the correct agreement.

 

Has anybody got any thoughts or can offer advice about what I should do ?

 

Should I prepare an arguement or just go with the stat demand and say where's the agreement ?

 

Or should I take the paperwork they have sent me and say different agreements ?

 

Should I take the default and letters I have receved for the correct agreement ?

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OMG now I'm worried. I received the application from the court yesterday with a date for a hearing to have the stat demand set aside.

 

I have received the stat demand with the court documents and have looked at them again and the agreement number, date of agreement, date of default and date of when the agreement are terminated are all incorrect. (I think they have mixed up my account with someone elses)

 

I'm going to try and use this in court as the documents from Largo is for my agreement. So my plan is to say the stat demand they have served has an agreement I know nothing about. They wil not be able to produce an agreement, or statment relating to the agreement on the stat demand in my name. I do have an agreement with them but different number and date. I have looked at the agreement they have sent and it seems ok so if they serve a second stat demand with the correct details on not sure what I will do. I'm hoping that if they attend the hearing the will end up looking fools and will just want me to to make an arrangement on the actual agreement I have. This is also going to be my argument if they flag up that I did make an offer because of the stat demand - I was just going to say it was because I thought it was on the agreement I do have and that offer still stands for the correct agreement.

 

Has anybody got any thoughts or can offer advice about what I should do ?

 

Should I prepare an arguement or just go with the stat demand and say where's the agreement ?

 

Or should I take the paperwork they have sent me and say different agreements ?

 

Should I take the default and letters I have receved for the correct agreement ?

can you scan up a copy of the agreement, minus personal details?


i will be off site for the next month or so. if you have any problems, feel free to report the post so a moderator can help you.

 

I am not a qualified or practicing lawyer.

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I'm afraid I don't have access to a scanner I will try to take some pic's although it isn't a great copy they have sent me so it may not photograph well enough to be read (I had to hold it about an inch away from my nose to be able to read the agreement number)

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I'm still having trouble getting copies of the agreement posted the quality of the copies is just to poor to read I have to scquint read it myself.

 

The date for the hearing is 10th December so I'm planning on just using the wrong agreement number, amount etc as my argument and if they raise the fact I do have another agreement point out to the judge that that is not the agreement they have sent a stat demend for and also point out that when I thought it was that agreement I did make an offer to make regular payments.

 

Has anybody any thoughts, ideas or suggestions.

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Well monday is the big day and I'm more nervous than a cat on a hot tin roof.

 

I'm going to take a copy of the OFT guidleins and Consumer credit act. Was going to the documents they have sent which refer to an agreement I do have but not the one detailed in the stat demand.

 

Going to argue that the details in stat demand I have no knowledge of and that they have not produced proof of that agreement.

 

If they point out that I do have an agreement and number on stat demend in adminstrative error intend to point out that have made an offer to make regular payments on that one and they have turned down offer.

 

Has anybody got any advice - i.e what I should take to court other than the above, do I take the doc's they have sent, do I take doc's refering to correct agreement and explain I'm willing to make regular payment on that account and see if entire matter can be resolved without them re-issing another demand with correct details.

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