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Natwest ruining my life!! Advice appreciated


andy262000
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Last 3 years have been hell with Natwest, I have a small shop which is on a commercial loan with my house as security.

 

Business has been difficult especially with some serious problems and whilst I had money to cover repayments they was also keen to offer me overdraft facilities across 3 accounts upto 40k 3 years ago, within a year of these facilities in place they wanted it back, I asked why the panic all of a sudden and they just said it's been passed over, my bank manager no longer wanted anything to do with me??

 

this Natwest person suggested consolodating one of the overdrafts onto my shop loan and converting 2 accounts into a loan, seperate businesses, on the strength that after a period of good banking they will be reinstated, I thought it was odd but natwesr gave me no choice and I was lead to believe they was helping.

 

Now Natwest want to enforce there security ie take my house and shop, I registered a complaint with federation of small business who suggested I contact the fos, Natwest replied basically saying we are not upholding your complaint if you don't like it you can register a complaint with fos, but that is were the complaint come from. Last friday I received a pack from shoosmiths basically saying we having been instructed to enforce the banks security and proceed to take your property, they have given me 3 working days from receipt.

 

I'm walking round in a daze but I know this problem is real and they will take everything I have worked for and made myself skint for over the last 6 years, 3 great and 3 hell.

 

The bank won't listen, tried all ways and all this person told me was to go to another lender borrow money from somewhere else, which I can't, just no sense and verbally threatened to take my property, and to only use the account to pay them what they are owed, (which I have recorded) and generally treat me like ****,

 

I even went into a branch to get a printout so I can see how much they have taken and after being made to wait 20mins I got called into a side room and handed a telephone with someone on the other end telling me off for trying to use the bank and my proposals for paying everything back.

 

They haven't sent me a bank statement for a year, I have no facilities, all my credits they take 2 or 3 times a month they empty my bank account. I just don't know what to do, battled for so long they have worn me down and out.

 

Thanks for reading hope someone can offer me some advice??

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For a start you should think about getting a parachute account and ensure that any income is paid into the new account. Do make sure that you dont go to a bank that is connected to the NW group.. Which will be LTSB, HBoS, I think.

 

I dont understand where you say Shoesmiths have sent you a pack that states they have been instructed to enforce the Bank's security..

 

Have they issued a claim against you?

 

Please stop telephoning these people and start communicating in writing, unless you have the facility to record the entire conversation.

 

I am sure others will be along soon to offer some advice.

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Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Thanks for your reply, and advice, they usually ring me I have had very little in writing, Shoosmiths have sent a covering letter saying

 

they act for natwest, we have been instructed that the debt is due and owing as secured by legal charges given by me. in the absence of payment we have been instructed to commence legal proceedings to seek recovery of property.

 

We have been instructed by our client wrote to you in accordance with the requirements of the Mortgage Pre Action Protocol. In the absence of any acceptable payment proposal and in the absence of any request from you to delay issue of proceedings for any reason then you should treat this letter as a demand for payment of the debt owing and as a letter of warning that proceedings will be commenced after 7 days.

 

In order that you are aware of a claim against you we have enclosed the following.

 

legal charges

cca notice

formal demands

statement of liability

MPAP letters and checklist

 

In the event you have proposal to pay this debt or in the event that you consider that our client should postpone or delay the issue of proceedings I should contact them.

 

You should inform us if any of the following apply

 

you have proposal to repay whether by lump sum or installments

 

you require our client to consider a change in payment method

 

you submit a claim to an insurer under mortgage protection

 

you have submitted a complaint to the financial ombudsman

 

you have the properties for sale

 

If you do nothing the court may award a possession order in our clients favour which may result in losing your home.

 

They literally empty my account a few times a month, whether it's £100 or £1500 they take everything. I've tried all year to come to an arrangement and all they have insisted on is repayment in full. They have had money every month all I wanted to do was make an arrangement, systematically ruined my business, turnover is half what is was with them doing what they are, my major worry is 3 of us will be unemployed a business established 30 years will be gone and I will have no home, the property will not cover what is owed, the business would if they helped us. It's a commercial loan not a mortgage does the same documentation still apply??

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Right so at this stage they are just following procedure.

 

You MUST start looking for a new bank account immediately and have your income paid into that.. what they are doing is called offsetting. However, I believe they are not permitted to take ALL your money and leave you nothing for other priority living expenses/creditors.

 

The Co-op I believe is worth a look. It might only be a basic account, but you will have access to online banking.

 

Have you made written proposals for the disposal of the debt owed?

 

For the moment, I think you need to ensure you have all the information you might require should they go ahead with their plan to start litigation. I will try and find some help for you.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Sorry I meant to say this is my business account they raid money from, It's a sole trader account. I've been using my personal account to buy stock and pay bills but cheque and card payments the Natwest take and HMRC don't believe the bank have not sent any statements for a year and will not accept the truth as to why I have to work like this.

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Thanks for the reply, when I first took on the business I was very naive my bank manager was my best pal and I did pretty much everything he said or offered so most probably there are products which I have been sold that could be subject to claim, my most blatent cock up was a stakeholder pension, I knew nothing about it or how they worked paid a chunk of money into it a can no longer keep it going or get the money back. Overdraft's we had three one for each business, my brother had one overdraft I had two, two of them was ltd companies but natwest forced the loans on us so everything is now on the sole trader account.

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Have you made a Subject Access request of the bank? That should provide you with everything in connection with your financial relationship with the bank and might just provide you with some information that will help.

 

There is a draft letter in the CAG libary at the top of each screen. You will of course need to amend it to request any information you believe is required. They have 40 days in which to comply and it will cost you £10.00. Some things you will certainly need to request are statements on all accounts. Communication logs (which is basically a computerised diary).

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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I'm really grateful for the responses, I have no one I can ask for advice family etc. It does help mentally getting responses from my posts. I have not done an SAR I presume I would just do the standard one with the additional request for other accounts and extra information. Should I send this to shoosmiths as well? seeing as though they want to hear from me by tomorrow which I think is an unreasonable amount of time considering I only received the document on friday. I also have the complaint in with the fos which natwest sort of acknowledged involvement of the fos, I logged my complaint in September, Natwest replied with:-

 

My understanding of your complaint to the bank

 

The information provided to the bank by the fos suggests you consider being forced into taking a consolidation loan, that insufficient support has been provided in setting up a repayment agreement, that your IFA was unsuccessful in discussing repayment with this office and you received a call which you found threatening.

 

Please let me know if you think I have misunderstood or missed anything.

 

Details of my investigation

 

In order to investigate your complaint, I have reviewed the file provided by you Business Manager and the electronic records held since you accounts were referred to this Office for recovery of your liability.

 

It is clear a Business loan was discussed and considered over a period of several months, you business manager monitored you Business Current Account to ensure that there was sufficient credits to cover the contractual repayments of a consolidation loan. A letter was sent to you I have enclosed a copy, which you may find useful. The loan was suggested to help your financial situation and affordability was proved. You were under no obligation to sign the loan agreement form and should of sought independant advice if you were not entirely happy with the situation.

 

Once accounts are referred to this office for recovery, repayment is expected in the short term, normally within three years. Discussions were held with our field agent in order to come to a mutually acceptable way forward. However, I can find nothing to suggest that repayment was arranged.

 

Please accept our apologies that you found a call from this office to be threatening; it was certainly not our intention. Staff are trained to be professional at all times and it is essential that customers are made aware of consequences of non repayment.

 

This office is due to take action as no repayment has been agreed.

 

My decision and racionale

 

After my investigation I am sorry but I have not decided to uphold your complaint. This is because as I have already detailed, all of the correct procedures were undertaken by the bank to ensure affordability and to adhere with the Data Protection Act. I appreciate this is not the response you was hoping for. We view the facts of each complaint individually when drawing our conclusions and I hope my explanations helps you understand the reasons behind my decisions.

 

Next Steps

 

I believe my decision is fair, based on the information available to me.

 

Ultimately if we cannot reach an agreement, you have the right to refer your complaint to the FOS but I hope this will not be necessary. If I dont hear from you within 8 weeks then I assume you are satisfied and close your complaint.

 

Customer care team.

 

 

The loan wasn't to help me Natwest just wanted there overdrafts back or they would commence proceedings to recover it, left me no option really.

 

There was no mention of affordability, the copy letter they have sent me is nothing to do with what they put in place.

 

I have spent months trying to find a mutually acceptable way forward, not sure who the field agent is, no one has been to see me??

 

I found the call threatening as someone shouting down the phone saying they are taking my house and my business is not professional and to speak to the Natwest person the next day tells me 'It was in the heat of the moment'??? If he was mad at someone else there was no need to take it out on me.

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My heads overflowing with what I should do and I'm getting nowhere fast, just doing SAR do I send it to shoosmiths as it's they who have demanded a response by tomorrow? Also how do I donate can't see a link or button or am I being stupid?

 

Thanks for the advice so far.

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Send the SAR to the Data Controller at NatWest, they will have to fulfill it. You could send a copy to Shoosmiths with a covering letter advising this is what you have done.

 

One of the caveats in Shoosmiths' letter was that you should let them know also, if you have made a complaint to the FOS. As you have now done so, then I would also give them the reference number you have been provided with in the covering letter as above.

 

You could point out to SM that despite their client's assertions, you have attempted to find a way forward, however, they have been obstructive and uncooperative.

 

From now on, I think you should keep all communication in writing and with proof of postage at the very least send your SAR and letter to SM via Recorded delivery mail, keep the receipts.

 

HTH

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Thanks for the reply citizenB, really appreciate being given some direction. Shoosmiths specify Mortgage Pre Action Protocol, I've read a little on it and to me it refers to residential and mortgages, what I have is a commercial loan which my house is security. I've had an agent look at the shop property to see if it would be worth trying to sell just so I could keep my house and maybe try and rent somewhere but they are of the opinion it's worth less than half what I paid for it in the current climate which if all property was taken and sold still would not cover the loan. Natwest fell over themselves to lend me that money at the time.

 

Will an email to shooshop be sufficient to satisfy their request?

 

Thanks for helping

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They just request that you contact them.. so an email should be fine. You could always send a hard copy. You should also click on the "request read receipt" facility on your email

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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I've sent you an e-mail. It would be very helpful if you could contact us by e-mail using our admin e-mail address.

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  • 3 months later...

Just and update, Natwest haven't sent me my information after the time lapsed for my SAR, I've sent another request. They have disregarded my complaint from the fos who'm I've to speak to again as they are not impressed with proceedings and the Natwest seem adamant to proceed with a possession order, I've emailed shoosmiths about my opinion of the banks unfair treatment and obstruction but they have yet to come back to me. Natwest also disabled my card machine so I couldn't take any payments by card so I contacted streamline and persuaded them to re-enable it after they informed me 'as far as they was concerned the business was no longer operating' why or how they could of assumed that I don't know lol.

I'm in the process of preparing a defence and I'm finding the BCOBS information very interesting reading.

 

While I have some money could someone please tell me how I can make a donation?

 

Also with all the grief, lies, threats and illness (i've been really ill since christmas, felt really down, no energy, depressed, went to see the doctor and he said it's stress related but sent me for blood tests and found I'm really low on vitamin D, gave me a year on calceos supplements.

 

would I or could I be in a position to make a counter claim?

 

Don't forget to tell me how to donate!

 

Thanks in advance

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Hi Andy, this is just a support message, I'm 'fighting' Natwest at the moment too, they have made my life hell for months, and like you my health has suffered :-(

 

Please don't give up, have they sent anything at all in response to your SAR? I got a letter stating they were having difficulties locating information on my accounts! This I don't understand as four of them were still active, but I sent them another letter (template somewhere on the site) reminding them they are in default and giving them a further 14 days. Still nothing from them (they have a few days left) but I think it's important to leave a paper trail, Natwest's non compliance should go against them in court (hopefully!)

 

Sorry I can't offer much advice as I'm not sure what my next steps should be either, but this site is fantastic and you'll get the support you need, I too will be donating soon :)

 

Ally

Hit the scales, you know you want to :p

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Hi allykat, thanks for your support, I'm not giving up although I have felt like it many times but I have realised they are not going to take my life away from me. The people I have had to deal with are the most arrogant, horrible, ruthless people I have come across, I've had someone pull a knife on me before know and that was a far more pleasant experience than with the Natwest. I have had nothing at all in response to SAR although i know it has been signed for.

 

This is a great site, just started feeling a bit guilty because I'd had some help and didn't have anything to give back at the time, I just hope I can get one over on Badwest.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I've filled in my defence form which they sent me 2, one for my house and the other for the commercial property, what I would like to know which I've just noticed is the form is a N11R Defence form for Rented Residential Premises? is this the correct form I have been sent?

 

Also in the Particulars of claim it seems to have a lot of irregularities ie. As far as they are aware I am not in possession of my house and they state it's part residential and commercial also the commercial property is being claimed for as residential?

 

They Also haven't quoted any arrears there may be, just a total sum of monies which they are claiming stating they do not have any further information about the claim just a sum which is split into two parts, one for the commercial loan and the other being my brothers overdraft which they converted to loan.

 

As Natwest forced consolodation of overdrafts on my business and restructured the loan agreement without giving me any reason at the time apart from telling me this is a short term measure after a period of time they would reinstate my facilities, would this be covered by BCOBS? they forced this upon me giving me no alternative as they said they would have to commence recovery of all money if I did not comply this happened towards the end of 2009 about september but when forced I had to agree in january 2010 with new agreements.

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This is way out of my league, so I will try and find some helpers for you.

 

Is the FOS still looking at this complaint for you ?

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Hi Andy CB as asked I look in.

 

OK firstly can you type out the Particulars of Claim(S) if more than one summons and type it verbatim (devil is in the detail)

Can you flesh the bones a little as to the dates of service and what stage you are at now.(Time Frame).

 

Regards

 

Andy

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Thanks for getting back to me, I'll scan the particulars of claim it's quite a large document there is two one for each property, the fos is very slow going to ring them tomorrow I keep having very bad days and the tablets I'm on put me in the wrong frame of mind to deal with things in a logical manner which I know is not good. I have to go to court on the 19th the fos told me to go tell the court about the position the bank have put me in, how unfair matters have been and give an assessment of how much money I have lost due to the banks threat (which I have a recording of the advisors admission to threatening me) and how I have made multiple offers of payment now business is improving and 4 people could be out of work if they wish to proceed with possession. Whether this is good advise I can only hope. I'll be back soon as I done scanning! Thankyou again!

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andy262000, suggest you follow the instructions below to post the documents on the thread. Much easier.

 

 

Dx100 – Instructions on uploading pdfs

scan the required letters/agreements/sheets

as a picture file

remove all pers info inc barcodes etc using paint

but leave all figures and dates.

goto one of the many free online pdf converter websites

convert the image to pdf format.

or ir you have PDF as an installed printer drive use that

open a new msg box here

hit go advanced below the msg box

hit manage attachments below that box

hit the add files button on the top right

hit select files, navigate to your file on your pc

hit upload files

NB:you can set where it goes in the post by hitting insert inline.

the hit reply button

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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