Nearlythere10 Vs Safeloans

[nearlythere10]

Hi all,

 

Could do with some advise (I have booked a meeting with CAB for next week, and am looking to schedule an hour free with a solicitor) however know that there is a mass of collective knowledge on this forum who could help.

 

Safeloans have filed a claim form with Northampton CC. The forms are legitimate. I do not want to contest that I owe the debt but want to contest the amount owed. Charges and interest which have been added to my account are more than double the amount owed.

 

I can’t find a copy of the T & C’s from when the loan was taken so am not sure if the charges are listed there but my defence will be based upon the charges not being fair.

 

Particulars of claim:

£131.21 loan amount

£299.68 loan charges and interest

£30 court fee

Note – No solicitors cost have been entered all money claimed is in ‘Amount claimed’ and ‘Court Fee’

 

History:

21st January 2011 borrowed £131.21 including interest to be paid in full on the 21st February 2011. On the 7th February 2011 borrowed £57.76 Making the total of £188.97 due for payment on the 21st February 2011.

I missed the due date but managed to pay £60 leaving a balance of £128.97 to be paid on the 21st March 2011.

I missed this due date and buy June owed:

Loan dated 21 January 2011 ( Including Interest) £198.38

Loan dated 2nd February 2011 (Including Interest) £90.02

Solicitor Costs - £142.76

 

Total amount : 430.89

 

In June I offered £150 in F & F but the best SL would offer was £330 which I declined as I thought was excessive.

No further payment has been made.

 

I’ve cleared approx. £6,000 of debt this year and this is one of my only issues left to resolve. Do I have a case for unfair charges or do I have to swallow this and pay it?

 

Sorry for the length of this post and appreciate any help!

[asmilecostsnothing]

Hi there

 

While it maybe to late have you tried complaining? and then taking that complaint to their trade association

BCCA - British Cheque & Credit Association

http://www.safeloans.co.uk/complaints-policy

 

when I was in a similiar situation with a different lender this really helped and the BCCA acted as mediation without the need for court although I had managed to pay back what was always initially owed even if it was under my own steam this really seemed to help my cause at the time and in the end

 

Hope some banana may be along too x

[nearlythere10]

Thanks Asmile. You are right, it is too late, however I will still make the complaint, as I feel it's worth investigation.

 

Any other input?

[42man]

Have you admitted to a partial CCJ (part of the moneies owed) in your defence ?

[nearlythere10]

Have you admitted to a partial CCJ (part of the moneies owed) in your defence ?

 

I've so far only stated that I intend to defend part of the claim in my acknowledgement of service. I now have approx 14 days to create and file my defence.

[nearlythere10]

Does anyone else have any guidance or opinions to offer?

[sillygirl1]

With a defence like this you do the following

 

On xxx date I borrowed xxx from xxx company which is a payday loan company, offering short term loans at xxx interest rate.

 

On xxx date I failed to repay the full amount of the loan due but did make a payment of xxx towards the balance and tried to come to an arrangement with the company to repay xxx amount over xxx period, this they refused.

 

(Include any correspondence trail here for reference)

 

I admit that I am liable for the original loan amount and one months interest thereon of xxx, having repaid xxx I feel I owe this company xxx only.

 

This company does not appear to be using a qualified legal representative so their claims for solicitors costs should be dismissed.

 

The additional charges and interest are not listed so I do not know how they have calculated these.

 

This is a statement of truth by xxx on xxx

 

It is as simple as that, do not give them any room to come back at you with a lot of legal jargon or start getting solicitors involved, this is the second PDL company going to court without a solicitor - seems to be a trend.

 

Also get in touch with MP Stella Creasy, she is pro-active in the Payday loan area, even though she may not be your local MP she can offer some help in this case.

[nearlythere10]

Wow, quick response. Thank you very much!

 

You are correct that SL aren't using a solicitor the 'legal' person i've been dealing with at Safeloans doesn't seem that well versed in the law. Infact she seems to understand even less than I do.

 

I will keep this thread updated.

[sillygirl1]

This type of quick defence is ideal for these sharks, they can't argue back other than factually and most judges don't want to see reams of breaches of OFT Guidelines as these are NOT law.

 

You should also get in contact with the OFT and Trading Standards as well, one of the requirements for a CCL Licence is for the company to have a suitably trained legal person on board. Seems that they are breaching this requirement big time.

[sillygirl1]

Pure logic at play there, if they are NOT using solicitors then they CANNOT claim their solicitors costs - complete farce.

[sillygirl1]

Whilst they state they have not included solicitors costs according to the history they have, so you put your figures and breakdown under the loan amount and head it Appendix A.

 

Don't forget to number each paragraph of the defence. That should stop you getting a Judgement by Default which I think they were hoping for.

[iaintw]

terms of conditions are on their website or I give it to you

1. INTERPRETATION

1. In these Terms and Conditions, the words "you'" and "your" refer to the Debtor who has entered into this Agreement.

2. The words "we", "us" and "our" refer to the Creditor, Safeloans Limited T/A PaydayOk

2. YOUR OBLIGATIONS

1. We will pay the Amount of Credit into a bank account nominated by you. You confirm that and agree that,

2. You will receive your salary payments on the dates you provided to us;

3. You have no reason to believe that your future salary payments will not be paid to you on or before the Payment Date, into the bank account ("the Account") specified by you in the Loan Application; You will notify us of any change.

4. If the Account is a joint bank account, you have individual, full and unrestricted authority to nominate such Account and any debit card or direct debit instruction nominated by you in the Loan Application for the purposes of these Terms and Conditions;

5. You have been in full employment for at least 120 consecutive days prior to entering into this Agreement and receiving a regular pay or salary amount;

6. You authorise us to debit the amounts payable by you on each Payment Date and any other fees that you may incur under this Agreement by use of your Debit Card or Direct Debit instruction to you bank account ("the Account") instructed by you;

7. You are not a debtor under any proceedings in bankruptcy and have no intention to file a petition for relief under the Insolvency Act 1986; an IVA.

8. You are not a debtor in a Debt Management programme or considering entering in to one.

9. You are UK resident and over 18 years of age.

10. You hereby authorise us to debit the amounts payable by you on each Repayment Date and any other fees and charges that you may incur under this Agreement to the debit card or your bank account by direct debit mandate nominated by you in your loan application. ("the Account") ("Your Debit Card").

11. If a debit is returned unpaid or dishonored for any reason when it is first presented by us for payment, we may re-present the debit for payment on Your Debit Card or Direct Debit mandate until we receive the Total Amount Payable under this Agreement. Unless otherwise agreed, if you do not pay the Total Amount Payable in accordance with this Agreement, you may incur default charges and other charges as specified in the loan particulars of this Agreement. You agree that we may also collect any such charges by way of a debit to Your Debit Card or bank account by Direct Debit mandate. The authority given by you to debit Your Debit Card or by Direct Debit mandate for the purposes of this Agreement is to remain in full force and effect until your obligations to us under this Agreement are fully satisfied.

12. Unless otherwise provided in this Agreement, all collected payments will be applied first to any charges, default letter fees, broken arrangement fees and any other charges payable under conditions of this Agreement, then any interest charges due under this Agreement and then to the loan capital in part or full repayment amount.

13. You grant us permission to contact your employer at any time as may be reasonably required by us.

14. You must inform us immediately of any changes to your Debit Card, Bank Account details or employment details, or of any other changes in circumstances which may affect your ability to make payments under this Agreement.

15. You agree that we may periodically carry out a credit search in helping us to make a responsible lending decision.

3. YOUR RIGHT TO WITHDRAW

1. You have the right to withdraw from this Agreement for a period of 14 days beginning with the day after this Agreement is made and electronically signed by you. You will receive a PDFcopy of the Agreement for your records.

2. You may exercise this right by giving us notice in writing by sending:

1. a letter to Safeloans Ltd 1st Floor Offices, 30 Church Street, Croydon, CR0 1RB

2. or by an email to [email protected]

3. Or by telephoning us on 0208 6800990.

3. In the event that any such notification is made after the payment by us of the advance to you under this Agreement, you will be required to repay within 30 days of providing notice of withdrawal the amount of the advance to us in full, together with interest accrued calculated by applying the contractual interest rate to the Amount of Credit on a daily basis for the period from the date we advance the Amount of Credit to you to the date the Amount of Credit is repaid or credited to us.

4. If you exercise your right of withdrawal within one business day we will waive out right to charge you one day's interest if you repay the credit to us in full by the end of the following business day after you take out the loan.

5. If you do not exercise the right to withdraw, you will still be able to settle this loan early in full or in part at any time prior to the Repayment Date. Your right to withdraw from this Agreement will be lost if you do not exercise the right within the withdrawal period specified above.

4. DEFAULT FEES, CHARGES AND COLLECTION AGENTS You will be in default under this Agreement if you do not pay us the Total Amount Payable (the money you owe us) by the Payment Date/s in accordance with this Agreement. Also, if you fail to make payment in accordance with this Agreement on the scheduled Payment Dates, you will be in default of this Agreement and liable to pay the following;

1. Default interest at the contractual rate. If you do not repay what you owe on the due date, default interest will be charged daily as per the contract at the rate of 1.00 % of the capital balance outstanding calculated and applied to the account each day as set out in the Agreement. We freeze default interest on day 64 from drawdown.

2. £12 each time payment is unpaid on any due date/s.

3. £12 for issuing a default notice;

4. We will charge you a broken arrangement fee of £30.00 if you fail to pay at the contracted rate within the contracted time;

5. If you do not repay us, the following examples show the amounts that will be due and payable on day 64 after drawdown on defaulted accounts, these examples include all fees, default charges, broken arrangement fees, interest and the capital outstanding. All the calculation of costs in relation to charges, default charges, broken arrangement fees are shown above: 4.1, 4.2, 4.3, and 4.4. If you borrow £100 and failed to repay, you would owe us, on day 64 after drawdown £218; if you borrow £150 and fail to repay, on day 64 after drawdown you will owe us £300; if you borrow £200 and fail to repay, on day 64 after drawdown you will owe us £382; if you borrow £250 and fail to repay, on day 64 after drawdown you will owe us £464.00; if you borrow £300 and fail to repay, on day 64 after drawdown you will owe us £546.

6. Any other reasonable expenses and costs that we may incur in taking steps to enforce our rights under the loan agreement including tracing you if you move without notifying us and legal expenses.

7. We may pass your account to a collection company to act on our behalf in collecting any monies outstanding.

8. We may engage collecting agents to call to your home address to arrange repayment of your loan.

9. Missing payment could have severe consequences and make the obtaining of credit by you in the future more difficult.

10. Subject to our obligations under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, all amounts owed by you under this Agreement, including interest payments, charges, default charges and the Amount of Credit, will become due and payable. Also, we may exercise our rights to enforce this Agreement, and may commence with court proceedings in which case you may be liable for our costs. Your account will be passed to legal representatives who will use the county courts and the various options available for enforcement. At this point our legal representatives will charge reasonable costs in preparing court papers and will add reasonable costs and any statutory court costs to the total debt.

5. DATA PROTECTION

1. The information we collect from you is used by us to assess your creditworthiness, to manage your account and to make collections; it is also used to contact you for marketing purposes; it is disclosed by us when legally required to do so at the request of government authorities conducting an investigation; we also use it to verify or enforce compliance with the policies governing our web site and applicable laws or to protect against misuse or unauthorised use of our web site.

2. 1. In considering whether to enter into this Agreement, we may search your record at credit reference agencies. They will add to their records about you, details of our search and your application and this will be seen by other organisations that make searches. We may also add to your records with the credit reference agencies details of your agreement with us, the payments you make under it and any default or failure to keep to its terms. These records will be shared with other organisations and may be used and searched by us and them in order to,

2. Consider applications for credit and credit related services such as insurance for you and any associated person;

3. Trace debtors, engage collection agents to recover debts, prevent or detect money laundering and fraud, and to manage your accounts.

4. To manage your accounts

3. It is important that you provide us with accurate information. We may check your details with fraud prevention agencies and if you provide false or inaccurate information or we suspect fraud, this information may be recorded. Fraud prevention agency records will be shared with other organisations to help make decisions on credit, motor, household, life and other insurance proposals or claims for you and members of your household.

4. Please contact us if you require details of the credit reference agencies or any other agencies from whom we obtain, and whom we pass, information about you. You have a legal right to these details. You have the right to receive a copy of the information we hold about you if you apply to us in writing. A small statutory fee will be payable.

5. We, and other carefully selected third parties, may use your information to inform you by post, fax, telephone or other electronic means, about other products and services (including those of others) which we believe may be of interest to you.

6. If you are not eligible for a loan with us then we may offer you an alternative financial product (including those of others) and we may pass your details to another financial services company for them to send you details of their products.

7. You may have already opted-out of receiving these marketing communications from us by ticking the appropriate box on the Privacy Policy , but if not you may do so at any time by responding to any of our email communications with "remove" in the subject line, by sending us an email to [email protected] or by contacting us at Safeloans Ltd 1st Floor Offices, 30 Church Street, Croydon, CR0 1RB If you opt-out of our use of your data for marketing purposes, we will honour such choice once we have had a reasonable opportunity to process your request. We reserve the right to take reasonable steps to authenticate your identity with respect to any such request or other enquiry.

8. Your data remains on file for 6 years after our files with your information are closed, whether settled by you or in default.

6 RESPONSIBLE LENDING AND DEFERRAL

1. Safeloans Limited is committed to responsible lending. It is important that you do not take on more borrowing than you can afford. Remember if you run into difficulties with your repayments, please contact us immediately.

2. The Consumer Credit Act 1974 states that irresponsible lending may be considered by the OFT to be deceitful, oppressive or otherwise unfair or improper. This conduct is incompatible with our operating principles.

3. We uphold the overarching principles of consumer protection and fair business practice in our consumer credit business by ensuring that they are entrenched in our business practices and procedures. As part of our adherence to these policies, we will only lend an amount of credit that we are reasonably satisfied that you are able to repay on your payday, including any charges.

4. We consider each lending decision individually on the basis of what we know about your circumstances and your credit and repayment history. We strictly observe the requirement to undertake due diligence on all our customers, this means we will not complete any transaction and pay out funds until we are sure we know who you are in accordance with the provisions of the Money Laundering Regulations 2007.

5. We operate a transparent, fixed charging policy - there are no hidden fees or charges, so you know how much you will repay before committing to the loan. Details of our charges are in this Agreement and further information regarding charges is available on request, or on our website www.safeloans.co.uk

6. We will never encourage deferral on your loan; we have repayment options in place to give you the flexibility to clear your loan over 1, 2, 3, or 4 Months.

Please do not apply for a loan from us if you have any doubt about your ability to repay in a comfortable and affordable manner.

7. COMPLAINTS

If you are not satisfied with any aspect of our service, we would like you to tell us of your concerns. You may contact us in any way which is convenient to you, by telephone in writing or by email. If you have a complaint, please contact us by calling us on 0208 6800990 or by sending us an email to [email protected] or by writing to us at Safeloans Ltd 1st Floor Offices, 30 Church Street, Croydon, CR0 1RB. Upon receipt of your complaint we will do our best to resolve your complaint by the end of the next Business day. If we can't do this, we will send you a Prompt written acknowledgement of your complaint and tell you who is dealing

With it. We will send you our full response within four weeks of receiving your complaint. We will include details of how, if you are dissatisfied with the way we have handled your complaint, how you can go to stage 2 of the procedure by referring your complaint to the British Cheque & Credit Association (BCCA) which is a Trade Association we belong to. Our letter will explain that you will have ultimate recourse to the Financial Ombudsman Service if you remain dissatisfied after stage 2 referral to the BCCA.

If you are not satisfied with our response to your complaint you can make a formal complaint to the BCCA by telephone, e-mail, and letter. Please contact the BCCA at: BCCA (British Cheque & Credit Association) PO BOX 3414 Chester CH1 9BF. Please telephone 01244 505904 or Email: [email protected]

The BCCA will investigate your complaint and will provide you with a final response within four weeks of receiving notification of your continuing dissatisfaction.

If you are dissatisfied with the final response from the BCCA, you can ask the Financial Ombudsman Service for an independent review. The BCCA will enclose a leaflet from the Financial Ombudsman Service in their final response letter to assist you if you decide to pursue this further course of action. You should contact the Financial Ombudsman Service within six months of receiving the final Response from the BCCA.

1. If you are not happy with our final response, you may have a right to have your complaint dealt with by the Financial Ombudsman Service ("FOS"). To do so, you should contact the FOS within 6 months of our final response to your complaint. You may write to the FOS at the following address: The Financial Ombudsman Service, South Quay Plaza, 183 Marsh Wall, and London, E14 9SR.

2. We are also members of the Consumer Credit Association (CCA). Please refer to their website at [email protected] for details of our code of practice.

8 REGULATORY INFORMATION

a. Our registered company number is 2410955. Our main business is Consumer Credit.

b. We are licensed under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and comply with the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (Electronic Agreements) Order 2004 and we are registered with the Information Commissioner in compliance with the Data Protection Act 1988. Our registration number is Z5762535

9 MISCELLANEOUS

1. If we do not enforce our rights under this Agreement at any time we will not be prevented from doing so later.

2. Any notice or demand we give will be assumed to have been properly given if served on you personally, or left or sent by prepaid envelope addressed to you at your current address or last known business or private address. If sent by franked first class post it will be assumed to have been received by you 48 hours after posting.

3. We may transfer or assign all or any of our rights under this Agreement without your consent but if we do so you will be informed of this.

4. This Agreement shall be construed according to the laws of England and Wales whose courts shall be the exclusive courts of jurisdiction over any claim or matter arising under or in connection with this Agreement.

5. The contractual terms and conditions, and the prior information, are in English. We undertake to communicate with you in English during the duration of this Agreement...

6. Your obligations under this Agreement are unsecured.

[sillygirl1]

Terms and conditions are not needed for this short defence. We are not arguing terms and conditions in great detail, it isn't necessary or needed for a payday loan defence.

 

If you are aguing this is needed then read 9.6 which states "Your obligations under this Agreement are unsecured." By going to court they have breached their own terms and conditions.. in fact the whole of Section 9 is contracually impossible....

[iaintw]

silly girl

the user said and quote "I can’t find a copy of the T & C’s from when the loan was taken so am not sure if the charges are listed there but my defence will be based upon the charges not being fair."

be

[sillygirl1]

Point taken, but as they haven't listed the fees then the terms won't be of any real help. If you argue every term and condition the judge won't be impressed. The interest rate not being stated is enough for the particulars of claim to be dismissed by the court should they want to do so.

 

Less is better in these defences as you don't want the other side to run up the cost of a 'proper' solicitor. The other side here haven't even got a legal person on board, which they ought to have under the consumer licence laws.

[sillygirl1]

iantw perhaps you can explain where in the terms and conditions it says they can make the total of the

 

£299.68 loan charges and interest

 

against a £131.21 loan - double the cost of the loan...

[iaintw]

thats true too

 

these payloans are making their own laws and their have been really bad recently thats why the grovement has setup a task force to combat it

[iaintw]

the interest is on the top of the loan like if you brorrow about £100 plus interest of 150. and then have the loan ext like 300 and they taken money from the debit card and then more interest in the loan and the charges are more.

like late payment charge £12.00

default notice

then it will double the loan

 

thats why people are stuck to pay off the loan

[sillygirl1]

As they are not allowed to charge to take money from the debit card I don't see where your arguement is going there, but the late payment charges are also not relevant as it is a payday loan. It is a completely different kettle of fish to a bank charge claim, as the payday loan company are not entitled to the same 'priveledges' as a bank as they are not a 'commercial bank.

[iaintw]

some payloans (I know a bank who do a payday loans called secure trust bank)

they do the same things as payday loans like Late payment charges to all.

[nearlythere10]

Hi Iaintw,

 

Thanks for your contribution. I didn't want to take the T&C's from their website as they aren't dated and didn't want to embarrass myself referencing incorrect terms.

 

I do have a copy of the terms of my agreement and although worded different they are similar. The other terms do state the APR though. I'll post them tomorrow when I've had chance to edit out the personal info.

 

Part of the reason I posted here because I wasn't sure the context of my defence was correct. I believe the charges to be unfair against the amount borrowed but wasn't sure if this would stand up.

 

I appreciate your support Sillygirl1 you have made it quite clear how to respond and why.

[iaintw]

i was trying to help

you are welcome

sillygirl is a the most helpful person

I am helpful person too

[nearlythere10]

Back in December I submitted my a partial defence against Safeloans, with a lot of help courtesy of Sillygirl1 (Thanks!)

 

Late last week I received a letter from them -

 

The basic message is that they don’t agree to my partial claim and have made a settlement offer of approx £330 which is the same as the original settlement offer they made (I don’t agree to).

 

They have provided a breakdown of charges and whilst correct don’t seem fair. They have charged me for letters and notices at £12 per time (total £60). Four of the notices they sent me were automatic e-mails so don’t see how they could’ve charged £12 per time, and also their solicitors letter at £130 seems excessive.

 

I’m not sure how best to respond to this letter and would appreciate any advise offered. It would seem they want to avoid court as they would've just pursued it otherwise.

[sillygirl1]

I think that is the best you are going to get out of them. At the end of the day it is a judges lottery, last two payday loan cases in front of a judge had mixed results, one judge sided with the PDL company (who had dropped £700 from their original claim during the court process) and the other judge took off some of the letter fees and said that 24% per annum interest should be granted from date of default to date of judgement...

 

I would go with the £330 myself and ask to repay it at a lower rate. Also check on MCOL that they haven't 'accidentally' got judgement against you.

[nearlythere10]

Just to let anyone following know that i've today agreed a settlement figure with SL. I'll update this thread once the debt has been paid/cleared.

 

Thanks again to all for their advise and input, especially Sillygirl1.