From JSA to ESA am I eligible.

[renegadeimp]

and notice of appropriation

 

I use this myself and its fantastic to know your essential living expenses are 100% secured.

[Dark]

BCOBS

 

and notice of appropriation

 

dx

 

And what does that mean? no explanation? No link??

[dx100uk]

sadly it looks like the auto links dont work on this thread

 

library green tab top left for the letter

 

BCOBS is on our front page

 

dx

[Dark]

sadly it looks like the auto links dont work on this thread

 

library green tab top left for the letter

 

BCOBS is on our front page

 

dx

 

Thanks for that.

 

I am currently on JSA (paid into the bank, so they know) I may go down the Notice of Appropriatoon path. In the meantime am I able to reclaim such charges (when I was receiving JSA) back to 1 Nov 2009 (When I beleive the BCOBR came into force)?

 

I note that the page on the BCOBR examples of unfair treatment http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/content.php?827-Examples-of-unfair-treament suggests that 'Charges on bounced DDs or cheques' are a 'probable breach of the rules'.

 

This seems very broad. Does it mean excessive charges, or all such bounced DD charges 'may' be unfair? (I'll also delve into the forums and see what other people have said.)

 

I am aware that the OFT took the banks to the high court about 3 years ago, and the Courts decided that the UTCCR did not apply because bank charges are 'core terms'. Does this Banking Code rectify that?

Edited September 23, 2012 by Dark

[ims21]

BCOBS replaced the banking code

[Dark]

BCOBS replaced the banking code

I meant this new code, the BCOBS. Are bounced DD charges always, or generally, unfair, or deemed unfair when the customer is on JSA or ESA, or always fair? I can't find specific references in the BCOBS or the FSA or Banking guidelines to DDs and ESA/JSA. Is there any case law yet?

[dx100uk]

they are uunlawful PENALTY charges anyway

 

regardsless to BCOBS!!

 

however, this will help....

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?353395-Letter-to-send-if-you-are-being-charged-bank-fees-whilst-on-benefits&highlight=santander+BCOBS

 

dx

[Dark]

they are uunlawful PENALTY charges anyway

 

regardsless to BCOBS!!

 

however, this will help....

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?353395-Letter-to-send-if-you-are-being-charged-bank-fees-whilst-on-benefits&highlight=santander+BCOBS

 

dx

 

First, I have been claiming JSA for a long while, and the BCOBS route seems to be the right path for me to reclaim recent penalty charges on my bank account. Thanks for your advice.

 

 

However, I am also asking a broader question, not related to JSA and ESA.

 

In 2008/9 I also filed a claim at the County Court for older bank charges under the UTCCR. The bank asked for it to be stayed until the OFT / High Court ruling was made... and the High Court ruled in the bank's favour, saying that the bank charges were 'core terms' and therefore not subject to the UTCCR. I thought that was the end of it and I had no case. The case is still stayed and I could revive it.

 

I have been out of the loop for a while (depression, unemployment) so I am not up to date with recent developments. I have heard people say that the charges are unlawful penalties many times before, but it seemed to be pot luck whether a court agreed without citing UTCCR.

 

Have there been any developments relating to pre-BCOBS?

Are courts still ruling that these old charges are unlawful, irrespective of them not coming under UTCCR?

Importantly, have there been any High Court rulings relating to bank charges being unlawful charges in the past 3 years?

Edited September 23, 2012 by Dark

[Lilly_Monroe]

I am in the WRAG group and have been for the past 6 months.

I have already declined working for myself, as there is NO way I could either make enough money, or mentally well enough to run my own business.

 

It has been suggested to me that I might want to look into volunteer work - and yes I have, I have sat for weeks looking at what is on offer, but because I suffer from depression/anxiety I am worried that I cannot commit (well I cannot commit).

I am also very concerned that once I do this, then ATOS or whoever will take this as a sign of me being well...when I am not.

 

At the moment I hardly go out, I make myself ill when I have to visit my Counsellor and then my advisor at the job centre.

 

In a perfect and fair system I would tell myself to try it, but the consequences of it going wrong, or the DWP seeing me as fit make me think otherwise, I am not fit to hold down a job, and at 56 what chances anyway.

 

I live alone, so I cannot afford (not only in money) but health wise to get it wrong.

Can they make me do the volunteer thing.

I know they are looking at making all of us do it, but as it stands of now what are my rights.

[antone]

OK, I'm not quite sure what you're asking, so I'll answer what I think you mean - apologies if I get it wrong. Anyhow:

 

Can you volunteer whilst on ESA? Yes, you can, provided you work for a charity or nonprofit organisation, and that no-one would normally be paid to do the work you are doing. This would have to be declared to the DWP.

 

Can they take your volunteering as evidence that you are fit for work? No. The whole point of doing this would be to prepare yourself for future paid work - it does not demonstrate that you are currently fit.

 

Can they force you to do voluntary work? No, not while you are on ESA.

[honeybee13]

Hi Lily.

 

I can only tell you of my own experience. My consultant psychiatrist recommended voluntary work as part of my recuperation. I told the DWP and they agreed, but they never said that being able to do that proved I was fit to do other types of work.

 

I quite enjoyed what I was offered and the people were nice.

 

My best, HB

[Nystagmite]

With voluntary work, it really is no big deal you not turning up due to being ill. They're used to it. I volunteer and many of the volunteers are retired and /or disabled. It's not unusual for some to take weeks off due to illness or whatever. I've done it with no questions asked.

[Lilly_Monroe]

Thanks everyone sorry for being confusing in my question, I confuse myself.

I am the stage where my illness makes me not know what I want to to do from one day to the next, plus I do not really want to mix with people at the moment (or I think I don't).

Basically I am not much good to anyone, not even myself - what makes it even sadder, is that the NHS are useless.

Thanks.

[honeybee13]

The NHS weren't useless with me, Lily, they saved me. Have you seen your CMHT, I can't remember?

 

HB

[abc123def]

CMHT have been brilliant for me too.

[Lilly_Monroe]

The NHS weren't useless with me, Lily, they saved me. Have you seen your CMHT, I can't remember?

 

HB

 

I have a CPN nurse, who is not good, he promises me things, then never delivers.

He said they have people working in the volunteer sector, if I needed help, so at the next meeting I said 'yes please' he back tracked, and said it was only 1 man, and he was busy - and that was that.

When I tell him I did not do a thing, he replies 'does it matter' and that's it.

Really not sure how I meant to get better with NO help.

I am trying myself but being depressed makes it so hard for me.

I was meant to be having a medication review,weeks ago - nothing.

I have asked if I can see a psychiatrist, and been told no I am not ill enough so I guess feeling and thinking about wanting to end it, are not good enough reasons.

I am basically at the end of my tether with it all.

What I do I am having to all by myself no one is helping me at all.

Sort my bills out, all my DWP stuff, it is like I am just lost and uncounted for in the system.

Come Feb I will probably be taken off ESA and made to go back to looking for work, what a joke that will be.

 

I just want some help, so I can get better, or well enough to try and get some of my old life back.

[Lilly_Monroe]

CMHT have been brilliant for me too.

 

I am pleased, it is good to hear it works for some people, I guess it is all down to areas, and the staff themselves.

[honeybee13]

So have you been put in touch with the CMHT, Lily?

 

HB

[abc123def]

Lily has a CPN whom I assume is part of her CMHT. Lily, you can ask for a different key worker, I did. My last one was very nice but completely hopeless and did nothing for me. Are there groups you can attend? I've done some DBT therapy groups which were very helpful, I asked to swap key worker to one that ran one of the groups whose attitude I liked and she has been brilliant. I've had so much help and support since switching to her.

[Lilly_Monroe]

Lily has a CPN whom I assume is part of her CMHT. Lily, you can ask for a different key worker, I did. My last one was very nice but completely hopeless and did nothing for me. Are there groups you can attend? I've done some DBT therapy groups which were very helpful, I asked to swap key worker to one that ran one of the groups whose attitude I liked and she has been brilliant. I've had so much help and support since switching to her.

 

When I was doing CBT the councellor who took that was lovely, but she agreed it was not working for me, so she suggested I see someone else hence the CPN I have at the mo - but he is not helping me.

So I went back to my GP, to discuss it - and got no where all in all.

Non of my notes from any of my counselling sessions have been even forwarded to my GP

I am not decrying anyone who does these things because we are all different, but because I do not come across as in a poor way, I sit still in the meetings, I am calm, no history of drugs or drink no self harm I am not being taken overly serious.

But I am suffering I just hide it because I am ashamed all in all.

 

So, please who did I ask to be appointed another counsellor

There are no groups near to be, I live very rural and driving for me is a no no, my concentration is zero.

I get to and fro on the two hourly bus to the job centre and the counsellor, which costs me £10 each time for the return journey, out of £97 a week it is not something I can overly afford that often, if at all.

[estellyn]

Lily, it really doesn't sound as if you are well enough for volunteer work yet - is someone trying to get you to do it?

[abc123def]

No counsellor is ever able to pass on any notes to anyone else except a coroner following a death. The only way they would share anything you said at all was if they believed that either you or someone else was in danger. So if you have had a counsellor previously they are not allowed to talk to your GP about anything you have said.

 

When I said change of key worker, I meant that, rather than a counsellor. A key worker within the CMHT is usually either a Community Psychiatric Nurse, an Occupational Therapist or a Social Worker so it might be asking to change from your current CPN to someone else within the team if you feel your current key worker is not helping.

 

Does your CMHT run any groups? Say for anxiety? Emotional coping skills? Self-esteem? Might be worth an ask? Do you have a local MIND centre? That might be worth looking up, if you have they run social events as well as groups. eg. walking group, craft, coffee and chat etc. They are safe places to be because everyone will understand the struggles you have.

[Lilly_Monroe]

Lily, it really doesn't sound as if you are well enough for volunteer work yet - is someone trying to get you to do it?

 

My advisor at the job centre, not in a nasty pressing way, but she keeps giving me things to think about and look at, hence the starting my own business (but she was fine when I said I could not do that).

I am just afraid, because most people think those of us with depression are faking it.

I hate sitting in that chair, trembling and feeling sick explaining why I cannot do these things - but the truth is the truth.

[Lilly_Monroe]

No counsellor is ever able to pass on any notes to anyone else except a coroner following a death. The only way they would share anything you said at all was if they believed that either you or someone else was in danger. So if you have had a counsellor previously they are not allowed to talk to your GP about anything you have said.

 

When I said change of key worker, I meant that, rather than a counsellor. A key worker within the CMHT is usually either a Community Psychiatric Nurse, an Occupational Therapist or a Social Worker so it might be asking to change from your current CPN to someone else within the team if you feel your current key worker is not helping.

 

Does your CMHT run any groups? Say for anxiety? Emotional coping skills? Self-esteem? Might be worth an ask? Do you have a local MIND centre? That might be worth looking up, if you have they run social events as well as groups. eg. walking group, craft, coffee and chat etc. They are safe places to be because everyone will understand the struggles you have.

 

When I first started seeing my CPN nurse he told me that all of my notes will be shared with my GP, and that I would also get a copy of anything that went backwards and forwards (I think he asked me if I was OK with that, and I said yes) because I saw no problem.

Did not know about what you have just told me.

 

I contacted Mind but the nearest is 25 miles away so a 50 mile trip, they are meant to be sending me some info.

But I am in the town tomorrow to see my advisor, so might if I feel able call into and see them.

I would like a safe place to go/visit with no expectations.

I have been offered nothing like that from my CPN - well I have been offered nothing at all.

 

Thank you for your time you have been very helpful.

[abc123def]

Yes Lily, your CPN is not a counsellor so will pass on some of your info to your GP, it is counsellors who are bound by confidentiality.

 

My social worker does not routinely pass on any information to my GP, though the Consultant Psychiatrist does who I see about medication. My Psychologist also passed on details of my assessment with them too. I know what my GP is told as I get copies of all letters sent to my surgery. My social worker has told me that details of my SH haven't been passed on to my GP, though the hospital will have informed my GP about my overdose.