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Cap1 & CCA return


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Hi all

IF a Court order directions say within 14 days of services of the order is that 14 days from the date on the order or when they receive it?

 

Cheers

HAK

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Cheers VS I will go with that.

 

Basically The Judge made it on the 19th and it was issued on the 20th Jan.

Therfore they have till 3rd of Feb then they are in breach.

 

Also anybody konw what happens if the claimants dont pay the hearing fee on time?>

 

HAK

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If you mean the allocation fee, the case is stayed and you may apply to have the claim dismissed.

If my comments have been useful please click the scales and let me know.

 

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Cheers VS I will go with that.

 

Basically The Judge made it on the 19th and it was issued on the 20th Jan.

Therfore they have till 3rd of Feb then they are in breach.

 

Also anybody konw what happens if the claimants dont pay the hearing fee on time?>

 

HAK

 

There is a hearing fee to pay 7 days before the final hearing.

 

If they haven't paid before the hearing, it won't go ahead - for one reason or another, my claim with O2 didn't have it's hearing fee paid and the Court Usher checked with the Judge who gave a threat of removing the hearing from the day's listings if it wasn't paid by the 10:00am hearing time... It was quite funny, though, as the hearing was listed for 10:00am and the bleeding counter didn't open until 10:00am, so the Usher had to go to get someone from the Counter to come and see me in the waiting room before 10:00am!!!

 

Anyway, the gist is they can pay the fee on the day, but if it isn't paid, the hearing will be delisted, the claim stayed and they will probably have to apply to the Court to lift the stay and explain why they didn't pay.

Always happy to help where I can!

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Am i right in saying that agreements entered into post May 31 2005 are governed by the 2004 regs and am i right in saying that there was no amendment of schedule 6 in relation to the prescribed terms as per the 1983 regs.

 

PW

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Hi all

IF a Court order directions say within 14 days of services of the order is that 14 days from the date on the order or when they receive it?

 

Cheers

HAK

 

I was informed by the court that the claimant has the period specified on the order (from the date of the order) + 2 extra days. If the claimant doesn't comply within that timespan you can ask for the claim to be struck out. Magda

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PW

 

You are right that Schedule 6 of the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 was left unchanged by the Consumer Credit (Agreements) (Amendment) Regulations 2004

Steven

 

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Hi everyone!

 

This might sound like a bit of a silly question but are the CCA Agreements being discussed on this thread only applicable to CREDIT CARDS? How about bank accounts?!? Can we only try to get monies back through the Hardship Waiver route?!?

 

Any clarification will be much appreciated:)

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Bank accounts aren't regulated by the CCA - they are regulated by the FSA.

 

Overdraft agreements are regulated by the CCA, however - despite the Banks' efforts to blind consumers with legal mumbo-jumbo to hide the facts - so are challengable on the same grounds as any CCA. The only difference will be that Overdrafts are exempt from the Agreement regulations due to a s.74 CCA 1974 Determination issued by the OFT - to benefit from the Determination, however, the Bank has to comply with it's terms, meaning they have to send you details of the interest rate and charges applicable when you apply for the Overdraft, or shortly afterwards, plus how they will terminate the agreement. If they don't comply with the Determination, the debt will be unenforceable in Court. This is a little gem that they don't want you to know, but it does work, believe me;

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/barclays-bank/110184-car2403-barclays-bank-default.html

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Always happy to help where I can!

:lol:

Beware of legal advice given on a private forum - do you REALLY know who is posting? Are they REALLY accountable for their posts? What if you follow their advice and get something wrong?

It was Winston Churchill who said; "Democracy is the worst way to run a country except for all the others"

 

Advice and comments posted by car2403 are offered purely without prejudice. They reflect only my personal opinion and do not represent the opinion of this forum or it's management. You should always seek legal advice from a qualified legal advisor. As a member of the site team, I disable reputation - reputation points mean nothing, please check my posting credentials yourself and make an informed decision. You shouldn't PM me and await a reply - I may be too late with a response. No replies will be given in Private Messages - just as with getting advice from the forum, getting advice via Private Messages is dangerous. CAG is about sharing successes so others can follow your example, this is primarily why I'm here, so please don't be offended if I don't offer replies in PM that doesn't comply with this. Help CAG to help others by keeping your thread up to date.

 

 

USEFUL LINKS; New User Guide to CAG | Can't find what you're looking for? | Intro to Consumer Credit Litigation | Is My Agreement Enforceable | Default (Surleybonds) Template Letter | Defaults - background, removal methods, challenges and taking a claim to Court | Digital Signature Guide | Overdrafts and the CCA

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Hi all,

 

can someone provide me with a link that details the legal requirements for service of documents?

 

That is, how many days after posting is a document deemed legally served?

omnia praesumuntur legitime facta donec probetur in contrarium

 

 

Please note: I am not a member of the legal profession, all advice given is purely my opinion, if in doubt consult a professional

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This thread & its info. was drawn to my attention by supasnooper this week, ncf. You may find it useful too

 

I think it was originally a post by x20 incorporated into a BRW Default Notice post. The relevant part is Council Tax Manual - Section 3 - Appendix 3.6 - Service of documents by post -

 

Default Notice period - 7 CLEAR days ?

Any knowledge I possess or advice I proffer is based solely on my experiences in the University of Life. Please make your own assessment of legality, risks & costs before taking any action.

 

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Mucho gracias!

 

:)

omnia praesumuntur legitime facta donec probetur in contrarium

 

 

Please note: I am not a member of the legal profession, all advice given is purely my opinion, if in doubt consult a professional

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Hmm

 

CPR itself (Practice directions) seems to make no reference to 2nd class post (in particular the "it will be assumed second class mail was used" (unless proved to contrary)

 

 

Where did they get that PD bit for the council tax manual?

omnia praesumuntur legitime facta donec probetur in contrarium

 

 

Please note: I am not a member of the legal profession, all advice given is purely my opinion, if in doubt consult a professional

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HSBC wrote to me stating they do not need to supply copy of the agreement and refered me to the act below:-

 

Documents) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1557)/3 General requirements as to form and content of copy documents

3 General requirements as to form and content of copy documents

(1) Subject to the following provisions of these Regulations, every copy of an executed agreement, security instrument or other document referred to in the Act and delivered or sent to a debtor, hirer or surety under any provision of the Act shall be a true copy thereof.

(2) There may be omitted from any such copy--

(a) any information included in an executed agreement, security instrument or other document relating to the debtor, hirer or surety or included for the use of the creditor or owner only which is not required to be included therein by the Act or any Regulations thereunder as to the form and content of the document of which it is a copy;

(b) any signature box, signature or date of signature (other than, in the case of a copy of a cancellable executed agreement delivered to the debtor under section 63(1) of the Act, the date of the signature by the debtor of an agreement to which section 68(b) of the Act applies);

© in the case of any copy of an unexecuted agreement delivered or sent to the debtor or hirer under section 62 of the Act, the name and address of the debtor or hirer; and

[(d) in the case of any copy of an executed agreement given to the debtor under section 77(1) of the Act for fixed-sum credit, or under section 78(1) for running-account credit, under which a person takes any articles in pawn, any description of the article taken in pawn.]

NOTES

Initial Commencement

Specified date

Specified date: 19 May 1985: see reg 1(1).

Amendment

Para (2): sub-para (d) substituted by SI 1984/1108, reg 2(a).

 

I did not want a copy of my signature copy but all the prescribed terms of the loan....

 

The above section uses the word MAY but makes no reference to all the prescribed terms of the loan... ie APR, No. of Payments, Time of Payments, etc etc

 

It appears that all banks are using this part of the act to try and get round the copy of executed agreement in accordance with section 77/78.

 

WELL THEY ARE WRONG... they must provide a copy of agreement with all the prescribed terms... dont let them fool you... I have read people have made applications under the data protection act, well you dont really need to do that...

 

I am really annoyed with the way Banks carry on.... increasing the APR from 9.9% to 20.9% is a joke..... extortionate credit bargain or what?

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HERE IS WHAT OFT SAYS

------------------------------------------------------------------------

We note that your letter raises concern in regard to executed credit agreement copies.

 

As you may know, s63 of the Act covers how and when lenders must provide consumers with a first (and where appropriate second) copy of a regulated agreement. It is clearly in the lender’s best interests to retain details of the original agreement and any subsequent variations or changes made to it, particularly as consumers can request a subsequent ‘true’ copy of most types of agreement under ss77 and 78 of the CCA (and on payment of the appropriate fee). There are rules about what is likely to constitute a ‘true copy’ under these sections of the Act. Further, if a consumer does make a valid request for a copy of their agreement under these provisions and the lender does not comply with the request the agreement may not be enforceable in the Courts, subject to any other mitigating factors.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

As you will know section 180(1) (b) authorises, "the omission from a copy of certain material from the original, or the inclusion of certain material in condensed form." This refers to statutory instruments made under the heading Copies of document regulations and in this care in particular to SI 1983/1557.

Before leaving section 180 there are two other sections that should be remembered these are:

Section 2(2) (a) A duty imposed by any provision of this Act (except section 35) to supply a copy of any document is not satisfied unless the copy supplied is in the prescribed form and conforms to the prescribed requirements;

And more importantly

Section 2(b) A duty imposed by any provision of this Act (except section 35) to supply a copy of any document is not infringed by the omission of any material, or its inclusion in condensed form, if that is authorised by regulations.

You will see that this quite clearly states that whilst certain items may be left out of the copy document the rest of the document must be in the form and contain all items as prescribed by the regulations.

Turning to the regulations regarding what may be omitted from these copies these are contained with SI 1983/1557.

The regulations state:

(2) There may be omitted from any such copy-

(a) any information included in an executed agreement, security instrument or other document relating to the debtor, hirer or surety or included for the use of the creditor or owner only which is not required to be included therein by the Act or any Regulations thereunder as to the form and content of the document of which it is a copy;

(b) any signature box, signature or date of signature (other than, in the case of a copy of a cancelable executed agreement delivered to the debtor under section 63(1) of the Act, the date of signature by the debtor of an agreement to which section 68(b) of the Act applies);

It is quite clear what can be omitted from the copy document, this again asserts that all other details of the agreement should presented in form and content as required by the regulations.

The requirements of the Agreement regulations 1983/1553 are very explicit in describing the form and content of an agreement and this as I have demonstrated also applies to the copy of any such agreement with the above mentioned proviso.

Nowhere within these regulations does it state that part of the agreement can be presented on a separate document headed terms and conditions.

It does state that all terms and conditions should be within the agreement document and is explicit of the form in which it is presented.

Edited by sanrhythm
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Hi all

new to this but need help regarding cca 1974-default-termination and "lombard"

Cab1ne-Lombard-Shoosmiths **Claim Recieved**

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?181761-Cab1ne-Lombard-Shoosmiths-**Claim-Recieved**/page25

Summary Judgement 01/02/2011 **REFUSED** set for trial "May 23rd To June 30th 2011"

DISCONTINUED 3rd MAY 2011 **WON**

 

santander" Responsible Lending!!!!!!!

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?219431-quot-santander-quot-Responsible-Lending!!!!!!!

 

Capquest "V" Cab1ne

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?262962-Capquest-quot-V-quot-Cab1ne

 

"STAYED"

 

CAB "Sittin Tight"

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Hi all

new to this but need help regarding cca 1974-default-termination and "lombard"

 

Hi,

 

its best if you create a seperate thread regarding your issues, and if possible scan any documents (remving your personal details, agreement number, barcodes, etc) and place them for us to view and attempt to advise

 

I believe the best forum for Lombard would be in "other institutions", found HERE

 

(just click on "new thread" and create the title and content of your thread)

 

 

Then once posted, copy the thread URL and post it back on here so we can visit it

 

:-)

omnia praesumuntur legitime facta donec probetur in contrarium

 

 

Please note: I am not a member of the legal profession, all advice given is purely my opinion, if in doubt consult a professional

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thankyou ncf355

will do

fingers crossed

Cab1ne-Lombard-Shoosmiths **Claim Recieved**

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?181761-Cab1ne-Lombard-Shoosmiths-**Claim-Recieved**/page25

Summary Judgement 01/02/2011 **REFUSED** set for trial "May 23rd To June 30th 2011"

DISCONTINUED 3rd MAY 2011 **WON**

 

santander" Responsible Lending!!!!!!!

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?219431-quot-santander-quot-Responsible-Lending!!!!!!!

 

Capquest "V" Cab1ne

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?262962-Capquest-quot-V-quot-Cab1ne

 

"STAYED"

 

CAB "Sittin Tight"

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Hi,

 

its best if you create a seperate thread regarding your issues, and if possible scan any documents (remving your personal details, agreement number, barcodes, etc) and place them for us to view and attempt to advise

 

I believe the best forum for Lombard would be in "other institutions", found HERE

 

(just click on "new thread" and create the title and content of your thread)

 

 

Then once posted, copy the thread URL and post it back on here so we can visit it

 

:-)

can't do attachments

so it looks like a good old chit chat

been reading this forum for about 3 weeks

 

top stuff

Cab1ne-Lombard-Shoosmiths **Claim Recieved**

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?181761-Cab1ne-Lombard-Shoosmiths-**Claim-Recieved**/page25

Summary Judgement 01/02/2011 **REFUSED** set for trial "May 23rd To June 30th 2011"

DISCONTINUED 3rd MAY 2011 **WON**

 

santander" Responsible Lending!!!!!!!

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?219431-quot-santander-quot-Responsible-Lending!!!!!!!

 

Capquest "V" Cab1ne

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?262962-Capquest-quot-V-quot-Cab1ne

 

"STAYED"

 

CAB "Sittin Tight"

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hi i created my own thread as been told

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/alliance-leicester/180805-mbna-replied-sign-copy.html

 

this lead to too many threads and no one answer or reply I don’t think it is help full I notice many ask to create their own even the thread is very relevant.

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there is far to much to read so i would like to ask a qus.

if you have a c.card and you canceled it as you lost it a got a new one do you need to sign a new c.card Agreement?

what happend if you dident sign a new c.card Agreement in my case?

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  • dx100uk changed the title to Cap1 & CCA return
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