Advice needed regarding Welcome Finance

[stephie2]

I wonder if anyone may have some advice for me.I got a loan out with Welcome Finance 3 years ago. The loan was for £2,500 and for 3 years I had to pay back £200. I missed 2 payments over the 3 years (in the first year) as I had a few problems when I was moving house etc. I discussed it with Welcome and they told me to increase my payments to £250 and that the loan would finish at the same time and the money I owed would be paid in full. I asked for the money to always be taken at the end of the month as I do not get paid until the last Thursday in every month. This was all put in place and everything was fine. My loan should have been paid off at the end of September. I rang a couple of months ago to check that the balance was now clear and to see if I could cancel my direct debit with them now the loan was paid to be told that I still owed £773. I have gone through every channel regarding this and have even wrote in and issued a complaint in writing. When I moved house I informed Welcome of my change of address and they acknowledge my move but I have never ever had a financial statement from them in the whole 3 years.I have now got to the root of the problem after a full month of continuous phone calls to the company. It would appear that the money owing £773 is all interest. According to Welcome my arrears are now paid (This is from having £600 off me in increased payments of 12 months @ £50). That covers the 2 months missed and the interest gained from that. It seems that the whole £773 is down to the fact that my due date is the 20th of the month and they do not get my money direct debit until the last day of every month. I have never been informed that I am getting charged interest nor has anyone ever said to me that I am having lots of interest put on my account because I get paid at the end of the month and it is always going to be a week later that they get my money. Surely they cannot charge me near on £800 in interest for 3 years of one week later payments can they? I have been told that I have to wait up to 8 weeks for them to look at my complaint and that I must not cancel my direct debit of £250 even though my loan is paid off and this is interest for something that is not even my fault. If I had received statements then maybe I could have noticed that I was in arrears and questioned it earlier. I am so angry as I have already paid back over £7,000 for a £2,500 loan and if I have another 3 months left to pay then they are going to have had near on £8,000 off me.Is there anything that I can do? I have also just completed an application form with the FSCS for PPI since this was added to the loan without my knowledge or permission. That comes to over £1,000 but at this rate even if I get it back they are going to [problem] it out of me! I really don't know where to go with this and the stress is that I thought that on the run up to Xmas I was going to be £250 better off to be able to spend on my family.

[pdb1980]

Right first things first get the PPI sorted out

 

I can pretty much guarantee that the PPI will more than cover the what is outstanding plus a little left over

 

When did you put the claim in because it can take up to 8 weeks to sort it out?

[MrZ]

Yes you shpu;d claim back PPI and anything else they have unlawfully charged you.

 

If you are prepared for the fight this is the relevent legislation from the Consumer Credit Act:

 

77A Statements to be provided in relation to fixed-sum credit agreements

 

(1)The creditor under a regulated agreement for fixed-sum credit—

 

(a)shall, within the period of one year beginning with the day after the day on which the agreement is made, give the debtor a statement under this section; and

 

(b)after the giving of that statement, shall give the debtor further statements under this section at intervals of not more than one year.

 

(2)Regulations may make provision about the form and content of statements under this section.

 

(3)The debtor shall have no liability to pay any sum in connection with the preparation or the giving to him of a statement under this section.

 

(4)The creditor is not required to give the debtor any statement under this section once the following conditions are satisfied—

 

(a)that there is no sum payable under the agreement by the debtor; and

 

(b)that there is no sum which will or may become so payable.

 

(5)Subsection (6) applies if at a time before the conditions mentioned in subsection (4) are satisfied the creditor fails to give the debtor—

 

(a)a statement under this section within the period mentioned in subsection (1)(a); or

 

(b)such a statement within the period of one year beginning with the day after the day on which such a statement was last given to him.

 

(6)Where this subsection applies in relation to a failure to give a statement under this section to the debtor—

 

(a)the creditor shall not be entitled to enforce the agreement during the period of non-compliance;

 

(b)the debtor shall have no liability to pay any sum of interest to the extent calculated by reference to the period of non-compliance or to any part of it; and

 

©the debtor shall have no liability to pay any default sum which (apart from this paragraph)—

 

(i)would have become payable during the period of non-compliance; or

 

(ii)would have become payable after the end of that period in connection with a breach of the agreement which occurs during that period (whether or not the breach continues after the end of that period).

 

(7)In this section ‘the period of non-compliance’ means, in relation to a failure to give a statement under this section to the debtor, the period which—

 

(a)begins immediately after the end of the period mentioned in paragraph (a) or (as the case may be) paragraph (b) of subsection (5); and

 

(b)ends at the end of the day on which the statement is given to the debtor or on which the conditions mentioned in subsection (4) are satisfied, whichever is earlier.

 

(8)This section does not apply in relation to a non-commercial agreement or to a small agreement.

[stephie2]

Right first things first get the PPI sorted out

 

I can pretty much guarantee that the PPI will more than cover the what is outstanding plus a little left over

 

When did you put the claim in because it can take up to 8 weeks to sort it out?

 

I have already filled in the application to get my PPI back and sent it back to FSCS. My point is that I have already paid this PPI money out and should be able to have the full amount back without them conning me out of it by saying I owe all this interest when i shouldn't owe them anything.I never had statements because they never changed my address over from 2 years ago when I moved house. This is all down to the incompetence of their staff. If someone had told me right from the beginning that I was accruing interest because my payment date was one week later than the due date then I could have done something about it. They have all my contact numbers and could easily have got in touch with me that way to talk to me about it. I don't see why they should keep my PPI money that I paid over £1,200 for to cover interest put on through their companies fault.

[stephie2]

Yes you shpu;d claim back PPI and anything else they have unlawfully charged you.

 

If you are prepared for the fight this is the relevent legislation from the Consumer Credit Act:

 

 

77A Statements to be provided in relation to fixed-sum credit agreements

 

(1)The creditor under a regulated agreement for fixed-sum credit—

 

(a)shall, within the period of one year beginning with the day after the day on which the agreement is made, give the debtor a statement under this section; and

 

(b)after the giving of that statement, shall give the debtor further statements under this section at intervals of not more than one year.

 

(2)Regulations may make provision about the form and content of statements under this section.

 

(3)The debtor shall have no liability to pay any sum in connection with the preparation or the giving to him of a statement under this section.

 

(4)The creditor is not required to give the debtor any statement under this section once the following conditions are satisfied—

 

(a)that there is no sum payable under the agreement by the debtor; and

 

(b)that there is no sum which will or may become so payable.

 

(5)Subsection (6) applies if at a time before the conditions mentioned in subsection (4) are satisfied the creditor fails to give the debtor—

 

(a)a statement under this section within the period mentioned in subsection (1)(a); or

 

(b)such a statement within the period of one year beginning with the day after the day on which such a statement was last given to him.

 

(6)Where this subsection applies in relation to a failure to give a statement under this section to the debtor—

 

(a)the creditor shall not be entitled to enforce the agreement during the period of non-compliance;

 

(b)the debtor shall have no liability to pay any sum of interest to the extent calculated by reference to the period of non-compliance or to any part of it; and

 

©the debtor shall have no liability to pay any default sum which (apart from this paragraph)—

 

(i)would have become payable during the period of non-compliance; or

 

(ii)would have become payable after the end of that period in connection with a breach of the agreement which occurs during that period (whether or not the breach continues after the end of that period).

 

(7)In this section ‘the period of non-compliance’ means, in relation to a failure to give a statement under this section to the debtor, the period which—

 

(a)begins immediately after the end of the period mentioned in paragraph (a) or (as the case may be) paragraph (b) of subsection (5); and

 

(b)ends at the end of the day on which the statement is given to the debtor or on which the conditions mentioned in subsection (4) are satisfied, whichever is earlier.

 

(8)This section does not apply in relation to a non-commercial agreement or to a small agreement.

 

Oh I certainly will fight it out. If I have to take them to court to get it back I will. I am so mad that even though my loan is finished with them I still have to pay 3 more months of £250 to cover the interest put on by them when that should be it. They have had £7,100 out of me already for me borrowing £2,500

[MrZ]

Oh I certainly will fight it out. If I have to take them to court to get it back I will. I am so mad that even though my loan is finished with them I still have to pay 3 more months of £250 to cover the interest put on by them when that should be it. They have had £7,100 out of me already for me borrowing £2,500

 

Well they certainly wont write it off without a fight. At least thats my experience. You have very good grounds for refusing to pay it, and refusing to allow any refund to be used to set off any balance they claim is owing.

 

First things first is to document your complain, and then get the evidence you need. You mentioned you have already written and complained. Whats the status of that complaint and did it specifically address the issue of no statements being sent?

[stephie2]

Well they certainly wont write it off without a fight. At least thats my experience. You have very good grounds for refusing to pay it, and refusing to allow any refund to be used to set off any balance they claim is owing.

 

First things first is to document your complain, and then get the evidence you need. You mentioned you have already written and complained. Whats the status of that complaint and did it specifically address the issue of no statements being sent?

 

Yes I have written to the complaints department. Two letters have been sent to them and the status is that I have to wait 8 weeks for them to investigate. I have clearly stated in the letters that I have never had one statement although they cannot deny that they have been informed of my change of address due to having a car hire with them and that since that has been changed over and I have received statements regarding that account they cannot deny I have done so as it was done at the same time. For a period of time whilst I was changing my bank accounts I was paying by card over the phone and was never informed of any interest going on my account so again they can't get away from that and that also has been put in the letter. They have told me that if I cancel my dd with them then I will be charged yet more interest even though I argued that since my loan is paid off this £773 is purely interest and they are getting this out of me by saying give them 8 weeks when I have clearly stated what the investigation findings will show them as they were found out by the Account Manager in less than a day of him looking over the account and seeing the problem immediately! The problem they had is that since they have been put into default they have closed offices galore and mine has been passed around from pillar to post! I have quoted them on the fact that I have not had statements, not been told verbally or written despite having my contact numbers and address that I was ever accruing interest and that they are trying to con me out of money and should be ashamed of themselves when they have already had their money back as well as an extra £4,600 without having to swindle me out of yet another £773.

[pdb1980]

Yes I have written to the complaints department. Two letters have been sent to them and the status is that I have to wait 8 weeks for them to investigate. I have clearly stated in the letters that I have never had one statement although they cannot deny that they have been informed of my change of address due to having a car hire with them and that since that has been changed over and I have received statements regarding that account they cannot deny I have done so as it was done at the same time. For a period of time whilst I was changing my bank accounts I was paying by card over the phone and was never informed of any interest going on my account so again they can't get away from that and that also has been put in the letter. They have told me that if I cancel my dd with them then I will be charged yet more interest even though I argued that since my loan is paid off this £773 is purely interest and they are getting this out of me by saying give them 8 weeks when I have clearly stated what the investigation findings will show them as they were found out by the Account Manager in less than a day of him looking over the account and seeing the problem immediately! The problem they had is that since they have been put into default they have closed offices galore and mine has been passed around from pillar to post! I have quoted them on the fact that I have not had statements, not been told verbally or written despite having my contact numbers and address that I was ever accruing interest and that they are trying to con me out of money and should be ashamed of themselves when they have already had their money back as well as an extra £4,600 without having to swindle me out of yet another £773.

 

My advice would be to put the account in dispute as you don't agree with their figures I would also send them a SAR

 

You will need to send a £10 postal order to obtain this which takes up to 40 days

 

I would bet my life on the fact that the monies you owe is made up of the charges they apply to the account and the interest added to that

 

These are unlawful and can be reclaimed.

 

I got my PPi back but because it was done through the FSCS you will only get 90% back and also because its through the FSCS it will be of set against any outstanding balance this is because welcome are still in default and are collecting their loan book and owe fortunes to their own creditors and shareholders

[stephie2]

My advice would be to put the account in dispute as you don't agree with their figures I would also send them a SAR

 

You will need to send a £10 postal order to obtain this which takes up to 40 days

 

I would bet my life on the fact that the monies you owe is made up of the charges they apply to the account and the interest added to that

 

These are unlawful and can be reclaimed.

 

I got my PPi back but because it was done through the FSCS you will only get 90% back and also because its through the FSCS it will be of set against any outstanding balance this is because welcome are still in default and are collecting their loan book and owe fortunes to their own creditors and shareholders

 

Thanks for that and I certainly will take your advice. I have finally received this morning a statement of my account that I have never had in all the time I have been with Welcome due to them never changing my address. On there is numerous amounts ranging from £158 through to £15 for capitalisation which is crazy as my payments should only have been £198 which means for nearly a year nothing has been coming off my account. This is where the amount has come from.

 

What do I do when I get the SAR back from them?

[stephie2]

Also on there it shows the PPI of £1021.15 added to the loan which I never asked for and am claiming back. Will I also get interest on that paid back to me?

[pdb1980]

Also on there it shows the PPI of £1021.15 added to the loan which I never asked for and am claiming back. Will I also get interest on that paid back to me?

 

You will get a bit as you were paying interest on it with your repayments

 

My PPI was on the loan was £928 and I got back £1600 which included the interest

 

CAPITALIZATION thats welcomes way of showing interest which should reduce as the payments are made every month

 

A SAR will show every single bit of detail they have one you and I mean everything

[stephie2]

You will get a bit as you were paying interest on it with your repayments

 

My PPI was on the loan was £928 and I got back £1600 which included the interest

 

CAPITALIZATION thats welcomes way of showing interest which should reduce as the payments are made every month

 

A SAR will show every single bit of detail they have one you and I mean everything

 

Was that with the FSCS cut off? So I am looking at roughly £1500 really as mine was £1200

[MrZ]

Your interest on the PPI refund will be from the date of the each payment up to the time of refund. So your first payment made will have a little more interest than the second, which in turn will have more than the thrid and so on.

 

I completely understand what you are saying about the time they choose to apply interst to your account. In my case it was the week before my payment. I asked them to wait until after my payment to apply interest. I was told it could not be chnaged and it was based on when the loan was taken...in fact this was not the case. So I asked them to change my payment date to before the interest was applied. They made the change, only to find out later that they also then changed the date interest is applied, to again be before the payment date.

 

They know exactly what they are doing and why they do it. In my opinion the difficulty you will face is getting them to agree with your position and refund whats actually due back to you. In my experience this wont be easy.

 

Having said that you really have to be thinking ahead about next steps in the event they dont do what is fair. Your choices are the FOS or court. The FOS wont look into any "legal" issues. They will only base their decision on fairness....assuming they actually do their job. The other option of court can be very expensive, all the more so given the amount in dispute.

 

As pdb suggests, send your SAR, then take some time to go through every detail of it and your statements. Work out the figures for yourself and then put your complete case forward to Welcome and see what they say. For each new complaint they are given 8 weeks for a final response before the FOS will look at it. It makes sense to put everything into one complaint instead of having multiple compliants and timelines. And yes Welcome will treat each letter as a separate complaint.

[stephie2]

Hi all Just an update to let you know that I won my PPI money back. They gave me a total of £2,036 back. I actually didn't get this back as I still had until February to pay for my car (a seperate account with welcome) but it just means that my car is now paid off in full. They still state that I owe £500 on my personal loan for all the interest that they put on for me paying at the end of the month instead of the middle (unknown to me) but I have stopped payments for that until I get the information back from the SARS. I have already paid them £800 over what I owed and I refuse to pay anymore until I get the SARS and more information.