1st Credit

[Tigi]

I wonder if anyone is able to help me I am having some problems with 1st Credit here is a timeline of events.

 

20/08/2005 - Letter received from Wescot confirming £50 a month acceptance of payment.

25/05/2005 - Letter confirming reduced amount of £5 a month acceptance of payment.

19/11/2009 - Letter from 1st Credit demanding full payment within 7 Days

6/11/2009 - Letter from 1st Credit chasing possible address for client

08/7/2010 - Letter from 1st Credit chasing possible address for client

09/07/2010 - CCA request letter sent recorded to 1st Credit for proof of debt

08/09/2011 - Letter from 1st Credit chasing possible address for client

19/09/2011 - Letter from Northern Rock Plc confiming debt sold to 1st Credit in 11/01/2006

23/09/2011 - Letter threating legal proceedings unless £10.00 is paid for copy of documents and payment arrangement made.

 

Please can someone tell me where I stand on this, not been paid since June 2005 from what I can gather but I need to get that confirmed (exact date trying to be found out) and I have no paperwork anywhere as ex destroyed all documentation I ever had.

 

Thanks

 

Tigi

[42man]

If you have not made any payment towards the debt in 6 years (5 in Scotland) or acknowledged in writing or via a recorded telephone conversation then it is likely to be statute barred - send this letter recorded delivery - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/content.php?408-Letter-sent-when-debt-is-statute-barred

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Check your credit reference files

first, check if the debt is still on them,

if it does not show then It's a good

indication that it may be statute

barred.

The check with Northern Rock as to

when the last payment or acknowledgment

was made.

The £10.00 is a fee for a subject

access request for all data held

it seem to me that you have asked

cor more than just the credit agreement.

[Tigi]

This was the letter that was sent to them regarding CA.

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

 

On 21st November 2009 I made a formal request for a true-signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8. This was signed for document sent by Royal Mail and I have proof of posting.

You have failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on 5th December 2010.

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document. In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

 

Furthermore, you are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

 

This limit has expired.

 

As you are no doubt aware section 78(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

 

(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

 

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As you have failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested. You will also be aware of the CPUTR 2008 and the OFT's guidelines on debt collection which state under the title Deceptive and/or unfair methods - Examples of unfair practices are as follows - 2.8

 

(i) - 'Failing to investigate and/or provide details as appropriate, when a debt is queried or disputed, possibly resulting in debtors being wrongly pursued'

 

(k) - 'Not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonable queried or disputed debt'

 

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

Furthermore I shall counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect.

 

This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed Breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data.

 

It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends.

 

Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY

Action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

 

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* You may not pass the account to a third party.

* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit.

You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

I can see their thinking, which is why

I advise to keep things simple and to

the point without recourse to abstracted

bits of various statutes, basically all you needed

to say was this is a CCA request under sect 77/78

of CCA 1974 here is the fee of£1.00 you have

12+ 2 days to reply, imho you have complicated

it so much that it reads like subject access request

which is why they want the stat fee of £10.00.

And actually the only restraint on them is that

they cannot enforce court action, but they can start it,

when a debt is disputed.

[Tigi]

They have left it a year before replying to the letter therefore are way out of their timeframe to reply in and the letter was suggested to send from here, it was also checked by CAB and apparently it was the correct letter to send confussed have only sent what I thought was correct on advice given, hence why I am confused as to what to do as they seem to ignore all letters you send to them anyway.

[Bazooka Boo]

It matters not that they have spent a year before replying to your request, but I think you are missing the point.

 

42man posed the question when the last payment was that you made on this?

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

When you want the credit agreement

it's a simple uncomplicated request for

a copy of the agreement and a statement

of the account sent with the fee of£1.00.

For ALL the other information you need to

do a Subject Access Request to the Original

Creditor,that's the letter it seems you have

sent.

If you want all the information send the £10.00

as it seems they are going to send the SAR

to the OC for you.

[Tigi]

From what I can see last payment was recorded in October 2005 I can not find anything to prove this as ex distroyed everything I had financial.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Could SB next month but could

be November depending when

the payment was made.

There is no harm phoning the

original creditor and asking for

the information.

[Tigi]

Thats just the problem Northern Rock are saying unless I can remember what the details are they cant speak to me due to Data Protection but because I dont have any information on it they wont speak to me. Im trying to get the information from the Bank see if they can come up with previous bank statements.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Do you have an account number?

Have 1st Credit Given any original

account details>

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Do you have an account number?

Have 1st Credit Given any original

account details>

[Tigi]

They have given a Credit Card number but no other details, Northern Rock want a password that was put on the account when it was opened.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

I think you could get round this

with a SAR to the bank, I take it

that you have not changed your

name and can verify any changes

of address??

[Tigi]

have no proof of name or address (name changed), ex destroyed all of that too arnt I the lucky one to meet such a lovely person

[Bazooka Boo]

Well IMO if you can't prove to the bank or the DCA that you are tied to this account then I seriously fail to see how they are ever going to attempt to do so in a court, ignore them.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Any old personal docs might

help.

Otherwise if you can be sure that

you would have made no payments

or acknowledgments since October

2005, I would do as Ist Credit have

suggested and send the the £10 to get

all the data.

I'm suggested out at present.

[Tigi]

Thanks for all your help though, I know what you mean ive been racking my brain too, gonna see what the bank can come up with too.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Keep us up to date Tigi.

[Undercover-Elsa]

They have left it a year before replying to the letter therefore are way out of their timeframe to reply in and the letter was suggested to send from here, it was also checked by CAB and apparently it was the correct letter to send confussed have only sent what I thought was correct on advice given, hence why I am confused as to what to do as they seem to ignore all letters you send to them anyway.

 

No wonder you're confused Tigi - not your fault - that template letter WAS the standard one in 2009. It was later revised in the light of various court cases, so some parts no longer apply. I've attached a copy of the OFT guidance on what to expect from a s 77-79 request.

Noetheless if you enclosed your £1 fee your request is still valid and as such the debt cannot be enforced by a court till they comply.

It may well be Statute Barred as 42man originally said. Have a read of my blog linked below, in it you'll find links to the SAR template. Send this to the Data Controller at Northern Rock, include your name and address at the time you had the account and ask for all data they hold on you. Enclose a £10 postal order, send by recorded delivery.

 

Elsa x

OFT-section77-79Requests.pdf