un1boy vs Black Horse **WON**

[un1boy]

Well, I'm doing this for my Dad - he called them and asked for a list of charges, so they sent them to him - free.

 

Sent the prelim, no reply. Due next week.

 

Will keep you posted!

[un1boy]

Issued LBA - no reply.

 

So, MCOL issued!

[un1boy]

MCOL issued - got 7 more days to acknowledge!

[milant123]

so......

 

 

did they acknowledge??

[un1boy]

yup, the barstewards!!! grrr....

 

Just realised, they part of LTSB, so I hope they don't drag it ut like LTSB do!!

[un1boy]

yup, the barstewards!!! grrr....

 

Just realised, they part of LTSB, so I hope they don't drag it out like LTSB do!!

[roscodog18]

Hi Un1Boy,

I've nailed MBNA credit cards next on my long list is Black Horse finance.

 

I've had no reply to prelim and LBA letters........so perhaps filing a Court Claim in Scotland for for £422.00 in charges and interest on a vehicle finance agreement that is now complete will make them sit up and take notice of me. I certainly was not ignored by them when they took every opportunity to send me a letter and charge me.

What particulars of claim did you use? Was it a modified template? I'm new to this so any help would be appreciated.

The charges were late payment charges when Lloyds bounced direct debits, charged me then Black Horse charged me as well.........no wonder Lloyds make so much money, a cosy little cartel they run!

 

Thanks in advance

 

Roscodog

[un1boy]

Hiya,

 

Here's the POC I used:

 

Claimant has account (A/C No) with Defendant from (Date)conducted on their standard terms and conditions. Claimant is claiming the return of money taken by Defendant in charges over 6 years. The Defendant's charges are a disproportionate penalty and therefore unenforceable as they are contrary to common law. They are also invalid under the Unfair Contracts Terms Act 1977 s.4 and under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.Para.8 and sch.2.1.e.

In the event that the charges are not a penalty they are unreasonable within the meaning of the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982 s.15. Defendant has declined justification of charges despite repeated requests. Claimant claims interest under Sec.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8% a year from(Date) to (Date) of (£0.00) and also interest at same rate up to the date of judgment or earlier payment at a daily rate of (£0.00).

 

 

They didn't reply to my LBA either, they have just acknowledged my MCOL caim though!!

 

Good luck and keep me posted!

[un1boy]

Ok, so they have acknowledged and entered a defence. the solicitors have written to me saying that they will offer me £100.00 because they don't understand where I got my figure from.

 

They are having a laugh - there's the usual bull about if i took this to court I would probably lose etc etc but the whole claim is for just over £400.00.

 

Now, the thing is that the statement I received only had one entry for charges, which had been compounded and added on one date. The solicitorss reckon that they happened on different days so the interest I have claimed isn't correct. I don't understand why they would say that - it will cost them more if I calcualted the interest from the dates of the charges -duurrgghh..

 

I'm a bit worried, but I'm going to accept this as part payment until the full amount is credited.

 

Another problem is that they reckon £90.00 of what I am claiming is a service charge for setting up the HP agreement - should I deduct this from the balance or tell them I want it?

 

I can't believe they've offered this - not even the court costs, the cheeky barstewards!

 

I post my reply and their full letter as soon as I can!!

[roscodog18]

Hi,

when I set up my finance with Black Horse, they took the setup fee with the first payment, at the end as with most hp agreements there was a £50 'option to purchase' fee, the vehicle is still technically being rented to you until this is paid.

I have not tried to reclaim either of these charges only late payment fees and the interest that was charged on them.

 

Roscodog18

[sezj127]

Hi there. Im gonna be keeping an eye on your thread as im waiting for my hubby to get back thursday evening, before we start his claim with BH. He got a letter while he was away saying as there were just short of £200 of charges added to his account, they will continue to collect his monthly D/D till they are satisfied. Just a quick question though...did they ever return a breakdown of charges for you or just a total amount? Only asking this as i have the full amount (due to their snotty letter) but to add my 8%, before MCOL, i would like to know dates, etc. Many thanks if you can help.

[un1boy]

Hi,

when I set up my finance with Black Horse, they took the setup fee with the first payment, at the end as with most hp agreements there was a £50 'option to purchase' fee, the vehicle is still technically being rented to you until this is paid.

I have not tried to reclaim either of these charges only late payment fees and the interest that was charged on them.

 

Roscodog18

 

Thanks for this - £90.00 of my calim is for an doc/opt fee which I thought was a carge, so I will wrtie back to them saying that I am happy to deduct this IF they prove it is a service fee (as it oesn't say it clearly and when I spoke with someone on the phone, they told me it was a charge fee!!) so, we will se waht they say.

 

When i get the letter I have been sent (my dad is sending it up to me) I will post their leter and my intended rely for you guys to check over, if that's ok?

[un1boy]

Hi there. Im gonna be keeping an eye on your thread as im waiting for my hubby to get back thursday evening, before we start his claim with BH. He got a letter while he was away saying as there were just short of £200 of charges added to his account, they will continue to collect his monthly D/D till they are satisfied. Just a quick question though...did they ever return a breakdown of charges for you or just a total amount? Only asking this as i have the full amount (due to their snotty letter) but to add my 8%, before MCOL, i would like to know dates, etc. Many thanks if you can help.

 

Well they applied all my cahrges in one go by the looks of it. The solicitors letter questions the interest because apparently tey were applie at differeent dates - I can only go by what BH sent me, which I will send back to the solicitors showing that they compounded all of the charges.

[roscodog18]

I paid my late dd charges at the end of the agreement, these charges and the interest that was applied to them was itemised on my final statement.

 

My agreement is complete and I have a letter stating that they have no further interest in my van so there is no chance of any retaliation for me.

 

Roscodog

[un1boy]

That's interesting - I sent a request for the final statement and got something that had compounded the charges in one go.

[roscodog18]

Hi,

here is how it appeared on my statement, note the ref for Collection activity,Returned payment fee and Late payment interest is 0000 for all 3!

 

 

 

Roscodog

[un1boy]

Got the letter- I will post their letter in full, and my reply when i can- my comp blew up so struggliong to get time to do it...

[un1boy]

Hi,

here is how it appeared on my statement, note the ref for Collection activity,Returned payment fee and Late payment interest is 0000 for all 3!

 

 

 

Roscodog

 

Hiya, thanks loads for this - it is a bit small though. WOuld you mind emailing me it? If not, please PM me and I'll send you my email address.

[un1boy]

Ok, so as promised, here's the letter SCM wrote to me:

___

STRICTLY WITHOUT PREJUDICE SAVE AS TO COSTS

 

We act on behalf of Black Horse Limitted and have filed a Defence to your legal proceedings.

 

However, our client does not consider it economically viable to become involved in contested proceedings for the sums in question.

 

We have considered the statement of account from our client, which shows that £xx was debited to your account in respect of collection activity charges and £xx in respect of late payment interest.

 

We do not thefefore understand where you obtained the figure of £xx.

Futhermore, you seek to claim statutory interest on the sums you seek from the xxxx February 2004 when in fact the individual amounts became payable at differing dates and the first cannot have been until November 2004 when the first direct debit mandate payment was unpaid.

 

Therefore, it is our client's position that the maximum you would be entitled to recover if you proved the allegations contained within your claim would be £xx subject to you providing evidence of the cost of the postage, your calculaiton of the interest and other matters raised in your claim.

 

Without any admission of liability fir any sums whatsoever and purely in an effort to avoid escalating legal costs which would not be recoverable by either party, we are instructed to offer you the sum of £100 in full and final settlement of all claims in respect of this matter.

 

Upon receipt of your written acceptance we will immediately arrange for a cheque to be sent to you on the understanding that you will discontinue these legal proceedings.

 

We thank you in anticipation of your attention and look forward to hearing from you.

____

 

I'll post their defence and my reply in a bit.

 

Sorry for the delays, but I don't have a scanner so I am typing these all up......in between everything else I am doing!

[un1boy]

Here's the defence:

 

• It is admitted and averred that the Agreement in question was a regulated Consumer Credit Agreement conducted on the then standard terms and conditions of the Defendant and that collection administration charges were made in accordance with those terms at various times when payment defaults occur.
  
• The Defendant believes that the collection administration charges recovered in relation to the Claimant’s Agreement do not, pro rata, exceed the actual administrative cost to the Defendant for collecting overdue sums from the customer generally. Obviously it would be impractical to calculate the precise annual cost in each and every instance and therefore standard charges have to be used.
  
• It is specifically denied that the Defendant is in breach of any statutory provisions listed by the Claimant in his claim or that the charges made were disproportionate or unreasonable or a penalty in common law. The Claimant is out to strict proof of these allegations.
  
• It is therefore denied that the Defendant has any liability to the Claimant either as claimed or at all.

[un1boy]

As promised, here's my reply:

___

I am writing in response to my letter dated xxx November 2006 in which you offer a settlement for the above claim.

I respectfully decline your offer of settlement and request, once again, that you return to me all charges imposed on this account, totaling £xxx. I would like to remind you that a daily interest rate of £0.07p is payable from the date of issue until the date of payment and also extra postage costs are £7.75, these are in addition to the balance.

You mention in your letter that you do not understand where I obtained the figure of £xxx based on the statement of account. The statement I received from your client included under total charges £90.00 with the description of “Doc/Opt Fee”; after calling an advisor in the Black Horse credit department, I was advised that this was a charge applied to the account due to missed payments etc. I would consider deducting £90.00 from the total balance I am claiming upon checking through your evidence that this “Doc/Opt” fee has nothing to do with late payment charges and the like.

You also mention in your letter that the dates of Statutory Interest became payable from different dates. The information I have used to compile my Claim have been taken directly from the last Statement Document I received from your Client and are therefore correct to the best of my knowledge. If you are able to provide any other evidence for me to consider, please feel free to do so.

 

In summary, I will accept the sum offered of £100.00 only as part settlement and on the clear understanding that I will pursue recovery of the remainder until the full balance of £xxx plus the daily interest plus the extra costs I have incurred since your recent letter, has been received, without withdrawing the County Court Claim until I have received the above balance in full.

 

I trust this clarifies my position.

___

 

Hope all this is he;ping you guys....I know not many people are posting in this forum and especially not for Black Horse!!

[juliekaye1982]

Hey, im going to keep an eye on this as Blackhorse are next on my hitlist!!! fingers crossed tey pay up soon!

[roscodog18]

Strange that collection activity and returned payment fees all end in .00 pence despite being an accurate reflection of Black Horses actual costs.............or am I just being cynical?

 

roscodog

[un1boy]

Hey, im going to keep an eye on this as Blackhorse are next on my hitlist!!! fingers crossed tey pay up soon!

 

Hi Julie, please do keep an eye on it.....hope all this info on this thread helps!

 

If anything I have mentioned in a thread has helped, please press the scales in the bottom left and tell me!!

 

Good luck with your claims!!

 

Keep us posted...

[un1boy]

Strange that collection activity and returned payment fees all end in .00 pence despite being an accurate reflection of Black Horses actual costs.............or am I just being cynical?

 

roscodog

 

Not at all Rosco, that's a very interesting point.

 

Although one of the points in their defence is that they cannot accurately calculate how much it is for each individual!!!