Lewis/Cohen claimform - merged GE money debts 3rd time.. **WON DISCd**

[monyl]

Hi Elsa

 

I have located two documents on my computer:

1. Reply to my SAR from CL Finance dated Nov 2008 on their ‘Account Notepad’ states ‘incoming letter from Defendant requests documents under CCA, enclosed fee.

 

2. Reply from GE Money re HBOS loan in December 2008, notes that account was sold in August 2008, no date of any Default Notice noted on the account. Also undated items of ‘transactions made to your account when administered by HBOS Personal Loan and list of dated ‘transactions made to your account when administered by GE Money’

 

No date of Default Notice or Notice of Assignment shown on any documents although the Notice of Assignment dated 29 September 2008 was sent along with a batch of documents with the other cases.

 

Anyway back to hunting through paperwork

 

Monyl

[Undercover-Elsa]

hi Monyl,

OK, well done. Good. Proof they haven't sent one..without which they can't enforce. Let's see how they handle that in their response to your disclosure request (31.14).

[consumeredge]

Hi monyl

 

In my opinion you need to be very clear what you want to achieve, do you dispute the claim full stop, in which case you intend to prove CL Finance Limited were never assigned the account absolute therefore they have no claim against you or standing in the court, or that you acknowledged the outstanding balance as owing to CL Finance Limited even if only administered by CL Finance Limited on behalf of HBOC, and merely wish to continue repayments at the rate of £25 per month.

 

The Lewis group aka CL Finance Limited aka Howard Cohen & Co monitor these forums, you have supplied enough detail for them too positively identify you.

 

Have you sent notice to Howard Cohen the account is in dispute and you will not be making the agreed monthly payments whilst legal proceedings are ongoing?

 

Again, in my opinion, the key to any defence would centre on the actual payments you have made, to that end I’ve enclosed 10 questions which if answered, when compiling any defence I would urge you to heed.

 

1. I have never disputed the loan (around £6K) with CL Finance Limited and made arrangements to pay £40 monthly.

How many payments of £40 did you make and when did you first make a payment of £40?

2. With the economic climate, petrol prices, rising cost of shopping and the cost of having to buy equipment for college, I got into problems with a beauty supplier for a nail kit (£66) which unfortunately was no good.

Reasonable mitigating circumstances to which Howard Cohen & Co term as "irregular payments" however, they normally only action if this occurred on 2 consecutive calendar months.

3. I forgot to make a payment and got a nasty letter from them to resume payment.

What was the date of CL Finance Limited/Howard Cohen & Co’s letter?

4. I contacted them and told them what had happened and they wanted a new income and expenditure.

Did you agree and forward a new income and expenditure statement?

5. I explained that I could only now afford £25 instead of £40

 

6. I paid the first £25 and received a 'notice of legal action' letter

On what date did you first make this reduced payment?

7. I telephoned again and found that they were not happy with the reduced payment

Why did you need to call them?

8. I spoke to four people that day, in the end, the last gentleman accepted my offer of £25.

Did you take the names of the people you spoke to and the date/time of the telephone call?

9. I made the payment and continued to do so.

How many actual payments of £25 have you made to date?

10. I then received another 'notice of legal action'

Considering point 6, have you received 2 "Notices of Impending legal Action"?

Normally, if Howard Cohen & Co pursue court action, if payments are reduced, yet unbroken, and they had been informed; they know they have no case and that the court would frown upon them. They will not submit a witness staement and offer you a consent order, under the pretex "in order to reach a statisfactory conclusion without the need to incur further costs......................"

 

All the best

 

Kind regards

 

C

[consumeredge]

The opening statements 1 to 10 are taken from your original post

[monyl]

Hi Elsa

 

Can they not just 'make one up' and produce it for the court hearing?

 

monyl

[monyl]

Hi Consumeredge,

 

Thanks for this, it is food for thought.

 

To address your first paragraph.

Everything obviously went wrong when I lost full time employment and all the companies starting renaging on my PPI policies.

It has been a nightmare trying to sort them out, let alone fighting debt collectors who would not listen to the disputes that I had with the companies.

 

The worst being Howard Cohen/CL Finance who appear to have the script to transfer straight to court before they even contact you.

At this moment, I do not know for sure if they purchased the debt in the correct manner but due to the stress of the other cases I agreed payment as it was affecting my health as it is doing now again.

 

I tried link for account in dispute but could not find relevant letter.

Do I need to put something together and send before I send defence?

 

I will attempt to answer your questions.

 

1. I need to check with bank again tomorrow.

I did go into branch on Friday and tried to get statement but computers were down (I don't do internet banking).

 

2. I only recall missing one payment around time I enrolled for course and bought equipment.

They sent letter immediately insisting payments were resumed which I did at the reduced rate.

If I had missed any payments in the past, they would have written to me, they would not have ignored me sending a payment.

 

Also in the past they have telephoned me on my mobile enough times checking if I had more money to pay as they had to right to contact me every 3-6 months to review my circumstances.

 

3. 12 May 2011.

 

4. When I responded to the 12 May letter, I explained what happened.

They took my income and expenditure over the phone, it was never done in writing on either side for both amounts (please note, it has been very stressful and I know better now).

 

6. Again, have to check bank and get back to you but think around May/June.

 

7. Letter dated 24 May 2011 headed 'Notice of Pending Legal Action' (no deadlines noted in letter to reply), I rang as it looked serious and I was told that they were not happy with my payment.

 

8. Yes, I have date and their names especially the lady who was horrified at the payments I was making to my cable company.

She would not listed when I was trying to explain that it included my phone line/broadband, tv package.

She was absolutely livid.

 

She was also saying that I should not be going to the cafe for my meals at college as i was spending too money there and should be buying my lunches in my shopping budget and wanted a good explanation why I felt I had to do this.

I dont even want to relive this telephone call, she was horrific.

 

9. About 2-3, again, will check.

 

10. Yes, I thought the second one had crossed with the chap accepting my payment and as there was no deadline in the letter again.

Also I thought if it was about the payment, they would have simply rang me.

 

I could not believe that they really think I'm going to rob a bank and give them what I have not got in light of the fact I'm trying to come off benefits and this will just complicate my employment prospects.

 

Will let you know the rest asap.

 

Regards

 

monyl

[monyl]

Hi Consumeredge

 

I spoke to the bank today and according to them the first payment of £40 was made in Oct 2010 (total 7 payments made).

I made a payment of £20 in May two further payment of £25 for June and July.

According to them I have not missed a payment yet their letter dated 12 May 2011 states that no payment had been received since 7 April.

 

Difficulty is I cannot get print out from branch relating to payments for some reason and the lady spoke to another department today who confirmed that I had not missed a payment. I will have to double check the dates again with Head Office in the morning.

 

I do know that the lady acting for Howard Cohen/CL Finance was livid because she calculated that I had £40 extra a month which she could have (without taking into account me buying clothes for my son and I which she said did not count and totally discounted my college course and equipment).

She was absolutely furious.

 

monyl

[Undercover-Elsa]

Hi Monyl,

Re DN - they could, and might, but if it's not noted on the comms log of the time that one was said that would make them look rather silly.

 

Really need to be on the ball this week.

If you haven't received anything from them by tomorrow, you will need to ring their solicitors and ask when you can expect compliance with your 31.14 request and confirmation of the extension of time.

 

you need to pin them down to an extension date (14 days after they supply the docs, to allow you time to prepare a defence.)

You then need to ask them to supply confirmation of the new extended date for filing defence, in email and followed up in writing.

 

This is important.

Upon receipt of that you need to contact the court and inform them of the extension, and send them a copy of the email.

This must be done by the end of this week.

 

IF they refuse a time extension then you will need to issue an N244 before 4pm Monday which (since the 33 days for submitting the defence ends on 6th-Saturday) is when your defence would have to be in if an extension isn't agreed, by my calculations.

 

Can someone else double check this please?

 

Elsa x

[consumeredge]

　

Hi monyl

 

You will need to contact your bank to confirm the exact dates of all payments to CL Finance Limited from October 2010 until August 2011

 

You will also need copies of your monthly bank statements from October 2010 until July 2011

 

From what you’ve stated you entered into a verbal concessionary repayment agreement with CL Finance Limited, to repay the outstanding balance of £6k owing to HBOS to CL Finance Limited, your first payment commenced October 2010.

 

You’ve done nothing wrong and whilst its upsetting their manner and unprofessional attitude towards you, you are in a very strong position to have the claim struck out.

 

Unless you have something in writing between CL Finance Limited and yourself that you agreed to pay a fixed £40 per month, the agreement is verbal and subject to your financial circumstances at any given time, whilst CL Finance Limited can ask you to increase the monthly amount if after a revue your income and expenditure account this shows a surplus above £40, however, you are entitled to decrease the amount of monthly payment if your financial circumstances worsen at any time.

 

The defence in my opinion is that having entered into the verbal agreement, and making payment, your financial situation worsened through the supply of faulty goods nesassary for your college course, as a direct result you had to make financial payment adjustments to offset unforeseen unrecoverable financial losses.

 

CL Finance Limited verbally agreed to accept reduce payments to £25, however, whilst CL Finance limited verbally agreed and accepted reduced payments, CL Finance then unlawfully issued a summons against you dated the 4th July 2011.

 

When you disputed the claim, CL Finance Limited stated non-payments from 7th April as to the reason for issuing said summons.

 

This is disputed and you can prove to be a false accusation

 

Bank statements of account will disclose continuous payment has been made since first entering into the verbal agreement.

 

The Claimant’s Particulars of Claim mislead the court, as they do not sight the true reason for issuing the summons, the Claimant solicitor conceals important facts

 

Name names and dates of the calls.

 

The Claimant will be obliged to provide the court and defendant with true copies of all Statements of Account from Oct 2010 to June 2011 for account number xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx to cross reference with your own bank statements.

Edited August 2, 2011 by consumeredge

[consumeredge]

I would like to say as well you are on benefits, this is a minimum payment to provide you and you son the basics to live on, never lose sight of that, in this present climate you are doing remarkably well to make any offer of payment at all.

 

All the best

 

Kind regards

 

Clive

[monyl]

Hi Elsa

 

From my previous dealings with Howard Cohen and CL Finance, the telephone number on all documents sent from Howard Cohen, are answered by CL Finance staff.

I do not recall ever speaking with Howard Cohen solicitors in the past.

 

I did not want to give them an email address for obvious reasons,

can I not just record the name of the person that I speak to or failing that,

ask that they need to email the court their confirmation.

 

I am really not comfortable with them having access to my email address for any reason.

Not with the difficulties I have had with them in the past,

they are a ghastly company to deal with.

However I will see what comes in the post tomorrow by late afternoon.

 

Please read my comments to Consumeredge next, it just goes to show how stressed I have been that I believed I had actually missed a payment when according to the bank I had not only reduced it!

 

I have to stand corrected.

I am so stressed out, I believed as well that I had missed a payment.

 

The bank have confirmed that I have request and pay £5 for the backdated statements as they cannot print an itemitised list of transactions that were made to the Lewis Group.

 

I double checked the date with them and apparently I have not missed any payments.

 

These are as follows:-

 

The events of college took place early May hence payment date missed.

 

I received their letter dated 12 May 2011 insisting that payment is resumed.

 

I telephoned (cannot remember date) and explained circumstances, think case was put on hold.

 

I then paid £20 on 25 May 2011, being all I could muster up.

 

Their Notice of Pending Legal Action is dated 24 May 2011 (I had not received this before I made payment).

 

I spoke to numerous persons on 3 June 2011 as to why I had received notice (big commotion with lady in CL Finance re £40 extra left over

- I made four telephone calls that day arguing with them (I have taken their names)

then final person agreed to the £25 (made on 8 June).

2nd Notice of Pending Legal Action dated 3 June 2011.

Payment of £25 sent on 5 July 2011.

 

I think CL Finance sent a letter confirming the payments last year (have to look for it) but I have never put confirmed or put anything in writing.

 

Where do I find 'account in dispute' letter please?

 

monyl

[Undercover-Elsa]

Hi Monyl,

You cannot trust them to contact the court, unfortunately.

It's your responsibility to inform the court, and you must have written confirmation.

Last thing you want is a CCJ by default o you must let the court know.

 

Don't stress, you can easily set up a free disposable email account eg @live.co.uk purely for using for this purpose.

Or, as I mentioned before I think, sign up for a free online fax service and get them to fax it.

 

I've recently finished putting this together

- it's the main points from the legal action advice stickies, and should give you a better picture of how it works, as it is very confusing..

pt-legal issues-compilation.pdf

[monyl]

Hi Elsa

 

Eventually managed to speak with HC after repeated phone calls, receptionist kept trying to transfer me to CL Finance.

 

Gentleman found my letter, stated that they would respond within 7 days from today.

He could not give actual dates as he was not person dealing with case but He would also ring court to inform them.

 

He said confirmation letter would be sent out today but would not take the email address as it was not made up of personal info, for example, no personal name in email address (i have his name and number).

 

I rang court to inform them of current situation, advised I could send info by email which I have done.

Going to read your 'pointers' with a cup of coffee.

Monyl:frown:

Edited August 3, 2011 by monyl

[Undercover-Elsa]

Well done!!!

So what's the new deadline for filing your defence? (If they're goin g to respond in 7 days, should be 14 days after you receive it...)

[monyl]

Hi Elsa

 

Received letter from CL Finance,

no dates in letter,

just stating that they will respond in days.

 

Sent another CPR 31 request today for the actual Deed of Assignment as I was not sure if they would enclose it as part of the Notice of Assignment.

As they had not started putting paperwork together, hoping they include it.

Going to finish nurse my migraine.

 

monyl

[monyl]

Hi Elsa

 

Well, I received some news and had to wait for it to be confirmed.

HC have sent me a Notice of Discontinuance after they finished stressing out my nerves.

 

They will not say why, only that they are not continuing with the claim!!

I was too mentally exhausted to even feel happy about it.

 

Thanks so much for your support on this but I am not stopped holding my breath yet

[Undercover-Elsa]

Monyl,

That is wonderful news!!!!!! Why the glum face???

 

These companies issue thousands and thousands of these claims, scattering them like messages in bottles.

 

In the many cases they don't have the paperwork to hand, either haven't bothered checking or may even know it doesn't exist.

They do it in the knowledge that a high proportion of people will panic and pay up, or do nothing so they get a judgement by default.

 

If you stand up to them as you did, unless they can get their ducks in a row with docs, sometimes it all becomes too much trouble for them, hence the discontinuance.

 

One last thing,

don't forget to check with the court whether they have informed them.

If they haven't, send in a copy of their Notice of Discontinuance just to cover yourself, cross the t's and dot the i's.

 

Obviously keep all the documents relating to this safe.

 

Well done, I know how stressful it's been for you, after all you've been through, but you did it!!

 

Elsa xxx

Edited August 13, 2011 by Undercover-Elsa

[monyl]

Hi Elsa

 

Sorry but had to catch up on some other urgent bits.

My face is glum because this is the third fight I've had with CL and HC over the past couple of years.

 

I've actually had to face their solicitor who tries to intimidate you into settling before you go into the room and it is very distressing overall, to the point that you do not wish to be in the court process in the first place.

 

the court have confirmed that the case has been discontinued in writing.

Meantime, I've had to complain to FOS again and SAR about both companies, I hope they are disgusted with themselves.

Will keep in touch, thank you for support.

 

Monyl :-/ (nearly smiling)

[tosh1]

well done. my nerves are on breaking point as i am about to start my fight with hc too.