Ingeus

[Nystagmite]

I wonder if she'd be saying the same if she was your mother? I doubt it.

[Dazza1983]

I doubt it as well.Bad enough that i have to see my advisor every day from next week for daily job search until i finish my time at Maximus at the end of May.The reason is because i have not found myself any job interviews for a while.I was also told everybody has to do this when they are near the end of the Work Programme which i know full well is a lie.Im thinking its the fact they are desperate to put me in any job so they get the bonus.

 

Just today when i was in there there was a guy being threatened with sanctions because he is meant to be starting a course tomorrow but he has got himself a work trial.They wouldn't let him avoid the course unless the company offering the work trial phoned Maximus.

[sillygirl1]

That is wrong on all counts, perhaps you could report them to the local MP for preventing a job seeker from starting employment as they would loose money due too him not attending one of their courses - which is designed to help him into work....

[Nystagmite]

I would hope that a decision maker would see some sense and not sanction the guy. He is after all, clearly doing what he can to seek employment.

[Dazza1983]

I would hope that a decision maker would see some sense and not sanction the guy. He is after all, clearly doing what he can to seek employment.

 

Agree.The poor guy must have spent 10 minutes trying to get them to just excuse him from the course.I got chatting to him and he used to go to a different Maximus branch where he was treated a lot better but when he moved house they transferred him to my local Maximus.I would say which branch it is but i dont want anybody from there seeing this (Unlikely as there only a few members of staff who work there) as it would probably make things worse for me.

[Dazza1983]

Another day.Another argument with my Work Programme advisor.Following on from what i mentioned the other day after the interview i had for the part time job my advisor has said today that she has sent a report about my interview to the jobcentre and that they will almost certain sanction me.When i asked on what grounds can they sanction me she couldn't give me an answer.When i said jsa claiments are under no obligation to take a part time job which is less than 16 hours she went silent.

 

She is still badgering me to get my parents not to charge me rent if i do get a part time job.She has given me until 4 o clock to get them to change their mind and if they do i have to walk straight up to the place where i had the interview and tell the guy i saw I'm interested in the job.I have already told him that both at the interview and in a phonecall i made to him later in the day.I have to phone her at 4 o clock either way.

 

I have a hospital appointment shortly and i may not be able to call her today.All this stress isn't helping me.

[Nystagmite]

I was on JSA about 4 years ago. One of the first things I asked my adviser was "do I have to take a job under 16 hours?" The advisers response was no. I was told that if I did take a part time job, (

 

The impression I got was, it's my choice. The unltimate goal is to get me off JSA and into meaingful full time employment.

 

People at the job do (or did) sit down with you and work out how better / worse off you are if you take a job.

[essexmat]

The reality is that all work isn't meaningful, sustainable or makes you better off - including seasonal work

 

When I started JCP(JSA) 2 years ago and then moved to the work programme I made it totally clear that I would not, under any circumstances, take part time work or any work that does not make me at least £50pw better off being off of benefits. They both tried to argue with me that getting a foot in the door was better than being on benefits and when I produced a spreadsheet showing what 12-16 hours would earn me less travel costs, council tax liability etc I proved it was not sustainable especially with rent to pay.

 

INGEUS will try everything to convince you that being in any employment is better than claiming benefits - the truth is, in the large % of case you won't be - especially if zero contract and hours changing weekly.

 

When I was asked what wage I was looking at and told them I was told "You are very unlikely to get that around here" so I said I was also looking at going back to London to work IF the salary was right.

 

You then get them trying to dumb down your CV - why should I and many others take their work experiences, achievements and qualifications off a CV?

[Nystagmite]

And if you dumb down your CV, you're going to have to explain those gaps...

[essexmat]

And if you dumb down your CV, you're going to have to explain those gaps...

 

Quite right

[Mr.P]

She is still badgering me to get my parents not to charge me rent if i do get a part time job.She has given me until 4 o clock to get them to change their mind.

 

You need to tell this "advisor" that your accommodation and financial arrangements are none of her business and when you want advice on such matters, you will seek proper guidance from a qualified expert.

 

Perhaps a simple "I don't think that is really any of your concern..." to start with, and then build up to a full blown verbal slap down.

[Nystagmite]

I find it quite rude that advisers feel it's ok to mention stuff like this. I remember mine being shocked that I was living at home rent free. I should point out, that I'd lent my parents a large sum of money and it was a bit silly to pay rent just for my parents to give it back to me. And so, it was agreed that until the money was paid back, I'd live at home rent free.

[Dazza1983]

You need to tell this "advisor" that your accommodation and financial arrangements are none of her business and when you want advice on such matters, you will seek proper guidance from a qualified expert.

 

Perhaps a simple "I don't think that is really any of your concern..." to start with, and then build up to a full blown verbal slap down.

 

Yeah i think it is time i stop being so polite with them.When she found out recently that i watch the football team i support every week (I bought my season ticket from the money i got when i had a temp job) she moaned about that.She said the other day that if i get a sanction i wont be able to afford to watch them in the fa cup semi final next month.(That gives you a clue to who i support) Seems she is also my finacial advisor:roll:

 

Its just annoying that before Christmas i had a different advisor who i got on really well with as we both support the same football team and he only put me forward to jobs that i have done in the past as well as actually being really helpfull.

 

Maybe i should start asking her personnel questions.Where she lives.How she spends her money.

[Dazza1983]

And if you dumb down your CV, you're going to have to explain those gaps...

 

Yeah iv never understood why they want you to dumb down your C.V. I had mine sent off by Maximus to a company who were so called experts in producing good C.V'S.Mine came back with about 10 spelling mistakes and it was badly worded.

[Mr.P]

Maybe I should start asking her personnel questions.

 

Might I suggest you keep the conversations business like. In the hope of a change in government come May, the prospects of the Work Programme continuing in its present form is under threat. Perhaps give her some advice on job hunting and budgeting on a paltry £72.40 per week.

[citizenB]

TJ Rodgers, having deleted a similar post just a few moments ago and having advised you by post why that post was deleted, I did not expect to see you repost..

 

CAG is not interested in this type of witch hunt.

[Dazza1983]

Well i am not very popular at the Maximus branch i go to.The manager of the sandwich shop where i had that interview last week has made an official complaint to Maximus and will no longer be using them to help him fill job roles at his company.

 

Maximus are now panicking about this and getting their manager to talk to him.All this happened whilst i was there for jobsearch.My advisor walked over to me whilst i was job searching and told me.I tried to keep a straight face and not laugh which i wanted to.She also said that when i sign on tomorrow that the jobcentre may talk to me about it.No idea why as it isn't my fault.

 

I went into the jobcentre today as i had to walk past it anyway.They have not heard anything about this and there are no sanctions on my claim relating to it.When i told the jobcentre about the interview they told me not to worry and that the Maximus advisor is talking crap.

 

This Maximus branch is closing down in a few weeks anyway and i have to go to one further away.

[Mr Happy77]

Can anyone offer any advice on stopping Ingeus contacting me.

 

I was sent to them in Dec 2012, went through the fortnightly meetings and in Jan of last year found a job. This was without any help from them.

 

I had believed there was a 2 year time limit to my stay with them but recently they have begun ring and harrassing my family while I am at work demanding to know details of my employers so they can 'close the books'.

 

Is there a time limit on how long they can keep contacting me. Do I have to give them details of something which they have had nothing to do with mi.e. my job.

 

Any advice would be gratefully appreciated.

[Nystagmite]

Unless things have changed, there is a 2 year limit. The 2 years runs from the date you started to engage with them - for you, that's December 2012.

 

You don't have to give them any details if you don't want to.

[Mr.P]

I had believed there was a 2 year time limit to my stay with them but recently they have begun ring and harrassing my family while I am at work demanding to know details of my employers so they can 'close the books'.

 

Presumably you were a mandatory participant, not that it really matters... Ingeus are required to engage with you for the two years that you were on the programme, and also offer "support" whilst in employment for six months if you request it. If you have already verbally instructed them to cease contacting you, they should respect your wishes. As they are contacting other family members to elicit employer's details, then I would suggest a letter sent to their local office and head office. Something along the lines of:

I do not require any "support", help, or advice from your staff. I do not consent to you contacting myself, family members, or employers. Any attempt to do so will be treated as harassment under the Protection From Harassment Act, 1997, and also in breach of Article 8 of the European Convention of Human Rights. Be advised, any further attempts to elicit personal information will be reported to the relevant authorities, and if necessary, legal action against the individuals involved.

 

If you have any trouble understanding the above, I would recommend you seek qualified advice.

 

You are under no obligation to provide the information they seek. Indeed, there is anecdotal evidence out there on the web of people having lost their job after a W2W provider made contact with the employer.

 

If Ingeus continue to harass you or your family, then a formal complaint to the JCP/DWP may be in order.

[trebormoinet]

Hi,

Been referred to the dreaded ingeus scheme.

 

Has anyone used this template on / refuted.org.uk/2013/10/12/withhold/

 

It seems to address the main issues I have with these people but I fear getting a sanction if I kick up a fuss before I even begin, would it be easier just biting my tongue and keeping my head down ?

Edited March 27, 2015 by honeybee13
Pejorative term.

[Mr.P]

Been referred to the dreaded ingeus scheme.

 

You have our sympathies.

 

As far as data protection goes, the Work Programme providers are 'data processors' acting on behalf of the DWP. It is the latter who are the 'data controllers' as far as the Data Protection Act is concerned. Therefore, withdrawing consent does little to protect yourself from their more questionable activities. By all means inform Ingeus that you do not consent to personal data being shared with third parties, but also send the same letter to the DWP.

 

You will be asked (possibly under threat of sanction) to sign some forms. Read them carefully, and if need be, insist on taking them away for a second opinion. If there is anything that you do not like, decline to sign them (even if they offer to cross out the offending sections). Quite often, DPA consent will be tucked away in the main body of their "agreement"...

 

It wouldn't hurt to print out extracts from the DWP issued provider guidance where it states that failing to sign a form is not subject to a benefit doubt. Back this up some Freedom of Information requests from the DWP on the subject - This will demonstrate to the Ingeus "adviser" that you are familiar with the guidance that they should be operating to and perhaps treat you with a little caution & respect.

[essexmat]

Hi,

Been referred to the dreaded ingeus scheme.

 

Has anyone used this template on / refuted.org.uk/2013/10/12/withhold/

 

It seems to address the main issues I have with these people but I fear getting a sanction if I kick up a fuss before I even begin, would it be easier just biting my tongue and keeping my head down ?

 

May god be with you!

[trebormoinet]

Looking at the main parties manifesto there doesn't seem to be an end in sight to this regime of treating the unemployed as criminals and deviants unworthy of a life and forced into an miserable existence.

 

IMO there should be a radical overhaul where common sense and decency play a part in how we treat our population.

 

1 The country needs a decent stock of unemployed people as a resource for new and expanding businesses.

 

2 Without unemployment the weight of power would fall to the workers who could negotiate higher wage better conditions and fair hours, not something businesses would consider a healthy environment.

 

So by its very nature it is inhuman to punish people who are part of the natural order of things as though they were part of the problem, when in fact they are part of the solution.

[fletch70]

There is nothing to divide labour and conservatives. To be honest, and this may not be popular the only real hope for change are the greens or the lib dems. Looking at the parties they are the only two socialist parties.

 

What is wrong with full employment, it served the country well in the post war years, the welfare state was born and paid for, it was only in the 70's that this changed. Full employment will lead to an increase in wages yes, so perhaps a living wage will be paid. If this is the case the welfare bill will drop as there will be less in work benefits as well as the unemployment costs.

Reading what you have posted the words that spring to mind are 'New Right' i.e the ideology that influenced my dear friend Maggie may she burn in hell.

 

The benefits of full employment (full employment does not mean zero unemployment BTW ) are huge, less expenditure, greater income therefore the welfare state can do what it should be doing, looking after the sick and disabled, providing a good NHS and decent retirement for the working person