58 on courses..trying to get self employment...and sick of being read the JSA riot act!

[Elliebes]

Just a general rant here....So far Im on two courses...one is for working voluntarily in a well known advice agency and the other is an effort to become self employed on my own initiative...and looking for jobs inbetween.......I am working my ass off................I went to sign on the other day and the woman behind the desk never even asked for or looked at my JOB LOG. I always make a note of it on the log that it wasnt looked at.

 

At the end of the little chat about my necklace and my family situation and my business ideas she then she told me you have now to sign another jobseekers agreeemnt. In this agreement we will be looking at and checking on any jobs that you have applied for and that you get given to apply for by the job centre. If we find you are not applying for these jobs then your benefit will be stopped so will your housing benefit and so will your council tax benefit? THREAT THREAT THREAT with no consideration for the the fact that you ARE actively seeking work and trying to better yourself or get off benefits.

 

I thought that they always did check on your job applications? Do they think I am so naive as to leave myself wide open for not having any evidence of my applications or searches? Sometimes I dont know how I manage to control myself. They just come out with these THREATS as though your a complete liar and waster.

[leemack]

I think maybe they're spelling it out more because there's been a lot of criticism that many jobseekers were unaware that applying for jobs given to them by the jobcentre was mandatory or their benefit would be stopped. A lot of people had been thinking these were just suggestions and weren't applying for any that seemed unsuitable. Were it me, I'd rather have all the information, even if it comes over as a threat, than have the wrong information and have my benefit stopped.

 

But yes, I expect it sounds harsh, but hopefully will lead to less sanctions.

[sillygirl1]

JSA is independent from Council Tax and Housing Benefit, they know that but think you don't....

 

I am 53 and in the same position as you, cited the work I do on CAG as voluntary work, as well as work I do for another charity, I upset them the other week when I went to sign on as I had applied for 10 jobs one week and 7 another.... and taken my phone bills with the phone calls made jobhunting highlighted, one colour for agencies and another for employees! Last time though they just said 'thanks,' and left it at that.

 

I am expecting more hassle next Friday but have already written up my job log, listed hours done doing 'community and charity' work and marked phone bills appropriately - hoping to have a couple of interviews next week though. They came up with one job but it was based too far away, the company were recruiting via a local office and the job was based in Cambridge. Another job centre job was for a school who wanted people with experience of the school (very christian denominational based school) and I didn't meet all the criteria.

 

I believe some of these job centre jobs are 'created' to make people apply for them just to help their targets, same as the agencies who ask you in to do their tests and then tell you you are unsuitable or they have only got a job at £7.50 an hour, despite the fact that you are a senior PA! I flatly refused to do the tests in one agency and got a call back asking me why, when I told them they said they would call the jobcentre and say I didn't turn up. I said 'try it and see', I have proof I was here by taking a picture outside as I came in on my mobile phone. That shut them up.

 

These box ticking exercises work both ways and at some point they have to stop (I used to do a lot of audit so know you have to close the circle, otherwise it is a complete farce).

 

Changing the goalposts all the time isn't productive, can't produce jobs from nowhere and doesn't help people get off benefits.

 

What the government HAS to do is put a stop on all jobs being farmed abroad, that hurts the economy in two ways, one the job is no longer available for UK people in the UK, two it keeps people off benefits and in work - SIMPLES

[sillygirl1]

BTW they haven't got the staff to check up on every single job, and people the 'other end' will not have the time or staff to constantly reply to the jobcentre so again a huge double whammy own goal.

 

If they checked up on every job I've gone for that would take one person 1 day. Is this what the 'volunteer staff' will be doing?

[Elliebes]

Gawd youve lost me now - what volunteer staff??

[caledfwlch]

BTW they haven't got the staff to check up on every single job, and people the 'other end' will not have the time or staff to constantly reply to the jobcentre so again a huge double whammy own goal.

 

If they checked up on every job I've gone for that would take one person 1 day. Is this what the 'volunteer staff' will be doing?

 

Oh, some of them do try!

 

I spent a few weeks working in the office of an awful agency last summer, and there were 2 or 3 calls a day from the Jobcentre wanting to check if X person applied for X job - by order of the management though, all requests were filed into the bin, no company has the time or the money, or the will to do the Jobcentres job for it, and its quite rude of them to expect it, not to mention a lot of agency branches will be signing up hundreds of people a week, and receiving 100+ applications for every single vacancy, it would not be remotely possible to track who applied for a job.

 

Used to enjoy the hissy fit phonecalls that would come in from the DWP employees a couple hours later because they have not been rung back with the info - "can I speak to a consultant/or manager" "no, sorry, they are busy working" It was very tempting to add, "unlike you, who is probably only doing this to either make your sanction victim hit list look good to your manager, or to look busy whilst doing bugger all useful"

 

I am sick to death of Working Links. Asked about training - they told me to contact the local training providers and there was me thinking that was what THEY were getting paid to do

 

I have a fairly bad shoulder injury, after being attacked 10 years ago, which is unlikely to ever get fixed due to its nature, and now some trapped nerves due to it, they know this, or they should since it went down on my forms with them.

 

So guess what work trial they offered me the other week? with a wholesalers lifting and moving boxes!

 

I did a CIEH Level 2 food hygiene certificate last year - Jobcentre sent me on one of those week + long courses, where they throw various stuff at you to add to your CV, so we did that, and a CIEH Level 2 Health and Safety in the Workplace, and some equality/discrimination training, and First Aid Appointed Persons training.

 

So they rung me up after the wholesalers fiasco telling me they had arranged for me to go on a work trial at a local pub as a Chef! err why? I asked rather bemused, not knowing the first thing about Chef's other than they wear silly hats - "You did a food hygiene certificate" they said. Yes, said I, and I did a first aid AP course too, will you ring me up tomorrow asking me to go on a work trial as a Surgeon up in the Hospital At least doing that, I would likely kill less people, than trying to be a Chef!

 

I would have thought that an "employment consultant" would have a clue what qualifications meant, and what they were for, or am I hopelessly naive?

 

They are also going on and on about how I have to do a trial before their contract runs out this month, and are trying to put the onus on me to find one! Not my problem in the slightest, thats their job, and its what they supposedly have contacts for, and its what they are being paid to do, I don't give a brown lump if they lose their bonus I cannot be sanctioned for not finding a work trial by the end of this month, its not my responsibility, nor is it in my agreement. AFAIK, at most, your Jobcentre advisor you sign on with can mention to you that you can point out in applications that you are able to do work trial, if you think it will help, but nothing "official" and like I say, nothing you can be punished for.

[jadeybags]

ROFL @ brown lump.

Sorry that just tickled me

[seen this before]

it might be during the conversation that it was picked up on that the jobseekers agreement was considered inappropriate and needed amending,you look to be taking a wide and varied outlook which is great for you. however it could mean they will start adding additional conditions to the agreement expecting more and more,be careful when doing voluntary work as this cannot be seen to interfere with the main objective of looking for paid employment.

 

the problem with council tax benefit's its linked to the jobseekers claim when one stops the other does too.

[sillygirl1]

Council Tax is NOT linked to Jobseekers allowance, I got council tax benefit and housing benefit from day 1 of my redundancy and only got JSA after several months. I don't know where seenthisbefore got that info from. It's been clearly stated on this forum that the JSA/ESA is SEPARATE from (or to) Council Tax and Housing Benefit.

 

You may be confusing the fact that when you come off JSA they inform the Housing Benefit people.

 

To find out what you really can claim go to

 

www.entitledto.com

 

and enter your details, this gives a very accurate picture at any time.

[seen this before]

normally when you sign off the council tax benefit stops also,if you you don't tell them they'll soon let you know and send an amended demand.you may be able to apply for as separate but they are normally claimed with jobseekers at the same time.

[leemack]

normally when you sign off the council tax benefit stops also,if you you don't tell them they'll soon let you know and send an amended demand.you may be able to apply for as separate but they are normally claimed with jobseekers at the same time.

 

Although they are claimed at the same time, this is to simplify the application process. They are separate claims from the start. Any changes should be notified to both. And if a qualifying benefit for HB/CTB stops, then the council need to be notified immediately - it doesn't always stop immediately, and sometimes doesn't stop for months leading to an overpayment.

[Elliebes]

Yes I know the HB and the CT are separate entities.

 

Perhaps I should have said that to the Advisor because she was lumping all three in as the BIG FRIGHTENER! I will be ready next time.

 

As for voluntary work I always tell them I will be dropping everything if a job comes along.

[seen this before]

i think you have them sized up well elliebes.

 

yes they are claimed separately but in the case of jobseekers applied for at the same time hence they finish at the same time,they were on me ( the council) like a ton of bricks for not telling them when my jsa stopped even threatening a fine.

 

independently you can claim it separately on a low income as the better off in work calculation shows however it tails off very quickly.

[leemack]

i think you have them sized up well elliebes.

 

yes they are claimed separately but in the case of jobseekers applied for at the same time hence they finish at the same time,they were on me ( the council) like a ton of bricks for not telling them when my jsa stopped even threatening a fine.

 

independently you can claim it separately on a low income as the better off in work calculation shows however it tails off very quickly.

 

No, HB/CTB will only finish if you are no longer entitled to it - not just because JSA has stopped. You don't have to claim 'independantly', the same claim just carries on, when the JSA finishes you provide proof of your ongoing income and savings. The claim gets suspended or cancelled, not because the JSA claim stops, but because people don't notify the change of circumstances - so it looks like the person is claiming based on JSA, when in fact the JSA stopped and they have not declared their new circumstances - otherwise known as fraudulently claiming - whether intended or not - at least that's how the council see it.