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County Court Claim Form Received - Please Help Me !


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Hi, please can someone help. I've just received a County Court Claim form - I've never been to court before! I ignored their threats as I figures they didn't have a valid agreement and would never take any action.

 

I've attached what I think are the most important documents I've received over the years on this account. I CCA's the creditor back in 2009 and was given what looks like an application form (which I've just noticed I only received copies of pages 1 & 3, not sure if the other two were on the back f the originals [on the back side of pages 1 & 3]).

 

Can anyone tell me if this is enforcable ? Should I get a solicitor ? I'm very worried that I have very little time to respond and not sure what the best course of action is.

 

Please see letters/docs attached.

Docs.pdf

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Last made a payment in June 2009 when I CCA'd them and didn't get a proper credit agreement back. What do you think of what they've issued as a credit agreement, there are pages missing and I can't see any APR on there.

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Don't have time though, court docs have been issued and I've got little time to get paperwork from them (if they even bother responding in time) SAR gives them about 40 days doesn't it ?

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I'm sure you can ask for documents as part of the case.

 

Don't have time though, court docs have been issued and I've got little time to get paperwork from them (if they even bother responding in time) SAR gives them about 40 days doesn't it ?
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Re your application form, where is page 2 & 4

 

They were not provided.

 

Reading through OFT1272 under 3.6, it says that "Further, section 172(1) provides that a statement given under section 77, 78 or 79 is binding on the creditor or owner."

 

Does that mean that whatever they provided me it all they can now use ? i.e. they can't dig out the other pages in court and say 'here you go, here is the full application form' ?

 

Also, I've checked and they didn't issue a statement of account along with the CCA request. Does that have any bearing ?

 

Towards the end of OFT1272 it says that "If your case is taken to court, you can ask the court not to go any further (called a stay of proceedings) until you get the information you entitled to."

 

Not sure what my next move is, do I go to court and say 'here is what I was given in response to my CCA request which is not binding on the creditor (and hopefully unenforcable, no APR etc showing on there) or do I ask for a stay of proceedings claiming that they didn't provide the right information under the CCA request (but would that give them the opportunity to change what they gave me & enforce the debt) ?

 

Really confused and the more I read, the more confused I get !!

Edited by inthewind
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After further reading it looks like I need to use CPR 31.14 to request sight (or copies of) documents they use in their particular of claim, one of which should be the complete CCA (which they've yet to provide). Is it best to send this request to the creditor and send a copy to the court or does the court not need to know what I'm doing other than my request for them to hold the case while I seek further info ?

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Thanks. Yes, have read that and half a dozen other links I've seen. I think it's a case of information overload as I've read so many things I think that's what's throwing me off track

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  • 4 weeks later...

Can anyone help me please ?

 

I sent off my CPR 31.14 asking for:-

 

The agreement

Deed of assignment

Deed of sale

Default notice

 

I've heard nothing back from the creditor and now need to submit my defence ASAP. Can I get this struck out ?

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Hi Inthewind

 

In the Clowns letter dated 26th Sept 2008 advising that they are now the assignee along with the default and recall of all the balance

they state " on behalf of MBNA to the extent that they are still a creditor " so one would question who is the legal owner The Clowns or MBNA?

The breach they refer to as 1b and 8 is rather puzzling as in A&L,s T&Cs the terms are not numbered.Rather strange!!!!

 

What date is your defence due? Have you considered asking for an extension of a further 28 days to allow more time for them to dream up more nonsense?

 

Regards

 

Andy

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The postman has just delivered their reply (see images)

 

The letters they refer to from 2007 & 2009 are covering letters I sent with an income & expense summary (i've not uploaded them).

 

Their response refers to my CPR 31.14 request which stated

"Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of each of the following documents mentioned in your Particulars of Claim.

 

  1. The agreement. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

  1. Deed of Assignment.

 

  1. Deed of Sale.

 

  1. Default Notice."

 

 

19 - Link Response - Page 5.jpg

 

No idea where I stand now ? Can I ask for more time ? What other info can I ask Link for ? (They've not provided a Deed of Sale, or a default notice).

 

EDIT: Sorry, my defence is due by the 9th of July. How do I get a further 28 days ?

18 - Link Response - Page 4.jpg

16 - Link Response - Page 2.jpg

15 - Link Response - Page 1.jpg

17 - Link Response - Page 3.jpg

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Uploads are too small ITW need to repost as you did in post 1.

 

Andy

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Mmmmmm August 2004 they purchased the debt and on the 28th Sept 2008 they issue a Default Notice (For the full amount 4 years later).

I assume you never received a NoA from either MBNA or these Muppet's?

Can you confirm what payments and to whom were made from the initial DN from A&L 27th May 2004 (they requested the arrears/ over credit limit only

on a credit limit of £1K.

 

Regards

Andy

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First default notice issued on 21st July 2004 by A&L (image in pdf of opening post), then letter dated 11th August 2004 from MBNA (who A&L were a part of) simply said "your outstanding balance due under the above agreement has been sold to Link Financial", then I paid Link for a number of years (minimal payments as was in & out of jobs), they (Link) then defaulted me on 26th Sept 2008. As for the credit limit, I guess it has been increased since I took it out initially (probably to £2k, but not sure).

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First default notice issued on 21st July 2004 by A&L (image in pdf of opening post),states 27th May 2004 on my PC not that it matters then letter dated 11th August 2004 from MBNA (who A&L were a part of) simply said "your outstanding balance due under the above agreement has been sold to Link Financial", You have not uploaded that, that is the NoA then I paid Link for a number of years (minimal payments as was in & out of jobs), they (Link) then defaulted me on 26th Sept 2008. As for the credit limit, I guess it has been increased since I took it out initially (probably to £2k, but not sure).

 

Andy

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Check all the balances from its departure to Link (DNs Statements/ Summons) etc.

The agreement is not compliant as per the prescribed terms of the CCA1974.

Links DN requests the full amount not the arrears.

Link have debited the account with legal fees pre court this is a penalty charge and should be argued.

You will have to check if any unfair interest as been applied.

Have you received annual statements from link and regular Notice of Arrears?

Have you received conformation of your payments and do you know how much in total you have paid them?

 

I really cant see much point in requesting an extension now as they have complied with your CPR request and therefore its your choice whether to

continue and submit a defence on the bases i have outlined above.The above could be used effectively in bringing them to an agreement.

 

Regards

 

Andy

We could do with some help from you.

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Check all the balances from its departure to Link (DNs Statements/ Summons) etc. - Thanks, will do

The agreement is not compliant as per the prescribed terms of the CCA1974. - Is this my best argument as it's a pre 2004 agreement so judge should just throw the case straught out ?

Links DN requests the full amount not the arrears. - Could this be due to the age of the debt ? i.e. it was owed and not paid for so long that it was effectivley all in arrears ?

Link have debited the account with legal fees pre court this is a penalty charge and should be argued. - Thanks, I didn't even know they couldn't do this !

You will have to check if any unfair interest as been applied. - They froze interest back in 2004 when the debt was passed on. Do you mean prior to that ?

Have you received annual statements from link and regular Notice of Arrears? - Not a statement as far as I'm aware, but just letters every so often.

Have you received conformation of your payments and do you know how much in total you have paid them? - From 2004 onwards, most were by Standing Order but not really received confirmation of them being applied to the account. I could go through my bank statements and see if the debt reduced as per my payments, but that may take a while...

 

I really cant see much point in requesting an extension now as they have complied with your CPR request and therefore its your choice whether to

continue and submit a defence on the bases i have outlined above.The above could be used effectively in bringing them to an agreement.

 

Regards

 

Andy

 

As the account is pre-2004 is my best defence just that it's not a compliant agreement and therefore the judge can't enforce it, should that not make it 'end of story' and case closed/thrown out ?

 

Any advice on how to word a defence, does it have to be all technical or can it be in simple (layman) engligh. i.e. I defend the case due to a non compliant CCA due to................ etc etc ?

 

Also, is it worth be pursuing the deed of sale and a copy of the default under a subject access request or another CPR route ? Could this help me find another chink in their armour, or is the non compliant CCA enough ?

 

Thanks again for all you help, it means a lot to have someone help out and point things out you'd never even known to look for.

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Basing a defence on that point alone ( unenforceable agreements) can be risky and as such should be researched thoroughly.

So that you can argue your plea as to why its unenforceable.

However throw a few more points in to bolster your defence and then it may have merit.

With regards to assignments they have sent you the NoA and also via your CPR request the DoA I see no argument that they have not follow

the requirements of informing you of the assignment but if the amount valued in the notices is incorrect it can render said NoA invalid again something you need to research thoroughly to argue.They will not state the figure purchased at as this is deemed sensitive information between the assignor and assignee.

 

A defence should refute the claimants PoC so look at their statement of case and break it down.You dont have to draft it in legalese your own words are fine as long as they make sense and have merit.You can imply and aver points even if to cast doubt, try not to refer to case laws at this stage and keep it simple.

One simple point of law is enough to swing it for the DJ in your case the fact that no statements or more particularly no Notice of Arrears have been furnished since the assignment is in itself enough to provide problems for the Claimant.Check the CCA2006 amendments and the consequences of not issuing these notices.

You will find that whilst the Claimant continues to neglect this he may not enforce the agreement and therefore that becomes the crux of your defence.

If these companies wish to purchase debts that have been wrote off and tax claimed by the OC then a responsibility comes with that purchase and conditions to be met to comply with Act. Not just to be purchased with the sole intention of litigating on them.

 

Another point in their P.o.C is the reference to the breach numbered and in the T&Cs of the agreement.As I have already high lighted A&Ls T&Cs dont have numbers

and therefore the breach that they refer to is nonsense.Put them to proof to show this breach and explain their numbering.

 

Digest the above ITW and post back if you require any further assistance.

 

Regards

 

Andy

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

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