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    • Hi everyone   Yesterday I got an email from the councillor I'd first contacted, asking me if things had improved. I thought I'd show you all my reply:     "Thank you very much for contacting me. Unfortunately, my original message to you achieved absolutely nothing (though I'm sure you did your best). I have made further efforts to fix this problem, but to no avail, and it has got to the point where I feel I'm just talking to myself. I contacted the Worcester News and they ran an article, but when they approached Platform Housing, its response was totally unhelpful. I contacted my MP, Harriett Baldwin, but she got the same unhelpful response when she approached them. I then emailed Elizabeth Froude, Platform's CEO, but she did not reply. I emailed her again, with the same result. Platform is simply refusing to enter into any dialogue whatsoever. Its chief excuse regarding this change to our computer setup is that they want to protect residents' information, but I am deeply sceptical about this, because for one thing, they actually removed residents' long-standing protection a long time before they made this change. When I first came to The Firs, anyone who wanted a private account on the computer could have one: this meant that when you switched the computer on, you saw several icons with usernames beside them, you clicked on yours, then put in your own unique password to get into the computer. If you needed to save the odd file, this was in your account only, behind that password an inaccessible to other residents. But a couple of years ago, this was all changed: suddenly there were no private accounts, and not even a password to get onto the computer. If you saved a file, it was there for all to see, so you had to remember to copy it onto a USB stick then delete it from the computer, or just download the information directly onto the USB stick from the Web. But if you wanted your information secure, that was no problem. But now they've locked us out of the computer with Kiosk Mode in the name of security, and as you can see from what I've just written, it appears to be a bogus excuse. Platform has supplied a printer, but it's useless to us. There's no paper, we don't even know if there's ink, and worst of all, there's no way of knowing how it interfaces with the present setup of the computer. If I wanted to print out an email right now, I wouldn't have the faintest idea how to do it, and I'm one of the most computer-savvy people here. The other problems persist: 1) No copying and pasting. If I wanted to insert a link into this email, it would be impossible. I'm going to give you a link to a Platform Housing publication later on, but the only reason I'll be able to do it is because I've borrowed someone's laptop to write this message. 2) No ad-blocker. The Chrome browser had an ad-blocker that worked fine, but now they've switched us to the Edge browser, we're plagued with ads. Some websites are almost unusable. The Daily Mail and Guardian, for instance, are full of animated popups that distract the eye, and the Mail has so many ads, the whole screen jumps up and down as the ads load, for minutes on end. Youtube videos are interrupted ever couple of minutes or so. The thing is, Edge has its own ad-blocker, made by Microsoft, but Platform will not enable it, and we can't enable it ourselves, as all controls are locked away from us. I've asked Platform to enable it, but just got a flat refusal. 3) We still can't upload anything from outside the computer. For instance, if I were seeking your help on a matter that was affecting my health, and I needed to show you a letter from my GP, until recently that would have been easy: just scan it, put in onto a USB stick, write an email to you and attach the letter. Now, that is simply impossible. One very important thing to note is that in its treatment of Firs residents, Platform Housing is going against everything it claims to stand for when it comes to digital inclusion for its tenants. Here is a pdf of its 'mission statement' (which, I should remind you, I could not even link you to using the Firs computer): https://www.platformhg.com/download.cfm?doc=docm93jijm4n6904.pdf&ver=10036 Its treatment of Firs residents renders this publication meaningless. I hope you will contact Platform again and try to get its staff to engage with us. Thank you."   I copied Platform Housing's CEO into the message. Probably won't do any good, but it's made me feel that at least I'm trying.
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Bank passed account over to Collections without giving me a chance to meet manager


noonakai
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We feel absolutely let down and ripped off by our bank for a lot of reasons that I won’t go into for fear of ranting! I wanted to ask for opinions on one relatively small aspect of the aftermath of it all – We were sent a letter of concern and immediately made strenuous efforts to meet with our bank manager to discuss our account with him. He mysteriously became incommunicado at a critical time (as he had often done in the past) and would not return any emails, letters or phone calls. They then started chasing for arrears.

Leaving aside our main grievances – did the bank behave properly by passing our account over to Collections without first giving us a chance to discuss things with our manager?

Incidentally, we did complain about this. I sent Lloyds a copy of an email I’d sent at the time asking our manager to contact us and suggesting times to meet and referring to phone calls we’d made in the weeks before. It was proof in black and white that we’d been proactive and the bank dealt with it by ignoring it! We sent it to them eight times! We also gave them a copy of a letter we’d sent recorded delivery to show how hard we had been trying to talk to people. The bank responded by ‘mixing’ up the dates of the letter with another one we had sent months later after the account had been given to Collections. As they were going on recorded delivery notices attached to the letters I’m not sure how they did this accidentally. Anyway, I digress......

Should the bank have passed our account over without giving us the opportunity to discuss it first? Any feedback would be really appreciated. Thanks!

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Hi there

 

I'm no expert but I would think this is against he banking code as I am sure thay are required to make reasonable attempts to discuss matters with their customer first and to take on board individual circumstances. Having said this, nothing about bank conduct surprises me anymore.

 

Not knowing the detail behind this, in answer do your direct question, I think it is out of order and complaint should be made through Lloyds normal process for complaints and escalate it from there. However, there appear to be other things going on as well so it is difficult to put it into context.

 

ims

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Thanks so much for this, it's appreciated. I think it backs up my gut feeling but I'll go through the Banking Code as you suggested to find out more. I've kept the main complaints (ie our original dispute) separate so as not to confuse the issues. Right now, I'm trying to pick individual points on which to fight and I'd love to be able to say that whatever the rights and wrongs of the case, Lloyds went about things improperly, and hopefully our arguments will accumulate.

 

You mentioned complaining direct to Lloyds - everything to do with that account goes to a Glen Davies and he is the one who insistes we did not contact the bank before it was passed over. He is the one to whom we keep sending the email and he is the one who somehow managed to 'misdate' the letter we sent. Absolute proof in black and white just being ignored again and again until we're dizzy with frustration! Anyway - if they're trying so hard to avoid admitting this then yes, perhaps they know they've done something wrong.

 

Okay - thanks for your feedback!!

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Hi

 

As I said, I'm no expert but there are probably OFT and FOS guidelines as well.

 

Others will comment as well I've no doubt.

 

I'll watch with interest to see how this pans out.

 

Best wishes

 

ims

Edited by ims21

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  • 1 month later...

I am returning to this post because the last few months have been incredibly frustrating.

I have been sending Lloyds incontrovertible proof of my case and they have been ignoring it to the point where I think I'm going slightly mad

I want to highlight just one example - there are many, many others. I'd really appreciate any feedback.

Ok - one complaint is that Lloyds passed over my account to Collections without giving me a chance to meet my manager and discuss my account and grievances first.

Lloyds' position is that they were trying to contact me and couldn't and that I never contacted them. This is rubbish and I provided them with several pieces of black and white proof that this was not true. One example was an email I wrote to my manager, Ben Kimball, on 21/02/09 in which I said:

“This is just a quick heads up to let you know that Tracie will give you a ring again on Monday. If we do not hear back from you could you email us a suggested date for us to meet? After half past three on any week day would be fine, for example.”

I think the email clearly shows that:

· First the date – 21/02/09 is well before the Formal Demand of payment of 12/03/09.

· Second it refers to Tracie phoning ‘again’ which is evidence that we were trying to contact Mr. Kimball even before the 21/02/09.

· Third it shows I am contacting him to give him notice of a call rather than trying on spec. This shows we were making a real effort to make contact and not a token one.

· Fourth ‘if we do not hear back from you’ hopefully gives a sense that we were already having difficulty getting him to reply.

· Fifth ‘could you email us a suggested date for us to meet?’ This shows that even though I was having difficulty getting hold of him I tried to set in place a ‘Plan B’ where he could be guaranteed to get information across to me.

· Sixth to further help him I suggest dates.

· Seventh these dates are not obscure ones – I will be available at times covering every day of the week!

In a nutshell – I had been trying hard to get hold of our bank manager.

Mr. Kimball never replied. I have tried desperately to get Lloyds to acknowledge all this:

· On 21/02/09 I sent them a copy of the email

· On 05/05/09 I wrote to Lloyds enclosing my email correspondence.

· On 27/07/09 I again enclosed the email to Lloyds

· In a letter of 06/09/10 I refer to the emails specifically

· On 03/11/10 I refer to the email again

· On 01/12/10 I refer to the email again!

· On 22/02/11 I quote clearly from the email and complain that no one has acknowledged it.

· On 05/04/11 I specifically ask them to comment on the issues they’ve ignored (including the email.)

· I have since complained in writing about the refusal to acknowledge the email two more times

And yet Lloyds simply do not mention it – it has disappeared from history and yet their file on me is full of copies of it. And their position remains that I never tried to contact them.

Now, any practical advice would be welcomed - however apart from anything else, any assurances that I’m not going mad and that my email does show what I claim it does would probably help my morale/state of mind considerably! Don't know if IMS is still around for kind words, but I'll take anything right now!

Thanks

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Hi noonakai

 

I can understand how incredibly frustrating this must be for you. Unfortunately the banks have no real interest in their customers...only their bottom line!

 

I would suggest a report direct to the CEO of Lloyds Banking Group.

 

In my view this report should be a full account of what has transpired in respect of each of your grievances. It should give dates and copies of all correspondence and e-mails that have been sent and the replies (if any) receved. It should detail the correspondence to which you have not received replies and explanations of the practices you feel are bening employed to frustrate you.

 

I would write this report in a professional manner rather than angry one and it may take some few pages to achieve this. It may also take some time to put together but I think it will be worth it in the long run.

 

Point out that you would rather not escalate this to a formal complaint to the OFT but that you are quite prepared to do so if your concerns are not satisfactorily resolved.

 

Send your report to the CEO of Llloyds and mark it private and confidential on both the envelope and at the head of the letter.

 

Send to

 

Mr Antonio Horta-Osorio (He's the new CEO from about March this year)

Lloyds Banking Group

25 Gresham Street

London

EC2V 7HN

 

Hope this helps

 

Regards

 

ims

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Thank you so much for your response – if nothing else it is giving me a sliver of hope

Yes, I’ll definitely write to the Chief Executive.

I should tell you what else I’ve done – originally the dispute was a business one but is now personal as it was reduced to being about the calling up of my personal guarantee.

As a business dispute we sent in a folder of evidence to the Ombudsman which was ignored. This included a report by Lloyds which ranged from them retrospectively justifying problematic dates by alleging we had arranged an overdraft limit of thousands of pounds for eight days – to them changing dates and limits on the say-so of non-account holders to a whole heap of other things which I am too tired to go into now. The dispute was handled by a David Martin who was a disgrace.

He sent us a stock response that evidence we sent had been looked at already. He had not uttered a single word on at least ten vital points that had been accompanied with proof. Lloyds refused to look at things because they said it was for the Ombudsman, the Ombudman refused with the stock response that they’d looked at it and when we sent in a folder of evidence and pointed out that not one single word had been uttered on anything in it, they merely sent us the exact same response and treated us like vexatious customers.

I managed to get the single issue of the personal guarantee kept alive by pointing out it was a personal banking matter after the business one had been swept under the carpet.

I wrote to my MP Hilary Benn who did pass my grievance onto the current Chief Executive of Lloyds. The Chief Executive simply passed it to complaints who, instead of investigating, simply wrote a brief letter to Mr. Benn saying that my "recent correspondence to you does not relate to a product or service we’ve provided him"

Mr. Benn accepted this without question and passed it on to me despite the fact that I had sent in seven pages of detailed notes of specific poor service.

And now Lloyds have given my complaints to a Bethan Hansen. Now Bethan Hansen has dismissed my case without actually acknowledging any of the evidence I sent, including the infamous email I posted about. Not only is Ms. Hansen one of the people about whom I originally complained and is now adjudicating on herself, she also belongs to the Recovery department not Complaints

Anyway – I will try the new Chief Executive and will handle the letter as you suggested. I realise I have made a series of sweeping statements without proof but I am conscious of not overwriting on a post – however – I would be more than happy to go into as much detail as anyone wants about any single thing I have mentioned. I will also make sure I write whilst calm (!) and make any report as clear as I can.

In the meantime, if anyone has a totally left-field suggestion that might get my case looked at properly I’d be grateful. Maybe an open letter to lloyds? Where would the best place to post that be? A mix of fact and an description of the emotional implications involved in having to fight this case? For now thanks - this is the one place where I've felt listened to - and let’s see what the new Chief Exec can do!

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Hi

 

Wow it seems far more comples than it first appeared.

 

I'd still be writing to the current CEO though.....at least it keeps things alive.

 

I've no doubt others will contribute to this thread as well.

 

Regards

 

ims

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I DON'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM BUT IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

 

 

 

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Yes - it is a huge, messy fight that I've fought for years and if anyone needs to know any details at all please just ask.

 

What I've tried to do is shrink it all down to the smallest thing possible to make it appropriate for this forum and also to retain focus - so I chose this - the bank handed my personal guarantee over to collections witthout giving me a chance to discuss it. i complained. They told me I hadn't contacted them. I sent them an email proving otherwise. They ignored it. I sent it many times and referred to it many more. They haven't mentioned it once.

 

If I can stay on that then I have faith that this is the tip of the iceberg and the rest of Lloyds' lies will unravel in time. Thanks IMS for moral support and thanks in advance to any other comments in the days to come!

 

Cheers

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I read your thread with interest as i find myself in a similar situation.

 

I have a personal guarantee against a business loan with Lloyds and due to a serious accident which has put me out of action for several months, I have had to place my business into liquidation. The loan repayments were up to date so, anxious to avoid a default and unnecessary charges being piled onto the loan, I made an appointment to see my Relationship manager this week to find a way forward.

 

I suggested that i set up a direct debit from my personal account to continue the loan payments until I can sell my house (I have already put it on the market) and pay the loan off in full. However, my 'relationship manager' told me that my account has been blocked and it isn't possible for me to make payments into it!!! Apparently it will all be passed to their Recoveries Department who will write to me and arrange a repayment plan. This will take about 6 weeks!

 

'But that's what i'm doing now' i suggested 'trying to arrange a repayment plan'

So, they want my money - they are enforcing the PG - but they won't let me set up a payment from my personal account until the account has defaulted and the Recoveries Team has contacted me to demand the money!

 

My manager was completely clueless and no help whatsoever (interestingly, he's been my RM for 2 years and i've never met him before, so not hugely supportive). I am furious that i took the time to initiate contact, attempted to set up a direct debit to ensure the repayments continued uninterrupted, and was told that they were going to force me to default and then make me go through the debt collection process.

 

Can they really do that?

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Hi breakaway

 

To my mind, the attitude that Lloyds seem to be showing lately is absurd.

 

There are other threads on the site of them being what appears to be deliberately obstructive and unhelpful.

 

The position you find yourself in is ludicrous....you are trying to sort something out and they are preventing you from doing so.

 

My view again would be a full report to good old Antonio with a professional, strong report giving dates, facts and events.

 

Maybe he doesn't realise what he's taken on with Lloyds or he's instrumental in their behaviour at the moment. Either way, let him know.

 

Having announced their mid-term figures the other day, maybe they are desperate to get some cash in by whatever means.

 

Same old banks and same old screwing of customers in the name of Profit.

 

Regards

 

ims

If I have helped you please leave me a message by clicking my star

 

1. Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

2. Reclaim mis-sold PPI

Read Here

3. Reclaim Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

4. The CAG Interest Tutorial

Read Here

5. Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors?

Read Here

6. Staying Calm About Debt

Read Here

7. Thinking of a Full & Final Settlement?

Read Here

 

How To Upload Documents To Cag

Instructions

 

I DON'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM BUT IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

 

 

 

Private message facilities are offered for users to communicate issues that are perhaps inappropriate for posting on the main forum. Site rules explain this in more detail.

 

If you receive a private message which you consider abusive, derogatory or otherwise inappropriate, whether it be about yourself or other members, please report it using the "report" icon

 

If you are approached (or have been approached) by private message with an offer of help "Off Forum" or with a view to asking you to visit another website, please inform the site team via the report icon, especially if this results in a request for a fee. Remember, this is for your own protection

my views are my own and are given in good faith to try and help people. Please seek professional advice on your case if necessary

 

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING

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  • 3 weeks later...

Being passed to collections is a good thing - you can do a deal with them which you can't do with the branch or relationship manager.

 

Forget about writing to the chief executive or MP's, it's a total waste of time.

 

You need to construct a robust offer at no more than 40% the value of the debt and negotiate from there. Or, if you have no lump sum then you need to ask for a reduction of the debt and ask to pay in manageable installments.

 

You have to start low. You can never get a deal from a relationship manager (or at least not to my knowledge).

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