Bailiffs Seized Car - Advice Needed !!!

[skegnar]

Hi,

 

my sister is a single mother with a 1 year old baby desperatly struggling to pay all the bills

with her very small income.

she literally has no money left for anything at all

after she pays for food, rent, electricity and all the other bills

and now she got herself on a monthly £30 DD to fend off Bristow and Sutor's bailiffs

that have seized/levied her car and are blackmailing her to pay

or else they would tow the car away and she really needs the car due to the baby.

 

after she was initially contacted (i think via a simple letter) she asked me for help

and i went on bristow and SUtor's website to pay in full and so i did pay the full amount i was presented.

she was away at the time and when she got back there was a notice with the same date that i paid

but dated a few hours before adding around another £35 to the bill

i called them and explained i had paid in full the correct total ammount

as presented to me by their own online payment system and if they provide an online payments option

it was their responsability to present correct ammounts, so as far as we were aware the debt was settled in full

so they were not entitled to anything else.

they obviously didn't liked this

and again, while she was away, on 31st of december,

there was a notice of seizure of goods seizing the car she uses,

also adding another bunch of fees including a £90 removal van + 1 man fee and VAT,

adding over £105 to the bill and they now say she owed them the total of £171.55

despite the fact that i had paid in full on her behalf a couple of weeks before as per above.

when she got back, fearing she might lose her car, she just panicked

and went on a £30 monthly DD agreement (that she simply cannot afford) with them.

 

i really wanted to help her out, but she is really affraid that if she stops paying

they may come around when she is not here and take her car away and then she will never get it back.

 

in order to help out my sister, i've been reading a few threads in here

and have a few questions regarding bailiffs in relation to a Parking ticket (PCN) issue.

 

1- i understand that a car on the driveway can be levied/seized without need for a signature from the owner/debtor.

is this correct?

 

2- if 1 is correct, why is it that to seize goods inside your house they need to have the debtor's signature

on the walking possession and for the car this is not required?

 

3- if the car is not owned (e.g. owned by me) by the debtor,

being the debtor only the registered keeper and not the actual owner,

does this makes the levy null and all the corresponding fees unlawfull

(e.g. levy, removal van and other similar fees)?

 

4- the car was bought on ebay and paid by me (in cash to a private seller)

and it was registered in DVLA under my sister's name

is there any way or legal document that can prove i am the actual owner of the veichle?

 

5- i think she qualifies as vulnerable as she is a single mom in severe economic hardship

is it possible to get the fine to go back to the council or the court and pay directly to them?

 

6- I think i paid well more than the fine warrant,

but have no idea if the bailliffs passed anything to the creditors (either the council or the court)

who is the creditor here council or the court?

and how can i find about any amounts received by the creditor so far?

 

7- also i have seen some threads mentioning the Out of time appeal procedure

would this be possible in her case, for any reason

perhaps in the context of she not being the owner?

 

8- the notice of seizure seems to be filled in a sloppy manner

(e.g. with a bogus £32.90 parking penalty charge ammount)

also, the (original) front sheet is signed but the (copy) inventory sheet where it lists the car is not.

could this be relevant?

 

9- i have seen 2 bailiff names on the papers none of them registered in northampton court

does the bailiff that acts for a warrant issued by court X have to be registered in that same court?

or can they be registered in one court and act on warrants for any court?

 

any advice on this would be most welcomed.

[brassnecked]

Not too sure about pcns but it looks to me that B & S are adding fees AFTER the account is settled using the argument that an electronic transfer is not "Cleared Funds", and have craftily added fees by doctoring their system, by backdating the addition of fees by a few hours, after you have paid. Do you have a printed reciept? I would complain to the council who originated the pcn, but really tomtubby is your girl on this one, although the others will be along with more concrete advice soon.

 

In the meantime tell your sister not to worry, this will be sorted, and if any fees are proved to be wrongfully applied you have 6 years to reclaim them.

 

You could swear a statutory declaration at a solicitors or court as to the ownership of the car, and any receipt from PayPal or whatever method you used for the purchase on E-Bay, would also be good evidence, to put the car out of the bailiffs reach.

Edited May 17, 2011 by brassnecked
kybdddddd

[hallowitch]

did she know about the pnc before the bailiffs letter

 

how much was the pnc

what council

 

find out from the council the date it was passed over to B&S the debt always belongs to the council and they are always responsible for the actions of there contractors (B&S)

 

{after she was initially contacted (i think via a simple letter) }

does she still have the letter how soon after she received it did you pay

 

do you have a receipt in your name saying that you paid for the car (how much did you pay not being nosey trying to establish the value of the car if sold at auction)

[skegnar]

the council of the PCN was Birmingham

 

not sure exactly how much was the PCN, but i paid £90 something pounds,

 

i should have a record of that in my statements as i paid by card

also i can do a printout from B&S online system that will confirm that as well

 

they have added over £170 on top of that in bailiff fees

on a PCN i paid in full on her behalf

 

 

i do have a "Used Car Envoice" with my name on it,

stating that the car was sold to me "on ebay as spares/repairs" for £727

and i think i might still have the ebay printout of the auction as well somewhere.

 

another £30 is due to come out of her account this week

[hallowitch]

when did you by the car

does your sister ever remember getting a pcn or a notice to owner through the post

do you have the pcn ref number you may be able to find it on her B&S web page (or from the council)

you need to find out what date the pnc was issued and to what address

the council should be able to help you answer some of these questions

if you have the pcn ref no you can phone the Traffic Enforcement Centre on 08457 045 007

 

I would send a letter or e-mail to the council informing them that there bailiffs have levied against vehicle reg no xxxxx and miss xxxx is the only the registered keeper of the car you are the owner therefore there bailiff has levied goods not belonging to the debtor thus making the levy unlawful

 

send copy of receipt for car

 

or go to a solicitor and get a statutory declaration done to send to the council and the bailiffs

[skegnar]

i have phoned the council and it seems that despite the fact i paid in full back in december

and despite she has also been paying £30 a month

totaling over £200 so far

 

the baillifs only paid £42 to the council

 

another £30 is due to come out of her account this week

so if i send the letters out today it takes a couple of days to reach them

and even more for them to reply back

so i am concerned if we send letters out and cancel the DD

they may come around tow the car anyway claiming they had a levy

and got no letters saying i was the owner

 

is there any sure way of quickly serve them

with the notice that i am the actual owner in a way they cannot claim they were not aware?

 

or should i let this week's DD go through just to be on the safe side and then take our chances in claiming it back?

(knowing it is unlikely they'll pay back anything at all without being forced by a court)

[hallowitch]

personally i would not cancel the DD

 

it will be very hard to prove that you are the owner without the receipt

 

a statutory declaration is legal document that basically means you are sewering under oath that you you own the car the council/bailiffs could say that you are only doing this to remove there fees and to honest i don't know what happens if this is the case

 

did you find out theto the questions i asked in post 5

 

we also need to know when the first letter from B&S was and if you paid within 7 days

 

there is a set of rules the council/bailiffs have to follow when enforcing a pnc the bailiffs fees are also set in legislation

[skegnar]

thanks for your help so far Hallowitch

regarding your questions

 

-any correspondence went to her house as it is the keepers address at DVLA

it is possible she received letters about this PCN previously but she's not sure

as she had 2 other parking fines that she paid at the time

and she thought she paid this one as well

she says she might have confused PCN nrs thinking she had only 2 parking fines to pay

she guesses that's why it remained unpaid,

 

 

-dont think i paid within 7 days of the baylif letter

she asked me if i could help out in paying on her behalf ,

as she didnt had enough money to pay,

so i presume it took her a quite a few days to come to me

and it took me at least 2 or 3 of days to actually pay because

i know sometimes debt collectors pose as baillifs and

i was a bit concerned in giving my credit card details to people i do not know

so i tried to pay in full to the council a couple of times but they allways refused

and told me to pay to the bayliffs

 

 

-as i said i do have the receipt (Used Car Envoice) of the sale of the car to me

saying very clearly SOLD TO: and my name on it,

 

-car was bought by me way back in feb 2010

and the fine was issued in may 2010

[hallowitch]

right photo copy the receipt and send it to the bailiffs along with a copy of the notice of seizure and ask them to release your vehicle from there levy as the Warrant of execution is for Missxx who is the registered keeper not the owner

 

Send a copy of everything to the council and ask them to confirm that there contractors(bailiff firm) will be removing your car from there levy as Miss xxx is only the registered keeper and not the owner

 

give both 14 days to reply to request

 

 

ask your sis to send the template on here for a breakdown of charges (don't put it in the same envelope as you as this is a different issue and you have 2 separate things going on here)

 

All letters to council and bailiffs should be sent recorded delivery

 

remember the bailiff Levy's goods on behalf of a local authority so the goods/levy belong to them

 

 

don't cancel the DD hopefully she wont have to make any further payments after the next one

but we need the bailiff fees and the amount of the PCN to work it out

 

any overpayment will be returned but it will take a few letter to the council and the bailiffs (you may have take both the council and bailiff firm to court but thats only in extreme circumstances bailiffs or councils wont go that far if you have overpaid and you can prove it)