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    • Hi All, before I start I know there are similar threads of the topic I am raising, and each, of course, has its own unique scenario, which may benefit others. My case is as follows: 1. I saw a gumtree ad on the 16th of Oct 2020 for a Mercedes E220 CDI, priced at 7,500 2. I called the seller and said I will come over on the 17th of Oct 2020 to view. 3. On the 17th of Oct 2020 I went to his place where he is working and viewed the car. He is working for a major car rental company. I checked the car and of course asked the normal things to ask e.g. any insurance write-offs, loans, accidents, etc. The seller said the car is clean etc.no loan, he had a loan but all is paid off etc. and he has the papers. 4. I negotiated the car price to 6,800 because the rims were showing some signs of damage, the rear light had a small burst, cosmetics, etc. I checked all but did not see any sign of damage to the car (it's a black car, the car was a bit dirty, and the sun was already setting in) 5. We agreed on 6,800 and decided to purchase the car. We went into his office, where I paid cash, and also got a Car Sales Invoice with all details of the seller, and a V5C green slip 6. I purchased car insurance and drove off. I asked him about Road Tax and he said Road tax is paid so I have not to worry, just need car insurance. 7. On 18th of Oct 2020 I cleaned the car interior because it was really dirty inside - it took me a few hours so decided to clean the exterior the next day 8. On the 19th of Oct 2020 I went to clean the exterior and after the car was clean I noticed some parts were resprayed. I became a bit suspicious; so on the 19th of Oct 2020 in the eve, I went on the internet and run an HPI check. The outcome from the HPI did not show any accidents, insurance write-off but an outstanding Loan with Moneybarn. At this point, I thought maybe the database is not updated, etc. 9. On the 20th of Oct 2020, morning, things were going through my mind; the seller said the car is clean, no issues, no loan since he settled all etc. but the HPI reports say there is still some outstanding loan. So what I did, I called Moneybarn, and explained the situation, and gave them the contract number as well (since it was displayed on the HPI report). They said they will send me a form by email, but they cannot share any information due to Data Protection (GDPR). fair enough I thought, but what made me boil, they said they OWN the car! So, I took the car and drove to the seller where he is working. I confronted him. He said don't worry, I will handle it, he has no time, he is very busy and bla bla bla. I said what reasons do I have to trust you, you lied, and now you say you still have a debt, etc. So I said I will not leave until he has settled the debt, or repay me my money. I also asked what is outstanding, he said around 7,000. Well, since I confronted him at his workplace he may have felt the heat, he assured he will settle all soon, I said sorry, I need a date, so I said you will settle the debt with Moneybarn by 23 Oct 2020, if not, you will refund me my money. He said Ok he will do it, so I said, since I don't trust you, you will sign a piece of paper, and sign it. On the paper, he wrote "I will clear the debt for the Mercedes by Friday" and signed it. I said I am not happy and added the debt details with contract number, and also a clause that if he fails to settle the debt with Moneybarn by Friday the 23rd of Oct 2020, he will refund me my money, 6,800, and sales of the car Mercedes, license plate, will be void. Also, I said to put an initial on each amendment I made with signature. He did, and I left. 10. On 22 Oct I sent him a message, to remind him to settle the debt by Friday 23 Oct 2020 noontime and also I outlined some legal jargon I had to sent that I received from citizensadvice. 11. On 23 Oct, morning time, I received a message from the seller, he said he will not/cannot refund me the money, not to visit him at his office or place, and that he feels threatened by me. 12. Now, the dilemma/headache; a). I received the form from Moneybarn on the 20th of Oct 2020 and I have to send it back within 7 days b). the seller send me a message he will not refund the money c). is the seller holding the title with Moneybarn or did he also buy and not knowing there is an outstanding loan on it d). did he sent the V5C to DVLA since I have the green slip? e). Shall I fill in the form and sent it to Moneybarn? f). If Moneybarn has all my details they may send someone to repossess the car? 13. I decided, I will not undertake anything yet, because my mind said, go there, confront him, park the car in front of the company since I purchased it there and signed all paperwork in their office, they will call the police, the police will come and surely will not do anything but will force me to remove the car and park somewhere else, record all on camera, take all evidence, sent to Moneybarn and at the same time to the seller's employer (when I asked him to sign a letter he will settle the debt by Friday 23rd of Oct 2020, he used a paper of the car rental company, and on the back, the logo of the rental company is displayed clearly and he may have acted on behalf of the company to sell me the car, after all, I don't know if he holds the title with Moneybarn - well, this is an excuse for me to even sue the car rental company, or blacklist him with the company he is working for since it seems he is some type of manager there and he may have acted in the capacity as a sales person to sell the car to me on behalf the company....). 14. So on the 23rd of Oct 2020, I didn't do anything like described under 13....it's not my style as such I called AWH solicitors, explained all, and they said one person is specialized in dealing with such cases and will call me back after studying my case and inform me if it is something they can fight or not. So they will call me Monday the 26th of Oct 2020. I also said I want to go now and confront the seller, but she said better wait till Monday, and if they can fight the case, they will tell me the next course of action - but my funds are limited and cannot afford a lengthy battle, because if no case against Moneybarn means I will have to sue the seller to the court which will cost me. The car has comprehensive insurance and with all this saga I added on the 20th of Oct 2020 also legal insurance on top. Lengthy story, but I am trying to be as detailed as I can, and yes I should have done an HPI before buying the car, but I am from Holland and car sales work there a bit different, and this is my first time I buy from a private seller. Well, once I have sent the form to Moneybarn, I will park the car in a garage, and at this stage, I am renting a room in a house (there is one more tenant). Since I am from Holland, I am planning a trip within 2 weeks to visit my family and I will drive down with the car and in the meanwhile wait if the solicitor can be of any help. I need some advice though, I am still planning to drive down to the seller on Tuesday after I talked with the solicitor, park the car in front of the company, and confront the seller, and try to record all. I will also try to make him sign a letter that I purchased the car in good faith from him (regardless if he holds the title with Moneybarn or not but at least I purchased in good faith from him). Evidence that I have: 1. Car sales invoice 2. Paper that I made him sign 3. Gumtree ad; I could retract this from google history, but the original add removed from gumtree. At least I can show it was advertised 4. I tried to create a history of past owners, total owners including me are 5. It seems the car was also posted on gumtree before by a company in Essex (I saw on google). The reason for doing this, it is very likely that the seller purchased the car from someone else with an outstanding loan. Since then I read a lot on the internet, so please any advice is welcome to pursue my case, I paid a lot and at least I want my money back. Also what I read so far, Moneybarn is not easy to deal with...thanks in advance for any advice I can use for my case.
    • Hi   I think you need to check not just the serial number but what Meter Point Reference Number (MPRN) as the MPRN is what is registered and energy supplier go off as well as the serial number.   So you need to see what the MPRN is as well as the energy supplier it is registered with.   If you look at this Ofgem link: https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/consumers/household-gas-and-electricity-guide/connections-and-moving-home/who-my-gas-or-electricity-supplier   In the above link to do this check it gives a link to:   Find My Supplier: https://www.findmysupplier.energy/webapp/index.html (note you may have to complete a captcha, then input your postcode only and click find my address, when the list comes up click on your exact address, you will then see you actual MPRN and the energy supplier linked to your address)   With the above make sure and take the details of the MPRN and the Energy Supplier, better still take a screenshot/pdf the webpage.   Please let use know if on doing the above it matches your current supplier?  
    • I had exactly the same issues.   Grossly over estimated bills from January onwards.  Despite what they claim, they are effectively taking an interest free loan from their customer base to keep the company in business.   They can dress it up how they like.  It’s irrelevant if they reconcile the bills the following month because they just over bill again thus keeping a rolling interest free loan.   it took two months of constant badgering to be finally moved to a fixed DD.   Once that was done I didn’t care how much they over-estimated by.   I had raised a query with the ombudsman over the billing fiasco and they readied a complaint should I wish to proceed.   I thought everything was sorted until May/June whereby I was allegedly more in debt then I was expecting to the tune of an extra months DD.   On querying it, it transpired that even though I was on a fixed monthly DD, because the bill was generated less than 5 days before the DD was due to be taken they didn’t take the DD.   They offered £5 compensation by way of apology but wanted to take two months DD in June.  I told them where to get off.   With appalling customer service,  bills that you need a Maths degree to follow, and I do have one and still struggled, inability to follow through on any agreements, constant gross over-estimation, the missed DD was the final straw and I proceeded with complaint to ombudsman.   Prior to getting to that stage I had to quote Symbio’s own complaints procedure to them to get any sort of response.   Their final offer to me was £25 goodwill and to waive an exit fee. The offer was derisory given the time it had taken to get things sorted and the continuing ineptitude.  Also, the whole thing has dragged on so long (5 months) I was already in the final 49 days of my contract and therefore there were no exit fees to pay and therefore nothing to waive.   Anyway, upshot is, ombudsman found in my favour.  Ordered an apology and a goodwill payment. Symbio appealed but were told the decision stood.   This week I received the goodwill payment.   I promptly left an honest and truthful review on trustpilot.   The next morning I received an email from Symbio with an apology.   This was followed an hour later with an email from trustpilot saying Symbio had replied to the review.  On reading the response they have accused me of not following procedure and of cyber bullying.   The company is a complete joke.
    • why not simply tell you supplier they have the wrong meter number you been paying for usage , and ofcourse you can view this online too so its not as if you'll owe anything you might get a nice surprise and find you are owed a refund.
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Arrow/? claimform - M&S Chargecard changed to Credit card


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Update time (to keep M up todate on what they are doing with my own account, as promised) .......

 

HL Solicitors for Sigma (who have apparently bought the debt from M&S), have sent a letter requesting payment, its my address and acc no, but the wrong name ... (again) !!!!

 

I will send them the usual defend letter, telling they them they have been screwed by M&S as the ALLEGED debt was in dispute at the time of disposal, its a credit card not a store card, that the cca is worthless, as was the DN.

 

Will update for infor on what they come back with ...

 

Abs x

Edited by Abby25
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Who's thread is this and who needs advice?

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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That will be the lady who started the thread on page 1, with the first post - Maureen 1, who has posted on behalf of her Aunt.

 

 

We're going throgh the process of seeing off DCAs (M&S already having given up) - with myself being someway along the line with this, providing guidance and templates, that I've already used in my defence (as her complaint is of the same basis i.e store card changed to credit card (without consumers request), CCA provided on request is for the old store card, with the CCA provided being an application form with no prescribed terms located within it in any event !! (same old, same old, really).

 

 

We also have a dud DN I believe - which I've advised not to raise at this point, as it is a dish best served cold in any court proceedings that may be brought.

 

 

So IMHO they are well and truly snookered with this, and I expect maureens aunt's debt to also be sold on, as mine and plenty others in the same boat have recently been (which is where Sigma and HL Legal join the game)

 

Hope this helps

 

Abs x>

Edited by Abby25
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Yes thank you for clearing that up....

A store card that turned into a credit card hey?? I'd like to be a fly on the wall when they try and explain that one to the Judge..if it ever reached such a stage.

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Well when I stated they could not change one type of credit facility to another (store only use in 1 store with a low credit limit, to a credit card with a limit in the 1000's), they replied yes they could, the OFT said it was perfectly ok.

 

Really ? I replied, thats funny becuase in the open press the OFT publicly slated you, told you that you had broken consumer law, and demanded that you send out new agreements for signature to all future transferees ...

 

Their response to this, and even if the could reply upon the store card app, it does not comply with the CCA74, in its absence of prescribed terms, was .... wait for it .... "were not prepared to engage in any further communication in the matter, unless its for myself to make payment " ... and do you know what, they never sent me another letter .....so sort of tells its own story that.... thats of course until the poor DCAs had a go, and they finally sold it to poor old Sigma ... who not only bought the debt whilst in dispute (so in breach of OFT regs), but also can't pursue it due to above ... !!!!

 

I actually miss the letters ... they were good fun to play with ... !!

 

Abs x

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Hi Abby,thank you for your update :-) as of today my aunt has not heard anything since i sent the letter back i got from you,but i have told her not to hold her breath as it will be sold back on and the letters will start back up,please keep me up to date with your dealings with them in this thread as it helps me to explain to my aunt that she's not the only one they are trying to "fob" off !:-)

 

Thank you Maureen

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The thing to add to this, which I hope will give good comfort to your aunt, Maureen, is to search for the recent (March 2012) Santander v Mayhew judgement.

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Here the link to the judgement to copy and paste ......... http://forums.http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.php?p=53600973/blog_attachment.php?attachmentid=56&d=1332300299 (which is in PDF format)

 

I've just found it and had a read, and supports the dispute of the debt already I've already submitted to M&S over 2 yrs ago (and which I have prev advised also forms part of your defence too) , which is power to the cause for all ! (apologies for link and not uploaded PDF, as I can't upload or insert anything due to major system probs with my account - which is incredibly frustrating, and which I have AGAIN asked the site team to look at for me).

 

Hope this helps

 

Abs x

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Told you, I'm having some real issues with links, upload, inserts etc .... even having to manually input the para splitter so my post doesn't all merge into one ...... its driving me INSANE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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  • 4 weeks later...

Update .... despite HL solicitors being advised of the situ, they have left a msg on the answer machine for me to call them.

 

Bless 'em - hope there not upset when I don't accept their kind invitation .... !!!!

Edited by Abby25
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  • 2 months later...

Ok just an update on this, HL (the cheeky blighters !) have issued a claim with northampton CC - the issues going on are discussed in my separate thread, which you will find in the legal forum. Abs xx

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Hi Abby sorry ive not been on here for a while had computer issues .My aunt still not heard anything back however ive just read you're other thread and all that "talk" about court and what you have had to do just went straight over my head! I wish you good luck on you're case , I'm now thinking it might be easier to offer them £1 month to avoid the possibility of going to court as my aunts health wouldn't cope with court.Thanks for all you're help you have giving us it's very much appreciated.

 

Maureen

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Hi Maureen,

 

There's nothing to worry about, trust me, they are just trying it on with a load of us whom the bought from Marks. Even if this did get before a Judge, which is very unlikely, they have nothing to go with - their claim talks about a credit agreement for a credit card that I defaulted on - but the problem they have is that THERE IS NO CREDIT AGREEMENT FOR THE CREDIT CARD, so thats their first mistake, they also admitted issuing a claim with ABSOLUTLEY NO DOCUMENTS, so then how do they estblish their claim, what is owed and what I breached ???? The DN is also in breach of the regs - so thats another nail in their coffin.

 

I just had a mild panic, because no one else has even go near a court with my other issues - as I have made sure that my letters clearly show the legalities supporting my dispute - which is the trick.

 

These idiots - are just taking a punt and hoping for the best - when I spoke to them on the phone and discussed what this particular dispute entailed. and if they had no docs from Marks (as they admitted), they had absolutely no business issuing a spurious claim and wasting the courts time, the Mgr I spoke to went to pieces - and said he would have it stayed unti they had time to review the docs and if necessary sell it back to Marks.

 

And don't forget, although I have always argued since 2009, the fact that there is no agreement for the credit card (only a rubbish one for the store card), which means that the debt is unenforceable, this has now subssequently been backed up by the Mayhew case.

 

If you start paying AFTER instigating the dispute which you currently have on-going , you will by default have admitted liability, and that will mean that they CAN TAKE YOU TO COURT AND EXPECT TO WIN. Now you have disputed it, you must stay the course, IF, you receive a court claim, you'll have me (and others) to help guide you, as we will have already been through the process and out the other side. So hold onto your hat and don't panic !!

 

Abs x

Edited by Abby25
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They play a numbers game, of all the claims they issue,unfortuantely many will simply either admit because they spent the money or simply ignore and judgment will be gained by default. Most people don't even realise that the CCA exists and that they can defend a claim.

 

Once you show your intention to defend, and more importantly will counterclaim against them for costs.....they will back off....they may put up a bit of a fight....even the odd stupid letter that it can be enforced when it isn't...but aslong as you respond to every letter and stay resolute...they will back off if it is going to cost them money. Unfortunately they go for the easy ones and milk them dry.:pout::pout:

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  • 1 year later...

Hi all,not been on here for a long time due to no internet connection,still in dispute with these idiots (have been ignoring them ) ill get the letter my aunt received yesterday and put it up for you all to read and see what she should do now thanks

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Well hello stranger !!

 

Hope you're well.

 

Yep post it up, and we'll guide .... just as an update of my own, I have heard not a peep from Sigma, I have phoned the court whom have advised that the claim is now stayed (due to 30 days passing and Sigma not continuing), which means that to get it re-instigated their claim for re-starting the process and why, has to go before a Judge.

 

The court clerk advised contacting them to see what their position is, but as I know it won't be reinstigated from the reason for dispute I've advised them, I'm leaving it to lie until the default has expired.

 

Anyhoo, enough about me .... post it up treacle and we'll have a look at it for you.

 

Abs x

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Hello Abs, glad your getting somewhere with your M&S card !!!!!

 

Any how here's a type up of the letter my aunt received any advice please

 

 

NOTICE OF RECOVERY ACTION

 

Due to your failure to satisfactorily resolve this matter with Rockwell,this account has now been escalated to Fenton Cooper for assessment and further recovery action.

 

Fenton Cooper is a specialist recovery team and part of Tessera Credit Services Limited.

 

We are now reviewing your account and may recommend that our client commence legal proceedings by placing this matter with their solicitors to issue a county court summons.

 

 

 

Do we just ignore this like the others ?

 

thanks Maureen

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I have had a quick look back over what has occurred and if I am correct, wasn't this a Store card that was upgraded to a credit card without a new agreement being signed ?

 

Could you perhaps put a summary of what indeed has happened for it to get to this point in time.

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