Robbers way, Lloyds TSB Credit Card 'fake' CCA sig and me

[teed_off]

Hi

 

As you can gather I am at loggerheads with LTSB,.

 

 

I sent a SAR to the bank and received the response in 2 parts.

 

 

The 2nd part was sent after I requested it again via their hound dogs Sacharri and wotsit.

 

got loads of stuff that did not make head nor tail to understand ,

but statements going back quite a few years.

Also I have a loan to LTSB and they sent the "CCA" for that which I am now disputing as the sigs are on a separate page etc.

 

As for the credit card , I CCA'd them in Jan then supplied me with it in June both sigs were different etc,

but whats getting me is this : with the sar for the bank account they sent me all the correspondance I sent to them

in regards to the credit card etc but no signed credit agreement came with it.

 

Surely if I SAR the bank and they supply me with ALL corresspondance in regards to the credit card

that includes copies of my letters, and all details of the amount of times I was contacted in regards to the credit card

then surely the signed CCA would have been included?

 

 

They also included ALL letters they sent in regards to the loan, bank and credit card account but no signed CCA for the credit card.

 

I have reported this to Finacial Ombudsman a few months back and awaiting the result. Should I tell the Ombudsman about the SAR etc?

 

Thanks in advance

[supasnooper]

If LTSB have not fully complied with any SAR request then complain to the Information Commissioners Office.

 

This can be done online - Complaints about data protection policy - ICO

 

Also, you may wish to take them to court to comply.

 

Have a read of this thread - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/49571-havinastella-lloyds-tsb.html

[teed_off]

If LTSB have not fully complied with any SAR request then complain to the Information Commissioners Office.

 

This can be done online - Complaints about data protection policy - ICO

 

Also, you may wish to take them to court to comply.

 

Have a read of this thread - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/49571-havinastella-lloyds-tsb.html

 

 

Thanks for that.

 

What I really needed to know was this - the signed CCA for the credit card would have been a part of the SAR's wouldn't it? Even though it was for my bank account?

[supasnooper]

A Subject Access request is just that...........a request for any data held against the name of the requestor.

 

So...........your CCA for a credit card was sent in your SAR documents even though you thought your SAR was for your bank account.

[teed_off]

A Subject Access request is just that...........a request for any data held against the name of the requestor.

 

So...........your CCA for a credit card was sent in your SAR documents even though you thought your SAR was for your bank account.

 

 

No the CCA was sent seperatly a while back..

 

 

. I was SAR my bank account as I want to claim back the charges

but the bank sent me details of the credit card account

such as letters I sent and replies I never received

also details of phone calls etc.

 

 

but no credit agreement for the card.

 

 

Surely if they sent those details such as the letters etc

then the signed CCA woul have been a part of it?

 

 

The reason am asking is that they sent the CCA agrement for a loan with them but not for the credit card with the SAR.

[supasnooper]

Then press LTSB for the CCA relating to the credit card by sending the this letter -

 

Your name

Your Address

Your Town

Your County

Your Postcode

 

 

 

Date 2009

The Company Secretary

The Creditor

Creditors address

CreditorsTown

Creditors county

Creditors postcode

 

 

LETTER BEFORE ACTION

Section 7(1) – Data Protection Act 1998

 

 

 

Account: XXXXXXXXXXXX

 

 

 

 

Dear Sir / Madam,

 

 

You have failed to comply with my Data Protection Act Subject Access Request dated xxth xxxxxxxxxx 2009.

 

I will remind you as to what documents I expect.

 

The following is by no means an exhaustive list but in the main this is what I require.

 

Please supply me with a complete list of transactions and charges relating to ALL accounting history with your organisation. Alternatively, a complete set of statements for that period will be acceptable.

 

Additionally, all records you hold on me relevant to this account, including but not limited to:

 

1. A transcript of all transactions, including charges, fees, interest, repayments and payments and both the original amount of the loan and any repayments made to the account.

 

2. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company

 

3. Where there has been any event in my accounts history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account. If you are unable to supply this data because there has been no such manual intervention, then please be so kind as to confirm this in your response

 

4. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notices that you may have sent to me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

 

5. Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted.

 

6. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

 

7. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

 

8. A genuine copy of any deed of assignment, or proof that you have a legal right to this money.

 

9. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

 

10. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

 

11. A copy of all account statements for the duration of the agreement.

 

12. Please would you also advise me of the logic involved in any automated decisions taken by you about me pursuant to section 7(1) (d) of the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

13. A True copy of the consumer credit agreement section 77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act of 1974 for the account.

 

14. Any Other information relating to this account.

 

If you do not comply within the next 14 days I shall seek a Court order obliging you to do so together with damages at the discretion of the Court and without any further notice.

 

 

Yours Faithfully,

Print your name here

Do NOT sign, Send by recorded delivery

 

[teed_off]

Sorry for being thick here.

 

SAR's was/is Lloyds TSB bank account.

What they sent was load of stuff that I could not understand,

no bank statements etc.

 

 

When I wrote to them stating they had not sent ALL of what was required this is what they sent me

 

1: copies of bank statements

2: Copy of CCA for Lloyds tsb loan (uneforcable) according info on this site. And copy statement etc for the loan.

3: Copies of lettes I sent in regards to Lloyds TSB Credit Card

4: copies of the amount of times they called me in regards to the credit card

5: Details of other info in regards to Credit card.

 

But NO signed Credit Agreement for the credit card.

 

My question is should the stuff about the credit card and loan be included in the SAR's for the bank account?

 

If the answer is yes then should they not have supplied copy statements to the credit card account as well? also a copy of the signed CCA?

 

Or should I send a SAR's to Lloyds Credit card and see what they come up with?

 

Crikey am not sure whether that makes sense to me now either lol

[supasnooper]

it's very simple really.

 

A Subject Access request is just that - a request for any data that contains your name.

 

Even though you sent a SAR for your bank account, LTSB are obliged to send you ALL the data they hold on YOU including any other bank accounts and credit cards.

 

So, for example, if you held 12 accounts with LTSB, they are obliged to send you data for ALL 12 accounts.

 

Now, you are saying that LTSB haven't sent a CCA for the Credit Card.......that means LTSB have not fully complied with your SAR as you know there should be a Credit Card agreement.

 

Moving on, having re-read your original post, I note that you contacted **** regarding your SAR - did you send them a SAR letter ?

[teed_off]

Hi All

 

About two years ago I cca'd Lloyds TSB for a credit card debt etc,

 

 

I only did it because they took all my wages from my current account to pay some of it.

 

 

they sent me what they said was my signed agreement but the signatures weren't mine.

 

 

Both sigs on the agreements whilst looked similar were different.

 

 

I disputed the agreement and it has gone from one debt collecton agency to another

and none of them have produced the CCA until now.

Not even a SARS producded it.

 

 

Robbersway have produced the agreement that was sent to me 2 years ago.

 

 

Now whilst both appear to have these signatures that are purported to be mine

Robbersway agreement is not very clear apart from the signatures

also where the bank should have signed on the one sent to me it is blank

 

 

but on the Robbers way one there is date stamp and suiqqle for a sig.

 

Now I am not sure what to do

- do I print off a copy of the one sent to me by Lloyds and send it with a copy of Robbers way

and say sorry but this beggers belief that someone is committing fraud etc.

 

 

I hope that lot makes sense.,

 

Any advice would be welcome..

[FORMISTER]

Hi Teed_off.

 

Regarding the signatures on the agreement, here is some info I lifted from another recent thread:

 

The person signing your unsigned returned agreement has committed an act of fraud.

As for you benefiting from receiving the money as part of the agreement that you never agreed to or signed. Well do not worry as the following Act protects you and entitles you to deem goods (being money in the case) as an unconditional gift, which you may dispose of as you see fit.

The Consumer Protection Distant Selling Regulations Act 2000 section 24 “inertia selling/unsolicited goods”, where it clearly states the following:

 

1) Paragraphs (2) and (3) apply if—

 

(a)unsolicited goods are sent to a person (“the recipient”) with a view to his acquiring them;

 

(b)the recipient has no reasonable cause to believe that they were sent with a view to their being acquired for the purposes of a business; and

 

©the recipient has neither agreed to acquire nor agreed to return them.

 

(2) The recipient may, as between himself and the sender, use, deal with or dispose of the goods as if they were an unconditional gift to him.

 

(3) The rights of the sender to the goods are extinguished

What year is your credit card agreement from? Any chance of posting it up, removing all personal details.

It would appear that RW have probably date stamped and signed it. What date is the stamp and what date did you supposely sign the document

[teed_off]

Hi Formister

 

Thanks for your reply but am not sure how it will help me tho. Well I got the card in April 2007 but according to these agreements I am supposed to have signed at the end of may 2007 also the "card" is dated May so they wouldn't give any agreement in retrospect would they? The date on these agreements are 26/05/2007 which was a whit bank holiday so the card would have start date June 2007 not May.

 

I wil scan both in and post them.

 

Cheers

[FORMISTER]

So basically you are stating that you already had the card in April but the agreement wasn't made until May? Is that right?

[teed_off]

Hi

 

Yes thats right the reason I am so adamant about when I got the card is because we went on holiday begining of May 2007 and used it to buy petrol etc etc.

[FORMISTER]

So has your SAR request produced something that you can back up the date with, Statement, log print out?

[teed_off]

The SAR produced other agreements and stuff but not the credit card agreement.

[teed_off]

I will try again with the CA.

Edited February 13, 2011 by teed_off

[FORMISTER]

Too small to read. Try converting to PDF and uploading by clicking on the Go Advanced button next to the quick reply button

[teed_off]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]24984[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]24985[/ATTACH]

[teed_off]

Fingers crossed this works now

 

First one is what Lloyds sent me

`

[teed_off]

have tried to get the docs bigger but failed lol so have done a direct link to them

 

http://tinyurl.com/robbersway this is for Robbersway

 

And

 

http://tinyurl.com/lloydstsb01 for Lloyds TSB.

 

Any comments gratefully received.

[teed_off]

Hello guests

 

Would really appreciate some comments... please

 

 

Bump

[teed_off]

Hi

 

I received today my SARS from Lloyds formally Lloyds TSB and I have two questions to ask please.

 

1: It says in part of the documentation that the debt was written off in 2011 and the balance was nil. It was then sold in 2013, am I right in thinking that as it was written off by the original creditor two years before they sold it, the "new owner" cannot collect on it?

 

2: Signed credit agreement, copy received throught the SARS and same debt as above, the date was not entered by me but on the documentation sent with the SCA is different to whats on the cca. Would that also make it unenforcable as fraud would have been committed?

 

Would really appreciate help on this as I need to put this to bed asap and I am getting begging letters galore from these "new owners" and they seem to disregard any correspondance I send them.

 

Thanks very much even for reading x

[dx100uk]

nope they can sadly

 

 

whats the type of debt please

[Bandit127]

You will probably find a note on your file around the time the debt was "written off" that the balance was sent to debt collection. This is standard practice and apparently legal.

 

So is selling the rights to the apparently "written off" debt.

 

This happens to a lot of people and it is confusing when your credit file shows a balance of zero and the account "satisfied". Shortly after it pops back with the name of a DCA on it and the original balance showing again.

 

If the balance has increased or the default date has changed then you should get that corrected.

[teed_off]

Thanks for your replies greatly appreciated.

 

I did see a note to stating that it had been sent to debt collection but that was in 2010

then 2011 it was written off and nothing further after that Until

 

 

sept 2013 from the buyers so to speak.

 

 

Its for a credit card and and its been disputed since Dec 2008

and no payment was made by me since Oct 2008.

 

 

The default date would be Oct 2008 and that can be proved.

 

I have checked my credit file and it does name the "new owners" but the default date is incorrect.

 

 

How would I go about changin that please?

 

 

There were a couple of others that are statue barred as well and the dates on them need changing or they need to be removed.

 

This has been a real worry for me and its the 2nd SARS I have sent lloyds and they still haven't provided all the requested details.