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Good Morning all

On November 8th 2010 a storm took the felt roof of our shed. We contacted Zurich who used Davies to asses there claim. This was handed down to Eastwell contractors who proceeded to sub con it to MD building services. MD came round took photos of the shed and stated that we should not do anything to it as they would replace it. We did, naively, as we were told.

 

After many calls to davies we finally got a decision. The report stated that we were not covered as the damage was due to wear and tear on the shed. The storm that night according to Zurich was 54mph winds. This also took some pf our fencing down.

 

I am now left with a shed that has been exposed to rain and snow since november and is now not usable based on what there representative told me, they are denying that this was ever said and we have ' no proof.' They allegedly sent us a letter out detailing there decision on 29/01/11 still to be recieved.

 

I rang them up yesterday and they stated they would call me back with options intstead they called ny wife at home 20 mins later and told her 'honestly you are best off paying for it yourselves.' This was not what they told me on the phone, they were going to call and detail any options on refuting the decision.

 

The attitude of Davies and the 'I hear what your saying' is frustrating as the shed is only 4 years old.

 

Can anyone advise on what course of action is available to me as I cannot afford a new shed.

 

Many thanks for your time in reading this

 

Dave

:mad2:

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Write a letter of complaint to Zurich. Highlight the fact the shed was only 4 years old. With the winds speed being 54mph (which is 1mph less than storm damage) ask them how they have calculated the wind speed to gust to 54 mph, where the nearest wind meter to your property is, and what is the percentage error of the readings provided to them.

They will not know the answers to these questions, but hopefully it will make them know where you are coming from, and they are on very shaky ground with the denial.

 

If they maintain the denial write back and ask for a final decision letter.


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Halifax, Mint & Egg - next on the hit list

 

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Have they pointed out what the wear and tear was ? do they have photo's of this. Thye have to prove this rather than assume.

4 years for a wooden shed is enough in my opinion to have wear and tear if it was not built correctly in the first place, this also beings into the faulty design/build exclusions.

Whislt there may have been storm winds ( and Zurich are not denying this) if the shed was suffering from wear and tear, the peril (the incident) becomes the wear and tear allowing the roof to be blown off, and the storm wind, just being the event that takes it off.

 

It's all down to what they can prove.

 

Regarding paying for it yourself, that may have been some helpful advice given at the wrong time, their point being if the shed is costing a couple of hundred, by the time you pay your excess, take any premium increased for the next couple of years and always have claim on your record (which can increase premiums), you may be better off paying yourself.

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Hi, Just curious about your problems with Davies since I too had a disasterous claim mis-handeled by them. The contractors they sent me were M.Daltons Builders, don't suppose that's who you mean by M.D.Building Services by any chance? Cheers Rich

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Hi, I too have had terrible problems with Davies and their contract management group Eastwell and I'm also insured with Zurich. They have mishandled my claim in a very serious way - misinformation, manipulation of facts, and outright lies regarding my claim. You'll get nothing out of them. If you can, get rid of them and ask for a different loss adjuster from Zurich.

 

I'm very much in conversation with Richard Withey - genuine man and very helpful. He can give you lots of leads as to how to handle them.

 

Agnes

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Hi same boat as other with Davies........

 

The claim is now with the FSO - whom decided against me in my claim and favoured Davies, but I want a binding decision from the Omnudsman, this could take another year, but I am annoyed they can refuse valid claims, on the back of ellegedly wrong reports from thier own builders/assesors and claims handlers - THEY ARE THE WORST..

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Another complainant here. Zurich- Davies -Eastwell but a different building firm, S&K Contract Finishers. Our woes began in May and don't appear to be getting anywhere fast, so we have begun an official complaint to Zurich. Our main issue is not wanting to continue with this building firm , who have been incompetent and then less than frank about the circumstances. We have been offered a sum in settlement that we suspect is way too little. We do not have access to the precise costings that the surveyor/loss adjustor/buidling contractor (they seem to wear all 3 hats) have supposedly supplied. I understand it is possible to get them to divulge these details via Freedom of Information act?

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Hi,

i/ Firstly, have a quick look at the forum under HSBC Ireland Ltd and Davies on this site (including the Insurance 360 Survey). I've taken some of my comments from it for you:

1/ Loss Adjusting Companies are totally without Regulation from anyone. i.e. They are accountable to no one.

2/ The C.I.L.A. is of no assistance to the consumer when Loss Adjusters act with negligence & are sacked

3/ The F.S.A & F.S.O. do not regulate Loss Adjusting Companies.

4/ My MP & Consumer Focus have been made aware of this loophole at this time & the Treasury is looking into it.

5/ F.S.A. guidelines intended to protect the consumer are totally bypassed when Loss Adjusting Companies manage claims for Insurers.

6/ In short, Loss Adjusters are actively misleading consumers in conjunction with their panel firms in order to bypass time consuming, and sometimes, costly regulations such as Health and safety C.D.M. regs, Buildings regs & Listed Buildings Consents. They are also actively misleading consumers as to who should act as the client during claims, which is very important legally when things go wrong.

7/ I am collating evidence of where this happens and it appears to be widespread among several large Loss Adjusting Companies.

Hope this helps, but the bottom line is if a Loss Adjusting Company has you over, currently your only redress is to take costly & lengthy civil action against them. I intend on getting the Loss Adjusting Industry regulated by the new organisation which is taking over from the F.S.A., using my own example as a benchmark as to why regulation is urgently required and should always have been in place.......

 

I haven't posted 20 times so can't post a link but if you google: Insurance 360 groundbreaking 2010 Loss Adjusters survey, you will find the first ever independent survey conducted on Loss Adjusting companies performance. It confirms many key issues and is worth reading if you are unlucky enough to get one of the worst performing Loss Adjusting companies sent to you.

ii/ Secondly, the reality is that you have a very serious issue on your hands... In, summary, as the policy holder you should employ all agents and have contracts with them all. Without this you are totally unprotected legally in "contract and negligence". Loss Adjusters give you the impression that they or the Insurance company choose & employ these agents, but this is totally untrue. This is what they want you to believe so that they can control everything and totally evade legal responsibility if things go wrong.

You are under no obligation to accept the Loss Adjusters Agents and they will deny any involvement in picking or employing these agents if it goes wrong. As you are "the client", "in legal terms and in the eyes of your Insurer" you should find or at least approve all the agents and have access to the Tender process, quotations, contracts, work schedules and reports/sign off documents/guarantees.

If you are unhappy with the agents picked and instructed by Davies, then confirm to your Insurer that "you have been misadvised as to your responsibilities as the Policy holder" and do the following:

Insist on a new Loss Adjusting Company taking over management of the claim or get your own Loss Adjuster to work for you.

Understand that unless you act and have contracts with all agents, you are not protected legally if they don't deliver as they should.

The bottom line is that, Loss Adjusters are protecting the Insurance Industry by very devious means and neither one of these have any interest in doing what you expect they would. In legal terms Loss Adjusters have complete immunity from prosecution since they owe you no "duty of care" in the courts eyes, "you have no contract with them" and "since they have no regulatory body to be accountable to". The C.I.L.A. will not help you since they do not regulate "Loss Adjusting Companies" as has been confirmed by Malcom Hyde (Executive Director of the C.I.L.A.) to Kirsty Williams AM on my behalf.

Honestly, The Davies Group are not to be trusted and you need to be aware that unless you know your legal rights and responsibilities they will take advantage of your ignorance to a staggering degree. Times have changed and Insurers do not make the money that they did in the past. "Private Venture Capitalist" Companies like Davies are cashing in on delivering for the Insurers at the expense of the policy holder.

"You must be the client and you must employ the agents."

"The agents do not work for your Insurer and they do not work for the Loss Adjusting Company no matter what they tell you or what they allude to."

"Keep all documentation and video/photograph everything that is done from day one."

Any deviation from this, then get it in black and white....You will find this impossible to do. This is the loophole that gets them out of being responsible for employing the worst and cheapest inept contractors that they can find......!! In the eyes of the Courts you employed them......if this is a shock to you, then ask your Insurer....!!! The Insurer has nothing to do with it and neither does the Loss Adjuster... In my case they employed a contractor that didn't even have Insurance to cover their work.....Don't be fooled times have changed and Davies and some others will do anything....Incredibly, as it stands now they are indeed "TOTALLY UNTOUCHABLE".... But not for much longer after I blow the lid on this scandalous industries methods of making a buck at our expense.....

The very best of luck and please let me know if you need some specific help. Last words of advice: DO NOT GIVE DAVIES A SECOND CHANCE......If your Insurer insists, come back to me and I will prove to you with firm evidence how The Davies Group were dismissed by the Insurer "Prestige". after 13 months for serious professional negligence. Funnily enough Zurich already know this and should not be using The Davies Group....one must wonder why??!!

Best wishes Richard.

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Richard thank you. We are due to discuss with Zurich our issues and concerns re Davies and their contractors. My hope is to exclude Davies from further involvment as I am failing to understand what they have contributed, other than stress and prevarication. The Eastwell layer is also confusing as they are somehow the same yet different people ? I am still looking into applying for all documentation and contents of phone calls, as we know our position has been misrepresented to our insurers.

Have spent days reading the trade literature amongst other sources of info and am amazed that Davies present themselves as eager to supply a shop window of excellence for the insurer. I wonder how much they charge the insurer for mismanaging claims and berating people belligerently ? I have been reduced to tears by their rudeness and bullying.

I wonder if the magic illusion of control, offered by their pin number for payment system, is a way of shifting the role of employer onto the policyholder ?

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Hi, it’s good to see you’re getting on to this and doing your research, well done, this will stand you in good stead and is the right approach. Here are a few more bits of info for your benefit and for others who may need to know.

I have Davies' audited accounts in my possession and "Eastwell" is indeed a subsidiary company of The Davies Group which is listed by their accountants in these audited documents....!

The last person I assisted (also with Zurich) was similarly misinformed by Davies as to who Eastwell actually are! They were able to get their Insurer to get rid of Davies very quickly (with assistance from their Insurance broker) when it was discovered that they were being bullied and lied to on many many issues after over 6 months had gone by. You may want to raise this with your Insurer since they got rid of Davies only a few short weeks ago......! Stay strong, you will feel a lot better when they are gone and things finally get done properly, everyone does.

As soon as the Insurer passes management of the claim to the Loss Adjuster, they are no longer responsible for anything other than picking up the final tab..... First Liability evaded and F.S.A. procedures bypassed.........

As soon as the Loss Adjuster makes you believe that the Agents and Surveyors can work on your property without legal contracts with anyone, second liability is evaded and F.S.A. procedures definitely bypassed.

As long as nothing goes wrong, they can control who, how and when without carrying any the responsibility that should normally protect you.

We wouldn’t allow an unregulated gas engineer to service our boilers, so why are we letting unregulated Loss Adjusters into our homes at such difficult times.....? Unbelievable, but totally true...... They can do whatever they want and to date have no come back at all, which is why they are so cocky...!! This is backed up by our Court system which does not recognise that Loss Adjusters owe Policy holders a “duty of care”..... Technically you can’t sue them unless they have a contract with you, which none of us do given that our Insurer employs them. Given that your Insurer is already in the clear by appointing a Loss Adjusting Company, both parties can do what they want regardless.....Priceless...!

The reasons why we are all sadly feeling Davies' bite is that they aren't doing too well in a few areas if you know what I mean?! It's not fair to condemn them yet before this goes into to public arena, however suffice to say....In the words of a credible Loss Adjusting insider who gave me the heads up on them..." Your Uninsured Losses would have been met if you were insured with anyone other than Prestige.....Davies know they and their agents are now liable, however their contract with Prestige was too small to make them want to pay now to save it, and they don't have the money to pay you or your Insurer anyway.....!!" I shall say no more but "creditgate".com can send anyone their current and past audited accounts online for a small fee which will back up my comments.

Also of interest is the fact that the majority shareholder has apparently suddenly put their stake of the Davies Group up for sale last month (via an auction sale) and is pulling out rapidly for some reason....!! Funny why they are doing this at this time given my actions with H.M. Treasury..... Especially given that the majority shareholder appears to be a ventures company owned by a well known bank......!!

All in all my opinion is that the Insurance 360 survey hit the nail on the head with this Industry. A lot of Loss Adjusting Companies are now simply fronted by "money men" (Venture Capitalist firms) who simply want to increase their balance sheet at any cost. Even the FSA highlighted back in 2004 that Loss Adjusters should be regulated, and yet for some reason nothing has been done since that time to protect the Consumer....

To anyone viewing this who is also encountering issues with Davies Loss Adjsuters ( The Davies Group ):

In my case and indeed many others, Davies staff are unhelpful, blatantly misleading and unable to offer any form of decent service due to their operating procedures, financial pressures and agendas. Act before it gets too serious and before months and months go by. They are not to be trusted and they are totally unregulated by anyone........ If your claim is in anyway complex or time consuming get another Loss Adjuster and Google the "Insurance 360 Loss Adjuster survey" to see who the better Loss Adjusting firms are. Never trust Davies’ panel agents and surveyors either, they are clearly bias and in some cases seriously inept. Always, always get your own Independent Surveyor to scope the works. You are allowed to do this and your Insurer pays for it as long as the costs meet current Construction Industry norms.

If you don’t then what is to stop the “panel surveyor” missing out things that need to be done on purpose/by mistake to save money for the Loss Adjuster? What is to stop them taking an incorrect/inappropriate approach to the works to save money for the Loss Adjuster? Remember you have no contracts with these companies so you can’t even sue them if they do it wrong...! Crazy eh..!

Regulation is on its way, believe me, but it won't happen overnight and until then all Consumers are totally vulnerable to be taken advantage of by a system of trust which is being blatantly abused by the new wave of Loss Adjusting firms’ owners that have arrived in the last decade or so.....Good luck all.....

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Hi, I'm the person that Richard Withey helped recently and without this website and Richard's information and moral support I would still be struggling with Davies and their awful crew. I refused the offer from Zurich of a 'nice kind man', or words to that effect, at the top of the management ladder at Davies as experience of both myself and Richard belied the existence of such a creature. Therefore, having refused to have anything more to do with Davies (having been forewarned by Richard of being offered this so called solution) I am now with Cunningham Lindsey loss adjusters. It's early days yet, perhaps, but now I have my own well reputed local builders in my house even though it's still very much under the auspices of the loss adjuster. I won't be breathing a sigh of relief until the work is completed and my builders have been paid. But this would never have happened with Davies.

 

I agree with everything that Richard has said. And would request another loss adjuster from Zurich. I have been told by a legal helpline that you DO NOT have to put up with a loss adjuster if you're not happy with them.

 

Good luck in your claim.

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Hi to All interested claimants,

 

A rather belated update on my problems with Davies Group in relation to their handling of my insurance claim.

 

In mid December 2011 I finally moved back into my home. The whole process had taken a full twelve months.

 

After having refused to have anything more to do with Davies Loss Adjusters (Cardiff), my claim went from strength to strength. The local builders that I myself appointed were overseen by a very good surveyor from Cunningham Lindsey Loss Adjusters - although the actual Loss Adjuster from Cunningham Lindsey was of a similar mindset to the Davies Group of Loss Adjusters. However, I was fortunate to be given a decent and honest surveyor whom I felt (in the main) I could trust.

 

The work by my own appointed builders was excellent and I am now enjoying my home very much.

 

Some time after I moved back into my home, I submitted a complaint to my insurer, Zurich, and have since received a heartfelt (or so they say) apology and have given me a courtesy payment of £500 by way of apology. I've accepted this and feel glad to finally draw a line under the whole dreadful experience.

 

It was so hard to take on both Davies Loss Adjusters and, in part, Zurich Insurance. However, I was in a stronger position to fight my case than most because Saga were my brokers and they did, where possible, fight my corner for me. Although, Saga, it has to be said, appoint insurance companies with disreputable loss adjusters - undoubtedly... Saga are only too aware of the problems that are so endemic within the insurance and loss adjusting industries.

Edited by MARTIN3030

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Glad it's sorted. The role of loss adjusters is to minimise the loss to their clients which is why they make it so hard for people claiming.

 

Agnetio/Richard - can you please provide a bit more information about what steps you took to settle your claim. I remember when I had a major claim being advised to appoint my own loss adjuster as they would be working in my best interest and not the insurance company, but I was not in a position to do that.

 

I'm sure we'd all welcome any advice you can offer for people who find themselves in a similar position in future.


 

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style="text-align:center;"> Please note that this topic has not had any new posts for the last 2942 days.

If you are trying to post a different story then you should start your own new thread. Posting on this thread is likely to mean that you won't get the help and advice that you need.

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