Australian credit card company chasing me in UK after nearly 6 years - threatening letters

[krios]

It wont hurt to put the complaints in

[minky47]

I just feel these c**** need to made an example of. So, yes, I will be sending off all the complaints necessary. As if I - like everyone else - haven't got better things to do with my time. I would like to put the shivers up them though. Any suggestions?

[krios]

As they are clearly acting as debt collectors the OFT need to check these parasites out as its not just solicitor work they are engaged in. Its clearly debt collection. I'm sure you can come up with something that requires them to be licenced as such and not hide behind the solicitor badge??

Also get everything sent from Credit corp as is your right under australian law. That will cost them time and postage.

[minky47]

Thanks Krios, common sense makes me think you are right. The funny thing is I have not received anything from Creditcorp. The copy of the letter they sent me from Creditcorp was sent to my old Australian address. When SD contacted me they sent me copies of old online bank statements plus one letter from Creditcorp to my old address in Australia. The only contact in relation to this debt is with SD. I am confused. Minky47

[William415]

Hiya, SD is back chasing me. Received a letter today which said that there is no proof I own the debt because the account was opened online.

 

NONSENSE. Even though you may have APPLIED for the account online, after you were approved then you would have been sent the fulfillment pack. Included therein would be a Credit Agreement that you would need to sign and send back.

 

It never ceases to amaze me the stories they come up with.

 

Tell them if they can't provide the original Credit Agreement, go jump in a lake. They are harassing you into paying a debt they cannot prove you are liable for. Complain about them to all and sundry. Even if the DO try to sue you - and I would eat my hat if they tried, over such a small amount - it won't get through the court process until it's Statute Barred.

 

Game over.

[William415]

"SD came back to me and said they would get this original credit agreement and send it to me shortly."

 

...

 

"Received a letter today which said that there is no proof I own the debt because the account was opened online."

 

TRANSLATION: We can't find - and therefore cannot produce - the original credit agreement. But pay up anyway!

 

If it were me, my next response would be: GO F*CK YOURSELF

[minky47]

Dear William 415, my sentiments exactly. They are admitting they have no proof, so this reinforces the fact to me fully that they are bullies and acting totally illegally, as if any of us needed proof of that. I will now make official complaints to OFT, the Law Society and anyone else I can think of. I asked them to proof the debt was mine back in February, but they came back with a pathetic excuse that they couldn't get it but would try - three months later - this is the letter I get. How do you say Go F*** Yourself in professional speak?

[krios]

Thanks Krios, common sense makes me think you are right. The funny thing is I have not received anything from Creditcorp. The copy of the letter they sent me from Creditcorp was sent to my old Australian address. When SD contacted me they sent me copies of old online bank statements plus one letter from Creditcorp to my old address in Australia. The only contact in relation to this debt is with SD. I am confused. Minky47

 

I would still go after Credit Corp as they are the ones that start all this. It will cost them if you complain and dispute the account to the Australian FOS.

I agree with what you suggest so far and a complaint to the law society is a professional embarrassment for Stevensdrake. Not that they would care about that it seems. They seem anything but professional.

[minky47]

Thanks Krios, I am concerned that if I contact Credit Corp in Australia I will open another can of worms. I simply don't know how to approach them or bring it up as I have never received any mail from them in any shape or form. The only letter was a copy sent to my old address in Australia, and dated 2006. This was what SD sent me at the ned of last year. It was a letter that said they were going to start proceedings against me if I didn't settle with them. The first I knew of this was when SD contacted me in November last year. Obviously Westpac sold the debt to Credit Corp. Why then did it take them at least four years to start pursuing me? I know there is a lot of advice in this thread from posts put on a few months ago. I think I need to go back and reread the advice there and take yours too, of course. Am thinking that I will send them a letter this week telling them I am now reporting them to OFT, the Law Society etc for harrassment, and see what happens. It's a warning out there to others in this position, that these people are total sharks, and obviously there is something big it in it for them to pursue someone without proof for such a small amount. I have never admitted to any debt nor will I. I do really appreciate your advice Krios, and will let everyone know how I get on. Cheers.

[William415]

Thanks Krios, I am concerned that if I contact Credit Corp in Australia I will open another can of worms. I simply don't know how to approach them or bring it up as I have never received any mail from them in any shape or form. The only letter was a copy sent to my old address in Australia, and dated 2006. This was what SD sent me at the ned of last year. It was a letter that said they were going to start proceedings against me if I didn't settle with them. The first I knew of this was when SD contacted me in November last year. Obviously Westpac sold the debt to Credit Corp. Why then did it take them at least four years to start pursuing me? I know there is a lot of advice in this thread from posts put on a few months ago. I think I need to go back and reread the advice there and take yours too, of course. Am thinking that I will send them a letter this week telling them I am now reporting them to OFT, the Law Society etc for harrassment, and see what happens. It's a warning out there to others in this position, that these people are total sharks, and obviously there is something big it in it for them to pursue someone without proof for such a small amount. I have never admitted to any debt nor will I. I do really appreciate your advice Krios, and will let everyone know how I get on. Cheers.

 

You should most definitely complain to ASIC and the Australian FOS about Credit Corp (I did). The complaints must be investigated by law, and it uses up Credit Corp resources to deal with it. Also, there have been numerous complaints about Credit Corp to these organisations ... the more complaints received, the worse Credit Corp looks to the regulators.

[minky47]

Dear William415, I will do this, but how would you suggest I approach SD now. I am going to wait until 7 days have passed (I got the letter yesterday), then I was going to send them a letter telling them they are in breach of OFT guidelines. At the same time I am going to send a letter to the Law Society or the right body that scrutinises law firms in the UK, as well as OFT. I want them to know I am sending a letter to OFT and the Law Society and to show them I have actually done it. How do you suggest I approach the Australian body re: creditcorp? Any advice would be so gratefully received. Should I tell SD in my letter that I am writing to the Australian ombudsman about them? Minky47

[William415]

Dear William415, I will do this, but how would you suggest I approach SD now. I am going to wait until 7 days have passed (I got the letter yesterday), then I was going to send them a letter telling them they are in breach of OFT guidelines. At the same time I am going to send a letter to the Law Society or the right body that scrutinises law firms in the UK, as well as OFT. I want them to know I am sending a letter to OFT and the Law Society and to show them I have actually done it. How do you suggest I approach the Australian body re: creditcorp? Any advice would be so gratefully received. Should I tell SD in my letter that I am writing to the Australian ombudsman about them? Minky47

 

Although I have been through essentially the same drill (Credit Corp chasing me in the UK for Australian debt) - SD were not involved in my case. Not sure why not, but thankful all the same.So given my personal experience, here is my advice:1. Send a formal complaint to ASIC regarding Credit Corp's tactics - you can find all the info you need to lodge a complaint on ASIC's website.2. Issue a formal complaint against Creidt Corp with the Australian FOS. Again, all the info you need is on their website.3. I agree you should complain about SD with the OFT and Law Society - although, as I said, SD were not involved in my case.As far as communications with SD themselves, personally I would ignore the little maggots. What are they going to do? Let them try to sue you - by the time they sort the paperwork and get a court date, your debts will be statute barred. If they DO - by some miracle - get a court date, then show up to court proving the debts in question are statute-barred and rip them a new one. Hell, I'll show up to watch the fun.Good luck.W.

[minky47]

Thanks William, I will do this. Have just emailed Legal Ombudsman - http://www.legalombudsman.org.uk - to make a complaint against them. I will have a look at the sites you talk about tonight. The thing is I really, really want SD to know I am pulling out the big guns on them. BTW how did you go with all this William. I read all your posts from a few months back. Did you get it sorted? Have Creditcorp stopped hassling you? Best wishes, Minky

[krios]

Why then did it take them at least four years to start pursuing me?

 

Well to answer that just look at all the credit Corp, Stevensdrake solicitor threads just here on this forum. Almost ALL are 5 year old debts. Of course Credit Corp PTY LTD have added 5 years of interest. That alone needs pointing out to the ASCI.

Plus the larger the debt gets the bigger the "Asset" is on their books when it comes to accounting time to show the share holders of Credit Corp.

The pattern is clear for all to see.

If you look at William415's thread in this folder you will see some good example of the complaint letters he drafted.

[William415]

Thanks William, I will do this. Have just emailed Legal Ombudsman - www.legalombudsman.org.uk - to make a complaint against them. I will have a look at the sites you talk about tonight. The thing is I really, really want SD to know I am pulling out the big guns on them. BTW how did you go with all this William. I read all your posts from a few months back. Did you get it sorted? Have Creditcorp stopped hassling you? Best wishes, Minky

 

Credit Corp have given up on me, apparently. Haven't heard boo from them in a few months. They tried to send me a letter a few months ago, but I just marked it "return to sender" and put it back in the post. Haven't heard anything since.All my debt will be statute-barred very soon, but I wouldn't be surprised of SD crawl out of their hole to have one last go at me. Rather looking forward to that, actually - might have some fun with them.The one thing I've learned from this experience is that if you fight back - and FIGHT BACK HARD - these lowlifes back down. Their entire business model is going after people who don't know their rights, and bullying them into paying up. They don't have the stomach for a fair fight.Good luck.W.

[minky47]

Here, here William. Couldn't have put it better myself. You're absolutely right. Companies like creditcorp and SD are ****. It's a disgusting practice what they are doing. In an ideal world none of us would walk out on our debts, but these credit card companies use every evil practice under the sun to sell products to anybody who moves, and sell them too with payment protection insurance, which then turns out to be worthless. I am so glad creditcorp have given up on you.I wish you a peaceful, serene life away from these scumbags. Brilliant. I will have a trawl through the sites tonight. I am not going to ignore SD though. I want them to know I am onto them, and what they are doing is illegal. They have contravened every rule in the OFT book, threatening me to take away my house etc etc and they have not even been able to provide proof. I am convinced too they trawl this site for inside information. Well if you're reading this XXX from SD - go FUxx YOURSELF. You will NEVER win.

 

To Krios thanks for your brilliant support. I will look at William's letters in the folder. Am looking forward to this now. There is nothing I hate more in this world than bullies. You think you're leaving them behind when you leave school, but I've met more adult bullies in the workplace and in my dealings with corporations than I ever met in the playground. It's zero tolerance all the way for me. Best wishes, Minky

[minky47]

Hi William. I have been through the ASIC website and have been directed to this online complaint form situation. I am nervous about proceeding because it is basically asking you to tell them everything about the complaint and allow them to deal with it. This really will open up a can of worms. It will mean they have to look at my file. Surely then this will restart the clock, even though I will never admit to anything. Have a quick read of the cut and pasted form below if you have time and let me know what you think. Best, Minky.

 

Online Complaint Form

 

Completing this form should take you about 15 minutes

 

If more than one person is making this complaint, please make sure that you are authorised by each of the other complainants to make the complaint. If you are making this complaint for someone else, that person (the complainant) will need to complete a Third Party Authority and a Disclosure Statement.

 

The online complaint form consists of 4 sections:

 

Your Details

About your Complaint

Complaint Details

Review and Submission

Tips when writing and making the complaint

Most fields in the complaint form are required, unless otherwise noted as optional

You do not need to use any formal, legal or technical terms

Tell us what compensation you want the Member to give you, or corrective action you want the Member to take to resolve your complaint

Give us a copy of all documents that are relevant to your complaint

Give us consent to send a copy of your complaint and your documents to the Member you are complaining about

You must consent to the Member giving us information and documents about your dealings with the Member

If you have any difficulty in presenting your complaint, we can help you prepare it. In doing so, we will not be "taking sides", but will simply help you present your complaint as clearly and concisely as possible.

 

If you need assistance in completing this form, please contact us on 1800 138 422 .

 

Please tell us the person or business that you are complaining about:

[Joe Q Public]

Refter SD to the reply in Arkell v. Pressdram (1971).

The plaintiff was the subject of an article relating to illicit payments, and the magazine had ample evidence to back up the article. Arkell's lawyers wrote a letter which concluded: "His attitude to damages will be governed by the nature of your reply." The magazine's response was, in full: "We acknowledge your letter of 29th April referring to Mr J. Arkell. We note that Mr Arkell's attitude to damages will be governed by the nature of our reply and would therefore be grateful if you would inform us what his attitude to damages would be, were he to learn that the nature of our reply is as follows: f*ck off."

[cerberusalert]

Private Eye gave a similar response.

 

http://mattwpbs.com/2009/08/10/i-refer-you-to-the-reply-given-in-arkell-vs-pressdram-1971

[krios]

Minky,

Have a read of this...http://www1.contactlaw.co.uk/jurisdiction-law.html

Maybe your credit agreement cant be found because it would hurt their case

[minky47]

Hi People, thanks for the responses. Have been reading Docker 1's thread and to be honest getting myself in a bit of a tizzy about things. One of the points raised got me thinking. SD obviously snooped around and found me on Google. I am highly visible on Google (unfortunately) as I have a business and I am listed in Companies House. They have threatened to get a CCJ against my house. The funny is they have obviously been snooping and have found out that I have a lot of equity in my house so that's why they are going for the kill over such a piddling amount. This leaves me to believe they pick their targets carefully and that is why they are not giving up with me. On reading Docker 1's situation - highly unfortunate - I got to thinking that he should not have under any circumstances offered to settle, and that SD are in fact just playing him. Lots you have picked up on the fact that the court proceedings appear to be totally illegal. I simply don't understand the barrage of incredible advice - (I mean I don't understand the technical aspects of it) - coming in here, for him. With every respect for those commenting I am now extremely confused about what I should do. SD have put me under a microscope and obviously have had their detectives out examining my financial life (how creepy). They have decided I can afford to settle with them - (I can't), and have decided to bully me into things (I won't be bullied). I cannot bring myself to request an Australian credit file for myself to see if any judgements have been made against me, because I want nothing to do with Australia in that way. All I have is copies of credit card statements and a letter from Credit Corp to my old address in Australia dated 2006 which say they are going to issue proceedings against me to reclaim the debt owed on the credit card. If SD are to be believed there was only one letter from Credit Corp. The last payment I made was online from a country other than Australia and other than the UK in mid-2005, then nothing after that. So here I am now with letters from SD saying they can't get an original credit agreement for me, but how would I like to pay? I am totally sick of this. Poor Docker 1 has been ground down by this whole affair, and ground down to the point where he has made an offer. I won't do that. Again how can a British court issue proceedings on behalf of an Australian DCA? It beggars belief that this can happen when so many of you out there are quoting legislation and precedents etc. It also defies logical common sense, otherwise, as others have said, it would happen ALL the time, and I don't believe it does, does it?

 

I think I need to calm down and write SD a letter asking them again for proof of the debt. They have already told me they can't get it, so what now? I want to complain to the Australian Federal agencies but am concerned that if I do, they will then - as they have stated they will on their website - share my information with Credit Corp. I am also going to be doing a lot of travel soon for my work and will be renting out my home so don't want any nasty letters going to that address and being opened by tenants. Oh F&&&!!!!

 

I know my situation is not nearly as dire as Docker 1, but his thread has put the willies up me (excuse the expression). My debt is nearly statute barred, but there seems to be concern on this site too that DCAs can go after you even though a debt is statute barred. Even if they don't stand a chance of winning, it is so incredibly stressful, and I like most people, have my fair share of life's stresses.

 

I am probably venting now and I need to take a chill pill. Everyone on this site is so incredibly helpful. I was just a bit buzzed out by the mass of help and legal jargon listed in the Docker 1 thread. BW, Minky

[cerberusalert]

The last payment I made was online from a country other than Australia and other than the UK in mid-2005, then nothing after that. So here I am now with letters from SD saying they can't get an original credit agreement for me, but how would I like to pay?

The debt is very nearly Statute Barred & when it is no enforcement can be taken in any country. Also if they can't provide a copy of the agreement no court would give judgement in their favour.

[minky47]

Thanks Cerberus a nice, proverbial, kind and much-needed slap on the face to calm me down. I mean it, thanks I think what I will do - and if my actions help someone else out there - then wonderful I am going to play games with SD, am going to write them another letter which is basically exactly the same letter that you advised me to send a few months back - you posted the template on this site if you remember, but I will also add at the bottom, that I am now going to issue a formal letter of complaint to the Australian Federal bureau of whatever it is. I will also send an email to the Legal Ombudsman here, and copy them in (I hope this is not seen as defamatory - and complain about them to the OFT. If my actions give them the kick up the ar%% they need (whichit won't I know), and make them think a little about their potential success rates, then all well and good. Blessings to you.

[minky47]

Hi again, can anyone shed light on this - comes from this link: - http://www.asic.gov.au/asic/pdflib.nsf/LookupByFileName/statute_barred_debts_report.pdf/$file/statute_barred_debts_report.pdf

 

Does this mean that if there is a court date and judgement in Australia, that the new statute barred date of between 12 and 15 years applies? Should I find out if a judgement has been issued against me in this case?

 

The columns have become a bit mangled but in essence the first year number is for a simple contract - ie 6 years, the second is debts following a court judgement?

 

 

What is the relevant the limitation period?

The limitation periods in Table 1 apply to:

• unsecured personal loans and credit cards (referred to as simple

contracts)—the majority of debts sold or referred to debt collectors

will arise from simple contracts; and

• debts following a court judgment.

5

 

Table 1: Limitation periods by state or territory

State/territory Limitation period for

simple contract

Limitation period for

court judgement

Australian Capital Territory 6 years 12 years

New South Wales 6 years 12 years

Northern Territory 3 years 12 years

Queensland 6 years 12 years

South Australia 6 years 15 years

Tasmania 6 years 12 years

Victoria 6 years 15 years

Western Australia 6 years 12 years

[minky47]

Sorry, me again. The following is very, very interesting, and - if I am reading it right - is something to shove up the [email protected]@@@@@@ of SD and all those like them. Hopefully I am reading it right and not reading what I want to read. Any observations and comments most welcome.

 

This is courtesy of ASIC's PDF on statute barred debts - link in my last post.

 

 

Which legislation applies?

Given the inconsistencies between limitation regimes and the increased

centralisation of debt collection by both lenders and debt collectors, one

of the key issues in ensuring compliance is knowing which legislation

applies to what debts.

In 1993, each state and territory enacted legislation providing a nationally

consistent answer to this question. For example, section 5 of the

Victorian legislation

11

provides that:

If the substantive law of another place being another

State, a Territory or New Zealand, is to govern a claim

before a court of this State, a limitation law of that place

is to be regarded as part of that substantive law and

applied accordingly by the court.

This means, for example, that if a debt is governed by NSW legislation,

the Limitation Act 1969 (NSW) will apply regardless of where legal

proceedings are commenced.

12

Several matters determine which state or territory’s legislation governs a

claim:

• If the debt arises out of credit regulated by the Consumer Credit

Code, the relevant jurisdiction will be that in which the debtor

ordinarily resided when the credit contract was entered into.

13

• If the debt is not regulated by the Consumer Credit Code, the relevant

jurisdiction will usually be that in which the contract was entered into.

• In some cases, the contract itself may include a clause that constitutes an

agreement between the parties that the contract is subject to the laws of a

particular jurisdiction. However, such a clause will be ineffective if the

contract is regulated by the Consumer Credit Code.

14