MIB-Close Credit Management - Claim issued

[analyst]

Hope this post is in the right place.

 

First the outline facts (as brief as I reasonably can):

In Sept 2001 I had a head-on vehicle bump in a narrow lane (2 cars can't pass), no witnesses, a bit light frontal damage to both cars. My contention was that she ran into me, but in such a lane there isn't really an argument anyway.

 

I duly reported to my insurer to be told, to my astonishment, that insurance lapsed 2 days ago. They argued that they sent a renewal notice, but I never received it. I asked where was the reminder then, but they responded that they do not send reminders. (crap eh? As well you might imagine, this was a long conversation, but lets move on)

 

Cut long story, the other party fabricated a claim through a shyster claim lawyer and well known "claims" doctor, on medical grounds. (medical my arse)

 

It ended up with Motor Insurers Bureau. Their investigator interviewed me in Feb 2002 and left it more or less indicating to leave it with him, he can see the picture and they will conclude it accordingly. That was nearly 9 years ago.

 

That was the last I ever heard of it, until today.

 

Got a demand from scare-monkeys Close Credit Management (somewhat notorious nasties) wanting over £9000 payment for compensation.

 

You can see their demand letter HERE

 

and the MIB "Assignment" letter HERE

 

 

There is no 'debt' as such and no demand has ever been made before this, and not even any correspondence in almost 9 years.

 

Please advise best actions at this stage.

NB What do you think of the line from Close Credit Management which states ". . .7 days . . . County Court proceedings will be issued against you . . . "

 

If its a bluff that sure contravenes the OFT guidance.

[harrassed senior]

Unbelievable!!! Not covered by any knowledge that I have, but, perhaps a SARS request may be the way to go first? Hopefully others will be along to help.

[the_shadow]

Interesting one this... the statute of limitation states that

 

Limitation periods commence at the time the cause of action accrues to the claimant. Time runs from the earliest time that legal proceedings could have been brought. So, every fact required to commence an action must be in existence before the limitation period commences to run.

 

So are we thinking that the start of the limitation period is from the accident or when the bureau paid out the money and hence created the debt?

 

I would be inclined to send the stat barred debt back and see what they respond with.

 

S.

[the_shadow]

Found this on a solicitors website in regards road traffic accident claims:-

 

Time Limits

 

A person usually only has 3 years from the date of their accident to issue Court Proceedings. Therefore if Court Proceedings are not issued within 3 years of the date of the accident you would usually be unable to pursue your claim further as it would be out of time and statute barred. The Courts can however waive this 3-year time limit if it can be shown that there was a valid reason why you did not pursue the claim sooner.

 

S.

[analyst]

Another side of me wonders, 'how long would it be reasonable to leave an (alleged) debt accruing interest before information is passed to the (alleged) debtor?" 10 years, 20 years, 30 years??

No case has ever been raised against me and I have never had an opportunity to contest their spurious claim that I was in any way negligent in my driving, so what supports that allegation, made in the absence of any witnesses?

 

Could it be simply that MIB has had a clear-out of old rubbish and these vultures have combed through it all for potential victims to bully?

[jango1]

Read your CAG yesterday and have had the same correspondence from the same people. After contacting CAB and the National Debt Line we have come to the conclusion MIB have sold on these statute barred debts hoping some percentage will pay. On the NDL website there is a covering letter to send to the CCM which should shake them off. Also it is advised don't phone them. Further advice and to let them know them know the extent of the problem phone National Debt Line 0808 808 4000

[harrassed senior]

Many thanks for that information, thanks for passing it on.

[Bazooka Boo]

Well well well, Close call mismanagement deal with what they term 'aged' debts, I'm inclined to coin the phrase 'statute barred' debts!

 

I needed to use the MIB a number of years ago, after my car was rammed by an uninsured driver who had just committed an armed robbery in Derby and was being chased by the rozzers..who he subsequently reversed into as well!!! Any way, they would only pay me 50% of my claim for the damage to the car, way before all these where there's blame companies sprouted up!

 

I did use their complaints procedure to good effect, so that would be my first advice, ignore their incompetent choice of an inept DCA who has nothing to say and is saying it too loudly, we'll deal with them later.

 

MIB complaints should first go to their own customer services manager to deal with,

Write to:

Customer Service Manager

Motor Insurers' Bureau

Linford Wood House

6-12 Capital Drive

Milton Keynes

MK14 6XT

 

Or email the Customer Service Manager at [email protected].

 

 

And when they fail to deal with your complaint effectively, you now have the chance to write to the Minister for Transport to investigate,

Write to:

Minister for Transport

Department for Transport

Licensing, Roadworthiness & Insurance Division

Great Minster House

76 Marsham Street

London

SW1P 4DR

If you go to their website, you can leave them feedback!!

http://www.mib.org.uk/Customer+Charter+and+Feedback/en/Making+a+complaint/Default.htm

 

 

Now then, that brings us to these fools!Quite who they think they are talking at is not clear, maybe they believe you have only just left school and still require to be spoken at like a 5 year old, send a copy of that letter to their membership organisation the CSA http://www.csaconsumers-uk.com/page/i-have-a-complaint

 

That second paragraph attempting to chastise you and show you the error of your ways, has clearly been left to some spotty ex burger flipper who has just been given a desk a script a telephone, and new box of crayons! If this is how they conduct their business, then you will get much more sense from a breeze block than these uneducated fools.!

You could also forward a copy of that letter to the OFT&TS via http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/contact

 

[Tingy]

I would send the Statute Barred letter and make complaints as per the post above.

[analyst]

I am sending a "stat barred" letter but, since the circumstances are a little different in my case, I have modified your standard letter.

Please see as follows and please advise on any suggestions or improvements I ought to make before sending.

Dear Sir/Madam

Limitation Act 1980

Administration of Justice Act 1970

You have contacted me regarding with the above reference number, in which you state a claim is owed.

 

I do not acknowledge this alleged matter as no correspondence with regard to any such claim has ever been issued to me by the MIB.

 

I would point out that under the Limitation Act 1980 Section 5:

“An action founded on simple contract shall not be brought after the expiration of six years from the date on which the cause of action accrued”.

I would also point out that the OFT say under their Debt Collection Guidance on statute barred debt that:

“It is unfair to pursue the debt if the debtor has heard nothing from the creditor during the relevant limitation period”.

This relates to a claim which was made over six years ago and no further acknowledgement or payment has been made since that time.

 

Unless you can provide evidence of payment or written contact from me in the relevant period under Section 5 of the Limitation Act, I suggest that you are no longer able to take any court action to recover the alleged amount claimed.

The OFT Debt Collection Guidance states further that:

“Continuing to press for payment after a debtor has stated that they will not be paying a debt because it is statute barred could amount to harassment contrary to section 40 (1) of the Administration of Justice Act 1970”.

 

I await your written confirmation that no further contact will be made concerning the above account and confirmation that this matter is now closed.

I look forward to your reply.

 

Thanks again for your help

[analyst]

This has now got serious - very serious.

Just received County Court claim for £9500 issued by MIB, (not the D.C.A.)

 

What gets me is that something lying dormant for 9 years can be raised for instant payment with absolutely no precedent through all that time.

I have never been given the opportunity to contest the facts.

Even the MIB guy back in Feb 2002 commented that my insurers had acted unreasonably and that had I continued insurance with them, even after the event, they would have been duty-bound to cover this.

I KNOW the claim was fraudulent in that no injuries were sustained by the other party, a local girl, who we saw swanning around for days after, perfectly ok. Then the "claim", no doubt whiplash, only materialised some time later after she visited a notorious "claims" lawyer.

 

I really don't know how best to contest this now.

[Bazooka Boo]

What are the PoC?

How was this delivered?

Plenty of others will be here later to give you better advice regarding this, you have a while to acknowledge the claim and whether you are going to defend it, which I don't see why you shouldn't?

[ScarletPimpernel]

Edited due to BB and I thinking the same, but him having faster fingers!

[Tingy]

can you post up exactly what you've been sent today (obviously removing all personal details and any bar codes) so that we can have a look.

[analyst]

You can see the claim form here

 

It was delivered by standard postal service

[ScarletPimpernel]

I've changed the thread title to reflect the current situation, and moved it to the Legal forum.

[harrassed senior]

This is just unbelievable, as I said previously, I really hope someone can give you loads of help on this.

[nicklea]

deleted original post

 

on second thoughts I don't want to promote any particular firm

[spamheed]

You might want to have a look here

 

Why do you need the permission of the uninsured motorist to deal with my claim?

Even uninsured motorists have the right in law to deal with their own affairs, and the agreement does not permit us to ignore their rights. However, if the uninsured motorist does not co-operate, we will tell you what options appear to be available to progress your claim.

 

It seems to me if you have never heard of these people before, then they didn't do what they were supposed to do - namely get your permission or involve you at any stage of their "investigation" I cannot see how they can bring a case where there is no agreement, or conviction to support their POC.

 

I think you really need to take some legal advice on this one, do a bit of googling and it looks as if they are part of the Dept of Transport and they believe that the SB regs don't apply to them.

Edited January 5, 2011 by spamheed

[jango1]

This is just unbelievable, as I said previously, I really hope someone can give you loads of help on this.

 

As previously stated I have also received correspondence from M.I.B and Closed Credit and after various bits of advice I sent C.C. a letter drafted by the National Debt Help-line. We sent the letter christmas week. Today i have received a county court letter, with additional charges, £190 court fees and solicitors fees of £100. I rang back the National debt line straight away who said that if we defended the case we could accrue further costs if we do not win the case. The court will decide if we should pay or not at the end of the day. We are going to defend our case based on the limitations act and hope that the statued barred with cover us. We have had no written correspondence, no county court judgments and no request for any payment since April 2004.

Have you contacted the debt collectors directly, have you had any advise stating statued barred!? Nice time of year for it....!

 

Oh and on the national debt line site they have a fact sheet that you may or may not have read with advice on how to deal with this problem. Called Applying to a county court judgement.....

 

National debt line advised me get some legal advice. They recommended the community legal advise. on 0845 3454345. You will need to go through an assessment to see if you qualify for free legal advise.

 

Keep us informed any info much welcomed....

[Bazooka Boo]

Ooh Look what I found!!!!

Making a claim for compensation for personal injury involves compliance with the Limitation Act 1980. Legal proceedings must be issued in a court of law within a set period of time subsequent to an injury failing which the opportunity to claim compensation may be lost forever. The time limit is generally set at three years following the instance of negligence, although that term may in some circumstances be extended. There are exceptions to the standard three year limit under The Limitation Act 1980 :-

 

• In circumstances where the individual incurring the injury suffers from mental disability, the limit period only starts when full mental capacity has returned and in situations where mental disability is ongoing, damages can be pursued at any future time. Not Applicable?
  
• When the person sustaining the injury was under 18 at the time of the accident, the three year period only starts to run on their 18th birthday. Not applicable? If the three year period then expires and they still have not issued proceedings that person will have lost the opportunity to claim, unless they also suffer from mental disability.
  
• Under the Limitation Act 1980 the courts have a discretion to extend the time limits, although the occasions on which they do so are rare. If you think the Limitation Act 1980 has invalidated a potential claim you should obtain expert legal advice as soon as possible.
  

http://www.mugomilk.co.uk/limitation.htm

 

I really do hope this is correct, as it does seem ridiculously unfair, plus it's one over on them and two fingers up to her!

[analyst]

For now, I'm going to return the claim as 'defended' and send an SAR to MIB to see what they are basing it on and event timings.

I'm feeling the need for a legal bod to act here as it seems quite a big-un. If so, the question arises, do I need a specialist and what type, would that be motoring or debt or ??? . . . and where might I find such.

 

The situation here is a little different. The "claim" was made in good time under the act, quite soon after the event. The time lag following is when MIB then chose to recoup their loses on the payout they have presumably made.

 

Interestingly, when this happened, my car was perfectly driveable, split a couple of fixing lugs off the bumper. Her car was not driveable - reason: the engine had lurched into the radiator. What does that say about our relative speeds at point of impact? It is still my contention that she ran into me. (FWIW her tearaway driving was well known in the village anyway - she was 18ish)

 

Does anyone remember the 'good old days' when a minor bump on a single track lane would always be settled on a knock-for-knock basis by insurers, as no other conclusion could be reached?

Of course, in those days, ClaimsVultures4U were not plying their mucky trade.

Edited January 6, 2011 by analyst
Further thoughts

[Bazooka Boo]

You've misread it, or I have the wrong end of the stick?

What that is saying is that the 'claim' needs to be issued and heard in a court within three years, if it isn't, as is your case, then under the limitation act they are out of time.

Or am I getting this wrong?

[analyst]

This is how I see it. The claim was made, by the solicitor, to the MIB in the absence of a valid insurer.

The MIB then dealt with the claim, but I was never informed how or when or the final outcome.

I heard (from an external source) that it was originally rejected by the MIB but they appealed.

The MIB are now in the process of recouping their payments and costs in settlement of that claim.

[jango1]

I got the first 2 letters on the same day as you (the analyst) and the court letter on the same day as you!! COINCEDENCE? Had you sent anything relating to "statute barred" to C.C.M.

As it stands I have sent the "acknowledgment of service" slip to the court and emailed M.I.B. requesting all information on the case such as timescales. Today I am going seek legal advice.

Let us share anything we come up with