Halifax and Blair Oliver & Scott CCA

[spaggeyhoops]

Hi everyone,

 

Ive been putting in some man hours reading through relevant threads and I must say how more self assured and happy I now feel about my situation thanks to CAG, so big thumbs up!

 

It would be a great help if someone could cast their eye over the correspondance Ive received from Halifax and advise on the supposed 'enforcable' CCA.

 

A bit of background. I had a credit card with Halifax, had it since circa 2002. Up until 4 years ago I managed perfectley well with my debts until I ran into trouble due to my job and other personal problems I wont bore you all with. Basically the interest began to outstrip what I could afford to pay back and things got out of hand. I rang and explained my situation and was basically told to bog off.

 

The account was terminated, default notice issued (as I recall) and I was advised to speak with the CCCS. I have been involved with a DMP with the CCCS for the last 3 years.

 

Up until 3 months ago I was a bit green, but following advice lifted from various posts in this forum I decided to fight back.

 

I wrote asking for my CCA and received what looks like a stock computer generated letter (1st letter on the attached and some generic T&C's). I wrote back putting the account in dispute and stopped my DMP until further evidence has been provided.

 

Next came what looks like a signed (an attempt to scare me I think) credit card application or 'upgrade agreement'. This single sheet is all that Halifax have been able to provide and claim is my exceuted CCA. Its this document I would welcome peoples comment upon.

 

Since then there has been a number of letters back and forth between myself and Halifax ending on the last letter as shown. Now its Blair Oliver and Scott taking over things!!!

 

For peice of mind Ive sent a SAR to Halifax to make sure. They have acknowledged it and Im now waiting the 40 days.

 

Any thoughts on the correspondance? the alleged CCA and my next steps?

 

Many thanks in advance guys...

CCA Copy.pdf

[spaggeyhoops]

Bump...Anyone have any thoughts on the attached?

[rebel11]

Hi Spaggey

 

Just to let you know Blair,Oliver and Scott = BOS = Bank of Scotland.

[Bazooka Boo]

All I can see is a load of generic T&C's, clearly these were the ones in force when you took the card out as I now believe that they have reduced their unfair charges to around £12?

 

Where is the actual agreement with your and theirs signature box?

[spaggeyhoops]

Thats my opinion Boo, Im not sure how many 'enforcable' CCA's start with "...Dear Mr so and so..."

 

Its basically an application form with a signature box. Ive SAR'd them so see what that throws up!

[Bazooka Boo]

I also like their self assertion that they feel they have complied with your request, I hate Shallowfax with a passion, for reasons I won't go in to, but lets just say what goes around comes around, and they have most definitely got their come-uppance!

Whilst application forms can be enforceable, it needs to have your sig and theirs on, with the words 'this is a credit agreement under the blah blah blah'

[maroondevo52]

Any idea how many charges on the account ?

[siennasmummy]

Yes as stated above by rebel11, Blair, Oliver and Scott are not solicitors or debt collectors. It is a department within Halifax / bank of scotland and they use this to scare you. The initials BOS (blair oliver scott) are actually BOS (bank of scotland) so I wouldn't worry too much about this. I had them write to me and that's how I found out. I rang the number and asked if I could speak to either Mr Blair, Mr Oliver or Mr Scott and guess what? I couldn't LOL

[spaggeyhoops]

Any idea how many charges on the account ?

 

Not yet, they have until the end of the month to cough up on the SAR...When I have all my details Im going to start a claim.

 

As I stated above Ive already payed back a fair chunk of money through the CCCS. Do people think this is an admitance on my behalf that the debt is enforcable? can this money be claimed back if they admit/or through the courts that the CCA is unenforceable?

[spaggeyhoops]

Yes as stated above by rebel11, Blair, Oliver and Scott are not solicitors or debt collectors. It is a department within Halifax / bank of scotland and they use this to scare you. The initials BOS (blair oliver scott) are actually BOS (bank of scotland) so I wouldn't worry too much about this. I had them write to me and that's how I found out. I rang the number and asked if I could speak to either Mr Blair, Mr Oliver or Mr Scott and guess what? I couldn't LOL

 

Hi, yes thanks for the info.

 

I intially thought it had been sold on to a DCA. I kind of wish it had, would make dealing with these people far easier. Halifax are like a dog (very aggresive one at that) with a bone! I imagine they will push me all the way to court, just have to continue to stand my corner and get educated on matters. Im up for a fight!

[spaggeyhoops]

Hi guys

 

This morning I received an 'intended court action' letter from Blair Oliver and Scott. There was no 'mays' or 'if's' on the letter so I guess this is actually going to end up in court.

 

So I can prepare in advance, can anyone start me off with the kind of arguments/defence I would need to prepare to fight this? or post any good examples?

 

They have until 1st December to reply on my SAR, but I apparentley only have till the 31/11/10 to pay up. Hopefully my info from Halifax will turn up so I can check the default notice etc...

 

Is this a standard threatogram? Or is this a firm threat of court action? Although Im 99% sure they dont have an enforceable CCA, there's always that doubt

 

If someone can help it might not be my weekend down the pan!

 

Cheers in advance...

[Bazooka Boo]

Blair Oliver & Snot IS Halifax (Bank Of Scotland B.O.S)

This sounds like one of the last threatogrammes they send out before selling your alleged debt onto a DCA, unfortuantely I had got rid of all my Blair Oliver & Snot letters before I found CAG.

I take it they have received your SAR? Hence why they have foolishly given you until the end of the month to pay up, idiots!

I would do nothing until you have received what you have requested from them, the only time you need worry about court is if they issue you with an SD.

[spaggeyhoops]

Hi Boo

 

Yup thats what i thought! They have acknowledged the SAR but nothing as of yet. Like I say 1st December is the deadline so ill await the post with baited breath.

 

Thanks for your reply.

 

Cheers

[spaggeyhoops]

Ive been dwelling on this over night and although this maybe a computer generated threatogram, id like to but a response together to BOS/Halifax regarding their intended court action, just incase!

 

As Ive said above the account is in dispute and I have pointed out their short comings in the CCA. Is there anything else which might make them think twice about court action?

[Bazooka Boo]

No not really, what you have to consider is that these letters they send out ARE printed off by a computer, NO human input is involved, less for the posty putting it through your letterbox. The computers work on a cycle, and unless they have any input from a human to tell it to stop or swu=itch to a different setting, then it will continue to send out what ever is the next threatogramme on it's software.

To continue sending them letters will be pretty fruitless, as most are not read, least of all understood!

Court Action is the very last thing they will do, so try not to worry too much about these letters, they are by design intended to intimidate threaten and exploit a debtors lack of knowledge.

[spaggeyhoops]

Hi All,

 

Quick update. I SAR'd Halifax and they eventually (2 weeks over due!!) replied. I dont have scanner at home but will post a copy up tommorow at work. Ive been doing some reading and the supposed CCA is pretty much identical to that in photos 3 and 4 of post 76 of the below thread:-

 

world wide web.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?119564-Halifax-Platinum-CCA**-WON-they-discontinued**/page4

 

Anyone have any thoughts? (sorry I cant post links at the moment due to post count)

 

I also managed to find at home my default notice. This was not part of my SAR bundle by the way, should this have been provided? Do I need to write back and remind them that they owe me some oustanding info?

 

My defalut notice was posted on the 18 March 2008 and they gave me till the 23 March 2008 to remedy. Based on these dates the default is flawed, however the actual charge off/termination date from the records I hold is the 21 April 2008. Do this mean the termination date is actually binding based on this date? Ive read case law which says so (although cant put my hand on it at the moment)

 

Thanks in advance CAG'ers

[spaggeyhoops]

Afternoon folks. Ive managed to scan up some bits and bobs I think are important to my case and would really appreacite peoples advice on the attached...

 

The first page is what Halifax returned to me in August following my CCA request. Im confident in the fact that this does not contain th required information to make it enforceable.

 

For completeness and to force Halifax's arm on the matter of my agreement I sent an SAR in October. The second document was part of the bundle. Its this which Im interested in getting peoples views on. It does appear to my lay persons eye to contain most/all of the prescribed terms required but im not sure. Could some one cast their expert eye over it please?

 

I also managed to dig up my original default from documents at home. The default did not (as I point out in my post above) come with the SAR bundle. Any reason why?

 

The default is the 3rd letter of the attached. It looks to me to be fatally flawed in terms of the dates to remedy etc. However as I point out above the account was not charged off until the 21 April 2008. Does this in fact reverse the flawed default? Im on a steep learning curve so advice would be welcome.

 

Thanks

SAR Info.pdf

[spaggeyhoops]

Ive been looking at the docs attached in my previous post on my dinner.

 

When Halifax sent me the upgrade agreement (the one which is clearly unenforceable) they changed my account number. Does this mean from that point on the whole debt became unenforceable? or if the original CCA is valid they can only claim up to the point which the account numbers were changed? Hope that makes sense!

 

Cheers

[Bazooka Boo]

OK, I'll try to be as succinct as I can, what they have sent you is hamster bedding at best.

 

You signed the "New agreement" ?

The application form, does not contain their signature? Have you sight of your cancellation rights?

Have you sight of the 'conditions of use' namely Condition 14?

 

The DN!!!

Well there is something else!

It first states that you have to rectify the account (Arrears??) within '5' days!!! New one for me I must say! Please tell me that you destroyed the card and disposed of it yourself and didn't send it back to them?

[spaggeyhoops]

Hi Boo

 

Thanks again for the reply. I went through this again last night and yes the info is pretty useless.

 

In the 'upgrade agreement' under the heading 'Important Infomation' they clearly withdraw and end the first agreement. I have my statements which show the balance at the time swopping from one account to antoher. They even state 'your existing terms will cease'. Clearly the new agreement is a pile of rubbish and the only thing they hold on account. It would be daft to proceed to court if that is their evidence...

 

The DN notice - Well what can I say, if you take the dates back in 2008 it effectivley gave me a Friday/Saturday morning to remedy before the deadline. That has to be one of the shortest remedy periods ever?

 

I await thier next threat.

 

Cheers

[spaggeyhoops]

Hi

 

Can anyone one point me in the direction of info regarding default notices? As above I beleive I have a flawed DN, but i cant find the relevant bits which states that a creditor can only pursue the arrears.

 

Thanks

[maroondevo52]

Hi,

 

This thread should help......................

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?196312-Invalid-Default-Notices&highlight=a+creditor+can+only+pursue+the+arrears

 

Refards.

 

Scott.

[spaggeyhoops]

Hi all

 

Its been quiet for a good 4/5 months now, just the odd statement from Halifax. However this morning I get hit with a 'Final Letter Before Action' from Halifax themselves and not from Blair Oliver and Scott who had been doing there dirty work for the last year.

 

Is this another threatogram or something more serious? A few threads similar to mine have ended up in court following this letter and to be honest Id like to keep it out of the courts.

 

Cheers

 

Hoops

[Bazooka Boo]

Can you scan & post it up? Remove all ID bar codes, ref numbers etc.