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    • what rights of access do you have on your agreement with the landlord?   i suspect you shouldn't have to pay a thing.
    • then there is your proof to them why would you pay for BB twice!!   for my notes: GENERAL NOTES ON CHARGEBACK & Continuous Payment Authority & BACS   .....  We have been telling people to put a letter into their bank instructing them  not to make any payments under any circumstances to these companies  . http://whatconsumer.co.uk/visa-debit-chargeback/- it works! usually this should be done using the number on your debit card  .  banks MUST follow written intructions from their customers ! . CANCELLING YOUR DEBIT CARD DOES NOT STOP CPA'S  .  This fsa guide has now been updated:  . http://www.fsa.gov.uk/static/pubs/consumer_info/know_your_rights_guide.pdf http://www.fca.org.uk/news/continuous-payment-authorities-your-right-to-cancel https://www.fca.org.uk/consumers/unauthorised-payments-account  .  Here's the text:  .  Cancelling a regular  card payment:  .  When you give your credit or debit card details to a company and authorise them to take regular payments from your account,   such as for a gym membership or magazine subscription,  it is known as a ‘recurring transaction’ or ‘continuous payment authority’.  . These are often confused with direct debits, but do not offer the same guarantee if the amount or date of the payment changes.  .  In most cases, regular payments can be cancelled by telling the company taking the payments.   .  However,   you have the right to cancel them directly with your bank or card issuer by telling it that you have stopped permission for the payments.   Your bank or card issuer must then stop them – it has no right to insist that you agree this first with the company taking the payments.  .  Be aware, though, that you will still be responsible for paying any money that you owe. and that CANCELLING YOUR CARD WILL NOT STOP THE CPA  .  ..  .  New june 2013  .  Regulator orders Banks and mutuals to review complaints about not cancelling recurring payments from November 2009.  .  Consumers who have set up a regular payment from their account will now be able to successfully cancel that arrangement   by contacting their card provider, the Financial Conduct Authority said.  .  The FCA has been examining how easy it is for customers to cancel Continuous Payment Authorities (CPAs)   due either to payday lendersicon or for other regular payments such as subscriptions or gymicon memberships.  .  CPAs, which are also commonly called recurring transactions or recurring payments,   are relatively easy to set up but can be hard to cancel, causing problems for consumers trying to manage their finances,the FCA said.  .  Now, following the FCA review of how the largest high street banks and mutuals process requests to cancel CPAs, they have agreed that they will ensure that when   a customer asks for a recurring payment to end, that will be sufficient to cancel the arrangement. They have also confirmed that should a payment go through by   mistake following cancellation by a customer the customer will be refunded immediately.  .  In addition to securing this commitment, the largest banks and mutuals have agreed to review every individual complaint they have received about the non-  cancellation of a CPA and to pay redress where payments have continued to be made despite the customer cancelling the arrangement. This applies to all complaints   since November 2009 when the Financial Services Authority, the FCA’s predecessor, began regulating banking conduct.  .  Clive Adamson, the FCA’s director of supervision, said: “It’s important that consumers are confident that banks are meeting their everyday banking needs. Today   customers can be confident that when they ask for a Continuous Payment Authority to be cancelled – it will be cancelled - and that it can be done easily.   . “We recognise that historically this is an area where some customers have struggled but the banks and mutuals have responded positively to our work on this issue.   From now on we expect them to be getting this right. In addition, they have committed to review past complaints.” .  .  Also mentioned your displeasure that as whomever took your money had obviously attempted this many times   probably activating your banks own anti fraud software - nobody had the decency to inform my you this was going on.? .  .In the FSA's own words:  .  ..  What should I do about a payment from my account that I didn’t authorise?  .  Your bank must refund an unauthorised transaction.   Money can only be taken from your account if you have authorised the transaction   or if your bank can prove you were at fault –  . see below.  Contact your bank immediately if you notice an unauthorised payment from your account. .  If you are sure you did not authorise the payment, you can claim a refund.  .  However, your bank does not have to refund you if you do not tell it about the payment until 13 months  or more after the date it left your account.  .  Your bank must refund an unauthorised transaction  .  ------------------  .  Your bank may only refuse a refund for an unauthorised transaction if:  .  ? it can prove you authorised the transaction  – though your bank cannot simply say that use of your password,   card and PIN proves you authorised a payment; or .  ? it can prove you are at fault because you acted fraudulently,   or because you deliberately,   or with gross negligence, failed to protect the details of your card, PIN or password in a way that allowed the transaction  .  -----------------------  .  How quickly must my bank refund me for an unauthorised transaction?  .  The bank must make the refund immediately unless it has evidence that one of the above reasons applies.   Your bank may ask you to answer some questions and fill out a form confirming what has happened,   but it cannot delay your refund while it waits for you to return the form.  If the bank has evidence that one of the above reasons for refusing a refund applies,   it may investigate before making a refund   but must look into it as quickly as possible.   If your bank rejects your claim for a refund it should explain why.  If the transaction was on a credit card, the refund may not happen immediately.   But the card issuer cannot charge interest or ask for repayment of the amount unless it can prove you are liable to pay        
    • Only asking because I want to get my facts right before I approach the bank! Yes, BT is coming out of the same account.
    • not if they want to make the OP the named claimant no!! let them take the other party to court themselves!! the op can be a witness then..   one bitten...read this thread..      
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    • Hi,  
      I was in Sainsbury’s today and did scan and shop.
      I arrived in after a busy day at work and immediately got distracted by the clothes.
      I put a few things in my trolley and then did a shop.
      I paid and was about to get into my car when the security guard stopped me and asked me to come back in.
      I did and they took me upstairs.
      I was mortified and said I forgot to scan the clothes and a conditioner, 5 items.
      I know its unacceptable but I was distracted and Initially hadn’t really planned to use scan and shop.
      No excuse.
      I offered to pay for the goods but the manager said it was too late.
      He looked at the CCTV and because I didn’t try to scan the items he was phoning the police.
      The cost of the items was about £40.
      I was crying at this point and told them I was a nurse, just coming from work and I could get struck off.
      They rang the police anyway and they came and issued me with a community resolution notice, which goes off my record in a year.
      I feel terrible. I have to declare this to my employer and NMC.
      They kept me in a room on my own with 4 staff and have banned me from all stores.
      The police said if I didn’t do the community order I would go to court and they would refer me to the PPS.
      I’m so stressed,
      can u appeal this or should I just accept it?
      Thanks for reading 
      • 16 replies
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We've just recently moved out of a house that we let for 4.5 years, and the LL is trying to keep a big portion of our deposit for what I consider to be unfair reasons. When we moved in, the house had been recently refurbed, new carpets, curtains, kitchen, etc. (new, but all of a cheap quality, i.e wickes flatpack kitchen, 2.99 sqm carpet upstairs w/out underlay, etc) Also the house is from the 60's, so although the paint was new, it was done sloppily and just over any old damage. You get the picture.


We had the carpets cleaned, filled and painted over any holes in the walls, and thoroughly cleaned the house. Prior to vacating, I emailed the letting agents about specifically what we needed to do in order to recoup our deposit. (we are expats so maybe things aren't the same as back home) They wrote back stating "clean the carpets, and leave it clean and tidy". At no time was there mention of professional cleaning or dry cleaning of the (cheap) curtains. Our original check-in was also only a general casual one, done by a guy at the estate agents, as opposed to an independent inventory clerk. Of course at check out, they DID have an IIC, who naturally found all sorts of things at fault, as is their job I suppose.

In the end, amongst other things, they wanted £240 to clean the curtains, and £300 to professionally clean the house. I'll admit that after 4 years, there probably were some marks on the curtains, and while I scrubbed my hardest, was unable to completely remove the baked-on spots from the inside of the oven. From 18 years of renting in the US and Germany, we felt that we left the house in a state any normal person would regard as "clean and tidy".


The letting agents keep harping on about how because everything was new, we have to bring it all back to the same condition. They also wrote that being new means being professionally cleaned. I wrote back that that was their definition, nowhere does it state on our inventory or letting agreement that anything must be professionally cleaned. It just seems like they haven't taken any account of fair wear and tear, especially considering we (husband, myself, and 2 kids) lived there for 4 years.


One other thing, I had taken down some blinds from the kitchen window and stored them in the garage. They claim that they were broken (they weren't) and want £50. They were very obviously not custom blinds, more like something off the shelf from b&q, which new wouldn't even cost £50, even accounting for the fact that the LL can't charge to replace it with new anyway.


Sorry this is so long. We are totally frustrated with this whole thing, and feel they are really taking the mickey charging us right and left for as much as possible.

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They are seriously ripping you off. You say you rented for 4.5 years - was your tenancy renewed during that period? If you signed a new AST after April 2007 they were legally required to protect your deposit in one of the 3 government-approved schemes. They may have had an inventory clerk do the check out, but without a proper check-in inventory - signed and agreed by you - they have wasted their time. Write to them firmly stating that their demands are ridiculous. You are expected to return the property in a similar condition to that at the beginning of the tenancy APART FROM FAIR WEAR AND TEAR - and after 4.5 years that is what you have done. Refute all their claims item by item - clearly and firmly and tell them you require the return of your deposit (less possibly a token amount) by a certain date or you will sue them through the small claims court.


Of course, if you did sign an agreement after April 2007, you can also threaten to sue them for deposit + 3xdeposit for not protecting it.

Kentish Lass

Information given is based on my knowledge and experience and is not to be considered as legal advice

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Hi there, thanks for the response. When we moved in, there was a check in report done, which I signed- but it wasn't a detailed independent one. Basically for each room it notes 3 or 4 things, curtain colour/clean, walls painted/colour, carpet colour/clean, etc. The IIC marked all sorts of things off like the skirting boards needed wiping (which I totally refute, seeing as I'd spent the better part of a week cleaning the house!), there were some cobwebs I'd missed, the oven wasn't sparkling clean, she noted that practically every window needed cleaning (though I'd cleaned them all- this is a house from the 60s as are the windows, there will be some remaining ingrained dirt!) scuff marks on base of some doors, etc etc.

The house, while recently refurbed, wasn't cleaned to the standard they are expecting us to leave it in. Is it even reasonably possible to leave a house as sparkling clean as it was when you moved in? I'd think that would be where fair wear and tear came in- like the scuffs to the doors and the oven having some baked on marks. We lived there for God's sake! It doesn't say anywhere that we were expected to have a professional clean. We own 2 houses in the US and would never require this sort of asinine level of cleanliness from our tenants, and those houses are newer and the interiors are of a much higher quality!

If we legitimately broke something, then yes we'd definitely pay for it. We even went around the house with a decorator friend and filled in and painted over all the holes in the walls. We also had him repaint the entire kitchen and downstairs bath! We had the carpets cleaned, as per the letting agents advice, but never would've thought we'd have to get those cheap curtains drycleaned! I'd actually be interested to see if it would've just been cheaper to replace the lot!

The letting agent has come back now with threats to add to our dilapidations list if we choose to go to court. Can the even do this once they've submitted their list in writing to us?

As for our deposit, no we never renewed, and as it was around the time this new deposit scheme came into effect, I suspect that was why they weren't keen on renewing.

Is it reasonable that they charge us the price of thoroughly cleaning the whole house? Obviously as I'd already cleaned it, I can't imagine they actually had a lot to do, other than just redoing what was done. As I've said, I've rented out many houses/apartments over the years, some brand new at the start, some not, and have never been expected to do a professional clean, aside from the carpet.

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