Trouble at't mill.

[yogibear8]

My wife works in a care home specialising in altzhiemers and dementia. She and her colleagues have always been paid every 4 weeks, but a month ago her employer said he was changing the pay date from the 17th to the 28th. As he only pays minimum rate, even at overtime it's flat NMW, the girls live month to month. Most of them are single and this is their only source of income.

 

As there is an 11 day gap between last pay day and the new one, the employer asked who would like an advance, to be deducted in two monthly payments, so the staff worked on that premise. Despite being asked by the staff, manager, and area manager, and him stating he had paid in the advances (all different banks) not one girl has received any money.He lied.

 

These girls kept the home running for three months after the last manager left, because he couldn't get anyone else to fill the post on the wages he offers. They got no extra money for it, nor any thanks.

 

Many of the girls cannot afford the bus fares to get into work this week and have stated that they intend, 100%, not to work if, as they suspect, their pay does not go into the bank on the 28th.

 

Does anyone know where they stand legally if he does not pay them? Can they refuse to work until he does pay them?

 

He has also this week informed them that they will have to pay to drink tea at work, he wants £4 per week off each employee to be used to provide activities for the residents...despite the fact that he charges the residents for thes already.

[yogibear8]

His staff are also working an average 14 hour day, 6 or 7 days on the trot, and have been for several months now.

[Guest Cartaphilus]

My wife works in a care home specialising in altzhiemers and dementia.

 

Welcome, but if this is a specialist care home as you said, where is the PCT involved in all this, if it's this bad surely they would need to be alerted to it? Also, I shouldn't think for one second families of anyone in the care there would be happy to learn/know their relatives are potentially being placed in jeopardy as a result of all of it. Also, social services another.

[yogibear8]

Thanks for that. I must admit, my first thoughts were to contact someone, but who? It's a private home and, as far as we are aware, the residents pay themselves (some £450 PW for 22 residents).

 

The staff are afraid that any adverse reporting may get them sacked, he has already said that anyone who is unhappy knows what to do.

[callumsgran]

Get on to ACAS and see what they have to say about it

[honeybee13]

Hello. I don't have anything much to add at the moment, just to say this sounds terrible for your OH and everyone else involved.

 

We have an NHS forum here. I know it's a private home, but depending on the answers you get, it might be worth asking on there or adding a link to your question on this forum. Don't copy and paste this, the site team don't like it.

 

I hope we can find some answers for you.

 

My best, HB

[honeybee13]

PS There is legal protection for anyone who is a whistleblower, which could be the case here. Have a look at PCAW [Public Concern at Work]. This cropped up the other day on another thread.

 

HB

[honeybee13]

Here's a link to directgov on work breaks and time between shifts, etc. The rules are different for hospital work and I imagine what your wife does, but it could be worth a read. I'm not up to the maths at this stage of the day.

 

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/Employees/WorkingHoursAndTimeOff/DG_10029451

 

HB

[papasmurf1cx]

Are any of the staff members of a union? If so perhaps they should be contacted.

[Sidewinder]

The first thing to do is to get a grievance in straight away. Collectively if possible, complain that despite assurances of an advance to ease the new pay date in without causing hardship, none of the staff concerned have received the money promised to them. Stress that staff are already suffering because of this and seek an assurance that they will receive their pay this week or some may not be financially able to get to work. Unilateral action in not going to work in retaliation is not a good idea, but floating the possibility that the employer may put staff in the position of not being able to afford to get in is different altogether.

 

If the employer does not pay staff then this will represent a breach of contract and an Unlawful Deduction, and whilst it will not necessarily guarantee prompt payment, the prospect of legal action by the staff may well focus the employer's mind.

 

Is there any concern over the level of care for the residents? Not talking about staff necessarily, but more food, heating, basic needs? If so, then the Home must be regulated and subject to inspection....

[yogibear8]

Thanks everyone. The care side of the job seems to be ticking along ok...albeit by breaking the EWTD which no-one has opted out of, but they recently got a slating because they don't employ a cook or cleaners...the carers have to do it.

 

Only two of them are in a union, something I have advised them to change, hopefully into the same union. I will advise them to take out a joint grievance and hand it in, as has been said, it may just force the employers attention.

[DJ2010]

Speaking Out is Part of Caring. Vulnerable people will suffer because of greedy care home owners

How are the patients/residents in the care home coping? They will have little choice but the stay there locked in there for 24/7 as there is no one to speak out for them. If people with dementia have no caring member of their family, which is unlikely if the are elderly as their families will either have passed away, or the family members do care about them.

It is goes on all the time in care homes and it is nothing new that elderly patients/residents are neglected in care home, but dose anyone care ‘NO’. Dementia patients suffer the most due to short term memory problems. If there is some one that shows some cares for them unfortunately due to short term memory problems they patients will not be able to tell them what has happened to them.

I bet the patients have lost all their teeth due to them not remembering to clean them at night time and there is no staff to remind them to clean them also they go without baths shows as well and if they do bother the staff then the medical cosh as it is known is given to them to keep sleeping most of the day.

[DJ2010]

Tried to post links about care homes but the site say no link posting. Look at the Alzhimers society site also Garry Robinson made 2 programms last year on BBC which you get by by looking up his name, this was also very revealing about greedy care home owners.

 

Also government run care homes are just as bad as Social Services will take all they can get from elderly people they will have to sell their homes that they have worked for all their lives and give it to them. Just look at the Age concern website and you will see how it is for elderly people today in England.

[yogibear8]

The residents are well cared for, the carers pull out all the stops to ensure this. That's the point. Because the staff run themselves ragged to ensure the right care is given, including cooking good meals and cleaning (which you can imagine is constant), this tosser lets them get on with it and doesn't replace staff.

 

They don't mind going the extra mile, they have genuine feelings for their residents (my wife has known a few of them since she was a child), the least they could expect in return is to be paid, paid well, and paid on time.

 

The only concern they do have is that all these hours they are working will, one day, catch up with them and then the brown stuff will hit the fan Unfortunately, the buck stops with the carer concerned, not the owner.

[DJ2010]

They don't mind going the extra mile, they have genuine feelings for their residents (my wife has known a few of them since she was a child), the least they could expect in return is to be paid, paid well, and paid on time.

The only concern they do have is that all these hours they are working will, one day, catch up with them and then the brown stuff will hit the fan Unfortunately, the buck stops with the carer concerned, not the owner.

Your wife cannot be there 24/7, if the home is treating their staff like this then they will not be good to its patients. What happens at night time?? In one of the Garry Robinsons program it showed night staff sleeping and before they settle down to sleep for their nights sleep they took away alarms from patients to make sure that they would not be work up. These people were supposed to be working and being paid to care for patients but all they cared for was themselves.

Alzheimers and dementia patients cannot remember what they have been subjected to them. These greedy owners only want to make money from the vulnerable elderly people.

The buck stops with the manager/owner and cares should speak out and it is their duty to do so where vulnerable people are concern.

If you Google Nursinghomeabuse.co.uk there is a form on their website and they will investigate it also you can telephone them 0161 832 6131

Below is a bit from their website, please read it….

 

CARE HOMES "STARVE" ELDERLY RESIDENTS

 

Elderly people in care homes are starving to death, the Commons has been told. Many suffer from malnutrition within weeks of entering private care homes, Liberal Democrat Paul Burstow said.

"It is a scandal that in the 21st Century elderly people in care are starving to death."

He called for new standards set to be introduced in school dinners to also be applied to care for the elderly. Mr Burstow told MPs his Care of Older and Incapacitated People (Human Rights) Bill aimed to "safeguard vulnerable older people from abuse and neglect".

He hoped to "close a loophole" which sees private care homes fall outside the Human Rights Act definition of public authorities. "There is a 'protection gap' and it is the old and the vulnerable that are falling through the gap.

"As the law stands two people can receive broadly the same service one in a council home the other in a private home but not enjoy equal protection under the law." He said malnutrition had reached "epidemic levels".

"One in 10 care home residents lose up to 5% of their body weight within a month of being admitted to the home and 10% of their body weight within six months."

He said an estimated 44,000 older people were victims of malnutrition in England and the cost to the taxpayer of treating it in long-term care had been estimated at £2.6 billion a year.

He told MPs of one care home where "residents were forced to live on a diet of Angel Delight and beans on toast - sometimes pilchards on toast".

"Residents were left to fend for themselves and relatives were banned from the dining area. Rightly the Government has decided to implement nutrient-based standards for school meals. It is time it did the same for care homes."

The Bill would give councils the task of investigating alleged abuse and the teeth to protect vulnerable adults. The Health Select Committee reported in 2004 that there could be as many as 500,000 elderly people being abused in the UK at any one time.

"What do I mean by abuse?," he said. "I am talking about theft, imprisonment, mental and physical torture, even rape.

"I am talking about care homes misusing drugs to make managing older people easier - a culture in which the convenience of the staff comes ahead of the needs of the resident.

"I am talking about maltreatment and neglect that denies vulnerable older people their dignity and sometimes their lives." Basic rights, proper nutrition and protection from harm were "essentials not luxuries".

The Bill gained its first reading but stands little chance of becoming law without Government backing.

[yogibear8]

I think some have got the wrong end of the stick here. The residents are NOT in danger, nor are they being abused. My wife works nights and the staff do without meals/brews in order to make sure that the home is in top nick for the residents. Some of the residents get up at wierd hours, my wife and her colleagues make time to settle them, get them a brew, etc.

That side of it is ok. The point was about the treatment of the staff, the lack of respect the owner has for them (why should he care, the carers consistently do whatever he asks if it benefits the residents, and it doesn't cost him a bean), the lies he tells them, etc.

 

The only POSSIBLE danger to a resident would come from a tired carer, not something done maliciously.

[DJ2010]

My point that I was trying to make is if this greedy care home owner is not paying the staff to look after vulnerable people that he take their money to provide that care.

 

As you quite rightly said there is a possibility that staff will be very tired and mistakes can be made. As we all know a simple mistake can cost residents lives in care home and in hospitals.

Staff need to be in a happy state of mind to enable them to interact with their residents this is a crucial part of caring. If staffs are constantly worry about how they are going to make ends meet themselves then their mind is not the very important job that they are doing for their patients/residents that need them. I know caring for patients with dementia is very stressful in itself, especially when they are being constantly been asked the same question over and over again by patients and this will nearly always be ‘when I am going home’. Carers have to have a lot of energy and not be tired all time and also staff needs to know that they are doing a very valuable job, which greedy care home owners do not recognize. What I have seen in care homes there is never enough staff employed for them to give enough time to their patients/residents.

On Age concern I saw distress daughter worried about asking to see the care plan for her mother in a care home because she was afraid that asking to see it would make matters worse for her mum there. This is dreadful way for a daughter to feel about the home she has put her mum into. After her mum has been there for only 2 weeks on a trial basis when she received a invoice for £4500 for 2 months care in advance.

There are some very good care home and a lot of very bad ones as well. As for the greedy owner making staff pay for activities for patients then that is disgraceful and should be reported immediately.

If I were in you position I would following the internal grievance and then write to our MP, councilor and the minister of health as this cannot be allowed to continue. If he is

not paying staff and not replacing staff this will have a very bad news for patients/residents. We are all getting older and with age related conditions and will probably end up in one of these homes. It is in everyone interest that this is not allowed to continue for all of our sakes.

P.S I would be interested to know the activities that they are suppose to be giving their patients/residents

If you have time look at Gerry Robinson link which can be very revealing on how good care home can give patients and staff a good environment to reside or work in at very little cost involved for the owners

[DJ2010]

Hope he post make sense, there is no where I can edit and cannot correct the mistakes for grammer.

[yogibear8]

Payday is here and...no pay. All the girls are upset, they are all there at the moment trying to sort it. He has promised they will be paid tomorrow...but he promised them an advance as well.

[DJ2010]

Report it immdeately to the relevant authorities that the care members of staff are being pair state for x amount of weeks and stress that there is a real fear that vulnerable patients/residents may suffer as a result. Do it today.

[Guest Cartaphilus]

As the above poster says, you need to report this now. The situation as you have described it, putting aside the pay issues, I would describe as inhumane alround. In all instances the resident/patient. With all the best will in the world no one can work the hours you say and it not affecting this. It's a viscious circle which can only be broken by reporting it, maybe even going to your local papers to get it exposed as the scandal it is. It's clear that tne home maybe in some kind of financial difficulties, same old story, one which is repeated elsewhere. The only people who can get this dealt are those there, reasonably no one here can do it for you. The issue is no longer about being paid it's about the welfare of tne residents and the clear fact tney are suffering as a result. Got to your council, to any number of alzeihmers charities, papers. It needs exposing now, not tomorrow. No longer an issue of pay, it went beyond that the moment you said the payments stopped. These are people who cannot fignt back, let anyone know what's happening to them, I dread to think how tney are now because if no one's being paid then one may also assume other areas like food, medication are as well. So please report all this right now. In fact put the pay issue aside for now, it's a humane issue. Let us know how you go.

[honeybee13]

I agree with the previous posters, there's no point waiting. The home owner sounds really bad news and I would find it hard to trust anything he says.

 

I feel very sorry for your wife and the girls, but also for the residents. If the staff can't afford to get to work, who's going to look after the people?

 

I hope you're getting somewhere with this.

 

My best, HB

[Sidewinder]

Desperately sorry for the staff involved, but if this employer can neglect to pay staff on two occasions now, then as with the others I would be seriously worried about the owner just disappearing and leaving the residents and carers to it.

 

I don't see a problem with an expression of concern to either the local Health Authority or Care Quality Commission

 

As far as the pay goes, the employer will by now be well aware of the effects of not paying staff and hopefully this will ensure that the money is available tomorrow. There are legal routes, but these will doubtless take a lot longer.

[honeybee13]

Hope he post make sense, there is no where I can edit and cannot correct the mistakes for grammer.

 

Sorry to go off topic for a minute. Your own posts should have something at the bottom in black typeface, along with Reply etc, that says Edit post. If you click on that, you should be able to alter what you've typed previously.

 

HB

[DJ2010]

Payday is here and...no pay. All the girls are upset, they are all there at the moment trying to sort it. He has promised they will be paid tomorrow...but he promised them an advance as well.

 

Yogibear8 - Hope everything has turned out OK for you and the staff and residents at the care home?