Carter claimform - old Cap1 card **SETTLED BY TOMLIN**

[DonkeyB]

YOU may have the DN, but will they...?

 

You might consider an SAR to Cap1, but that will take some time. The info, however, could be useful in determining charges more quickly, as Carter hardly ever seems to fulfil CPR requests.

[emmaf01]

Is this okay for the CPR31.14 or do I need to amend further?

 

Dear Sir,

 

Re: Capital One v ************* Claim No: **********

 

 

CPR 31.14 Request

 

On *********** 2010 I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the Northampton County Court.

 

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

 

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of the documents mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

 

(You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.)

 

1. A photocopy of the signed, executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened.

The copy should be easily legible. If a copy of a microfiche document is supplied, please confirm whether the original document is still in existence. If it is, then a copy of the ORIGINAL will be required to be produced.

If a copy of the original document no longer exists, then you must state this.

 

 

2. A true copy of any Default Notice issued, with confirmation of method and proof of posting

 

3. A true copy of any Termination Notice issued by the claimant.

 

4. A full Breakdown of the amount claimed including any charges, late payment and over limit fees.

 

5. Any other documents that the Claimant seeks to rely on in court.

 

 

If a copy of the above documents is to be relied on in court rather than original, a copy of the Notice of Proposal to adduce hearsay evidence is required under s2(1) of the Civil Evidence Act 1995, together with proof of the authenticity of the documents as required under s8(1)(b) of the Act, including, but not limited to:

 

a) A copy of the procedure(s) used for copying, storing and retrieving documents

b) A copy of the relevant log entry showing the time and date of the scan or copy, the name of the member of staff making the copy, the method used for copying, storage and retrieval and time and date of destruction of the original documents

c) Copies of internal and external audit reports covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedures have been complied with

d) Copies of Quality Assurance accreditation certificates covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedures and audit processes comply with the appropriate quality standards

Although your claim is for a sum which is not more than £5,000.00 and will in all likelihood be allocated to the small claims track for determination upon my delivering a defence, at this moment in time I have not delivered my defence and the case has not been allocated to a track. In consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise.

 

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the documents I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter.

 

Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy.

Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

 

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

 

yours faithfully

[emmaf01]

Now a CPR 18- how do I use this?

 

 

 

 

 

IN THE XXXXXXXXX

county court CLAIM NO:

 

 

BETWEEN:

 

XXXXXXXXXX

Claimant

 

 

and

 

 

XXXXXXXXXXX

 

Defendant

 

 

_________________________ _________________________ ___________________

part 18 REQUEST FOR FURTHER INFORMATION

_________________________ _________________________ ___________________

 

 

To: XXXXXXXXXX (claimant)

 

Please answer the following questions:

 

1. What date is shown as the date the Claimant/Defendants account was transferred from XXXXXX to the Claimant/Defendant on the Deed of assignment?

 

2. What is the XXXXXXX account number shown on the Deed as being the Claimants/Defendants account?

 

 

 

TAKE NOTICE THAT YOU ARE REQUIRED TO ANSWER THE ABOVE REQUEST WITHIN 14 DAYS OF SERVICE OF THE SAME UPON YOU

 

 

 

From what I've seen it says CPR18 is not for documents- so what will I be requesting for it?

[AndyOrch]

Obtaining further information

 

18.1

 

(1) The court may at any time order a party to –

(a) clarify any matter which is in dispute in the proceedings; or

 

(b) give additional information in relation to any such matter,

 

whether or not the matter is contained or referred to in a statement of case.

 

(2) Paragraph (1) is subject to any rule of law to the contrary.

 

(3) Where the court makes an order under paragraph (1), the party against whom it is made must –

(a) file his response; and

 

(b) serve it on the other parties,

 

within the time specified by the court.

 

 

You have ti the wrong way round Emma, docs not referred t0 = CPR 18.1

[emmaf01]

No I'm still lost. So I send them a letter quoting CPR18- is there a template somewhere I can pick apart?

 

Or do I send CPR18 to the court, asking them to order BC to produce statements, amount borrowed, amount paid into account by us, amount of charges, credit agreement, notice of assignment- plus anything else anyone can think of?

 

And is the CPR31.14 letter above alright to send- it seems to have a lot on it which isn't strictly mentioned in their POC.

[emmaf01]

Well I got the CPR31.14 off.

 

I still don't understand the CPR18 so I haven't done it yet- if anyone can point me towards some explanations as I haven't found one I understand during my reading over the last couple of days?

[emmaf01]

They've received the CPR31.14. Signature printed out.

 

Now I've found the CPR18 which I understand- do I send it to Cap1 and BC? Can anyone have a check- it seems to be relevant to both, especially for Cap1 and the charges- it would be good to note if they showed how many times we told them the account was in dispute due to the charges while they defaulted us.

 

REQUEST FOR INFORMATION - CPR part 18

 

I have received a recent court claim from your organisation. In order to file a Defence and counter claim I require some information. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below.

 

The information must be furnished within fourteen days of the receipt of this letter. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this letter will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.

 

1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

 

1.1 If copies of any of the above documents are to be relied on in court rather than originals, a copy of the Notice of proposal to adduce hearsay evidence required under s2(1) of the Civil Evidence Act 1995 together with proof of the authenticity of the document(s) as required under s8(1)(b) of the Act, including but not limited to:

 

(a) a copy of the procedure(s) used for copying, storing and retrieving documents

(b) a copy of the relevant log entry showing the time and date of the scan or copy, the name of the member of staff making the copy, the method used for copying, storage and retrieval and time and date of destruction of the original document(s)

© copies of internal and external audit reports covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedures have been complied with

(d) copies of Quality Assurance accreditation certificates covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedure(s) and audit process(es) comply with the appropriate quality standards

 

2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:

 

a. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company, or by any previous creditor

b. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account formerly held with Barclaycard.

c. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

d. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

e. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

f. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

g. Copies of statements for the entire duration of the credit agreement.

 

3. Any other documents you seek to rely on in court.

 

I will require this information within the next fourteen days. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, it will be reported to the Court that you are trying to frustrate proceedings and denying me the opportunity to file a Defence and counter claim.

 

 

 

 

[emmaf01]

Still nothing from Mr Carter, so we'll be looking at sending a CPR31.15, 18 and an embarassed defence. Oh joy.

 

I've spotted a possible ED which may fit, plus it contains stuff about the charges we have repeatedly disputed including putting in a CC claim, which Capital One paid up for. Of course then they started adding more charges again.

 

 

• I, ********** of ************** make this statement as my defence to the claim brought by **************
  
• The claimants particulars of claim are vague and fail to disclose any cause of action, they appear to be an abuse of the process in that they fail to deal with the basic rules of pleading in accordance with the CPR even allowing for the constraints of the bulk issue system
  
• No documents supporting the claims in the particulars have been offered and despite a request to the claimant for further information none has been forth coming and as a result I cannot plead in defence to the claim
  
• The claimant pleads that the claim is brought under a regulated credit agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, yet the claimant claims statutory interest which the claimant should surely know it is not entitled to by virtue of the County Courts (Interest on Judgment Debts) Order 1991 (No. 1184 (L. 12)) in particular section 2 (3) which expressly prohibits such an award.
  
• The defendant contends that point 4 in itself amounts to a clear abuse of the process as the claimant would know the law and is trying to bring a claim for monies which it is not entitled to and knows that this is the case
  
• Without clarification of the claimants claim, the defendant is extremely disadvantaged and the claimants claim appears without merit
  
• Further to that above 6 paragraphs, the defendant is unable to plead effectively or at all. The defendant is embarrassed.
  

and if I combine it with something about the charges being unlawful and therefore the DN contains these charges?

 

I'm trying to track down a defence I can look at which refers to the charges but I can't find it at the moment. I've only got a week to pull this together so if anyone has spotted a defence with these points can you shout out ... please?

[emmaf01]

can I bump this- I think I've got the panic tonight, sorry.

[emmaf01]

I only have a couple of days to send in the defence for this. Has anyone got any ideas? I feel like I am doing this on my own and really don't know what I'm doing.

 

Can someone please help me? I know we can say there is a problem with the account being disputed because of the charges, but I keep looking and can only find stuff about default notices which doesn't count in our case. I don't know where to find the info on this and Bryan Carter hasn't even responded to our 31.14.

 

With his POC being so short and his adding s69 interest I am fuddled on what to write. I need to have an idea what to write about the charges making the amount wrong.

[emmaf01]

I need to get this done today to get it in before the defence deadline. Can anyone help? I can't find a defence which mentions credit card charges, Bryan Carter hasn't sent anything in response to the CPR31.14 and I don't know what to do.

 

Can anyone point me in the direction of a defence which mentions charges?

[emmaf01]

Do I need to put in anything about the charges, or do I just put in an embarassed defence and a note about the s69 interest? I don't want to nobble us by trying to put in too much but I'm really confused.

 

Can someone help?

[emmaf01]

Okay, this is the defence I have so far- cobbled together and not containing anything about charges.

 

 

 

1. I xxxxxxxxx am the Defendant in this action & I am a Litigant in Person.

2. Except where otherwise mentioned in this defence, I neither admit nor deny any allegation made in the Claimant’s Particulars of Claim and put the Claimant to strict proof thereof.

 

3. The Defendant is embarrassed in pleading to the Particulars of Claim as it stands at present, inter alia: -

 

(a) The Particulars of Claim are vague and insufficient and do not disclose an adequate statement of facts relating to or preceding the alleged cause of action. No particulars are offered in relation to the nature of the written agreement referred to, the method by which the Claimant calculated any outstanding sums due, the details of any default notices issued or any other matters necessary to substantiate the Claimant's claim.

 

b) A copy of the purported written agreement that the Claimant cites in the Particulars of Claim, and which appears to form the basis upon which these proceedings have been brought, has not been served.

 

c) A copy of any evidence of both the scope and nature of any default, and proof of any amount outstanding on the alleged accounts, has not been served

 

4.On 27th September 2010 the Defendant submitted a request under CPR31.14 for a copy of the agreement and any other documents which the Claimant has used to support how the claimant has arrived at the sum claimed.

 

5. The Claimant has not responded to this request.

 

6. The Claimant has failed to provide an agreement, a complete statement of account, neither have they provided a method or statement as to how the sum claimed has been calculated

 

7. The claimant seeks to claim interest of £xxx and also interest pursuant to Section 69 of the County Courts acts 1984. The defendant notes that the claimant is not entitled to do so and attention is drawn to The County Courts (Interest on Judgment Debts) Order 1991 (No. 1184 (L. 12)) Section 2 (3)(a) which sets out that this is the case where a claim is in relation to a debt regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

8. The Claimant’s entitlement to payment of the sum of xxxx and to interest is denied.

 

 

Statement of Truth

I, xxxx, believe the above statement to be true and factual

 

Signed:

 

Date:

 

 

What does anyone think? Please?

Edited October 18, 2010 by emmaf01
oops

[MandM]

[/font]If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

 

......................and Bryan Carter hasn't even responded to our 31.14.

 

.

 

Hi emmaf.

 

Did this bit ever happen? If BC hasn't responded to your CPR then you can agree an extension giving you (upto) a further 28 days to submit your defence,

 

M

[emmaf01]

Version 2, with some tweaking-

 

1. I xxxx am the Defendant in this action & I am a Litigant in Person.

2. Except where otherwise mentioned in this defence, I neither admit nor deny any allegation made in the Claimant’s Particulars of Claim and put the Claimant to strict proof thereof.

 

3. The Defendant is embarrassed in pleading to the Particulars of Claim as it stands at present, inter alia: -

 

(a) The Particulars of Claim are vague and insufficient and do not disclose an adequate statement of facts relating to or preceding the alleged cause of action. No particulars are offered in relation to the nature of the written agreement referred to, the method by which the Claimant calculated any outstanding sums due, the details of any default notices issued or any other matters necessary to substantiate the Claimant's claim.

 

b) A copy of the purported written agreement that the Claimant cites in the Particulars of Claim, and which appears to form the basis upon which these proceedings have been brought, has not been served.

 

c) A copy of any evidence of both the scope and nature of any default, and proof of any amount outstanding on the alleged accounts, has not been served

 

4.On 27th September 2010 the Defendant submitted a request under CPR31.14 for a copy of the agreement and any other documents which the Claimant has used to support how the claimant has arrived at the sum claimed.

 

5. To date the Claimant has failed to comply with my request under the CPR and I have not received any such documentation requested. As a result it has proven difficult to compose this defence without disclosure of the information requested, especially as I am a Litigant in Person.

 

6. The Claimant has failed to provide an agreement, a complete statement of account, neither have they provided a method or statement as to how the sum claimed has been calculated.

7. The amount detailed in the Claimant’s claim includes penalties charges, which are unlawful at Common Law, Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Company Limited v New Garage and Motor Company Limited [1915], under The Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 and The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.

 

8. The claimant seeks to claim interest pursuant to Section 69 of the County Courts acts 1984. The defendant notes that the claimant is not entitled to do so and attention is drawn to The County Courts (Interest on Judgment Debts) Order 1991 (No. 1184 (L. 12)) Section 2 (3)(a) which sets out that this is the case where a claim is in relation to a debt regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

9. The Claimant’s entitlement to payment of the sum of xxxx is denied.

 

Edited October 18, 2010 by emmaf01

[emmaf01]

BC has not replied at all to our 31.14 request- no response at all. How do I request an extension? I thought I had better just get in a defence before the deadline in 2 days?

[MandM]

BC has not replied at all to our 31.14 request- no response at all. How do I request an extension?

 

Quickest route possible at this late stage! It goes against the grain a bit but call BC now - see if they want the extension as offered in your CPR 31.14 request.

 

If so, get them to confirm it - I'm sure they can e mail you something.

 

Then it's up to YOU to inform the court. It must be in writing (with BCs agreement to it attached).

 

M

[emmaf01]

But they haven't said anything about producing the documents for us. Is this a better idea than putting in an embarassed defence or should I put in the ED and request an extension from BC? What if they say they won't produce the documents anyway as they have shown no sign of doing so up to now?

[emmaf01]

Right, phoned BC who say the matter has been referred back to Cap One for the documents. They SAY they have notified the court of this and the claim has been suspended- when I asked why we have not been told of this , they say the court should have notified us?

 

No I am befuddled - to defence or not to defence. I don't trust them. Off to the court website.

[emmaf01]

Nothing on the court website. On to the telephone.

[DonkeyB]

They cannot ‘suspend’ a claim. It is either a time extension, a discontinuation, or else they are trying to trick you into not entering a defence so you get a default judgment against you.

 

If you must talk to Carter on the phone, record the call. Having that on tape would have been dynamite.

[MandM]

But they haven't said anything about producing the documents for us. Have they said that they won't? You offered the extension in your 31.14. They haven't complied and TBH they should have contacted you and asked for it. But they haven't and now you're being very reasonable by reitterating that offer

 

Is this a better idea than putting in an embarassed defence or should I put in the ED and request an extension from BC? The courts are clogged with EDs. Again, you're showing how reasonable you are by giving them the extra time even though you don't have to! Once you've submitted your ED the extension won't be an option. Your case will (should) advance to AQs and be moved to your home court. Next real opportunity to get the info will be draft directions for the court to use submitted with your AQ and your revised defence 14 days or so thereafter.

 

What if they say they won't produce the documents anyway as they have shown no sign of doing so up to now? Again, get it in writing. Won't look good on BC. Then all you can do is submit a ED.

 

If BC plays ball then your defence submission can be delayed by upto another 28 days from the current due date.

 

If BC still doesn't come up with the goods then you can start looking at making some applications of your own - specifically to get his claim struck out.

[MandM]

They cannot ‘suspend’ a claim. It is either a time extension, a discontinuation, or else they are trying to trick you into not entering a defence so you get a default judgment against you.

 

If you must talk to Carter on the phone, record the call. Having that on tape would have been dynamite.

 

Yep. I smell a rat here! Only the defendant can confirm the extension with the court. I agree totally with DonkeyB.

 

As they have already 'agreed' the extension get it confirmed by e-mail NOW!

 

THEN confirm it with the court.

 

M

[emmaf01]

The court say they have received nothing from Bryan Carter! I had heard about this sort of thing.

 

BC say there is a "solicitors hold" on the account. ?????

 

First person OH spoke to said they did not need to notify me, Cap1 did. XXXXXXs! They have referred back to Cap1 for documents- shouldn't they have had them to bring the claim?

They then said they had notified the court- see previous XXXXXX.

 

Second BC person spoken to had no clue- "solicitor's hold" on account and they will have to contact someone more senior to see what is going on. They have not contacted us or the court about this. I'm getting a blinking defence in unless I get something in writing.

Edited October 18, 2010 by emmaf01

[MandM]

BC say there is a "solicitors hold" on the account. ?????

LOL. This is rubbish!